I'd say that there were idelogical barbs in most of the posts and replies on this board. But that's how the political world operates beyond cyberspace and this board. Ever watch a debate and realize that this is what it boils down to:
Candidate A: I support good government, my oppostiion wants to slash these programs for working people.
Candidate B: I do support these programs, just in a way that is better. And Canidate B is an asshole.
Candidate A: Candidate B voted against these issues before. Candidate B is therefore a liar and a jackass. So there.
And we don't nearly delve into the personal attacks that real life politicos do. This is not Frank Lautenburg v Doug Forrester, Gray Davis v Bill Simon, or Bret Hart v Shawn Michaels.
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I dunno. I've been reading the posts for months, and though the majority of posters try to break down their arguments, some just make a minor point and call the other guy a jackass.
Also, I think a lot of initial posts start things in the wrong direction. For instance, if you link to an article, then follow it with "this shows what a bunch of assholes [name a group] are", flaming is sure to follow. However, if you say "this is just wrong/bad policy/etc" you tend to get a better discussion.
Then again, there are some posters whose reason for living seems to be to turn threads to the Dark Side. Is there any way to ban individuals from posting in certain forums?
I personally apologize because I know I'm guilty of this as much as anyone else. I don't know what it is about politics. We can discuss anything else on this board and, generally, things remain calm. (Grimis's example notwithstanding, although some jerkoff newbie started that.) I know I piss people off as much as they piss me off, but I personally will refrain from any personal attacks in the future and hope the others do the same.
Of course, something like that is said at the beginning of every election, and it usually lasts, what, two weeks?
The Pennsylvania Governer election has pretty much gone like this.
MIKE FISHER: Ed Rendell is a douchebag. ED RENDELL: I am not a douchebag, but on several instances, Mike Fisher has proven to be a douchebag. MIKE FISHER: Oh yeah, well here's videotape of Ed Rendell saying "I am a douchebag." ED RENDELL: That video was taken totally out of context and, besides, Mike Fisher is the real douchebag. MIKE FISHER: Oh yeah, well, um, I'm from Pittsburgh!
I, for one, would like to see this forum try and go a week without using the words Democrat, Republican, Liberal, Conservative, Left, or Right. It does seem like you can't mention a single idea anymore without it turning into a Party war....
A Current Issues Forum would be a lot better then. Perhaps, maybe then, you could actually discuss, I don't know, Current Issues without people having "Well, your a Republican, so you are wrong" to fall back on, among others. You might actually get decent debates/conversations that way.
Don't get me wrong, Fletch, I have seen it both ways, but it DOES HAPPEN. Every single time one of the threads loses total control it is because it turns into a "Your a Democrat, YOU are wrong! NO! You are a Republican, YOU are wrong!" debate. Ah... the failings of a 2 party system... Maybe the politics forum needs a moderator...
(edited by Pool-Boy on 29.10.02 1456) Craig Reade "Pool Boy"Detroit Lions! 2-5!
Originally posted by El NastioA current issues forum could also still maintain the political stuff as well, it's just that it could also have threads that don't happen to have it in them....or doesn't HAVE to have it in them.
I thought that was what the Random forum was for.
I want you to know, I agree with everything I've just said.
Originally posted by Pool-BoyDon't get me wrong, Fletch, I have seen it both ways, but it DOES HAPPEN. Every single time one of the threads loses total control it is because it turns into a "Your a Democrat, YOU are wrong! NO! You are a Republican, YOU are wrong!" debate. Ah... the failings of a 2 party system... Maybe the politics forum needs a moderator...
(edited by Pool-Boy on 29.10.02 1456)
I've never said "you're a Republican so you are wrong". All I've said is "You are Pool-Boy, so you are wrong."
A joke! A joke! The little smiley means it's a joke!!!
lol I know, I know... and even if you YOURSELF have not said those exact words (and I don't think those exact words are ever actually used)... someone ends up meaning that. I mean, the end of most of these threads ends up being a party battle, and whenever something becomes so partisan, it always boils down to "You are ____, so you are wrong" Fill in your favorite party name in the blank....
Originally posted by MoeGatesDemocrat, Republican, Liberal, Conservative, Left, or Right.
This is the politics forum. If we aren't talking about Democrats, Republicans, Conservatives, Liberals, Left and Right, then it's just the "Current Issues" forum.
I have political views and ideals but do not label myself as any of those that you listed.
You can debate the merits of an idea without declaring it to be a "liberal" or "conservative" idea.
Mean Gene: "You know, I don't think it's a question - Goldberg, I don't think it's a question of who's next, I think it's a question of who's left?" Goldberg: "No, see, that's where you're wrong. It ain't who's left, it's - WHO'S NEXT?"
"Just how hardcore am I? Well this morning, I drank milk that was two days past the expiration!" -Norman Smiley
This is a wonderful, thoughtful rebuttal. I wouldn't think very much of Gonzalez if he said "I don't trust Obama because he's a Democrat," and I doubt you would either, but that's pretty much exactly what you've done.