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The W - Pro Wrestling - Raw #1056 8/19/13
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It's False
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Since: 20.6.02
From: I am the Tag Team Champions!

Since last post: 8 days
Last activity: 21 hours
#1 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.38
Welcome to 1999, as the McMahon-Helmsley Era begins again. Let's welcome your cast of characters.

Triple H as "Triple H"
Stephanie McMahon as "Stephanie McMahon"
Vince McMahon as "Vince McMahon"
Brad Maddox as "Shane McMahon"
Daniel Bryan as "Stone Cold Mick Foley"
The Shield as "Degeneration X"
Dolph Ziggler as "The Rock"
The Big Show as "The Big Show"
and Randy Orton as "The Beaver"

Yup, it was the bad old times all over again, right down to the pointless handicap matches, which we'll probably see about 100 more of for the next year or so. I don't fault the endgame here, which is pretty clearly that they're serious about Daniel Bryan in the main event. But this story is just so old hat that I can't get excited about it anymore. You can only tell the exact same McMahon Master Plan story so many times before it just feels old. The only real difference was that instead of starting the show with a 20-minute Triple H promo, they ENDED the show with a 20-minute Triple H promo.

Luckily, there were a few other things that I did like. The Punk/Heyman story continued to be told effectively, thanks to Punk selling and Curtis Axel turning in his own high-caliber performance.

Alberto Del Rio polished off Sin Cara, after he injured himself AGAIN on a dive. Del Rio delivered his same promo from last night calling himself the hero of the Latino people, which brought out Ricardo Rodriguez for rebuttal. Ricardo said he has a new client and when he started rolling his R's, I could have SWORN that this would cue Rey's big return, but instead...he said Rob Van Dam! Well, I didn't see that coming, but turning Ricardo into Bill Alfonso certainly isn't the worst idea in the world.

We have an interesting situation with the Prime Time Players, as they've been essentially turned babyface...without any explanation. Yup, they played the babyface role against the Tea Party Patriots to a tee, but NOBODY addressed the big elephant in the room. On the plus side, Young looked genuinely moved at the end of the match and I couldn't help but feel happy for the guy.

And that's all I've got. Except that Raw hasn't COMPLETELY timewarped to 1999. That Los Matadores bit (the vignette AND the gimmick!) looked like it was pulled straight out of 1993. Has Tito Santana not taught anyone ANYTHING?

(edited by It's False on 19.8.13 2030)

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John Orquiola
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Since: 28.2.02
From: Boston

Since last post: 128 days
Last activity: 92 days
#2 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.17
CM Punk and Paul Heyman (and Curtis Axel) exist in their own universe, which is the Cool Bad Ass WWE Universe that belongs only to them, where Punk can swear and call out fat guys at ringside. They had the only must see segment.

I live tweeted RAW (twitter.com) and I'll spare imbedding any of it.

RAW gets a *solid* B+. (That's a joke.) But Triple H did say one thing that I agreed with: we deserved an A+. Unfortunately, we didn't get what we deserve.



"Cody, I mustache you a question." - The Miz
DirtyMikeSeaver
Boudin rouge








Since: 19.5.02
From: Toronto

Since last post: 80 days
Last activity: 80 days
#3 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.97
To play into the story, why was Mark Henry on the stage just standing there? Doesn't he hate The Shield? Didn't his tag partner get beaten up? Why wouldn't he help Daniel Bryan?

Hey, if you're watching a fight and someone gets the tar beaten out of them for 11 rounds, and then in the 12th, they get a lucky punch and win, does that mean that the other guy got his comeuppance?

Well, at least John Cena will be back in 4 months to get his revenge on the McMahons.

(Funniest thing was that "The McMahons" and "The Shield" were trending. I almost forgot that Randy Orton was champ)



Kevin Kelly: "Mr. Austin, would you like to comment on Wade Keller's Take that endorsing the XFL hurts your anti-authority character?"

Steve Austin: "Oh shit, he actually said that? I thought the boys in the back were ribbing me!"

Kelly: "No, he really said that. Did they tell you the part about you sitting in the stands, looking all skeptical?"

Austin: "AHAHAHAHAHAHA. Yeah... oh man that was too much."
Hokienautic
Liverwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: Blacksburg VA

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 1 hour
#4 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.83
    Originally posted by John Orquiola
    CM Punk and Paul Heyman (and Curtis Axel) exist in their own universe, which is the Cool Bad Ass WWE Universe that belongs only to them, where Punk can swear and call out fat guys at ringside. They had the only must see segment.

    I live tweeted RAW (twitter.com) and I'll spare imbedding any of it.

    RAW gets a *solid* B+. (That's a joke.) But Triple H did say one thing that I agreed with: we deserved an A+. Unfortunately, we didn't get what we deserve.


I was convinced we were going to get an Earthquake redux with the number of times they referenced that fat guy at ringside. Sadly, no.
JustinShapiro
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Since: 12.12.01
From: Pittsburgh, PA

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 13 min.
#5 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.83
This show reminded me of the Raw after Austin left for a year to have his neck fusion. Plug Rock into the machine, keep things rolling.

Loved the opening segment. I thought Daniel and, god help me, Stephanie were both excellent in setting up A New Journey. Established the stakes, made Bryan a stoic and noble hero. It seemed to perfectly set the stage for Bryan's badass comeback at the end of the show, but ...

... they went with the heat. And Triple H talking forever. OK. I do like angles where the one embattled guy declares war on the whole mafia and takes them out one-by-one. Look out, Brad.

It's kind of tragic that Vince is now the Patterson and the Brisco of the Factgime. Mortality.

Good for the Shield to get put back in an important position. It's too bad that Kane is in the Wyatt feud and out for the movie now, because Kane would be a perfect best friend dude for all the tag matches. Would've fit Sheamus' nice guy routine too. Oh well. DB, Ziggler, Henry, and Show (who can do whatever he wants to the bosses w/ his no-cut contract) as the new Union.

Cena says goodbye for 4-6 months, always divide those TV timelines by 2 so it seems like they made a superhuman recovery. That's still three or four PPVs for Bryan and Punk to carry (there's two in October). Cena already did the "surprise Rumble return win" thing once.

Curtis Axel tried his best, but Paul's going to need another Paul Heyman Guy. Maybe Punk's new great enemy, Fat Fan, will come out of the crowd like Earthqu

    Originally posted by Hokienautic
    I was convinced we were going to get an Earthquake redux with the number of times they referenced that fat guy at ringside. Sadly, no.


DAMN IT

Alberto Del Rio's great rival, the high-flying hero to the Latino people R






ob Van Dam. Sure. Vintage Sin Cara -- what made that scenario and Alberto's pissiness extra-funny was Del Rio supposedly dislikes Mistico going back. (confirm/deny CUBS? apocryphal internet myth repetition?)

GIRL, BYE. That referee was so close to being fucked on another divas finish.

Los Matadores, omg. Big feud coming up with Bull Buchanan and Johnny Stamboli.

I thought Ryback was going to beat up all the Foot Locker shoes.

(edited by JustinShapiro on 20.8.13 0002)
thecubsfan
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Since: 10.12.01
From: Aurora, IL

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 59 min.
#6 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.33
I really thought this, the 18th time they've done the match, would be the time Sin Cara would beat Alberto Del Rio.

I only like talking about the very unimportant...

They were not at all subtle about wanting us to chant 'Ole!' at the Matadors, which means someone's been watching the Sami Zayn matches and taken the wrong thing.

It was much more mixed on what we were supposed to make of them. It was fairly obvious it was the Colons under masks, yet there were those masks. Why have the masks if their Twitter is even revealing their identities?

Also mixed - where do they exactly fit in the strangely crowded tag team division? Big Show & Mark Henry, the Usos and (at least for the moment) PTP all seem set up for title shots. That's probably good news if you're the Shield, but doesn't leave much room for a big debut run for a 'new' team. They didn't seem like rule breakers in the skit, but they would seem to be behind the Wyatts there.

---

Edit: spent most of the first segment looking at my computer and listening to the show, and thought the "solid B+" line was great. I was actually looking up for the replay later, and it was not nearly as good. Stephanie is still Stephanie.

But nothing beats Layla's acting in the women's tag. Amazing. And I guess doing fake ref screwups to mess with the internet = $$$$

(edited by thecubsfan on 19.8.13 2303)


thecubsfan.com - luchablog
Hokienautic
Liverwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: Blacksburg VA

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 1 hour
#7 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.83
    Originally posted by JustinShapiro
    Loved the opening segment, I thought Daniel and, god help me, Stephanie were both excellent in setting up A New Journey. Established the stakes, made Bryan a stoic and noble hero.


I was a little surprised that she didn't turn on Bryan a bit, try to pull the "Hey, I *tried* to help you become a champion we could all be proud of, but you crapped all over that -- YOU GAVE US NO CHOICE!"
BigDaddyLoco
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Since: 2.1.02

Since last post: 3 days
Last activity: 4 hours
#8 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.82
I thought we were going to get off easy when Helmsley said he wasn't going to explain his whole reasoning of why he did what he did. Ten minutes later he was still talking.

I don't like what they are doing with The Shield right now.

It is a weird time. I like a lot if the roster, but I don't like what most of them are doing or not doing.

thecubsfan
Scrapple
Moderator








Since: 10.12.01
From: Aurora, IL

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 59 min.
#9 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.33
There was a moment in Stephanie's speech, she was explaining why they had to do it to Bryan, where I thought they were about to go very meta. "Randy Orton had to beat you, Daniel - we just see a lot more money in you chasing the title then being champion."


    Vintage Sin Cara -- what made that scenario and Alberto's pissiness extra-funny was Del Rio supposedly dislikes Mistico going back. (confirm/deny CUBS? apocryphal internet myth repetition?)


There's a story Konnan tells about Mistico or Mistico's people threatening Alberto with a gun in a locker room long ago. It's a locker room story so who knows. A lot more people talked about how Alberto was very unhappy when he found out Sin Cara was coming to the WWE and trying to stop it on both sides (putting in bad word with WWE, warning CMLL Mistico was jumping) though neither obviously worked.

But all of that was years ago now, and only they know how a few years of Alberto being a Big Deal and Sin Cara being Definitely Not A Big Deal might have changed their relationship. ADR might have just been upset about the segment getting messed up.

It also might have just been old habits. Attacking a guy who's being treated by medics, *especially* if it's a legit injury, is standard practice in Mexico. It never makes sense to me, but the guys carrying the stretcher usually have to shove away the rivals at the same time.



thecubsfan.com - luchablog
CruelAngel777
Frankfurter








Since: 7.4.02

Since last post: 22 hours
Last activity: 21 hours
#10 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.79
I am soo on board for the Daniel Bryan revenge world tour and the CM Punk II: Back to the Revengance fall lineup we are getting ready to witness.

Man I remember seeing Bryan Danielson in the first main event in Ring of Honor history in a triple threat with Low-Ki and pre-appletini Christopher Daniels around 2004. It's surreal to see him in the biggest storyline in the biggest wrestling company in the world, as one of the most over guys on the roster in 2013. I'm so hyped to see where this goes.

Fuck you fat guy for being to vocal!

The Shield had a busy night tonight. I kind of like them being dogs for hire as it fits the mercenary vibe these guys have. Plus them pissing off Show, Henry, and Ziggler pretty much guarantees them joining Team G.O.A.T. at Survivor Series.

Did Sin Cara legit injure himself again? Time to cut losses and bring in Sami Zayn or anybody slumming it on NXT that can walk down the ramp without hurting themselves for 6 months.

(edited by CruelAngel777 on 19.8.13 2144)


I believe in The Shield....
Moss
Kishke








Since: 23.9.10
From: Calgary, AB

Since last post: 82 days
Last activity: 5 days
#11 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.07
If this Ricardo/RVD is going to work RR needs to announce him as Robertooooooooo.

Handicap match vs Shield is the new Kane for the "you pissed off the boss" opponent.



BORK LASER PLS
Big Bad
Scrapple








Since: 4.1.02
From: Dorchester, Ontario

Since last post: 3 days
Last activity: 2 days
#12 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.72
This worked in the sense that I legitimately wanted Bryan to destroy the entire McMahon/Helmsley Factgime by the end of the show, but man, I feel like we'll get a lot of these segments over the next several months. We've gone from a Raw where virtually every show ends with Cena sending the crowd home happy by beating a heel into a Raw where the heels almost always get one over on poor Daniel Bryan.

So it's Bryan, Ziggler, Big Show and I guess Henry (and I agree, he should've been down there at the end to help DB) teaming up against the McMaHHHons and Orton. The way the Shield were kicking everyone's ass all night, they could've at least had them take out Cena and create a better excuse for his absence.

I had to laugh at Ricardo coming off a suspension for pot and then getting paired up with the most notorious stoner in wrestling.



"It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone." --- Bart Giamatti, on baseball
El Nastio
Andouille








Since: 14.1.02
From: Ottawa Ontario, by way of Walkerton

Since last post: 10 days
Last activity: 1 day
ICQ:  
#13 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.42
Opening promo set the tone for the angle, and some seeds have been planted.

First off, Punk is busy with Heyman still. He might show up later, but I doubt it. Punk's been made already, to keep Bryan going Punk doesn't need to be in the picture. But there's someone else who could stand to benefit....

Ziggler has been vocal on different sites including WWE.com. The latter was used as justification for the handicap match. It's a matter of time I think before he gets roped into this, and I could see him being elevated.

Henry and Show both have beef with the Shield. One of these days Bryan and Ziggler are going to get beat down, and wigs gonna get split.

Overall, this show was all about planting the seeds. Injuries aside, they're playing the long game now.



"You can't put a price on integrity"
SKLOKAZOID
Bratwurst








Since: 20.3.02
From: California

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 3 hours
AIM:  
#14 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.45
I say this sincerely and without ANY hint of irony: One thing that I feel has always worked without fail in wrestling is a very large and powerful heel stable going up against a very over and sympathetic babyface, who rallies his friends to wage war with the heels.

SEE: Every non-Dungeon of Doom War Games match ever, Sting/Dusty vs the 4 Horsemen, Sting/Luger/Giant vs the nWo*, Steve Austin vs The Corporation, and The Nexus feud (however short-lived that was, it was GREAT during the summer).

All WWE has to do is not mess it up. Okay, that last sentence had a little bit of irony to it.

(* The various post-98 incarnations of the nWo only didn't work because the nWo feud had outworn its welcome and had climaxed, it was still an angle that worked up to that point)

I have no idea what Night of Champions is going to be like, but if the new PPV is called "Battleground," it would be awesome if they brought War Games back and had Orton/The Shield vs Bryan/Ziggler/Show/Henry. Just putting it out there.


Listen, I still love the new WWE Title belt and am unabashedly going to talk about it whenever I can. Looks great on Orton. Looks great on just about everybody. I hope he stays champion until WrestleMania and drops it in an epic title match.


Heyman needs some new guys for sure. It's nice that he has the Intercontinental Champion, and I'm still pulling for Axel to be a force, but he needs a returning Batista or someone to really be his muscle when Brock isn't around.


I didn't mind The Shield's use this week. Definite improvement from last week. YES, WWE. Their gimmick is that they're MERCENARIES. Keep emphasizing that. They're MERCENARIES. They're not three guys who are out to prove they're "the best," they're not serving any sort of cause. They're hired guns. They also happen to have belts to prove their qualifications, but that's an afterthought.

Think of them like a more serious version of the APA and stick with it. I like this way of portraying them.

Before, it was Heyman who was using them. This week, it looked more like HHH/Vince was using them. Hell, have Christian hire them to help him beat Del Rio or something to show that they're completely morally neutral.

Then, have one of them grow a conscious when the other two go too far and split 'em up at WrestleMania. Bam. Something that works.


Even though it's still not perfect, WWE really has been on a great course since roughly May/June and SummerSlam did everything it needed to jump start people into roles that fit, and have some legitimately emotionally engaging storylines. The WWE Title feels way more important now, especially since it's clear it's THE prize, and there's a lot of great attention being given to the midcard. The McMahons even seem relevant at the moment, but of course they usually let that go to their heads.

Anyway, I'm into it. Great shows.


EDIT: So, is the story that HHH didn't want Maddox to screw Daniel Bryan, that he wanted to personally do it himself and that Maddox is just too spineless to stand up to the McMahons after eating the Pedigree? I think they should have just set up the guest ref thing differently and this might have actually had an explanation I'd have bought.

(edited by SKLOKAZOID on 19.8.13 2318)
Lexus
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Stafford, VA

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 1 day
AIM:  
#15 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.71
It's been said you could reuse the same storylines from a decade ago and it could work seemlessly. I think the WWE is proving that. Nostalgia glasses put down, and lord knows I own a pair like most here, what I saw tonight shows a lot of promise. Besides, a successful Austin redux with a guy who has little in common with Austin while addressing the notion 'WWE only pushes big guys' sounds like what most of us have been waiting years for.

Why did they keep showing the Eye of Sauron every time they discussed Randy Orton's "coronation"?

Maybe with Orton getting the nod as the Corporate guy there's less irony to Ricardo being with RVD than we think. Besides setting up RVD/Alberto all fall.

Ryback is still bizarrely entertaining in his role. Even with the Nelson Muntz vest to hammer it all home how much of a bully he is. I'm interested to see what it all is setting up for.

I like Cody and Sandow, but these guys need to work with others to generate some kind of reaction.



"Laugh and the world laughs with you. Frown and the world laughs at you."
-Me.
Tyler Durden
Frankfurter








Since: 22.2.04
From: Frankfurt, Germany

Since last post: 17 hours
Last activity: 5 hours
#16 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.62
    Originally posted by It's False
    Welcome to 1999, as the McMahon-Helmsley Era begins again. Let's welcome your cast of characters.

    Triple H as "Triple H"
    Stephanie McMahon as "Stephanie McMahon"
    Vince McMahon as "Vince McMahon"
    Brad Maddox as "Shane McMahon"
    Daniel Bryan as "Stone Cold Mick Foley"
    The Shield as "Degeneration X"
    Dolph Ziggler as "The Rock"
    The Big Show as "The Big Show"
    and Randy Orton as "The Beaver"


In my opinion, WWE now feels more like WWF in late 1998/early 1999, right after Rock won the championship at Survivor Series:

Summerslam 2013 = Survivor Series 1998
Daniel Bryan = Stone Cold and - at Summerslam - Mick Foley (in one person)
Randy Orton = The Rock
Vince Mc Mahon = Vince Mc Mahon
Triple H = Shane Mc Mahon
The Shield = The Big Boss Man

All they now need, to drag this out till Wrestlemania XV ... I mean XXX, is a guy (a Mick Foley) for Orton to feud with till then. How about Christian?



#WatchROH
Amos Cochran
Bratwurst








Since: 28.8.09

Since last post: 3 days
Last activity: 2 days
#17 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.74
Call me crazy, but maybe they should pull the trigger early on that Wyatt Family face turn. Imagine doing a repeat of that February 2000 Raw - HHH tells Bryan he has two hours to find partners for an eight-man against Orton and the Shield. Cue the Shield eliminating Ziggler, Show and Henry backstage. We get to main event time, Bryan walks to the ring to face the heel team alone, and...the lights go out.

"...we're here."

Tell me the place wouldn't go nuts for that.
Big Bad
Scrapple








Since: 4.1.02
From: Dorchester, Ontario

Since last post: 3 days
Last activity: 2 days
#18 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.72

    I say this sincerely and without ANY hint of irony: One thing that I feel has always worked without fail in wrestling is a very large and powerful heel stable going up against a very over and sympathetic babyface, who rallies his friends to wage war with the heels.



    Call me crazy, but maybe they should pull the trigger early on that Wyatt Family face turn. Imagine doing a repeat of that February 2000 Raw - HHH tells Bryan he has two hours to find partners for an eight-man against Orton and the Shield. Cue the Shield eliminating Ziggler, Show and Henry backstage. We get to main event time, Bryan walks to the ring to face the heel team alone, and...the lights go out.

    "...we're here."

    Tell me the place wouldn't go nuts for that.


Just to add to this train of thought, I had a wild idea that when Bryan was getting beaten down by Shield/Orton/HHH, you'd suddenly see Barrett, Young, Gabriel and Slater rush the ring and boom, Nexus 3.0.



"It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone." --- Bart Giamatti, on baseball
lotjx
Scrapple








Since: 5.9.08

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 1 hour
#19 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.12
Ugh.



The Wee Baby Sheamus.Twitter: @realjoecarfley its a bit more toned down there. A bit.
Amos Cochran
Bratwurst








Since: 28.8.09

Since last post: 3 days
Last activity: 2 days
#20 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.74
I know, Bryan as the company's top babyface taking on the entire world. WHAT ARE THEY THINKING.
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