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The W - Baseball - Tying? There's no tying in baseball. (Page 2)
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haz
Landjager








Since: 2.1.02
From: Whitby, Ontario, Canada

Since last post: 43 days
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#21 Posted on
I actually don't have a problem with the game being called. As I watched the ninth, I wondered how long they would let it go...

The bigger issue to me is not naming a MVP. You just renamed the award after Ted Williams, but you go out and not give it to anyone. Just because the game ended up a tie?? Makes absolutely no sense what-so-ever.

Then again, I have stopped looking for the sense in the things baseball does anyway, so no surprise here....



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dunkndollaz
Banger








Since: 3.1.02
From: Northern NJ

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#22 Posted on
It was a "screw you" to the fans and just a pre-cursor to the even bigger "screw you" when they strike and cancel the season and series - not that I care.

Why not end it with a HR Derby to end it like a shootout - one swing per batter until you have a winner

and you can put that MVP award in the freezer with it's namesake until next year....

(edited by dunkndollaz on 10.7.02 0932)


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evilwaldo
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Since: 7.2.02
From: New York, NY

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#23 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.00
Honestly, who let Russo book this shit? It was like watching wrestling.

The whole idea of leaving a starter until the end is in case the game goes to extra innings so that the last pitcher can go for longer period of time. If a regular season game goes 15 innings both teams usually throw a starter in there because they are out of relievers.

If Padilla can't get loose that's just to bad. It's not like the Phillies are going anywhere except another level lower in the celler. Have him serve up a home run to end the game.

What a crappy way to end a great game. Selig and the dopes on ESPN deserve to be slapped for trying to justify this travesty.

Here is an idea for next year, instead of playing the game why don't we just sell the sponsership to EA Sports and we can watch the managers play the videogame.

Ranting over.






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JayJayDean
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Since: 2.1.02
From: Seattle, WA

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Y!:
#24 Posted on
I knew it was going to be a tie when they got past the 9th because of the money tied up in the pitchers. I don't have a problem with them calling the game, but they were pretty stupid to announce it to the crowd over the P.A. Chants of "Bud must go!" in Milwaukee. Priceless.

They definitely need to take the emphasis off getting everyone in the game. It's not like the guys we want to see trying to win the game at the end, the Bonds, Sosas, and Giambis, are even around after the fourth inning anyway. One of the ESPN guys said it best in that do we really NEED to see Randy Winn play, or every pitcher get in, including Barry Zito for one-third of an inning. I think not. I think Torre and Brenly both felt pretty stupid about it in the press conference I saw after the game, though.

You can't have guys going out there and intentionally risking their careers for a game that doesn't count though. If I own the Phillies and Padilla's arm falls off because he pitched three innings in the All-Star game instead of two then I'm going to have Selig and Brenly's body parts stuffed and mounted to the wall in my office.
edturtle
Linguica








Since: 24.1.02
From: HI in the middle, round on both ends!

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#25 Posted on
I dunno. I can see where a Randy Wynn or Robert Fick ain't exactly worth seeing but...when I was a kid and before all the cable games where you get a chance to see every team, I kinda dug the chance to see a guy from a suck-ass team in the national spotlight, that I hadn't seen play before. *shrug*

What can you do? I remember Cito Gaston getting bitched at in '93 when he didn't get Mussina in the game. Now the managers try too hard to get everyone in. Maybe they should keep back one vet/established-yet-waning-star pitcher just in case? Nolan Ryan looked in pretty good sahpe last night. I bet he could've gone another 9. :)



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estragand
Summer sausage








Since: 18.6.02

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#26 Posted on
Quick...without looking it up, recite the last five or six All-Star game scores, winners and MVP's!

Copped from my crappy website, here's my ideas:

First alternative would be to waive the pitching rule and allow pitchers to return. This would require communication and a mutual agreement between both teams.
Ask all the guys: "hey, we know this is uncharted territory, but does anyone else want to throw another inning?". Make em' sign a waiver if they were wooried about their "health". Some pitchers had already changed out of their uniforms and showered. But others, like Pittsburgh's Mike Williams, could still be seen in the dugout, in uniform, as late as the seventh inning. Surely Oakland's Barry Zito, who only pitched to ONE batter, could return to toss a few more balls, regardless of his upcoming regular-season starting assignment. Even the Cardinals' Matt Morris, who didn't play in memory of Darryl Kile, could have been forced into emergency duty. John Smoltz is a closer, nowadays, but he could have worked one more inning. The batters aren't scrubs, these are All-Stars, the best hitters in each league... so you could maybe (just maybe)
understand a pitcher's hesitation.

If pitchers refused to pitch, then ask for volunteers from the position players. It rarely happens in the regular season, but it's rather imcomprehensible to belive that
someone on the roster wouldn't get a kick out of lobbing a few balls at the All-Star game. Sure, they would be batting practice throws, but it would been intriguing and would
would almost guarantee that someone would push a run across the plate. A guy like Curt Schilling might get miffed at being lit up, but would Mike Lowell give a shit
if his ERA was 54.00?

If THAT didn't work... well, I do believe Warren Spahn was in the building.

After the pitching idea, the second alternative would be to copy a page from two of the lamest activities since scab-picking: soccer and hockey. Go to the shoot-out. Each team has a full coaching and training staff, which includes someone who can throw batting practice. Take each team's entrants from the previous night's Home Run Derby and send them out there. If those guys have already hopped a plane or showered, then take ANY of your All-Stars. Again, I find it strange that nobody on either bench wouldn't want to go out and take a few hacks. Alter the rules a bit,so the thing doesn't last two hours. Perhaps give each batter three "outs" instead of the usual ten. Maybe each team has two batters, instead of the usual four? Everybody loves a game-ending homerun, and this would have been talked about for years. Finally, somebody found a way to make a Home Run Derby matter.





-ES
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TheBucsFan
TheChiefsFan








Since: 2.1.02

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#27 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.42
    Originally posted by estragand
    Quick...without looking it up, recite the last five or six All-Star game scores, winners and MVP's


If it weren't for the fact that the Yankess always win, I couldn't tell you who won the last six World Series without REALLY thinming hard. I can't think w/o looking who they beat in 1998 or 1999, or how many game it took them to do it. So you're point is invalid, unless you were trying to say the World Series is meaningless.

(edited by TheBucsFan on 10.7.02 1502)


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spf
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Since: 2.1.02
From: The Las Vegas of Canada

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#28 Posted on

    Originally posted by kazhayashi81
    A tie in sports is like going to the prom with your sister.

    That's the reason that soccer will never catch on here. You invest all that time watching a game.. and then no one wins! A frickin draw!


Exactly, that would be as silly as if NHL games could end in a...oh wait. Well, how about if NFL games could end in a...oh, never mind.



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estragand
Summer sausage








Since: 18.6.02

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#29 Posted on
My point was: even though we're whining about a tie, do we really care who wins the All-Star game? I'm not saying a tie is okay. I wanted a decision,too. I just think it's kind of ironic.

I'd be able to recite World Series match-ups and winners from the last ten years or so, without looking it up. But, I use these things to put myself to sleep at nights. I also recall Super Bowl winners and their corresponding MVPs, WWF tag team champs from 83-93, GI Joe figures released each year, Bronco 1000 yarders and annual win-loss records, and other braindead shit. I don't get out or get laid much, either...



-ES
Visit ES online- it's "Internet Entertainment"!
TheBucsFan
TheChiefsFan








Since: 2.1.02

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#30 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.42

    Originally posted by estragand
    My point was: even though we're whining about a tie, do we really care who wins the All-Star game? I'm not saying a tie is okay. I wanted a decision,too. I just think it's kind of ironic.

    I'd be able to recite World Series match-ups and winners from the last ten years or so, without looking it up. But, I use these things to put myself to sleep at nights. I also recall Super Bowl winners and their corresponding MVPs, WWF tag team champs from 83-93, GI Joe figures released each year, Bronco 1000 yarders and annual win-loss records, and other braindead shit. I don't get out or get laid much, either...



Hey, I'm not the only one! I can recite just about every series matchup until 1987 or so. Sports (in particula baseball) history has been a passion of mine for years. But recent years don't interest me as much.



Mean Gene: "You know, I don't think it's a question - Goldberg, I don't think it's a question of who's next, I think it's a question of who's left?"
Goldberg: "No, see, that's where you're wrong. It ain't who's left, it's - WHO'S NEXT?"

"Just how hardcore am I? Well this morning, I drank milk that was two days past the expiration!"
-Norman Smiley

"She is one of them! She's CANADIAN!"
-Stevie Ray
ges7184
Lap cheong








Since: 7.1.02
From: Birmingham, AL

Since last post: 87 days
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#31 Posted on
What a sorry way to do things. But once again, this is baseball. Of course they don't plan ahead.

Here's the problem. Bud Selig had the audacity to actually say something like "Who in their wildest dreams could have imagined that the All-Star game would end in a tie." (meaning after 9 innings). Bud, it's baseball you idiot! Games going into extra innings are pretty common. So knowing that, someone with forethought could decide, if it ends in a tie, do we want to play it out or not. If not, set up a rule for the all-star game. Make it a max 9 innings, 10 innings, 11 innings, whatever. Stick to that. Announce it, and that way fans who spend their hard earn dollars going to the game, and those investing time to watch it know exactly what they are getting into BEFORE the game.

In this case, since the issue wasn't addressed, it was assumed that the game would be played in its entirety. That was the fans expectations. That is what should have happened. If they didn't want to do that, they should have addressed the issue (which, like I said, was very predictable) BEFOREHAND. Don't change the rules mid-stream. The fact that they FORGOT to award the MVP award shows how sudden the decision was. I mean, they didn't decide not to reward it, THEY FORGOT TO REWARD IT!

All this carrying on about protecting players is stupid. You risk injury by merely playing in the All-Star game, it doesn't matter how little. If you are worried about injury, DON'T PLAY. It seems that those who make this case are making a case not to have the All-Star Game at all. Maybe that is what should be done.
joepet
Tocino








Since: 17.4.02

Since last post: 2584 days
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#32 Posted on
Even though ties suck, I'm still surprised people got so bent out of shape over this. The people who spent their "hard earned money" to see the game got to see 11 innings of action for the price of 9!

Would you be upset if you went to a WWE house show where they put out 11 matches instead of the scheduled 9, but all of them ended in a time limit draw or double DQ?
TheBucsFan
TheChiefsFan








Since: 2.1.02

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#33 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.42

    Originally posted by joepet
    The people who spent their "hard earned money" to see the game got to see 11 innings of action for the price of 9


And zero winners at the price of one.


    Originally posted by joepet
    Would you be upset if you went to a WWE house show where they put out 11 matches instead of the scheduled 9, but all of them ended in a time limit draw or double DQ?


Absolutely.



Mean Gene: "You know, I don't think it's a question - Goldberg, I don't think it's a question of who's next, I think it's a question of who's left?"
Goldberg: "No, see, that's where you're wrong. It ain't who's left, it's - WHO'S NEXT?"

"Just how hardcore am I? Well this morning, I drank milk that was two days past the expiration!"
-Norman Smiley

"She is one of them! She's CANADIAN!"
-Stevie Ray
Freeway
Scrapple








Since: 3.1.02
From: Calgary

Since last post: 220 days
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#34 Posted on

    Originally posted by kazhayashi81
    A tie in sports is like going to the prom with your sister.

    That's the reason that soccer will never catch on here. You invest all that time watching a game.. and then no one wins! A frickin draw!



To quote Don Cherry, among others "A tie is like kissing your sister".

Baseball, of all sports, should NEVER end in a tie. Ever.



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Sailor: OK people, you heard the lady. Back into the hold. We'll try Canada.
[the immigrants moan]
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deadbeater
Morcilla








Since: 12.2.02
From: Parts unknown

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#35 Posted on
I reluctantly have to agree with Selig, although they should have declared an inning limit before the game.

If Derek Lowe reenters the game and blows out like Kevin Nash did, there would have been war between Massachusetts and NY.

(edited by deadbeater on 11.7.02 0020)
Sec19Row53
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Oconomowoc, WI

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Y!:
#36 Posted on

    Originally posted by JayJayDean
    I knew it was going to be a tie when they got past the 9th because of the money tied up in the pitchers. I don't have a problem with them calling the game, but they were pretty stupid to announce it to the crowd over the P.A. Chants of "Bud must go!" in Milwaukee. Priceless.


Um, I was there, and I never heard that chant. The chant that I DID hear was "Let them play" - right out of one of the Bad News Bears movies.

Was it the right call? I think so.

Should they have arrived at this point? No chance in hell. Someone should have had the "vision" to understand that you could go extra innings, so you better hold back some players.

As for a fix, you just allow position players to re-enter, and you explain to the pitchers that they won't all (likely) play. I don't think that you can ask a pitcher to re-enter once they've pitched. I think it would be too difficult to get loose.



[It's where I sit]
JayJayDean
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02
From: Seattle, WA

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#37 Posted on

    Originally posted by Sec19Row53

    Um, I was there, and I never heard that chant. The chant that I DID hear was "Let them play" - right out of one of the Bad News Bears movies.

    Was it the right call? I think so.

    Should they have arrived at this point? No chance in hell. Someone should have had the "vision" to understand that you could go extra innings, so you better hold back some players.

    As for a fix, you just allow position players to re-enter, and you explain to the pitchers that they won't all (likely) play. I don't think that you can ask a pitcher to re-enter once they've pitched. I think it would be too difficult to get loose.



I could've sworn I heard a small group of fans chanting "Bud must go" as the conference with Torre and Brenly was breaking up. I know there was a huge "Let them play" chant going.
ekedolphin
Scrapple








Since: 12.1.02
From: Indianapolis, IN; now residing in Suffolk, VA

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#38 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.52
“Exactly, that would be as silly as if NHL games could end in a...oh wait. Well, how about if NFL games could end in a...oh, never mind.”

Well... hockey is pretty much incomprehensible or stupid to your average American fan. Hell, not only are there ties, but the NHL actually differentiates between loses in regulation and losses in overtime! So there are teams with such records as 5-4-2-3. The hell? And they wonder why hockey's popularity is not nearly that of basketball or football.

And football games end in a tie an average of once every three years or so. All a team really has to do is get within field-goal range and chip it in, and that's it. So because there's more than one way to score in a football game, there's less chance of a tie because in sudden-death overtime, even a field goal will win the game.

Soccer is as unpopular in America as it is popular in the rest of the world, and I daresay part of the reason is the tie issue (although not the main reason).

But dammit, there should be no ties in basketball or baseball. That's why God invented overtimes and extra innings.

But let's get past that for just a minute and look at what is really riling up a bunch of people. Not only did the game end in a tie, but that decision was made in the middle of the 11th inning, after one team had already had its final at-bats. If they'd said from the beginning, “Game ends after x innings,” fine. But they didn't. Selig made the decision on the fly, without even allowing one of the teams to have any more at-bats.

And then, the testicularly-challenged commissioner turns around and puts the heat on the AL and NL managers! “They made the decision, I OK'ed it.” FUCK YOU, SELIG! You're their boss, not the other way around.

So, instead of adhering to an intelligent plan, Selig instead decided to suddenly announce at random, “Three more outs and that'll be the game.” Idiot. And he wonders why baseball is going down the shitter.

In the TV series Star Trek: Deep Space Nine, a back history has been established that baseball became extinct sometime in the mid-21st century (2030, or something like that). Decisions like this, plus the prospect of a strike, might end baseball far sooner.



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Alex
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Since: 24.2.02

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#39 Posted on
I wonder if that fan who sued because of the tie will actually make any money off of this. Because of the "emotional distress" the result put him through, heh.
drjayphd
Scrapple
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Since: 22.4.02
From: Long Island

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#40 Posted on
You shoulda seen TalkBack Live... they had that guy on the phone and everyone on the show and in the audience ripped him new ones. He tried to compare it to his ratting out Michigan in 1996 (which was good investigative journalism), then when that didn't work, took up the flag of "baseball has serious problems, I'm trying to expose him". You can imagine that it was as hard to argue and not come across as a dick as the whole terrorism issue without looking unpatriotic. Of course baseball has issues, and we don't need your dumbass lawsuit to tell us so.
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