ShotGunShep
Frankfurter
   
   
      
 
Since: 20.2.03
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|  #1 Posted on 28.7.03 2053.10 | http://www.newsnet5.com/news/2360897/detail.html
"When you talk about slavery, students need to understand it is not our fault," she said. "Our ancestors did nothing wrong to be enslaved.
"How do you work through that when the person teaching it is the same type of person who did the enslaving?"
Wow! I'd say THAT person needs to do some serious thinking! Some people see color as so much. Black slave owners sold their slaves to white traders. So should descendents of West Africa not be allowed to teach it either?
Black history is a factual thing, I think any white teacher who has a degree in African American Studies. Should black teachers be barred from teaching European History? Should only latin(or spanish) teachers teach spanish?
It's pretty ridiculous when you think about it.| Promote this thread! |           | Merc
Potato korv
Since: 3.1.02
From: Brisbane, Australia
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|  #2 Posted on 29.7.03 0135.19 | It seems a bit strange to me. Surely the qualifications are what matter. Are white kids allowed to take the class? (Just in general, we don't have a similar thing here and my only exposure to anything like it was a Fresh Prince of Bel Air episode  )
I'm a fat wannabe surfer | Whitebacon
Boudin blanc
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| #3 Posted on 29.7.03 0337.44 | Originally posted by Merc
It seems a bit strange to me. Surely the qualifications are what matter. Are white kids allowed to take the class? (Just in general, we don't have a similar thing here and my only exposure to anything like it was a Fresh Prince of Bel Air episode )
Don't forget How High.
At least I thought it was funny.
(edited by Whitebacon on 29.7.03 0137)
Baseball's Sad Lexicon
These are the saddest of possible words:
"Tinker to Evers to Chance."
Trio of bear cubs, and fleeter than birds,
Tinker and Evers and Chance.
Ruthlessly pricking our gonfalon bubble,
Making a Giant hit into a double-
Words that are heavy with nothing but trouble:
"Tinker to Evers to Chance."
Franklin Pierce Adams ©
| DrOp
Frankfurter
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| #4 Posted on 29.7.03 0745.33 | When it comes to teaching, certification and qualificatiosn matter.
Neither race nor ethnicity presume or preclude either of the two.
If a teacher is certified to teach a subject area, then they should teach it. It is the teacher's responsibilty to bring an objective, yet thought-provoking presentaion to the subject matter.
And Marking Out
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Wienerville | deadbeater3
Chipolata
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| #5 Posted on 29.7.03 1648.48 | The previous teacher was evidently popular, and he was shuffled out by an administrative move. Darn tooting that will get protests.
The divas should not be about T&A, they should be about Kicking A. | FurryHippie
Frankfurter
Since: 29.10.02
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| #6 Posted on 29.7.03 2200.59 |
Originally posted by kgriffey79
"How do you work through that when the person teaching it is the same type of person who did the enslaving?"
Slavery is a horrible thing...but do these people realize they are complete and utter racists by saying something like "the same type of person that did the enslaving"? So a well educated white man living in 2003 is gonna be held accountable for things done years and years before he was even born? These people need to look in the mirror and realize that racism goes two ways, and that kind of thinking just makes them look pretty bad to me. | NEO
Salami
Since: 15.1.02
From: Texas
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| #7 Posted on 30.7.03 0629.28 | My initial reaction would be that those parents need to get a grip. Everyone should know by now that it shouldn't make a damn what color you are. Just know what the hell you're talking about.
After putting more thought into it, maybe just maybe there's more to it. Hopefully there is cuz it's kinda sad that such ignorant people are even allowed to have kids. Would they raise as much hell if a Black man was teaching an English class?
"NOW YOU GET YOUR WHININ ASS OUTTA HERE!!" Sid Vicious after slapping Bret Hart | BigVitoMark
Lap cheong
Since: 10.8.02
From: Queen's University, Canada
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|  #8 Posted on 30.7.03 1427.30 | | I'm sure there will be no shortage of people watching over this class to make sure that the teacher is presenting black history in an unbiased light. If there ends up that the teacher is prejudiced or otherwise incapable of teaching the course, deal with that problem then. Otherwise, leave this teacher alone the same way a black teacher lecturing about the civil war should be left to do his job. | 12characters
Cotto
Since: 17.7.03
From: Auckland, New Zealand
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|  #9 Posted on 31.7.03 0111.04 | Just having a black history class at all strikes me as mild racism. Why the hell SHOULDN'T European teachers be able to teach about other cultures. It's just stupid crap by people who are ready to cry racism at any little thing when they do not realise that removing a white teacher based on his skin colour *is* racism in itself.
RantWars runner-up. At least I beat Dave Shilling. | Grimis
Scrapple
Since: 11.7.02
From: MD
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| #10 Posted on 31.7.03 0656.19 | Instant Rating: 7.29 | Originally posted by 12characters
Just having a black history class at all strikes me as mild racism.
We've been down this road before: several times.
Of course, at least on the collegiate level, maybe we should have Conservatives teach something.
(edited by Grimis on 31.7.03 0756)
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote."
- Ben Franklin, 1759 | DMC
Liverwurst
Since: 8.1.02
From: Modesto, CA
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| #11 Posted on 31.7.03 1326.38 | Without even reading all of that article Grimis, I can say that I totally concur. Academic departments, at least at most public colleges in California, will really make it hard for you if you're a conservative. I have had a very hard time trying to land even a part-time position at local community colleges, and yes, part of the reason I feel is because of my background and my interests/beliefs. These types of things can show in your resume and in your letters of recommendation (and you never know what kind of checking these people are able to do on you in order to find stuff out).
Other states' colleges might be different (like Texas, or Pennsylvania), but California academics are definately not open to having people with conservative and/or strong religious values teaching classes. There are probably some exceptions that are open to a fair-minded right-leaning person in the name of academic and intellectual diversity, but in my limited experience to date, there don't seem to be many. And I'm sure if I am ever able to hide my beliefs enough and get my foot in the door of a full-time professorship in this state, I will have a good deal of tension from my colleagues when I eventually let my perspective be known on certain issues. I don't need to hear other people's experiences to know that's going to happen.
So far I've found that many of the private two-year trade/career colleges seem to be more open to academic freedom, but only because they are often run by conservative groups or businesses. It's a plus that they're more open to trusting me to teach properly (occasionally offering my personal perspectives) and leaving me alone, but unfortunately not too many of them offer tenure, they don't pay as well, and they are often run in a strict military-style which runs against the grain of what most acamdemically-oriented people are willing to put up with. So I'm ultimately torn: I don't know if I would feel more comfortable with where I am at now, or at a public institution.
DMC
(edited by DMC on 31.7.03 1129)
"WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO?" -Malone, The Untouchables | Leroy
Andouille
Since: 7.2.02
From: Queens, NY
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| #12 Posted on 31.7.03 1514.38 | I work at a University in California Santa Barbara, and just finished an M.A. - and I have to say that my expereince is quite different. While I was fortunate to have a department that consisted of students and faculty with similar (but not exclusively) left-leaning beliefs, I know for a fact that other departments are by no means dominated by leftists.
Best case in point - the wealthiest developer in the state of California, Donald Bren (third wealthiest in the country, founder of the Irvine Company and one of the largest contributors to the Republican Party in the state of California) gave this campus $15 million to build on the "Bren School of Environmental Science" - complete with a brand new building and revamped cirriculum. The Board of Directors of the school is dominated by Bren appointees. When graduates students try to tackle issues regarding over-development of areas (as Orange County, Bren's home county, experienced) or other environmental issues, they are told to pursue other subjects by their advisors (in one case, in a not so subtle way by the chair of the dept).
Basically, Bren has set up a school that will teach a who slew of graduate students how to help developers get their projects past Environmental Impact Reviews and Coastal Commission requirements, regardless of the negative impacts they have on the community. Never mind that the Bren School of Environmental Science is like setting up the Mother Theresa School of Human Sexuality.
And Computer Science, Engineering, and other departments operate in very much the same way (although usually not quite so blantantly), since a lot of their funding comes directly from the Department of Defense or other military contractors (I also saw a lot of this system wide when I worked for a sponsored-research program). Our in some cases, even the Music Department has significant number of right-wingers (not so much in Ethnomusicology, but in Theory and Histroy).
The thing is, the left-wing professors are typically very vocal, so it appears that they are dominating the school. But if you take into account the administration (Chancellors, etc) - you'll find a very different beast.
"It's hard to be a prophet and still make a profit."
- Da Bush Babees
"Finally, a candidate who can explain the current administration's position on civil liberties in the original German."
- Bill Maher on Arnold Schwarzenneger | Grimis
Scrapple
Since: 11.7.02
From: MD
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| #13 Posted on 31.7.03 1518.48 | Instant Rating: 7.29 |
Originally posted by Leroy
The thing is, the left-wing professors are typically very vocal, so it appears that they are dominating the school. But if you take into account the administration (Chancellors, etc) - you'll find a very different beast.
Nah, the administration at my school was awfully liberal as well...I was just fortunate that 3 of the 4 profs in my Political Science department when open to discussion and could accept viewpoints as long as you had reason behind it.
The fourth was a Communist, so she wasn't quite keen on things like discussion and critical thinking.
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote."
- Ben Franklin, 1759 | DMC
Liverwurst
Since: 8.1.02
From: Modesto, CA
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| #14 Posted on 31.7.03 1529.34 | I'm dying to know if even private 2 year technical colleges like ITT Technical Institute get money from the DOD. They are so heavily staffed with ex-military people that it kind of makes me wonder.
DMC
"WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO?" -Malone, The Untouchables | MoeGates
Andouille
Since: 6.1.02
From: Brooklyn, NY
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| #15 Posted on 31.7.03 1920.38 | Instant Rating: 6.28 | Have you guys ever taken a University Economics or Business class? I wouldn't say those departments are remotely dominated by liberals. I'll put you disagreeing with your PoliSci professors up against me disagreeing with my Business professors any day of the week (and this was at a supposedly liberal college, Madison).
Moral of the story: Liberals disciplines pay a lot worse.
"I'm sorry, I didn't think I was going to talk about 'man on dog' with a United States Senator. It's sort of freaking me out."
Associated Press interview with Senator Rick Santorum (R-PA), 04-07-2003. | Grimis
Scrapple
Since: 11.7.02
From: MD
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| #16 Posted on 31.7.03 1940.05 | Instant Rating: 7.29 |
Originally posted by MoeGates
Have you guys ever taken a University Economics or Business class? I wouldn't say those departments are remotely dominated by liberals. I'll put you disagreeing with your PoliSci professors up against me disagreeing with my Business professors any day of the week (and this was at a supposedly liberal college, Madison). <
Granted. Our econ guys were OK(though one was an asshole)
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote."
- Ben Franklin, 1759 | BigVitoMark
Lap cheong
Since: 10.8.02
From: Queen's University, Canada
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| #17 Posted on 5.8.03 1522.15 | North of the border it's more of the same...sadly, MoeGates, even the economics department (I'm an econ major) at my school is split about 50/50. Politics department? Forget it. It seems like if your heart doesn't bleed your heart doesn't beat at times up here. If there is a good thing to have come from this, though, it's that being a conservative is so far from the accepted norm around here that part of the fun of it for us true believers has stemmed from that very fact, making our values more entrenched and our mouths more vocal.
But remember, kids...it's only discrimination when those being oppressed are not rich, male, able-bodied, and white...or a stereotypical offshoot of those same characteristics. | Davros
Blutwurst
Since: 22.8.02
From: Between thought and Reality, TZ
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| #18 Posted on 6.8.03 0912.24 | Boy BVM, that's totally ignorant of you to say. Really.
And irresponsible as well.
Welcome to Wienerboard, the board where intelligence is required, often not used, but where trolls are destroyed at the stroke of a key. I know, I've been banned for numerous reasons. So don't be a troll, enjoy your stay, enjoy a fresh delicious Subway sammich and watch Raw. Wienerboard...read fresh.
| CRZ
Big Brother
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| #19 Posted on 6.8.03 0929.41 | Instant Rating: 8.65 |
Originally posted by Davros
Boy BVM, that's totally ignorant of you to say. Really.
And irresponsible as well.
Pot, kettle, ...oops, probably a poor choice of words for this thread. HA
©CRZ™ | PalpatineW
Lap cheong
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| #20 Posted on 6.8.03 0929.49 | Instant Rating: 9.00 |
Originally posted by Davros
Boy BVM, that's totally ignorant of you to say. Really.
And irresponsible as well.
Before you start in with the school-marm behavior, offer an argument.
Imagine, for a moment, that black teachers were being forbidden to teach white history. There would not be a SINGLE rational response in the thread. There were simply be cries of RACISM! (And they'd be justified). BVM has a point. Forbidding someone to teach ANYTHING on the basis of skin color is racism, pure and simple. And to pretend that we even need to debate this issue is totally ignorant of you. Really. And irreponsible as well.
"Georgie Porgie, he might buy the whole league, but he doesn't have enough money to buy fear to put in my heart."
Pedro Martinez | | Pages: 1 2 Next
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