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The W - Movies & TV - The Walking Dead 2x8 - "Nebraska"
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John Orquiola
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Since: 28.2.02
From: Boston

Since last post: 25 days
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#1 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.26
It's been three months for us since Barnageddon, but for the group on Herschel's farm doomed to spend the rest of their days battling the Walking Dead, it's been mere seconds since Rick popped a 357 magnum cap in zombie Sophia's head.

Non-obligatory DC Comics reference: Shane is what the character of Guy Gardner should be, to both the Green Lantern Corps and the Justice League International.

All Halloween haunted hayrides from here on in should be required to let people ride on the back of flatbed trucks with a bunch of zombie corpses.

"It's not this problem I'm trying to solve. We need Herschel for the baby." Rick is on top of the plot threads!

Dale's guesswork about Shane sacrificing Otis is extremely detailed for a strong hypothesis. Here's the thing, and I Tweeted this when the episode aired, I'm not entirely sure in the exact same circumstance, I wouldn't have done the same thing Shane did to Otis. That's what's fucked up about this show - and why it's so good - it makes you question your own capabilities if you were in the characters' shoes, and not always to your liking.

I forgot Glenn was Daniel Bryan months before AJ told Daniel she loved him. Glenn certainly APPRECIATES Maggie. No doubt he has a STRONG ADMIRATION for her, as the Woman Who Loves Him. Glenn should constantly remind Maggie that he'll protect her and he'd never let anything happen to her.

Fuck yeah, Daryl! He's DONE looking for people. He took a bullet and an arrow looking for that little zombie girl, Olive Oyl! Plus the ghost of his dead(?) brother called him a pussy the whole time. He needs more of that like a hole in the head.

Suddenly, the show turned sepia colored when Rick and Glenn found Herschel in the bar. Did they time travel back to a 1940s speak easy? Poor Herschel snapped out of his denial during Barnageddon. "Holy shit! They're all zombies! What a fool I've been!"

Lori Grimes - typical woman driver. Am I right, fellas?

We'd just met Dave and Tony but I instantly hated them. New actual alive characters are nice, but Dane Cook and Dom De Louise lookalikes? Fuck those guys. And Rick did exactly what I wanted him to do, no Shane required.

I hear Nebraska's nice.




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It's False
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Since: 20.6.02
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#2 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.30
Eh, if you turn Guy Gardner into Shane, you take all of his likability away. Shane's not what I'd call a likable character in the strictest definition of the term. I'd call him more of a villain I can root for.

I have to agree with the issue I have with Shane and Otis. We're supposed to think Shane is some kind of dastardly fiend for ditching Otis, but what else was he supposed to do under that circumstance? There was no realistic way to save him, so even if everyone buys into Dale's idea that Shane ditched Otis...what then? There was no feasible way they both could have escaped.

The last 15 minutes of this episode had more action and character moments than most of the entire first half of the season put together.



StaggerLee
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Since: 3.10.02
From: Right side of the tracks

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#3 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.68
GREAT way to start the second half of the season. I was shocked to see good old Britt from Terriers eat the bullet so quickly. But, right after chiding Shane for killing for no real reason, Rick goes and shoots a guy that was only wanting the same sanctuary he was seeking when he found the farm.
Surely I wasn't the only one to make a "please keep all arms and legs inside the ride at all times" joke tonight.

Can't wait to see how the season goes.
Tenken347
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Since: 27.2.03
From: Parts Unknown

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#4 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.13
    Originally posted by John Orquiola


    We'd just met Dave and Tony but I instantly hated them. New actual alive characters are nice, but Dane Cook and Dom De Louise lookalikes? Fuck those guys. And Rick did exactly what I wanted him to do, no Shane required.




I was amazed at how effective they were. They made two people who we've never met before, and who should be sympathetic by shear virtue of the fact that they're still alive, instantly both unlikable and threatening just through the way the actors carried themselves. And it was a great moment for Rick as well. It's been a while since we've seen him do something to remind us how tough he is. Since they need to keep him strong for the eventual (and hopefully far in the future) confrontation with Shane, periodically doing stuff like this is really important.
theremin
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Since: 31.1.12

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#5 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.14
I hope they at least stick to the book and don't have them have a confrontation.
John Orquiola
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Since: 28.2.02
From: Boston

Since last post: 25 days
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#6 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.26
    Originally posted by It's False
    Eh, if you turn Guy Gardner into Shane, you take all of his likability away. Shane's not what I'd call a likable character in the strictest definition of the term. I'd call him more of a villain I can root for.

    I have to agree with the issue I have with Shane and Otis. We're supposed to think Shane is some kind of dastardly fiend for ditching Otis, but what else was he supposed to do under that circumstance? There was no realistic way to save him, so even if everyone buys into Dale's idea that Shane ditched Otis...what then? There was no feasible way they both could have escaped.


I don't think of Shane as a villain at all, not in the traditional way one can define a villain. I think your second paragraph even works against the cut and dry idea that he is a villain. Shane is motivated by survival at base level; in the Walking Dead world, one can't completely fault him, or anyone for that. And it's not like Shane doesn't care about anyone, like Daryl's (dead?) brother. Shane cares deeply, about himself, his loved ones, and he does care about the group. He does what he thinks is best for the group under the most trying of circumstances.

If you break down Walking Dead world into three levels of survival:

I MUST DO WHAT IS BEST FOR ME. Shane does that.
I MUST DO WHAT IS BEST FOR MY LOVED ONES/MY GROUP. Shane does that as well.
I MUST DO WHAT IS BEST FOR GREATER GOOD/THE WORLD AT LARGE/THE WORLD AS IT WAS TO PRESERVE WHAT WAS. That's where Shane says, "screw that. Waste of time." And why Dale seems to hate him.

I think the presence of Rick makes it easier for Shane as well because Shane would like to be the higher minded sort Rick is, but with Rick there it frees him from the burden of having to be. Every time Rick fails (as perceived by Shane), it only convinces him further that that sort of idealism is a flawed luxury in Walking Dead world.

We just met Tony and Dave, who ostensibly are like Shane. Or vice versa. Granted, we know Shane much better than those two, but I think it is safe to say, those two were villains. I don't think Shane has reached the level of menace quite yet those two potentially represented before Rick blew their heads off. But then, maybe we're just more comfortable with the Devil We Know than the Devils We Don't Know.



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Matt Tracker
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Since: 8.5.03
From: North Carolina

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#7 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.54
We didn't need two instances where women run to others to fetch their menfolk from town. Maggie wasn't worried enough about her pappy to literally ride shotgun, and Lori was too upset about Carl recognizing the need to shoot zombies to initially go after Rick herself.

The Lovely Mrs. Tracker practically stood and applauded Darryl's refusal to solve Lori's problem, and then she wanted to throttle her for not talking an original farmhouse resident to show her where the bar was -- the bar where their father is possibly surrounded by zombies.

The rock that anchored this family during the end times has a crisis of faith and falls off the 20-year-old wagon. He ran to town despite the threat of hungry corpses. Let's not do anything to help him. Y'all deserve to get eaten.

I hope Merle also appears to Lori to insult her into surviving.



"To be the man, you gotta beat demands." -- The Lovely Mrs. Tracker
John Orquiola
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Since: 28.2.02
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#8 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.26
Damn. 8.1 million viewers. (insidetv.ew.com) Biggest ratings in the adult demo in basic cable history. 10 million watched when the encore is factored in.

(edited by John Orquiola on 13.2.12 1340)


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cranlsn
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Since: 18.3.02
From: Sussex, WI

Since last post: 86 days
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#9 Posted on

Lori frustrated me as well. Tells Rick he needs to be here as the "caring man" example for his son...forbids him to "go off" and be caring...ugh. Then to top things off, she goes off herself potentially leaving her child parentless during a zombie apocolypse. ...nice...

Dale rather than Shane is my pick to go round the bend sooner than later. He's been the moral center all along, notcing and pointing out things that have been kind of sketchy. Everybody was yelling at Shane for his "stupid" decision to open the barn, but when Dale opens his mouth they tell him to shut it because it's "no use arguing". He can't win...

Agreed that Dave & Tony did an excellent job of being instantly shady & unlikeable. My only gripes:

1. How have they made it this far if they're THAT transparent. Moot point as Rick snuffed them.

2. How has Glenn made it this far if he's THAT gullible?

I'm looking forward to next week as I hope it's the begginning of the end for the farm. They need move on.
BigDaddyLoco
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Since: 2.1.02

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#10 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.47
    Originally posted by It's False


    The last 15 minutes of this episode had more action and character moments than most of the entire first half of the season put together.


I was really hating on most of these characters the first 45 minutes. It also adds that dimension that meeting real living people can be scarier than meeting the Walkers. At least you know what you are getting into when you come across a Walker.

I was excited to see some new blood, then I thought during the back and forth, why don't these guys just get their own farm and hole up, but then you realize that these guys weren't there to settle anywhere. They are just modern day pirates.

They need to reaffirm their time line for me. I'm guessing that this has all happened to them in a matter of weeks, or am I totally wrong and have they been together for months now? Also the fact that none of these people can have a full conversation is annoying.

Lori is the dumbest character on television. I hope they eat her.

emma
Cherries > Peaches








Since: 1.8.02
From: Phoenix-ish

Since last post: 120 days
Last activity: 14 hours
#11 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.71
Much better than the first half of the season. Starting right off with Mrs Hershel being "not quite dead yet" was a nice way to jump in.

If Otis had made it back alive, he could have spared everybody all the time & effort of looking for Sophia? So we can now officially blame Shane for the boring-est bits of the first half of season 2.

Interesting counterpoint between Rick wanting to keep the new outsiders out, vs Hershel not really wanting our outsiders on his world. Hershel had the extra guilt of one of his people having shot Carl, but if it weren't for that, our group wouldn't have been allowed to hang out on the farm either.

"We bury the ones we love, & burn the rest." Yup, that's a pretty concise summary.

Somebody please explain to me *why* Lori decided she had to go running off into town. The blondie chick (Beth?) collapses, everybody decides that Hershel has gone to the bar in town, Rick & Glen go into town to fetch Hershel. OK. Beth continues to be collapsed, barely enough time has passed for them to even get to town, & Lori decides that somehow either sending Daryl or going herself is somehow going to expedite the process? They weren't gone longer than expected, there's no change in Beth's status. What is the point of her running off on her own like an idiot? At least she put on a nice car coat (in the summer in Georgia), found some car keys & rounded up a regional map before she left, none of which anybody else apparently noticed.

We don't know that Lori even tried to recruit anybody other than Daryl to go after Rick. It felt to me like she just decided to go rogue all on her own.

"Y'got coos? I haven't had a piece of ass in weeks." I bet the post-apocalyptic ladies are just lining up for the charmer who is Tony. Between that, peeing on the floor in the middle of a perfectly respectable bar, & every technique possible to wheedle information -- in spite of Dave's touching speech, I wouldn't say Dave & Tony made the most stellar impression on Rick & Hershel. I don't really see comparing them to Shane.

Somebody remind me: In this set of zombie rules, if you get killed (eg. shot in a barroom shootout with the sheriff), can you still end up zombified? We know that zombies won't eat the smelly dead, but will they nosh on freshly dead? And if so, does the zombification "take" in that case? Rick went to shoot Tony in the head, thought about it, then didn't. Should he have?

One other thing. I ended up watching the first ep of season 1. There's a scene from before the zombie time, before Rick was shot. Shane & Rick were talking about women, Shane asks about Lori, Rick tells him that he & Lori are having problems. Were Lori & Shane sleeping together even then, before Zombie-mania?

BigDaddyLoco
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Since: 2.1.02

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#12 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.47
    Originally posted by emma

    Somebody remind me: In this set of zombie rules, if you get killed (eg. shot in a barroom shootout with the sheriff), can you still end up zombified? We know that zombies won't eat the smelly dead, but will they nosh on freshly dead? And if so, does the zombification "take" in that case? Rick went to shoot Tony in the head, thought about it, then didn't.


So, Sophie just got bit along the way or else she wouldn't just be walking dead, but eaten dead, right? Which makes her mom wrong. She probably did suffer and spend a night or two scared.

(edited by BigDaddyLoco on 13.2.12 2120)
dMp
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Since: 4.1.02
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#13 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.89
    Originally posted by emma
    Were Lori & Shane sleeping together even then, before Zombie-mania?




As far as I know/remember they weren't.
I recall Lori saying it just happened because she thought Rick was dead.

I have to say, after the craziness of barmageddon, the episode seemed to slow down a lot again.
I liked the personal interactions (and I loved that Hershel started packing his wife's stuff. He finally gave up on her) But yeah...things just went back to just talking.

The end, with the two guys, was brilliant. As pointed out here (and all over the web) they were definitely not to be trusted. Dave was too friendly and slick, Tony was just screaming "muscle henchman"
The comparison between how Hershel must've seen Rick and how Rick saw these guys is interesting.

I haven't seen anything from next weeks episode, but I can only assume this is NOT the end of this story.
Business is about to pick up.




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geemoney
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Since: 26.1.03
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#14 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.63
    Originally posted by Tenken347
      Originally posted by John Orquiola


      We'd just met Dave and Tony but I instantly hated them. New actual alive characters are nice, but Dane Cook and Dom De Louise lookalikes? Fuck those guys. And Rick did exactly what I wanted him to do, no Shane required.




    I was amazed at how effective they were. They made two people who we've never met before, and who should be sympathetic by shear virtue of the fact that they're still alive, instantly both unlikable and threatening just through the way the actors carried themselves.


Agreed. They went from two guys you kinda wanted to help out, to two guys you didn't want to be alone with very quickly. As the conversation progressed, it was almost like the walls were closing in on Glenn, Hershel and Rick; the longer the talk went, the more uncomfortable it became. Just a great piece of television, that scene.

(edited by geemoney on 14.2.12 1113)


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lotjx
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Since: 5.9.08

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#15 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.14
Barnaggedon, love it! I finally got to see it tonight. A few thoughts. I don't know how any more obvious it was those guys were going to take Rick and the others when Tony peed on the floor to mark his territory. This was a legit good kill for Rick unlike Shane who killed Otis to save his own ass that just happens to have the stuff to save Carl. Granted, I would do what Shane did to, maybe. I did like Carl saying he would have done the same thing too. That is going to be interesting down the road.

Lori is an idiot, I truly believe they have no idea how to write her and are praying to kill her off. Darryl, is my hero after telling Lori off. Shane is starting to go around the bend before anyone else that is a fact.

I just wonder if the Jersey boys were a scout party for him?


(edited by lotjx on 14.2.12 1909)


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John Orquiola
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Since: 28.2.02
From: Boston

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#16 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.26
This just happened, and is kind of cool. The Walking Dead's showrunner @GlenMazzara Tweeted a joke about season 3:

@glenmazzara
#thewalkingdead In S3, Rick buys the farm next door to Hershel, becomes his wacky neighbor. Hilarity ensues.

I fired back:

@BackoftheHead
@glenmazzara #WalkingDead s3: Rick's farm should be next to Herschel's and next to Schrute Farms. Get The Office spinoff crowd. Hilarity!

And he responded:

@glenmazzara
@BackoftheHead Dwight has zombies in his barn. #thewalkingdead #theoffice



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JustinShapiro
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Since: 12.12.01
From: Pittsburgh, PA

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#17 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.79
Here's a free one from me
The zombie is the show. #boomroasted
SchippeWreck
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Since: 26.3.03
From: Glendale, CA

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#18 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.84
    Originally posted by JustinShapiro
    Here's a free one from me
    The zombie is the show. #boomroasted

...except zombies usually go somewhere. #ohsnap



"It's magic! We don't need to explain it!"
SEADAWG
Boudin rouge
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Since: 5.7.03

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#19 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.88
    Originally posted by It's False
    I have to agree with the issue I have with Shane and Otis. We're supposed to think Shane is some kind of dastardly fiend for ditching Otis, but what else was he supposed to do under that circumstance? There was no realistic way to save him

No way to save who? Save Otis? 'Cause Otis didn't really need saving until Shane shot him and left him for dead. Which could probably be used as an answer to the "What else was he supposed to do?" question. Not shoot him and leave him for dead, perhaps.

We don't know if they both could have made it. All we know is that Shane (having hurt his leg) didn't want to be the one lagging behind, so he made sure Otis stayed behind instead. And we know Shane didn't want anyone to know what he did, hence shaving his head and lying about it.

So as to the query of "Even if everyone believed Dale, what then?", if they thought Shane might sacrifice any of them to save himself like he did with Otis, that might not sit well.

    Originally posted by emma
    Rick went to shoot Tony in the head, thought about it, then didn't. Should he have?

He actually did. Right after he shot him twice in the chest, he went over and shot him a third time. We didn't see where and then they cut to another scene, but when they came back to the bar, the guy had a hole in his forehead. That's when Rick looked like he was about to shoot him again and didn't. I'm not sure what that was supposed to mean.
emma
Cherries > Peaches








Since: 1.8.02
From: Phoenix-ish

Since last post: 120 days
Last activity: 14 hours
#20 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.71
    Originally posted by SEADAWG
      Originally posted by emma
      Rick went to shoot Tony in the head, thought about it, then didn't. Should he have?

    He actually did. Right after he shot him twice in the chest, he went over and shot him a third time. We didn't see where and then they cut to another scene, but when they came back to the bar, the guy had a hole in his forehead. That's when Rick looked like he was about to shoot him again and didn't. I'm not sure what that was supposed to mean.
Oh, I see what you're saying. There is the audio of another shot, & there is a head wound that I didn't see before. So in the follow-on scene, Rick probably wasn't so much pointing the gun at Tony, as it was just a camera angle thing. OK, I'm happier with that -- thanks!
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Kris and Jon annoyed me. I know that's not the way most people feel, but they were just too chirpy and chipper and overall not very entertaining. Probably the wrong way to go about looking at it, but eh. I can't stand them.
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