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The W - Football - UF prez to propose NCAA playoff to SEC
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Zeruel
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Since: 2.1.02
From: The Silver Spring in the Land of Mary.

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#1 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.05
From: http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=2885646


    The only playoff Khayat can see is to take the top four BCS teams, seeding them and using two Jan. 1 bowls to match No. 1 vs. No. 4 and No. 2 vs. No. 3, with the winners meeting the following week for the national championship.

    "That would be palatable," Khayat said. "I'm the only one I've heard say that, and I haven't said it much. I think we need to listen to anybody with credibility that has something to say about determining a national championship."

    South Carolina coach Steve Spurrier has been a playoff proponent for years. Auburn coach Tommy Tuberville raised his voice in the fight when his unbeaten 2004 squad got left out of the BCS national championship game.

    Tennessee coach Phillip Fulmer, whose team won the 1998 national championship the first year the BCS system was implemented, said he thinks presidents and conference commissioners still aren't keen on a playoff.

    "I don't really hear very many presidents or commissioners in the meetings I'm in really talking about a playoff," Fulmer said. "I don't think you can get a consensus with our head coaches.

    "But will it eventually happen? I'm sure it will, because of television and the dollars it can create."


While I would love for more than a 4 team playoff, that is better than nothing at this point.

(edited by Zeruel on 29.5.07 1950)


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wmatistic
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Since: 2.2.04
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#2 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.08
Of course I have to chime in and say, no it isn't. Teams five to say at least seven would bitch to high heaven about being left out of that sucker. I thought the idea was to create less controversy and whining, not more?

Not to mention, I would be interested to see how well fans followed a team if say their first game was at the Rose Bowl and the title game was at the Orange. Yeah, pretty sure it would take one year before they scrap the "bowl" games and just do highest ranked team hosts the first round.

Which pretty much makes college NFL light, which would indeed suck. But hey, who likes tradition in their sports anyway.(fully noting that the BCS destroyed in part the tradition long ago)

Besides, we all know it ain't happening for at least several more years.
JayJayDean
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Since: 2.1.02
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#3 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.40
    Originally posted by wmatistic
    Of course I have to chime in and say, no it isn't. Teams five to say at least seven would bitch to high heaven about being left out of that sucker. I thought the idea was to create less controversy and whining, not more?


I have to pretty much agree with you. The only upside to making a four-team playoff is that it would eventually grow into a full-blown tournament, but otherwise I'd be pretty non-plussed about it, UNLESS they could have a way to pick the four teams that involved (a) no people voting unless it was a committee or (b) a mathematical formula or criteria that everyone could understand going into the season.

If they were going to do the post-bowl four-team playoff, it would be great if they went back to how the bowls used to make their match-ups, and get rid of the BCS. The problem with doing it after the bowls is that if you keep the Rose Bowl intact that eliminates either the Pac-10 or Big Ten champ before the playoffs even start.



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Since: 9.12.01
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#4 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.81
Isn't the reason for four teams so that they can argue that even if the ranked #1 and #2 are wrong, the real #1 and #2 would at least be in the top 4, so they would have a shot at the title game by winning.

The "real" #1 team in the nation shouldn't be sitting at #5 if the system is working correctly, right?




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wmatistic
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Since: 2.2.04
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#5 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.08
    Originally posted by Guru Zim
    Isn't the reason for four teams so that they can argue that even if the ranked #1 and #2 are wrong, the real #1 and #2 would at least be in the top 4, so they would have a shot at the title game by winning.

    The "real" #1 team in the nation shouldn't be sitting at #5 if the system is working correctly, right?


Well look at last season. You'd have left out undefeated Boise State, which I'm sure would not sit well at all. I mean people were somewhat calm last season because Boise played such a crap schedule that they didn't deserve to play in the title game. But to have a playoff and leave them out, while including two two-loss teams(Michigan and LSU)? I'm pretty sure the complaints would have been much, much louder.

Not to mention that you'd be including a Michigan team that already lost to Ohio State over #5 USC, and one loss teams like #6 Louisville and #7 Wisconsin.

Problem is the system doesn't work correctly to determine who's more deserving. There are too many teams, too many biases, and not a long enough season. Which I why I much prefer the old way where everything was set in stone as to bowl matchups and we didn't worry so much about who "got screwed".
Reverend J Shaft
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Since: 25.6.03
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#6 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.91
The problem is that you can only include so many teams. No one ever argues that the first team left out of the NCAA basketball tourney actually had a chance to win. But there are so many teams that look like world-beaters on bowl day but would be ranked out of the top 4 playoff (e.g. USC this past year).

    Originally posted by wmatistic
    Not to mention that you'd be including a Michigan team that already lost to Ohio State over #5 USC, and one loss teams like #6 Louisville and #7 Wisconsin


But to defend my Wolverines to wmatistic (who seems to be taking my school to task in several respects lately ), Michigan HAD already beaten Wisconsin, so I don't think THEY had a legitimate beef there - one loss or not.

I'm probably from the old guard who doesn't think a playoff is likely or necessary. In the end, the champion will still be determined in some respect by a bunch of voters, making the national title mythical (to me anyway). Besides I think people enjoy arguing about this crap. It takes up half of SportsCenter every fall anyway.
Sec19Row53
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Since: 2.1.02
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#7 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.12
    Originally posted by Reverend J Shaft
    The problem is that you can only include so many teams. No one ever argues that the first team left out of the NCAA basketball tourney actually had a chance to win. But there are so many teams that look like world-beaters on bowl day but would be ranked out of the top 4 playoff (e.g. USC this past year).

      Originally posted by wmatistic
      Not to mention that you'd be including a Michigan team that already lost to Ohio State over #5 USC, and one loss teams like #6 Louisville and #7 Wisconsin


    But to defend my Wolverines to wmatistic (who seems to be taking my school to task in several respects lately ), Michigan HAD already beaten Wisconsin, so I don't think THEY had a legitimate beef there - one loss or not.

    I'm probably from the old guard who doesn't think a playoff is likely or necessary. In the end, the champion will still be determined in some respect by a bunch of voters, making the national title mythical (to me anyway). Besides I think people enjoy arguing about this crap. It takes up half of SportsCenter every fall anyway.

But by your logic, you'd have to eliminate Michigan because they already lost to Ohio State.

If we're going to wish for this, I'll wish for 8 teams.

There's something I want to add about polls at the end of the season, but I'm not sure I can put words to it well. Essentially, I think voting is done with regard to potential bowl match-ups, as opposed to actual strength of teams. Thus, Boise State was rated high enough to get into a BCS game, without people really knowing how good they were (and thus how high they should have been rated). Similarly, Wisconsin was ranked high to get into a decent game without the benefit of having beaten anyone.
wmatistic
Andouille








Since: 2.2.04
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#8 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.08
    Originally posted by Reverend J Shaft
    The problem is that you can only include so many teams. No one ever argues that the first team left out of the NCAA basketball tourney actually had a chance to win. But there are so many teams that look like world-beaters on bowl day but would be ranked out of the top 4 playoff (e.g. USC this past year).

      Originally posted by wmatistic
      Not to mention that you'd be including a Michigan team that already lost to Ohio State over #5 USC, and one loss teams like #6 Louisville and #7 Wisconsin


    But to defend my Wolverines to wmatistic (who seems to be taking my school to task in several respects lately ), Michigan HAD already beaten Wisconsin, so I don't think THEY had a legitimate beef there - one loss or not.

    I'm probably from the old guard who doesn't think a playoff is likely or necessary. In the end, the champion will still be determined in some respect by a bunch of voters, making the national title mythical (to me anyway). Besides I think people enjoy arguing about this crap. It takes up half of SportsCenter every fall anyway.


Oh I'm not really trying to pick on Michigan. Always been somewhat of a fan, going back to the big FSU regular season game with Howard/Buckley going at it. Fun stuff(especially since FSU won).

But yeah I realized they beat Wisconsin, just was pointing out that if people could complain, as they did, that Michigan deserved a rematch with Ohio State then certainly Wisconsin would have a beef as well since they had that one loss and didn't play Ohio State.

I enjoyed arguing this stuff before the BCS, when it didn't matter because you were never going to get the perfect matchups and we just accepted it and had fun with the what if's. Now, it's just annoying as people constantly push for a playoff that doesn't resolve any of the things they complain about.
redsoxnation
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Since: 24.7.02

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#9 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.78
Not that I like saying anything nice about Michigan, but they were only a 1 loss team going into the Rose Bowl last season, not a 2 loss team.
The FOX/BCS deal is through either 2011 or 2012, so you can't do anything until that point anyway, as the Rose Bowl is outside the FOX deal and you can't do anything without the Rose Bowl.
The only realistic manner in which Division 1 Bowl Sub-Division(if they are going to have a retarded name for it, at least could they sell it to a corporation) henceforth known as Division I) has a playoff is if the ACC, Big East, Big Ten, Big XII, Pac 10, SEC and Notre Dame break away and form a Super Division, separate from that where the WAC, Mid American etc. reside. Then, it might be possible to get the votes from that group to form a playoff. Most of the Presidents of the schools in the major conferences seem to be against a playoff, but, regimes change and money talks, so it's possible.
I miss the pre-Bowl Alliance/BCS anarchy way of doing things, where you knew it was corrupt going in and there was no fascade of fairness or computers. Of course that meant multiple bowls could provide interest and the season was over by January 1st or 2nd rather than dragged out for an extra week, but, it seemed to work fine for a number of years. However, if they want to level the playing field slightly under the current system: No AP or Coaches Poll until Columbus Day. By that point you are somewhere between 4 and 6 games into the season and performance on the field dictates votes, not where someone picked a team in August.


(edited by redsoxnation on 30.5.07 2321)

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wmatistic
Andouille








Since: 2.2.04
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#10 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.08
I kinda agree but I don't think the voters really had anyone screwed last season. I think the most likely candidate for that label would have been Boise State, but again they really played just a joke of a schedule from top to bottom. As bad as I've ever seen really. So I don't think starting the voting later would have helped them anyway, but of course I think there have been cases where it would have.

I think the before the BCS days were better because we didn't disect the polls like this. We gave them less importance, as it should be.
Quezzy
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Since: 6.1.02
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#11 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.51
If the talk of Boise State not being in the Championship game was calm then so would them not making a four team playoff. Their schedule still sucked and I don't think anybody really thinks they would've beaten one of the top four teams. If you honestly take an unbiased look at the teams Florida, Ohio State, Michigan and LSU were definitely the four best teams in the nation last year and the playoff would've been perfect. It might not always work that way but it did last year.

Like Guru said, the point is to make sure the #1 team gets a shot at the National Championship and I can't think of any season where there was more than four teams that deserved a shot.

I'm just glad Florida isn't backing down from the playoff thing. Everybody assumed they were for a playoff because they might get screwed. Then when they made the championship everybody thought they would drop it but they didn't because the SEC realizes they're getting screwed in the new style over substance outlook in college football.



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wmatistic
Andouille








Since: 2.2.04
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#12 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.08
    Originally posted by Quezzy
    If the talk of Boise State not being in the Championship game was calm then so would them not making a four team playoff. Their schedule still sucked and I don't think anybody really thinks they would've beaten one of the top four teams. If you honestly take an unbiased look at the teams Florida, Ohio State, Michigan and LSU were definitely the four best teams in the nation last year and the playoff would've been perfect. It might not always work that way but it did last year.

    Like Guru said, the point is to make sure the #1 team gets a shot at the National Championship and I can't think of any season where there was more than four teams that deserved a shot.

    I'm just glad Florida isn't backing down from the playoff thing. Everybody assumed they were for a playoff because they might get screwed. Then when they made the championship everybody thought they would drop it but they didn't because the SEC realizes they're getting screwed in the new style over substance outlook in college football.


No, there would be much more controversy. People couldn't really make a huge case for Boise to play for the title, but were somewhat quiet only because they still got a BCS game. And I say somewhat quiet even though we had every talk show telling us they deserved a chance after the bowls to play Florida. And I do mean every damn show.

With a playoff, you devalue all the other bowls to a huge degree, which means the fighting for those few spots would be much worse. You leave Boise State out of that and you can bet they'd be bitching to high heaven, because there wouldn't be a "BCS" game for them, just a bowl that matters even less than it did before. The bowls would become the NIT of college football, but only four teams get to go dancing.

Not to mention the huge financial difference it would make to a school as well as exposure. And hell that's just a team like Boise, think about if in the future it was a Notre Dame or a USC in that spot. You'd never get people to shut up about that.

And if Michigan was "definitely" one of the four best then why did they get stomped by #5 USC in a bowl game?

(edited by wmatistic on 1.6.07 1305)
Zeruel
Thirty Millionth Hit
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Since: 2.1.02
From: The Silver Spring in the Land of Mary.

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#13 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.05
Holy flip-flop Batman!

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=2889798

Florida president backs off playoff plan at SEC meetings


    DESTIN, Fla. -- Florida president Bernie Machen backed off his playoff football proposal after conferring with colleagues at the Southeastern Conference's spring meeting.

    Machen decided it's better to work within the confines of the current Bowl Championship Series system.

    "What we learned today from my colleagues is that we see the world pretty much the same way," Machen said Friday on the final day of the annual meeting. "We see the problems in the current system.

    "They are persuaded, and I am now persuaded, that the best way to proceed is to try to work within the BCS structure, to make some changes to make it better. That seems to me to be a very good way to go."

    The basis of his proposal was to form a limited liability corporation that, much like the BCS, would work outside the framework of the NCAA. He wanted to keep the current bowl structure intact and distribute revenue to all 119 Division I-A schools instead of keeping most of the money for the schools in the six BCS conferences.


(edited by Zeruel on 2.6.07 0925)


-- 2006 Time magazine Person of the Year --

ges7184
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Since: 7.1.02
From: Birmingham, AL

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#14 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.42
It just shows again that there is no real desire by those in power to create a playoff system. Frankly, that's why the heated debates over this issue are pointless. Playoffs (outside of the current 2-team playoff) are not going to happen, and those of us who think that it would really be neat if they had a playoff at the end of the season just need to get over it.



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TheOldMan
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Since: 13.2.03
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#15 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.99
I think the article works better if you read it chronologically

    Originally posted by ESPN (with a bit of editorial finesse)
    "What we learned today from my colleagues is that we see the world pretty much the same way," Machen said Friday on the final day of the annual meeting. "We see the problems in the current system.

    The basis of his proposal was to form a limited liability corporation that, much like the BCS, would work outside the framework of the NCAA. He wanted to keep the current bowl structure intact and distribute revenue to all 119 Division I-A schools instead of keeping most of the money for the schools in the six BCS conferences.

    DESTIN, Fla. -- Florida president Bernie Machen backed off his playoff football proposal after conferring with colleagues at the Southeastern Conference's spring meeting.

    Machen decided it's better to work within the confines of the current Bowl Championship Series system.

    "They are persuaded, and I am now persuaded, that the best way to proceed is to try to work within the BCS structure, to make some changes to make it better. That seems to me to be a very good way to go."


As much as the BCS may work against a loaded SEC that has a championship game that some other BCS conferences don't, they're the ones that voted to add teams, and cash in on a big TV game at the end of the season. And they sure aren't about to share the BCS pot with Tulane, Bowling Green, or even stinkin' Boise State - at least not any more than they have to.

(edited by TheOldMan on 2.6.07 1136)




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No, the stink of it is that Mike Williams DID do something wrong. He accepted benefits that were not repayable and gave him an unfair competetive advantage. Once he did that, game over. The NCAA did nothing wrong, Mike Williams did.
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