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The W - Movies & TV - The West Wing
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The Goon
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Since: 2.1.02
From: Calgary, Alberta, Canada

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#1 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.08
I've never heard of a season finale so early-the 6th of April? Do I have to wait five-and-a-half months before I see a new episode?

That out of the way, I thought the episode was really well done. I was hanging as to who was going to win until Santos' speech at the end. And that was quite the turn to see Ed O' Neill's character throw the monkey wrench into the Democratic convention. (I kept thinking, "President Al Bundy".)

The other story arc is pointing towards CJ as the leak in the West Wing, which will make for some interesting fallout.

I enjoyed the final scene, with Arnold Vinick(Alan Alda) watching the Dems' ticket of Santos/McGarry, and simply saying, "Okay, let's win this thing."

Unlike real election campaigns, I am seriously looking forward to this one.
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Grimis
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Since: 11.7.02
From: MD

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#2 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.29
Somehow, I've had Leo pegged as Santos' running mate for a couple of weeks. It almost has a Bush-Cheney feel to it; young guy from Texas with a old white guy who has been in Washington for 100 years.
    Originally posted by The Goon
    The other story arc is pointing towards CJ as the leak in the West Wing, which will make for some interesting fallout.
It does point to CJ, but I don't think it will actually be CJ. It might be Toby considering what he said when CJ asked him what he would do had it been his brother on the Space Station.

The ending with Vinick was awesome.



I complained to another Liberal friend about some of the Left’s tone concerning the 2004 elections. I thought it insulting to hear those “red state” voters caricatured as red-necked rubes. My friend asked, “Well, don’t you think that people who live in large urban areas, who travel and read and speak other languages are better able to make informed choices?” It turns out it is superiority, not familiarity, which breeds contempt. - Pat Sajak
Matt Tracker
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Since: 8.5.03
From: North Carolina

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#3 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.55
Anyone remember the "Leo as VP" conversation when they had to replace Hoynes? The staff joked about his alcholism, and Leo asked them if they really believed administration heavies didn't toss back a few in bad times.

Before I can even ask "what about his heart," I think of Cheney.



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DrDirt
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Since: 8.10.03
From: flyover country

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#4 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.22
It's got to be Toby. Also, did anyone think they were telling the Dems what they should have done to win in 2004? Makes for fun TV to watch but no real basis as to reality.



Perception is reality
Bullitt
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Since: 11.1.02
From: Houston

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#5 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.54
Great finale indeed.

I never thought Leo would accept the VP nomination...too much baggage, health issues, etc...will certainly make for an exciting first few episodes come September.



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Since: 17.11.03
From: Tallahassee, FL

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#6 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.72
    Originally posted by Bullitt
    Great finale indeed.

    I never thought Leo would accept the VP nomination...too much baggage, health issues, etc...will certainly make for an exciting first few episodes come September.


And this is a rough sketch of just the stuff we know of:

-Recovering alcoholic/pill addict (known, referred to as the worst-kept secret in the beltway), had relapse less than 2 years later (unknown, but it came dangerously close to exposition)

-Assisted in the cover-up of Bartlet's MS (association)

-Co-conspired in the murder of Abdul Shareef (Bartlet took the public accountability during the Zoey arc, but guilty by association)

-Suffered heart attack (public record)

-Has a sister who as principal had students arrested for praying during a football game and used the incident as positionary grandstanding (public)

-Although Leo (that we know) was personally innocent, has ties to a defense contractor that committed impropriety in order to recieve certain dfense contracts (public).

-Divorced (public record)

-As WH COS, may have overstepped the 22nd Amendment while Bartlet was temporarily incapacitated after being shot by being the one who made executive decisions (unknown).



(edited by Blanket Jackson on 7.4.05 1432)


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redsoxnation
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Since: 24.7.02

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#7 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.79
    Originally posted by Matt Tracker
    Anyone remember the "Leo as VP" conversation when they had to replace Hoynes? The staff joked about his alcholism, and Leo asked them if they really believed administration heavies didn't toss back a few in bad times.

    Before I can even ask "what about his heart," I think of Cheney.






Also, go back to Season 4 Finale when Josh points at the picture of Leo and the President and asks Charlie what he thinks of him as VP.
ON why the season ended early: NBC is running End of the World/Revelations/The History Channel in the West Wing time slot the next few weeks.
Maybe I've watched to much M*A*S*H through the years, but Alan Alda portraying a Republican doesn't pass the smell test. Sure, he was a Republican President in Canadian Bacon, but it still doesn't seem right. And, in a West Wing/M*A*S*H comparison, when does Rob Lowe legally change his name to McClain Stevenson?
As for Leo as VP: If there was a doubt which party was winning the Presidency next season, that doubt is now gone. They have way to much of the current cast invested with Santos to completely flip the show.
Grimis
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Since: 11.7.02
From: MD

Since last post: 1306 days
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#8 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.29
    Originally posted by redsoxnation
    As for Leo as VP: If there was a doubt which party was winning the Presidency next season, that doubt is now gone. They have way to much of the current cast invested with Santos to completely flip the show.
I'm not certain if there ever was a doubt to begin with. If Vinick wins, they have to bring in an entirely new cast. Viewers are not going to buy have to be introduced to a new cast...



I complained to another Liberal friend about some of the Left’s tone concerning the 2004 elections. I thought it insulting to hear those “red state” voters caricatured as red-necked rubes. My friend asked, “Well, don’t you think that people who live in large urban areas, who travel and read and speak other languages are better able to make informed choices?” It turns out it is superiority, not familiarity, which breeds contempt. - Pat Sajak
EddieBurkett
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Since: 3.1.02
From: GA in person, NJ in heart

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#9 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.15
    Originally posted by Grimis
      Originally posted by redsoxnation
      As for Leo as VP: If there was a doubt which party was winning the Presidency next season, that doubt is now gone. They have way to much of the current cast invested with Santos to completely flip the show.
    I'm not certain if there ever was a doubt to begin with. If Vinick wins, they have to bring in an entirely new cast. Viewers are not going to buy have to be introduced to a new cast...


I for one always expected that the series would end when Bartlett left office, and I'm rather surprised they've rushed through his eight year reign in six years. That said, I think that Leo's nomination is swerve. They want everyone to think that since Leo is on the ticket, they'll be able to retain most of the cast when they win, so everyone will be expecting a Santos victory, and then be surprised when Vinick wins. I don't think viewers will be opposed to the new cast, because they understand the political process and understand that the change is coming, and also, they'll have an episode or two between the election and the inauguration to show Vinick assembling his staff while bidding farewell to the old cast. Besides, I keep reading about how the West Wing white house has been out of step with the real white house since 2001 when Clinton left office. This is their chance to realign themselves, at least for the next few years.

    Originally posted by The Goon
    Unlike real election campaigns, I am seriously looking forward to this one.


Sorry to burst your bubble, but I heard that the season premiere is the election itself. Looks like we miss the actual campaign.




"Now that you've built up the courage to get into the gym, let me give you five reasons why you should put in the time to train with consistency: 1. Increased strength 2. Improved self-confidence 3. Injury prevention 4. Self-discipline 5. Sex (Trust me, you'll have a better shot with the ladies if you're in shape.)" -- Making the Game, pp. 14 - 15
JoshMann
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Since: 17.11.03
From: Tallahassee, FL

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#10 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.73
If the Vinnick episodes from this season were any indications, one of the new cast would then most likely be Stephen "Crazy Billionaire Uncle Jimmy/I beleive you have my stapler" Root. That's at least a good first step towards a new cast if they go that route.

(edited by Blanket Jackson on 11.4.05 0842)


"Meet the kite-eating tree you son of a bitch!"

ekedolphin
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Since: 12.1.02
From: Indianapolis, IN; now residing in Suffolk, VA

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Last activity: 1 day
#11 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.52
Bah, I want 'em to have Santos win! Santos/McGarry for America, baby!

Perhaps the series has been out of step with the real White House since the Republicans took over, but I don't care... I'm a Democrat. If the Republicans are gonna take the country down the shitter (even moreso than usual), at least don't screw up one of my favorite TV shows.



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haz
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Since: 2.1.02
From: Whitby, Ontario, Canada

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#12 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.21
I actually expect to see the Republicans win, but as with this years show, I expect that it will be a two-part kind of show.

One week we will see White House stuff with Alan Alda and his staff... The next week we will get Democrat stuff. Kind of similar to what they did this year with the campaign one week then the White House the next...



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Since: 11.7.02
From: New Jersey

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#13 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.81
It was another very good season. They were smart enough to keep the focus on the new contenders.

The season opener usually takes place the same time it airs. So I expect them to skip past the May - August race and jump into September. They always can do flashbacks to the campaigns.

The say Alda is the heavy favorite to win since he is a liberal Republican who should take California. They still have on staff the Home Improvement wife and Ron Silver with the Red stapler guy.

The reason Leo didn't like his staff laughing about him being VP when they were talking about replacing Hoynes is that he knew Hoynes had the same drinking problem as him while the staff didn't. Leo also has the experience, military background, and money to help out.

The only flaw is that Leo shouldn't have been pushing Santos so hard to quit when he had to know he was on the short list for VP. I don't think they printed up the Santos/McGary banners without Leo's ok.
ekedolphin
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Since: 12.1.02
From: Indianapolis, IN; now residing in Suffolk, VA

Since last post: 163 days
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#14 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.52
I dunno, I think Leo was probably taken by surprise when he was asked to be the vice-presidential nominee. I know I was.



“Hi, Haley. Look, I found all these free swords. They were in my spleen.”
--Elan, The Order of the Stick

Four-Time Wiener of the Day (5/27/02; 7/3/02; 7/30/04; 8/28/04)

The Only Five-Time (and Last) N.E.W. World Heavyweight Champion

Certified RFMC Member-- Ask To See My Credentials!

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What, no Michael Ian Black this time around? I didn't realize the show switched to Sundays, I'll have to set my VCR. DJ, I don't know if you mean low limit hold 'em games, or low no limit buy ins. Gordon's advice is more appropriate for the later.
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