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The W - Current Events & Politics - The first ten days
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Jaguar
Knackwurst








Since: 23.1.02
From: In a Blue State finally

Since last post: 230 days
Last activity: 33 days
#1 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.96
Or the first five days according to Sean Spicer.

So it's been ten days into the new Presidential term. How's everybody feeling? Here's a list of some of the administration's first actions:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jan/27/trump-first-12-official-presidential-actions

Of course, this doesn't include my personal favorite, redistributing access to the National Security Council, by removing the Joint Chiefs and National Director of Intelligence's seats at the table and replacing them with Steve "the media is our enemy" Bannon.

But yeah, Federal hiring freeze, Muslin ban, ACA repeal, bigliest inauguration ever - it's been quite a ride so far.

What's your take?



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lotjx
Scrapple








Since: 5.9.08

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 2 hours
#2 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.14
There is a rumor about an Executive Order concerning LBGTQ that includes preventing adoptions. Its only going to get worse. Also that Trump market whirlwind is RIP.



http://comicbookspotlight.wordpress.com/



Now previewing the Fall TV lineup.@realjoecarfley
El Nastio
Boudin blanc








Since: 14.1.02
From: Ottawa Ontario, by way of Walkerton

Since last post: 34 days
Last activity: 3 hours
ICQ:  
#3 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.81
    Originally posted by lotjx
    There is a rumor about an Executive Order concerning LBGTQ that includes preventing adoptions. Its only going to get worse. Also that Trump market whirlwind is RIP.


You're going to provide any actual citations for this?



"You can't put a price on integrity"
Peter The Hegemon
Lap cheong








Since: 11.2.03
From: Hackettstown, NJ

Since last post: 31 days
Last activity: 1 day
#4 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.42
You missed the biggest thing--after a week of establishing that this Administration embraces "alternative facts", which is to say lies, Trump announces that they will be "investigating" voter fraud. You can bet that they will claim to have found copious evidence of it, despite their not being able to produce any, and that this will be used to further suppress legitimate votes, especially those of minorities.

Republicans used to claim that Obama would not give up the Presidency at the end if his term. I've learned over the years that whatever crazy things the Republicans accuse the Democrats of is what the Republicans end up doing.
lotjx
Scrapple








Since: 5.9.08

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 2 hours
#5 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.14
He just fired the Attorney General for not wanting to legally challenge his Executive Order. We are entering dangerous waters.



http://comicbookspotlight.wordpress.com/



Now previewing the Fall TV lineup.@realjoecarfley
EddieBurkett
Boudin blanc








Since: 3.1.02
From: GA in person, NJ in heart

Since last post: 51 days
Last activity: 11 hours
#6 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.93
Source for the LGBTQ EO. (washingtonpost.com)

I called one of my senators for the first time today. I do not think it will be my last, and I need to get comfortable doing it more. It feels like there is so little that can be done, but this whole situation feels so untenable. Something's gotta give, but what and when?



Mash Those Buttons -- by gamers, for gamers, about gamers gaming (mashthosebuttons.com)

WoW! Talk! - A podcast about World of Warcraft (soundcloud.com)


@WookieeBH
Jaguar
Knackwurst








Since: 23.1.02
From: In a Blue State finally

Since last post: 230 days
Last activity: 33 days
#7 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.57
I called my current Senators today to encourage them to filibuster anyone for SCOTUS who isn't Merrick Garland, as there's rumors the Dems might want to cave on that.

Also called my former Senators, Flake and McCain to tell them I'd appreciate it if they block Sessions from AG.

Looking forward to repeating those calls in the morning.

But hey, good news - the left may have found a hero to run in 2020 in Sally Yates
El Nastio
Boudin blanc








Since: 14.1.02
From: Ottawa Ontario, by way of Walkerton

Since last post: 34 days
Last activity: 3 hours
ICQ:  
#8 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.81


Thanks! So it's less an outright ban like lotjx was saying, but a part of the overarching concern that people have regarding protection for religious organizations and peoples belief systems?

I'll say this; as much as I complain about government(s) here, I'm glad I live in Canada as a Canadian citizen.



"You can't put a price on integrity"
StaggerLee
Scrapple








Since: 3.10.02
From: Right side of the tracks

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 23 hours
#9 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.63
So, is the sky falling where you all live?

No "Muslim ban", only a TEMPORARY halting of visas for the listed countries. Hey, remember when Obama halted visas too?

Alternative facts? Seriously, that's what has you people worried? Arguing over how many people showed up to the big party? Seems a bit........petty. On both sides.

And he fired the acting AG, as he is able to do, because they were not willing to support the administration. Which he SHOULD do. Funny, no mention of the AG who broke the law and lost a shit ton of automatic weapons(after he sold them to drug cartels)...... oh yeah, he's a democrat. Forgot, only GOP members actions are to be criticized.


"Of course, this doesn't include my personal favorite, redistributing access to the National Security Council, by removing the Joint Chiefs and National Director of Intelligence's seats at the table"

Alternative facts? "The Director of National Intelligence and the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff shall attend where issues pertaining to their responsibilities and expertise are to be discussed."

But don't let the actual facts get in the way of shitting on somebody's administration you don't like.


I notice you didn't mention the POTUS directing the department heads to NOT process any fines against people for not being compliant with the ACA. I guess protecting individuals from fines, ooops sorry "taxes" for not being able to afford something is somehow bad.

In other words, water is wet, sky is blue, Democrats will shit on everything any GOP POTUS does, and cling to the narrative being put out by the opposition, oops, I mean the media.

To Quote the last POTUS who loved to gloat "Elections have consequences". Now you're seeing how the other half felt for 8 years.
pieman
As young as
he feels








Since: 11.12.01
From: China, Maine

Since last post: 6 days
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#10 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.64


I am neither a Republican or a Democrat, but you must admit Sean Spicer comes off as a tool.



lotjx
Scrapple








Since: 5.9.08

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 2 hours
#11 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.14
The other half didnt go out of its way to hurt people. Trump stopping the fines is a wat for employeers to drop their employee coverages. I dont believe anything Trump does will be temporary. The GOP will line up behind him. Actions due have consequences. The AG is allow to say no to the President as Sessions even said. Bannon is a right wing nut job who has no business sitting at that table. Alt facts are lies, it us a simple as that.



http://comicbookspotlight.wordpress.com/



Now previewing the Fall TV lineup.@realjoecarfley
Jaguar
Knackwurst








Since: 23.1.02
From: In a Blue State finally

Since last post: 230 days
Last activity: 33 days
#12 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.57
    Originally posted by StaggerLee
    So, is the sky falling where you all live?

    No "Muslim ban", only a TEMPORARY halting of visas for the listed countries. Hey, remember when Obama halted visas too?



Stagger, is there a difference in your mind between halting the issuance of visas and detaining/deporting/refusing entry to people who already have visas? What about people who have green cards and are legal residents of the United States?

Also:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/news/the-fix/wp/2017/01/29/trump-asked-for-a-muslim-ban-giuliani-says-and-ordered-a-commission-to-do-it-legally/?client=ms-android-verizon

Is Rudy lying here or is it a Muslim Ban?
Jaguar
Knackwurst








Since: 23.1.02
From: In a Blue State finally

Since last post: 230 days
Last activity: 33 days
#13 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.57
As an aside I really am curious as to how people are feeling about all this. I mean we can always just throw talking points at each other about which side is more right, but I can get that plenty of places.

I'm much more interested in genuine reactions to what is going on. Personally I am way beyond being frightened, almost past angry too. These are all things Trump promised to do all along, which is why I opposed him and will continue to oppose him. Shock has given way to resolution: never stop fighting
EddieBurkett
Boudin blanc








Since: 3.1.02
From: GA in person, NJ in heart

Since last post: 51 days
Last activity: 11 hours
#14 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.93
    Originally posted by StaggerLee
    To Quote the last POTUS who loved to gloat "Elections have consequences". Now you're seeing how the other half felt for 8 years.



I get that each side feels oppressed under the other party to a degree, but to the left, there are concerns that Trump is in the process of installing a Kleptocracy if not invalidating the Judicial Branch altogether and turning our government into an Autocracy. I know there were concerns among the right that Obama was "coming for their guns", but just how terrifying was Obama's presidency? Did people spend eight years worried that Obama was going to turn the US into a dictatorship?



Mash Those Buttons -- by gamers, for gamers, about gamers gaming (mashthosebuttons.com)

WoW! Talk! - A podcast about World of Warcraft (soundcloud.com)


@WookieeBH
StaggerLee
Scrapple








Since: 3.10.02
From: Right side of the tracks

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 23 hours
#15 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.63
    Originally posted by EddieBurkett
      Originally posted by StaggerLee
      To Quote the last POTUS who loved to gloat "Elections have consequences". Now you're seeing how the other half felt for 8 years.



    I get that each side feels oppressed under the other party to a degree, but to the left, there are concerns that Trump is in the process of installing a Kleptocracy if not invalidating the Judicial Branch altogether and turning our government into an Autocracy. I know there were concerns among the right that Obama was "coming for their guns", but just how terrifying was Obama's presidency? Did people spend eight years worried that Obama was going to turn the US into a dictatorship?


You must have missed that "I have a phone amd a pen" comment from Obama.


Also: http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/01/31/512606452/white-house-says-obamas-order-on-lgbtq-rights-will-stay-in-effect

Jaguars, just curious, have you read the entire text of the executive order and all there related US Codes that are cited in it? Because I have.
And if you're going to be that invested in the people with green cards, maybe the announcement from the head of the DHS stating anybody with a current, valid Green Card would be allowed to travel freely (as directed by Trump) will ease your fears.
Again, the FACTS are, he's doing nothing that's not constitutionally within his powers.
Peter The Hegemon
Lap cheong








Since: 11.2.03
From: Hackettstown, NJ

Since last post: 31 days
Last activity: 1 day
#16 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.42
    Originally posted by StaggerLee
    So, is the sky falling where you all live?

    No "Muslim ban", only a TEMPORARY halting of visas for the listed countries. Hey, remember when Obama halted visas too?


Not just a halting of visas; they're stopping people who already have visas from entering the country, denying them access to their lawyers, and defying court orders. But, hey, as long as you can pick out one small part of it that's vaguely similar to something Obama did, then it's fine...and the media is so terrible for not treating them exactly the same.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2017/01/29/trumps-facile-claim-that-his-refugee-policy-is-similar-to-obama-in-2011/?utm_term=.7a048673a595

    Originally posted by StaggerLee
    Alternative facts? Seriously, that's what has you people worried? Arguing over how many people showed up to the big party? Seems a bit........petty. On both sides.


I made it perfectly clear why I was worried about that.

    Originally posted by StaggerLee
    And he fired the acting AG, as he is able to do, because they were not willing to support the administration. Which he SHOULD do.


No, the AG is NOT supposed to support the Administration when it does something unConstitutional. A point which a certain Republican named Jeff Sessions specifically made to that very appointee during her Senate confirmation hearings. Maybe he meant that you're only supposed to support the Constitution over a black President?

    Originally posted by StaggerLee
    Funny, no mention of the AG who broke the law and lost a shit ton of automatic weapons(after he sold them to drug cartels)...... oh yeah, he's a democrat. Forgot, only GOP members actions are to be criticized.


Yeah, isn't it WEIRD that we're talking about the current President violating the Constitution, and not about something that happened years ago?

Please refresh my memory by pointing me to all the times people were complaining about Obama, and you said they should be talking about completely irrelevant things Bush did wrong.


    Originally posted by StaggerLee
    "Of course, this doesn't include my personal favorite, redistributing access to the National Security Council, by removing the Joint Chiefs and National Director of Intelligence's seats at the table"

    Alternative facts? "The Director of National Intelligence and the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff shall attend where issues pertaining to their responsibilities and expertise are to be discussed."

    But don't let the actual facts get in the way of shitting on somebody's administration you don't like.


Yeah, how DARE they say that Bannon got the Chairman's seat when the TRUTH is...um, that Bannon got the Chairman's seat, but they'll let the Chairman in once in a while?

Bannon--a NAZI, for crying out loud, not to mention someone who has devoted his career to propaganda and disinformation--will have a regular place at the meetings. The Chairman of the Joint Chiefs will not. Being brought in to brief on specific topics is not at all the same as being there regularly.


Jaguar
Knackwurst








Since: 23.1.02
From: In a Blue State finally

Since last post: 230 days
Last activity: 33 days
#17 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.57
    Originally posted by StaggerLee


    Jaguars, just curious, have you read the entire text of the executive order and all there related US Codes that are cited in it? Because I have.
    And if you're going to be that invested in the people with green cards, maybe the announcement from the head of the DHS stating anybody with a current, valid Green Card would be allowed to travel freely (as directed by Trump) will ease your fears.
    Again, the FACTS are, he's doing nothing that's not constitutionally within his powers.


Okay, you read the specific text of the EO. I haven't. Three questions:

1) So why all the confusion about Green Card holders the first two days that then had to be clarified by DHS and the Administration? Is the wording unclear?

2) Does the EO contain the same language and parameters as the Obama administrations temporary halt? If so, again, why all the confusion this time and not then?

3) If it is the same order as the Obama one, why does Rudy Giuliani go on Foxnews and tell them that Trump asked for a "legal way" to do a Muslim Ban, and not just say that they're repeating measures already taken by previous administrations?


And as an aside - when you write "if you're going to be that invested in the people with green cards" it can be read pretty uncharitably. Why wouldn't I be invested in legal residents of this country, LEGAL IMMIGRANTS, to have full protection under the law?
StaggerLee
Scrapple








Since: 3.10.02
From: Right side of the tracks

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 23 hours
#18 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.62
    Originally posted by Jaguar
      Originally posted by StaggerLee


      Jaguars, just curious, have you read the entire text of the executive order and all there related US Codes that are cited in it? Because I have.
      And if you're going to be that invested in the people with green cards, maybe the announcement from the head of the DHS stating anybody with a current, valid Green Card would be allowed to travel freely (as directed by Trump) will ease your fears.
      Again, the FACTS are, he's doing nothing that's not constitutionally within his powers.


    Okay, you read the specific text of the EO. I haven't. Three questions:

    1) So why all the confusion about Green Card holders the first two days that then had to be clarified by DHS and the Administration? Is the wording unclear?

    2) Does the EO contain the same language and parameters as the Obama administrations temporary halt? If so, again, why all the confusion this time and not then?

    3) If it is the same order as the Obama one, why does Rudy Giuliani go on Foxnews and tell them that Trump asked for a "legal way" to do a Muslim Ban, and not just say that they're repeating measures already taken by previous administrations?


    And as an aside - when you write "if you're going to be that invested in the people with green cards" it can be read pretty uncharitably. Why wouldn't I be invested in legal residents of this country, LEGAL IMMIGRANTS, to have full protection under the law?


1)The confusion was, the DHS had to make the determination, as outlined in the EO. That wasn't going to be a 5 minute deal. While unfortunate that the three days went by before it was decided, in the end, people with lawful authority to be here are indeed allowed in.
2) Im unclear what you're asking
3) Rudy is an idiot to begin with, and I doubt that he had direct marching orders from Trump. Wouldn't be the first time he's ran his mouth without checking what the POTUS policy was.

StaggerLee
Scrapple








Since: 3.10.02
From: Right side of the tracks

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 23 hours
#19 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.62
    Originally posted by Peter The Hegemon
      Originally posted by StaggerLee
      So, is the sky falling where you all live?

      No "Muslim ban", only a TEMPORARY halting of visas for the listed countries. Hey, remember when Obama halted visas too?


    Not just a halting of visas; they're stopping people who already have visas from entering the country, denying them access to their lawyers, and defying court orders. But, hey, as long as you can pick out one small part of it that's vaguely similar to something Obama did, then it's fine...and the media is so terrible for not treating them exactly the same.

No. They aren't. Please keep up with the current events. Anybody with a Green Card is allowed in. Visas can be revoked and suspended.

See 8 US Code 1182 Subsection F.

[Quote]No, the AG is NOT supposed to support the Administration when it does something unConstitutional. A point which a certain Republican named Jeff Sessions specifically made to that very appointee during her Senate confirmation hearings. Maybe he meant that you're only supposed to support the Constitution over a black President?


Um, you are aware that this EO, like every other one that has been issued was run through the DOJ Legal Compliance Office right? It was presented and deemed to be legal. So YOU thinking it's unConstitutional means nothing when the DOJ has already reviewed it.
And yes, The AG is an employee of the Executive branch. Their boss is the POTUS. They can resign if they feel a law is unjust, but they cannot direct everyone in the DOJ to ignore it and not expect their boss to discipline or fire them.

Jaguar
Knackwurst








Since: 23.1.02
From: In a Blue State finally

Since last post: 230 days
Last activity: 33 days
#20 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.57
Stagger if you watch the clip from Foxnews, according to Rudy, Trump approached *him* calling it a Muslim Ban. But yes, Rudy is an idiot. So glad he's in charge of "the cyber" now!

    Originally posted by StaggerLee

    1)The confusion was, the DHS had to make the determination, as outlined in the EO. That wasn't going to be a 5 minute deal. While unfortunate that the three days went by before it was decided, in the end, people with lawful authority to be here are indeed allowed in.


Just going to point out that someone died while this was being incompetently handled, as well as the fact that apparently the rest of the green card holding family members have not been permitted to fly home either.

http://www.fox2detroit.com/news/local-news/232856168-story


    Hager said he was returning home with his family that included his sick mom. They were returning home to the United States where his mother has lived since 1995. As they were waiting in line at the airport in Iraq on Friday, he was told that he could pass through because he was a U.S. citizen. But his family members - including his mom - weren't allowed, despite holding green cards.


I'm gonna move on from this for the moment - don't really feel the need to be piling on against you, Stagger
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