i'm in there... 15 isn't bad considering that there isn't too many that check out the basketball forum it seems....
gonzaga should have had a higher seed. the committee goofed that up. imo gonzaga is just as good as arizona, miami, and ohio st. i mean they are ranked #6 in the country the last time i checked. that should say something. if your in the top 15 in the country there is no way you should be lower than a 4 seed.... and they were #6.
Okay... I've worked up a little formula and applied it to all the 65 - now 64 - teams in the field. First off, the weakest - according to the TWF (as I called it) - out of the top 4 is Alabama. I can tend to support that, as they were only 9-7 away from home this year; I mean, 19-0 at home is awesome, and if the tourney was being played on 'Bama's home court, I'd say they win it all, but it's not. They'll play a very good, very underrated Kent State team in the second round, and lose to them. You heard it here first.
Ser, I'm guessing you didn't read the latest "How the Committee Screwed Gonzaga" dispatch. Supposedly, even if they had gone undefeated over the entire regular season, they wouldn't have gotten any higher than a 4 seed. Now chew on that.
For a more complete analysis, check the "Bracket Thoughts" thread, 'cause I am NOT typing that much again. As usual, the gun is ready to shoot myself in the foot.
Actually i have a post or two in the bracket thoughts thread. I was just stating my opinion in response to how someone seemed to think that it would be bad to have Gonzaga at a higher seed. It would have moved certain teams down. I agree with most everything you posted in both threads.
"I was just stating my opinion in response to how someone seemed to think that it would be bad to have Gonzaga at a higher seed. It would have moved certain teams down."
That was me. I still don't think they should be any higher than a 5 or 6 in their bracket. If the main factor were rankings then Uconn wouldn't have come close to a 2 seed as they were #24 (#19 in the other) two weeks ago. Then they won the conference tourney. If the conference tourney matters that much, I don't see how you put Gonzaga ahead of Cincy, Oklahoma, Arizona, or Ohio State, who all are in better confrences and all won the conference tourney. If Gonzaga is going to be out west with those teams they deserve a 5 or 6. Another point I made was that moving Gonzaga as high as a 3 wouldnt make much difference. As long as they beat the team they are supposed to in round one, round two would be just as tough. If Gonzaga is three and you move everyone down, and the teams that are supposed to win do, in round two you would have Gonzaga/Miami. Miami beat six teams who are in the tourney including #2 seed UConn. Gonzaga beat five teams including Pepperdine twice. If Gonzaga weren't out West i could see them as high as a four, but in the west I think they got what they deserved.
(edited by mskj on 13.3.02 1817)
Ohio State is your Big Ten Champion. And they beat Michigan three times.
Originally posted by mskjIf the conference tourney matters that much, I don't see how you put Gonzaga ahead of Cincy, Oklahoma, Arizona, or Ohio State, who all are in better confrences and all won the conference tourney.
Ah, but see, conference tournaments don't mean that much. If they did, then Oklahoma would have been a #1 seed.
"and don't ask me who i am...cause you don't want to know... don't ask me who i am...just sit back and watch the show..." - Andy Happel
Since I can't get 'em into the Yahoo bracket, here is a summary of my picks:
South Region: Upsets: (11) Penn over (6) Cal, (10) Kent State over (7) Oklahoma State Regional Finals: (1) Duke over (2) Alabama
West Region: Upsets: (10) Hawaii over (7) Xavier, 2nd round: (6) Gonzaga over (3) Arizona Regional Finals: (2) Oklahoma over (1) Cincinnati
East Region: Upsets: (13) Valparaiso over (4) Kentucky, (11) So. Illinois over (6) Texas Tech, 2nd round: (8) Wisconsin over (1) Maryland Regional Finals: (2) Connecticut over (5) Marquette
Midwest Region: Upsets: (12) Creighton over (5) Florida, (11) Boston College over (6) Texas, (10) Pepperdine over (7) Wake Forest, 2nd round: (11) Boston College over (3) Mississippi State, (10) Pepperdine over (2) Oregon Regional Finals: (1) Kansas over (11) Boston College
National Semifinals: Kansas over Connecticut, Duke over Oklahoma Finals: Duke over Kansas
mskj.... i agree you have some valid points. But the seeding isn't just based on how teams did in their own conference. Just like rankings it's only part of the equation. I still feel Gonzaga should have been higher. If you couldn't make them higher in that region then why not a different region where they could have been a 4 or a 3 seed?
"If you couldn't make them higher in that region then why not a different region where they could have been a 4 or a 3 seed?"
That is a good question. If Gonzaga were in the East they could be the #4 seed. And they would probably last longer than Kentucky will with that seed. Looking at my braket, I'd say make Gonzaga the East #4, Kentucky the South #5, and Indiana the West #6. But thats just my opinion.
The only reason i can think of that Gonzaga is out West is that the tourney was trying to keep teams closer to home this year. At least they said so. I wonder if Gonzaga were the East #4, would they be upset because they have to go across the county to play?
I think stuff like where you have to play shouldn't matter so much to teams. You still have to win six games. That is why i haven't complained yet about the Buckeyes getting a four out west, while a team they beat twice (Illinois) gets to play as a four seed in Chicago. All the complaining Jim Obrien is doing is probably going to hurt the teams chances. Last time the Buckeyes were a four seed they made it all the way to the final four. I am banking on them doing it again in my brackets this year. Now watch them lose to Davidson today.
Ohio State is your Big Ten Champion. And they beat Michigan three times.
That raises a good question. Would Gonzaga have complained about traveling if they had a higher seed somewhere else? I know some teams complain about it and some dont.
I wonder what happened to cause Duke to have such an easy path again. I'm not saying the teams in that region aren't good but i dont think they are the best out of all the picks. I just dont think the bracket was balanced that well. If you need to have schools travel to balance the games and the seedings then have them travel. I guess that's my own opinion.
I think kentucky has probably the most talented set of players out there. But their main problem is that they dont seem to have the team chemistry and thats a shame.
I think Gonzaga ended up out west because of the S-curve deal; they were the strongest 6 seed, so they get the West bracket. Kind of a screwy deal, I would think. Besides, let's say you give Gonzaga the East 4 seed. Directionally speaking, that doesn't make much sense - about as much as Indiana in the Midwest. (I'd say rotate Florida and Indiana location-wise.)
Please don't get me started on Kentucky. I have not liked the way their team worked this year at all. As you said, all the talent, none of the work, none of the chemistry. I place more emphasis on those last 2 than the first.
Gonzaga hurt me a little too Zim. But if they had won and UCLA wins today then you would have been looking really sweet in the west. On any given day.... I just dont think Gonzaga brought their A-game.
I suspect it's a health issue. I've never cared for Lute, but I hate to see anyone in poor health. I'm totally WAG'ing here, but he built this program from scratch and like cubsfan said - the scenario with O'Neill and letting Josh Pastner et al.