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The W - Pro Wrestling - Unforgiven: Let us discuss... (Page 2)
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Net Hack Slasher
Banger








Since: 6.1.02
From: Outer reaches of your mind

Since last post: 7033 days
Last activity: 5453 days
#21 Posted on
I thought the PPV was okay, some strangness at the end of both title matches, some matches that didn't click. But there was a couple of off the charts matches and the women match I'd put under the good category.

-Americans v. Unamericans- Ugly spot when Bubba dropped Storm on his head early on (didn't bubba mess up a nowinski spot a few weeks back). The match seemed to pick up speed in the end. LOL @ BT wassup. I like when these matches have everyone hitting there finisher, I always think they are cool.

-Jericho v. Flair- I find it strange that the first unified champ and the 16 time world champ are facing off for the elevation title. Almost as strange as that cheap floating photoshop job IC belt around Jericho's graphic... Not a great match, nice spot of Flair throwing y2j over the turnbuckle. Also nice image of Jericho jumping after noticing Flair let his guard down

-Eddie v. Edge- Eddie is such an awesome heel, ref gets on his case Eddie comes back with an insincere "Look, I'm sooory" (lol). Great match amazing ending. It looked like the fans were getting behind Eddie. Great work by Tazz in stating that Eddie has a lot of history in So. Cal and the latino population.

-Island Boys v. Billy/Chuck- This match is lucky that it had a bunch of stips going in cause other then that it was a nothing match and it did nothing for me, one of the Island guys did a middle rope moonsault which looked okay but other then that nothing stood out... Best thing about the match was Rico outside when a girl in the front row was cheering on Billy, Rico said something to her she came back with an insult of her own and Rico did the "talk to the hand" signal*haha* not a great signal when the most interesting thing was Rico outside.

-HHH v. RVD- Well atleast it looks like HHH could keep up with people now which for the longest time he couldn't do. Match was pretty good. RVD jumping over the top to the floor with H sidesteppin was violent *ouch*. RVD got most of his stuff that I like to see... I'm sorry Flair coming out and helping HHH, he just looks like an old tool now. Great all we need is Flair going around saying "HHH is the new man"

-Trish v. Molly- Like someone said why couldn't they have some sort of story going into this, the match was worked great if they had a story it would have been a great platform to reboot the women division... Great mat and outside violence by both gals. Nice straight-jacket move by Molly and nice slow reversal by Trish. Great sidestep of the Stratusphere headscissor by Molly and putting Trish in the tree of woe and stetching her neck back. And a nice finish by Trish by leaping up grabbing Molly's neck and hitting the bulldog. Decent interview afterwards by Trish saying how important the title is to her, but again it would be nice if they did that BEFORE the match instead of going with the granny panties storyline. If you decided to skip this match you missed a pretty good match and effort better then a couple of men matches on the card

-Benoit v. Angle- Awesome. Nice to see the crowd show respect for both guys when switching moves. I had no problem with the ending. They are both two heelish cheats, It was a clean match untill Angle tried to cheat a bit ref caught him which give Benoit a chance to cheat wich the ref didn't. I think it ended really well.

-HLA- Look at all those lesbians volunteering to Lesbianize Steph. Hey Shaq's kid in the audience he shouldn't be watching this! The second Rikishi got in the ring I could tell it was Rikish. Actually I was pretty indifferent on the whole thing I didn't care what happened. Seriously

-Brock v. Undertaker- Good for an Undertaker match (which is kind of a backhanded compliment), I'd like a bit more action in my main events but it's not in the cards. An okay power match. I HATE no finishes. Nothing turns me off more of ordering next months PPV then wasting $30 and getting a no finish the month before. Err I kinda wish the H/RVD match was the main event atleast it wouldnt' have ended in a lame not finish. Another month at Taker in main event TV storylines. Oh joy.

other stuff: I think the announcers did a real good job especially Cole/Tazz they really seemed to shine, They were smart, called the matches well and funny at times. Some real improvment there... Rico is so funny backstage, I need to see more of him and Eric backstage stuff on Raw... Great commercial for next months PPV, I actually dont' think I'll mind seeing that ad over and over again on WWETV.

line of the night: Rico "I know Billy and Chuck inside out" also Cole going through all the victims of the Island boys "stasiak, d-lo brown, lilian garcia, bigshow, lesbians, jeff hardy, stephanie mcmahon" Those girls just called generic Lesbians it's just too surreal. Fink called them lesbians with Eric Bischoff during intros tonight, that's actually something I'd think be even funnier to hear Lilian announce (lol)

well my predictions was 5-2-1... 2 wrong pics were Billy/Chuck (what was I thinking?) & Angle the one draw was the main event, but I was kinda right cause Brock kept the title and that's what counts.

(edited by Net Hack Slasher on 23.9.02 0505)


WWE new slogan "WWE: circling the drain"
oldschoolhero
Knackwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: nWo Country

Since last post: 5431 days
Last activity: 5365 days
#22 Posted on
Heh, I love it. Watching everyone get their panties in a bunch becuase the fed didn't do EXACTLY as they wanted. Because van Dam didn't go over in a **** match, clean. Because Undertaker/Brock ended in a non-finish to set up a rematch. OH NO, THE SKY IS FALLIN IN! Obviously, 'Taker, MUST have requested that finish himself, just to piss all over Brock and make look pathetic. And I'm sure Trips beat down Vince's door until Vince agreed, quaking, to turn Ric Flair heel.

You just ignore what has come before, don't you? The whole caboodle of Brock's push, with him being put over Hogan, Flair and Rock clean as a whistle. Doesn't that SUGGEST to you that maybe, just maybe the fed are going to stop at nothing to get him over? That the non-finish was designed to prolong this feud so that when Brock finally does level tTaker it means all the more? And don't get me started on the Triple H tihng. I enjoyed his match with van Dam, thought it was pretty much the best we could expect. Van Dam controlled most of the offence, Trips bumped well for him, even put him over during the ref bumps. But of course, unless Triple H jobs clean in every match then he's an evil bastard just TRYING to destroy the company. Never mind that it took a freakin' sledgehammer to put van Dam down.

Christ, would you listen to yourselves for once? Just because Trips goes over does not mean he's "burying" RVD. Burying would entail no-selling his offence, treating the match like a joke and generally pissing on everything van Dam. I wouldn't count taking all of van Dam's major offence and making it appear that he had the title won "burying" him.




Apparently, I Am


The Result Of This Survey Was Really, Really Disturbing To Me

emma
Cherries > Peaches








Since: 1.8.02
From: Phoenix-ish

Since last post: 445 days
Last activity: 167 days
#23 Posted on

    Originally posted by WhoBettahThanDeion
    I do think Flair/RVD is next, however. Flair needs to show RVD he's still "The Man," that he can still go. I have a feeling Flair's going to start cheating more than EVER!



Are we ultimately looking at Flair/RVD, or at Flair/HHH ?
"You called me a loser. Yeah, you're right, I have been acting like a loser. I've gotten soft; I've let these little punks, like RVD & Y2J, get away with shit that I never should have. That's gonna stop right now. I shouldn't have let you keep that Big Gold Belt when I was the first one to challenge you for it. You think I don't have that desire any more? Well, I want that belt back, & I'm going to take it back from you, HHH."
SKLOKAZOID
Bierwurst








Since: 20.3.02
From: California

Since last post: 1692 days
Last activity: 822 days
#24 Posted on

    Originally posted by WhoBettahThanDeion
    I think the finish to the Benoit/Angle match sets up their submission match next month. The fued isn't over, hence the way Benoit one. Plus, I don't personally think either could have afforded to lost cleanly at this point. Besides, most matches in the WWE don't end cleanly.font face=verdana size=-2>(edited by WhoBettahThanDeion on 22.9.02 2034)



Yeah, we've already seen this feud, remember? They had a submission match at the PPV after WMX7, then had a third match that was a ladder match for Angle's medals. Same old shit, no matter how good of workers they are.

Unforgiven sounded like a complete waste of $35. I can't see them churning out PPV profits for much longer on the non-"Big Five" PPVs with crap like this. Non-finishes in the main event just aren't a good way to build up a fanbase when they're downtrodden and cynical about everything.

The Flair heel turn is yet another horrible career choice Flair is making in the twilight of his career. He will serve no other purpose than to try to draw a connection in the fans' eyes between Flair & HHH. HHH has been trying to be the "next Ric Flair" for quite some time, so now he's hoping for some sort of rub. It's just sad to see Ric go out this way. Now, Flair gets to say HHH is great so Steph & HHH don't have to say it to themselves when looking in the mirror.
Texas Kelly
Lap cheong








Since: 3.1.02
From: FOREST HILLS CONTROLS THE UNIVERSE

Since last post: 2368 days
Last activity: 1529 days
ICQ:  
#25 Posted on
8-Man: Good little opener, but I didn't think the time was right for a Booker Coalition win over the Unamericans. Still, I'm happy that they saved the elimination match for Survivor Series, as they should have.

Jericho/Flair: Relieved to see Jericho go over, but the match was too short and the ending, while good to the "Flair doesn't have it anymore" storyline, was a bit unnecessary and dumb. The worst thing about this match though wasn't revealed until later...

Edge/Eddie: Great match, best of the night if not for Benoit/Angle. They were stuck in a corner with this one, as putting either guy over would have been a good business decision, but Eddie did need the win a bit more.

B&C/J&R: Well, I knew that the Island Boyz were going over irregardless of the stips, so once they did win I called the Rikishi thing right away. That payoff was OK; but they should have saved it for Raw or Smackdown so that more time could have been given to the MATCH.

RVD/Teo: Yes, Teo treated RVD like a champ for most of the match, but the Ric Flair heel turn GOOD GOD pissed me off. Not only do we get to see Teo go over again at the expense of younger, more talented, and more over wrestlers, but the Flair heel turns forces us AGAIN to see a better wrestler stroke Teo's ego and play second fiddle to him, renders the whole "Flair doesn't have it anymore" storyline (since it was just getting started) and his last three months as a babyface completely meaningless. That's right, even with the both of them as heels, Teo continues to find new ways to hold Jericho back. I know I'll probably be bashed for that comment, but it's true and I don't care how I sound anymore - Teo is exactly what's wrong with the company and canning him on his ass or permanently shunting him down into the midcard is the only way to truly turn the company around.

Molly/Trish: Giving Trish the belt was a good idea because I think most people had forgotten it existed, but man was the crowd dead for this. Hopefully it was still in the bathroom puking in reaction to the finish of the last match.

Benoit/Angle: This match would have redeemed the entire show if not for the main event. Great match, great finish, and I'll be looking forward to the rematch where Angle goes over next month. I still would have positioned Benoit as a straight-up babyface, though.

Brock/UT: Oy. If Teo is Hulk Hogan, then Undertaker is Kevin Nash. You knew, I knew, the entire World knew that the only acceptable outcome here was to see Brock pound UT into a fat tub of jelly, but of course, the exact opposite happens. FUCK I hate politics. Undertaker, stop being a whining crybaby and do your freaking job. You're almost as much of an embarrassment to this business now as Teo is. No one will buy you as a champion anymore, and I think your brief run a few months ago proved that. Get out while the getting is good. If Brock doesn't destroy him next month, then I'm going to start taking predictions for the death of the company, because at this rate, fans WILL stop caring.

The matches get a thumbs in the middle, but boneheaded booking decisions get this show a big thumbs down.



Being The Bookerman (No Way Out)
Grading The Bookerman (No Way Out)
Worship Your God And Mine

CRZ NOTABLE QUOTABLE OF THE MONTH:
KANE: Triple H...tonight, I will burn the flesh from your body!
MICHAEL COLE: OH MY GOD. KANE THREATENING TRIPLE H, SAYING HE'S GONNA BURN THE FLESH FROM HIS BODY!
CRZ: Umm, I heard it the FIRST time!
-- WWF Smackdown, 9/9/99

Teppan-Yaki
Pepperoni








Since: 28.6.02

Since last post: 4381 days
Last activity: 4351 days
#26 Posted on
My thoughts:

I can understand for those that were able to watch at Hooters could give this PPV a higher score, due to yummy wings and, well, yummy distractions and, well, it's FREE.

But for those gullible enough (like myself) to spend $35 on last night -- I'm asking for a $22.50 refund.

Eddie and Edge was great -- Edge sold the head injury like gold most of the match, and Eddie's sunset flip powerbomb was sweet. Why use the trunks? Oh... I forgot. CHEAT TO WIN~!

Angle/Benoit -- Yeah, it's SOS... but out of this blast radius, it's perfectly acceptable to me.

Trish & Molly -- See Kurt and Chris above. [edit]NetHack -- I do like Trish's interview, but it was out of place. It was, well, disjointed... not her fault, though.[/edit]

The 4x4 was ok, if a little disjointed. I mean, the timing was completely off there, no?

With Trips and RVD -- how did Trips treat Rob like a champ -- just because he sold Rob's set of moves -- no, no -- because he let Rob mock him? I don't know.

To paraphrase Rob's catch phrase:

Glass

Cei

ling

Brock and UT I have yet to watch because of the debacle of Eric and Stephanie. As mentioned in other posts, that could have been done so well five times to Tuesday... but I mean... two things were apparent in that "skit":

A) WWE's makeup ain't *that* great
B) Stephie can't dance. I can't dance that great, either, but I'm not going to in a crowd of 20K plus a buyrate of 100K or so. The dancing Spiderman avatar is tons better.

Did I mention the plethora of counter-programming I'll probably watch compared to tonight's RAW, which I'll tape out of spite?



(edited by Teppan-Yaki on 23.9.02 0804)


"There's an old saying in Tennessee—I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee—that says, fool me once, shame on—shame on you. Fool me—you can't get fooled again."—
George W. Bush, Nashville, Tenn., Sept. 17, 2002
Phantom
Frankfurter








Since: 17.3.02

Since last post: 5819 days
Last activity: 5795 days
#27 Posted on
And because HHH didn't drop the belt that they only just "recreated" less than a month ago?
Ringmistress
Lap cheong








Since: 15.1.02
From: Philly

Since last post: 6119 days
Last activity: 6118 days
#28 Posted on
The PPV was okay, I didn't expect much, so things worked out. Especially since I didn't have to pay. I was watching it at a friend's place. Not sure what to think right now, but I hope to HELL they get their crap together (ala Summerslam) at Survivor Series.

Ringmistress



Ringmistress - A bitch among heels.
asteroidboy
Andouille








Since: 22.1.02
From: Texas

Since last post: 4873 days
Last activity: 439 days
#29 Posted on

    Originally posted by oldschoolhero
    Heh, I love it. Watching everyone get their panties in a bunch becuase the fed didn't do EXACTLY as they wanted. Because van Dam didn't go over in a **** match, clean. Because Undertaker/Brock ended in a non-finish to set up a rematch. OH NO, THE SKY IS FALLIN IN! Obviously, 'Taker, MUST have requested that finish himself, just to piss all over Brock and make look pathetic. And I'm sure Trips beat down Vince's door until Vince agreed, quaking, to turn Ric Flair heel.

    You just ignore what has come before, don't you? The whole caboodle of Brock's push, with him being put over Hogan, Flair and Rock clean as a whistle. Doesn't that SUGGEST to you that maybe, just maybe the fed are going to stop at nothing to get him over? That the non-finish was designed to prolong this feud so that when Brock finally does level tTaker it means all the more? And don't get me started on the Triple H tihng. I enjoyed his match with van Dam, thought it was pretty much the best we could expect. Van Dam controlled most of the offence, Trips bumped well for him, even put him over during the ref bumps. But of course, unless Triple H jobs clean in every match then he's an evil bastard just TRYING to destroy the company. Never mind that it took a freakin' sledgehammer to put van Dam down.

    Christ, would you listen to yourselves for once? Just because Trips goes over does not mean he's "burying" RVD. Burying would entail no-selling his offence, treating the match like a joke and generally pissing on everything van Dam. I wouldn't count taking all of van Dam's major offence and making it appear that he had the title won "burying" him.



You're kidding, right? I love a good devil's advocate routine, but don't try to sell me on the fact that a fucking non-finish is worth paying $35 for. To set up a rematch? Nobody gave a shit about this match, why would they want to prolong it for another match? Austin/Angle from Summerslam last year was at least something I could live with because those two tore the fucking house down before the DQ and made me feel like I wasn't cheated. If you're the WWE, is it really wise, when business is down, to give fans a finish that they're chanting BULLSHIT for????

I agree that HHH/RVD was probably the best match we could've hoped for, given that RVD needs to be carried and HHH can hardly carry his bottle of water to the ring anymore. But the real burying of RVD will come in the weeks ahead, when he's feuding with a crippled Ric Flair and HHH has moved on to squashing Bubba Ray Dudley in a title match.



"My brother saw the Undertaker walking through an airport." - Rex

"Was he no-selling?" - Me
The Amazing Salami
Sujuk








Since: 23.5.02
From: Oklahoma

Since last post: 7231 days
Last activity: 7230 days
#30 Posted on
I'm real glad I didn't buy this one. With all the non-finishes, etc., tonight's Raw will probably be a better show than last night's PPV.

I try to stay out of the booking wars, but I do have one question. Why did RVD have to drop the strap NOW if he's not going to go over HHH until the next PPV (if ever)?



"You're always 17 in your hometown." - Cross Canadian Ragweed
Kawshen
Liverwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: Bronx, NY

Since last post: 5402 days
Last activity: 3662 days
#31 Posted on


Rob Van Dam is the Game. Dude. :)




Tom Dean
Bockwurst








Since: 30.8.02
From: New York, NY

Since last post: 6750 days
Last activity: 6119 days
#32 Posted on
You're kidding, right? I love a good devil's advocate routine, but don't try to sell me on the fact that a fucking non-finish is worth paying $35 for. To set up a rematch? Nobody gave a shit about this match, why would they want to prolong it for another match?

Basically, yeah.

Good undercard, but in the final analysis, bullshit.

I don't understand why they are so obsessed with heel Flair. I don't think anyone wants to see that either.

They seemed to be making a very conscious effort to present the women as wrestlers first, which is great.



Three Faces of Dean: Teenage Riot, T.R., and now this guy

"How YOU Doin'?"
- me, weekly (or so) at [slash]

"History is being make-ed... someone is going to get their head completely shaved off"
- David McLane, PPV opening promo

You see this? You see how my body's glowing like that? Yeah... a lot of people can't do that. Come get some of this glowing. Oh, okay, you. You want some. You want some of the glowing. Look, man... your soul... I'm going to totally floss with it and chew on your spirit. I read that somewhere. But I'll do it.

darkdragoon
Bockwurst








Since: 26.8.02

Since last post: 7140 days
Last activity: 7140 days
#33 Posted on
Definitely in the middle.

8-man was surprisingly good. Everybody got their thing in; I didn't know Regal could do a T-bone.

Jericho/Flair-- way too short; Jericho coulda used the extra time to learn something. Set up the heel turn if you paid attention.

Edge/Eddie was good but more of the same, just different part. I guess if there's a third PPV match Edge is gonna need his leg worked on?

RVD/HHH. Not bad, but RVD did the same headlock takeover and wheel kick over and over! HHH's quad doesn't seem to bother him as much; still if this had been in 2000... Bringing in Flair could work and besides, it's a worthless title anyway.

Benoit/Angle ruled. They were hyper on the matwrestling-- that's what Brock should be doing instead of trying to get the bearhug/gutwrench thing over. Excellent reversal sequences. I don't quiteget Angle's bearhug to the sternum thing though. Finish was actually good IMO. Angle got outsmarted.

Women's match: Not bad at all, but couldn't we have had Rey/Noble instead? The tearful win by Trish was overdone too.

Island Boys/Billy & Chuck was all right. Nothing spectacular but what did people really expect?

The HLA thing was funny for a while but just dragged on too long. Rikishi missed the superkick too...

Brock/Taker: Started good, ended crappy.
asteroidboy
Andouille








Since: 22.1.02
From: Texas

Since last post: 4873 days
Last activity: 439 days
#34 Posted on

    Originally posted by Kawshen


    Rob Van Dam is the Game. Dude. :)



I'm still laughing at those tights with the dragon pointing to itself.

If you look at the pic closely, you can see the water dripping from the glass ceilling. :)



"My brother saw the Undertaker walking through an airport." - Rex

"Was he no-selling?" - Me
Parts Unknown
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Darkenwood

Since last post: 1763 days
Last activity: 1448 days
#35 Posted on
I think the main event should have ended with Undertaker walking up the ramp and Brock mutilated and hanging on the ropes yelling, "Taaayyyyker! Ya didna BRAKE meeee! Ya wont brake meeee!"

Oh wait...



"Oh, i'll never understand this emptiness...but I'll never really try and understand, I guess." - Whiskeytown, Sit and Listen to the Rain
Scorpio
Boudin rouge








Since: 18.2.02
From: Laurel, MD, USA

Since last post: 7308 days
Last activity: 7259 days
#36 Posted on

So, how was the announcing last night?




PMMJ

"Nothing remains interesting where anything may happen." -H.G. Wells
"Show me the country in which there are no strikes and I'll show you that country in which there is no liberty." -Emma Goldman

darkdragoon
Bockwurst








Since: 26.8.02

Since last post: 7140 days
Last activity: 7140 days
#37 Posted on

    Originally posted by Scorpio

    So, how was the announcing last night?



Tazz and Cole were good. Lawler was still on the HLA thing but a little toned down. JR was still iffy.
polybi
Chaurice








Since: 23.9.02
From: Los Angeles, CA

Since last post: 7487 days
Last activity: 7487 days
#38 Posted on
Well, if you guys want to know why the Woman's belt went to Trish Straus last night, let's hear what Ms Nora Greewald, aka Molly Holly, has to say on a recent Byte This, concerning the imfamous Raw HLA seg:

"It upset me greatly that Bubba Dudley and Steven Richards went out there, killed themselves in their match, doing everything, giving 110% of themselves, and the commentators were talking about HLA. And I know as a wrestler that that is the most disturbing thing to not be appreciated for getting killed out there. And the other thing that upset me was, well, I understand the reasons... well I don't really understand it but, from the fan response, I see that the HLA was a good idea for the pop because the fans want to see it. But what upset me about the actual turn of events was when you see half-naked girls getting beat up by men... it was a very sickening thing for me to watch. For example when I saw one of the girls over Rosie's head, kicking and screaming, she just looked naked, and, I don't know, it just seemed a little bit too much for me and I thought it was awful."

Just found it interesting....

don
mskj
Summer sausage








Since: 10.1.02
From: Tennessee

Since last post: 4412 days
Last activity: 1027 days
#39 Posted on
I didn't get the ppv. Got home late from the miserable Titans game.

The finish of the main event may have sucked, but dragging Brock/Taker out another month is a good move. If Brock had destroyed and beaten Taker, who would he fight next? Angle? WWE wants to save that match for possibly Wrestlemania. Benoit? Two heels, and Benoit isn't very over. Edge? The buy rate for a ppv with an Edge/Brock main event would be worse than whatever Unforgiven ends up with. Edge is getting close, but having him squashed by Brock would kill him dead. And he just lost to Eddy. Hogan is out injured, Rock is making movies, Austin is at home, and HHH and RVD are busy on RAW. So, the way I see it, blowing off Brock/Taker last night would have resulted in one of two things. A premature Angle/Brock match that could be much bigger down the road, or main event Edge. I'm glad they are going with Taker another month.



Forget Rock. Maurice Clarett is my hero.
Punkinhed
Salami








Since: 23.1.02

Since last post: 7692 days
Last activity: 7667 days
#40 Posted on

How I rate PPVS:

1)The buildup: it was good (not great), and it made the matches more interesting.

2) The matches themselves: taken as themselves, they were mostly entertaining (I'd really like to know why RVD kept doing thet same move over and over); no MOTY, except for possibly, POSSIBLY Benoit/Angle, and that was MOTN, certianly.

3) What they do with it: I'm willing, as always, to give them one week to explain themselves. If the explanations are not good enough, then I will make my final judgement about Unforgiven.

I encourage all of you to try this method; it saves a lot of stress screaming about how someone got buried and why did they do this and that; hold off on that till you have all the facts, is my advice. Of course, like the man says, that's just my opinion; I could be wrong.



Triple H is a dead ringer for "Buzzer" of the Dreadnoks. Just give him some mirror shades and teach him to say "Blimey, Zartan".
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Not sure about he lawsuit - if it were really a big deal, we wouldn't see Flair back, right? What's this about Burke and Punk?
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