You'd THINK the scab ref era would peak with the game-ending Field Goal from last night's Patriots/Ravens game. But the Packers and Seahawks just one-upped that one.
And yeah, that final play was an absolute disaster. Golden Tate just shoved a defender out of the way, M.D. Jennings seemingly made the interception and Tate tried to weasel it away, and one official bought it. Game over. They may or may not have to go through the charade of a two point conversion, but I can't be bothered to wait find out and neither should you.
An enormous disaster, indeed.
Golden Tate came down on his back, but the Packers' Jennings clearly had control of that ball more than Tate did. For the scabs to call that a Seahawks TD is a major league travesty. And ESPN is absolutely EVISCERATING the scabs right now. Unbelievable!
In two nights, the Patriots and the Packers both got jobbed on iffy calls. That HAS to end the referee lockout...
Right?
Take us home, David Aldridge!
NFL announces Dave and Earl Hebner to referee next Monday's game. #montreal
Just awful...up to a point the bad calls went back and forth for both teams. Then Shields got punked on a pass interference call that should have gone the other way.
That last call is going to be talked about all week. I can't entirely blame the refs, but they're completely over their heads.
Would have been nice if we could have scored enough to nullify any bad calls...but still...
That's why you KNOCK THE BALL DOWN and not try to get greedy.
But, yeah, with the blatant offensive PI and the (what should have been) obvious interception, the Pack got screwed.
You've gotta think this prompts the league to get the real refs back, right? On the other hand, "controversy creates cash"! Tune in Thursday/Sunday/Monday to see what wackiness unfurls next!
Both sides already were in working hard at shifting the blame the last 24 hours. Peter King reports the NFL has broken off talks with no plans to resume, NFL tells Mort Goodell is totally hands on and really trying to get things done. I wonder what heroic measures the commish will have said to be done by morning.
This whole thing really fell apart when they didn't have a decent backup plan if they didn't get a deal done before the season.
Originally posted by Spaceman SpiffThat's why you KNOCK THE BALL DOWN and not try to get greedy.
But, yeah, with the blatant offensive PI
Yeah, the refs missed that big time. It had to be reviewed because it was a scoring play. I thought that flags could be thrown if a penalty is revealed in the review?
and the (what should have been) obvious interception, the Pack got screwed.
Simultaneous possession. It doesn't matter who touches it first, they both came down and finish the act of the catch at the same time. Tie goes to the offense. As others say, knock it down (or out of bounds)!
-- 2006 Time magazine Person of the Year -- -- July 2009 Ordained Reverend --
I didn't watch the game, just video highlights after the fact. Maybe that makes me less qualified to opine. Or, since I wasn't caught up in the immediate frenzy, maybe it makes me more qualified? I don't know.
But from MY vantage point, it was a coin flip. The most blatantly wrong thing on that final play is missing the push off (and even that, I would think, is debatable). The catch, however, could have gone either way. How on earth can everyone be so sure it was an interception? As if there is NO POSSIBLE WAY for reasonable minds to disagree on whether Golden Tate also had his hands on the ball before it was dead.
Is this just Packers fandom (and/or replacement ref hatred) run amok?
EDIT: As a Falcons homer, I would like to point out that Golden Tate came out of the fracas with the ball. When the Falcons were awarded a fumble recovery against Broncos last Monday night, half the country screamed bloody murder because it was the Broncos who came out of the pile with the ball. Guess that doesn't matter now though?
Nah, tere's no tie goes to the runner here. As Jerry Austin said on ESPN during and after the game, Jennings had two arms around the ball and the ball secured to his chest. Tate just had an arm on the ball. Once Jennings and Tate hit the ground, possession is maintained by Jennings. It isn't a simultaneous catch by the rules.
From the NFL Rule Book: If a pass is caught simultaneously by two eligible opponents, and both players retain it, the ball belongs to the passers. It is not a simultaneous catch if a player gains control first and an opponent subsequently gains joint control. If the ball is muffed after simultaneous touching by two such players, all the players of the passing team become eligible to catch the loose ball.
I work for a semipro football team, so I see my share of bad reffing on a weekly basis. This call screemed of someone in over their heads, as did many of the 'the play is under review' calls over the last few weeks.
As an ex-Notre Dame player, Golden Tate is going to have to go to confession for that lie, but he was at least smart enough to make it seem like he had possession. Green Bay should be more concerned about their O-line that allowed eight sacks. Don't give up a sack or two and this won't happen. Regardless, if the NFL doesn't move on getting the regular refs back, this is going to be the story of the year and the idea that these over their head refs could work a playoff game or the Super Bowl has to scare the hell out of the NFL and the fans.
The Wee Baby Sheamus.Twitter: @realjoecarfley its a bit more toned down there. A bit.
I'm streaming KJR Seattle this morning (iHeart Radio) and the host is taking the no apologies stance of there being "millions of bad calls" that would have changed the shape of the game in Seattle's favor.
This should be terribly amusing conversation all day.
Originally posted by It's FalseEDIT: I totally screwed up the final score through all that bile. Should be Seahawks 13, Pack 12.
(edited by It's False on 24.9.12 2114)
Actually was Seahawks 14, Pack 12 after they dragged GB back on the field for the PAT. Pretty classy of McCarthy & the Packer players to actually come out of the locker-room for the meaningless kick, RIGHT after getting jobbed.
While I understand that the play was missed on the field (giving the on-field refs the benefit of the doubt), what I don't understand is how the call wasn't corrected by the booth review? It feels like someone at the league office made the call not to overturn the call, in order to avoid riots in Seattle. I have a strong feeling that the call would've been overturned if the game were at Lambeau.
Originally posted by Von MaestroWhile I understand that the play was missed on the field (giving the on-field refs the benefit of the doubt), what I don't understand is how the call wasn't corrected by the booth review?
They addressed this on ESPN - the replay booth cannot overturn a possession call on the field. EDIT: It wasn't ESPN saying it, but they quoted a former referee as saying that the call could not be overturned by replay.
Originally posted by Von MaestroWhile I understand that the play was missed on the field (giving the on-field refs the benefit of the doubt), what I don't understand is how the call wasn't corrected by the booth review?
They addressed this on ESPN - the replay booth cannot overturn a possession call on the field. EDIT: It wasn't ESPN saying it, but they quoted a former referee as saying that the call could not be overturned by replay.
(edited by Reverend J Shaft on 25.9.12 0946)
Incorrect. Interceptions in the end zone are reviewable. Again, from the NFL Rule Book:
Reviewable Plays. The Replay System will cover the following play situations only: (a) Plays governed by Sideline, Goal Line, End Zone, and End Line: 1. Scoring plays, including a runner breaking the plane of the goal line. 2. Pass complete/incomplete/intercepted at sideline, goal line, end zone, and end line. 3. Runner/receiver in or out of bounds. 4. Recovery of loose ball in or out of bounds.
Originally posted by Sec19Row53Incorrect. Interceptions in the end zone are reviewable. Again, from the NFL Rule Book:
Reviewable Plays. The Replay System will cover the following play situations only: (a) Plays governed by Sideline, Goal Line, End Zone, and End Line: 1. Scoring plays, including a runner breaking the plane of the goal line. 2. Pass complete/incomplete/intercepted at sideline, goal line, end zone, and end line. 3. Runner/receiver in or out of bounds. 4. Recovery of loose ball in or out of bounds.
Originally posted by NFL.com articleRule 8, Section 1, Article 3, Item 5 of the NFL rulebook discusses a simultaneous catch.
"If a pass is caught simultaneously by two eligible opponents, and both retain it, the ball belongs to the passers. It is not a simultaneous catch if a player gains control first and an opponent subsequently gains joint control," the rule states.
The rulebook also states when a simultaneous catch is ruled, you can't review who made the catch. You can only review if it was complete or incomplete.
I agree that Jennings had control. But the assertion I quoted above is 100% correct.
EDIT: My term "possession" above was meant to apply to "who" had possession, not IF the pass was complete/incomplete, though whatever happened there it was definitely a completed pass. Just that WHO had possession is not reviewable.
Originally posted by Sec19Row53Incorrect. Interceptions in the end zone are reviewable. Again, from the NFL Rule Book:
Reviewable Plays. The Replay System will cover the following play situations only: (a) Plays governed by Sideline, Goal Line, End Zone, and End Line: 1. Scoring plays, including a runner breaking the plane of the goal line. 2. Pass complete/incomplete/intercepted at sideline, goal line, end zone, and end line. 3. Runner/receiver in or out of bounds. 4. Recovery of loose ball in or out of bounds.
Originally posted by NFL.com articleRule 8, Section 1, Article 3, Item 5 of the NFL rulebook discusses a simultaneous catch.
"If a pass is caught simultaneously by two eligible opponents, and both retain it, the ball belongs to the passers. It is not a simultaneous catch if a player gains control first and an opponent subsequently gains joint control," the rule states.
The rulebook also states when a simultaneous catch is ruled, you can't review who made the catch. You can only review if it was complete or incomplete.
I agree that Jennings had control. But the assertion I quoted above is 100% correct.
EDIT: My term "possession" above was meant to apply to "who" had possession, not IF the pass was complete/incomplete, though whatever happened there it was definitely a completed pass. Just that WHO had possession is not reviewable.
(edited by Reverend J Shaft on 25.9.12 1047)
Except that they didn't rule simultaneous possession on the field. They didn't rule anything other than Touchdown. So I think it is reviewable, as it relates to was it a touchdown or an interception.
If it were ruled simlutaneous possession, a ruling of Jennings having caught the ball equates to an incompletion (although that is a stretch, I fully admit).
Not that it matters any more, cuz it's a Seahawk win.
Thread ahead: College Footbal Week 6: We all fall down. Next thread: The W Survival League: 2012.05 Previous thread: Last two playes of first half of ILL-PSU game
...so he can retire from the NFL as a Green Bay Packer. (Packers.com) I was in his house once for an interview...cool how he had his Packers, royal-blue-era Patriots and UW-La Crosse jerseys (w/ the helmets, too!) framed up in a row.
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