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The W - Pro Wrestling - RAW #840 6/29/09 (Page 3)
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R-Dub
Mettwurst








Since: 25.8.05
From: Michigan

Since last post: 283 days
Last activity: 135 days
#41 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.00
Isn't Tiffany off the hook, since Trump orchestrated this trade?
kentish
Andouille








Since: 19.8.05
From: My Old Kentucky Home

Since last post: 28 days
Last activity: 17 hours
#42 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.79
    Originally posted by StaggerLee
      Originally posted by kentish

      It's not Cena's job to make new stars, that falls on Vince and his staff. I doubt many top guys, past or present would say "No, I think I would rather do the job". I don't like the booking, but the blame doesn't fall on Cena.




    I believe THE ROCK put just about every guy over who ever stepped into the ring with him, and made them look pretty damn good as well. No reason at all Cena can't do the same.



You are right. That's why I said "I doubt MANY top guys", not "I doubt any". Nevertheless, I, nor you, can't say for a fact that Rock insisted on laying down for guys. Just because he always did, doesn't mean he asked to do so when booked otherwise.

BigDaddyLoco,

You forget the history of this very site. At one point or another, there were numerous posts (including my own) saying Santino, Carlito, and Kennedy deserved to be pushed to the top. And as geemoney pointed out, Matt Hardy vs. MVP was a highlight to many people in 2007, as both seemed to be elevating each other to the next level. Not to mention Matt's feud against Edge, which was the hottest thing in the WWE in 2005 before they screwed that up. Just because you disagree about all these guys in hindsight after they didn't make it, doesn't mean there wasn't a time when all of them were red hot, but for various reasons fell of the map.




"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ."

-- Mahatma Gandhi
redsoxnation
Scrapple








Since: 24.7.02

Since last post: 537 days
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#43 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.80
    Originally posted by timdrake
      Originally posted by JustinShapiro
      I think Cena/Miz played out exactly how Jericho wished that his deal with Goldberg would have.


    Exactly. I remembered Jericho saying the plan was always for Goldberg to destroy him in about a minute and this interview seems to back that up:

    WWE.com: You’ve never wrestled him one on one?

    Jericho: No. I’ve never wrestled him ever. One on one, tag team, whatever it was. I wanted to wrestle him. We started this angle (in WCW) on a whim, as kind of like a joke, and it became something that people wanted to see. I was calling him “Greenberg” at the time, because he was just starting out. And I always claimed victories over him whenever I escaped. It got to the point where I would always have a shirt that said, “Jericho 1, Greenberg 0.” And then when I “beat” him again, it would be “Jericho 2, Greenberg 0” and then “Jericho 3, Greenberg 0.” People had signs in the crowd counting along with me. People wanted to see him kick my ass, and that’s what I wanted him to do. This was when he was in the middle of his winning streak, and the office wanted to end this in a two-minute squash match, as we call them, with him just spearing me and jackhammering me. I refused to do it because people wanted to see this match, and they were going to pay for it. I wanted to have a match on a pay-per-view, and he could kick the s*** out of me in a minute if that’s what they wanted, but at least people would be paying to see it – not seeing it on free TV as just another guy that was part of his streak. It was never a problem with losing to Bill – in being speared and jackhammered – that’s what I wanted to do. But I wanted people to pay to see it, because I knew that they would, because I could tell by the reactions we were getting doing this angle. And that was basically one of the reasons why I left WCW. Actually, that was the catalyst for me to leave because I realized if they weren’t going to go with that, they were never going to go with anything that I had. Because that was a hot angle that people were into. If they weren’t going to go with it, it was probably best for me just to move on.









So, Miz needs Ralphus? I miss Ralphus.
Hokienautic
Toulouse








Since: 2.1.02
From: Blacksburg VA

Since last post: 1 day
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#44 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.24
    Originally posted by R-Dub
    Isn't Tiffany off the hook, since Trump orchestrated this trade?


Uhhh, he still needed the other GMs to approve it.
drjayphd
Scrapple
Moderator








Since: 22.4.02
From: Long Island

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#45 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.54
You wanted the best, you got... Out of Context Quote of the Week.

"Mangini might not have had balls, but he DID have soft, supple breasts." (SEADAWG)


    Originally posted by Hokienautic
      Originally posted by R-Dub
      Isn't Tiffany off the hook, since Trump orchestrated this trade?


    Uhhh, he still needed the other GMs to approve it.


I'd assume WWE.com would've left out the BOATLOADS OF MONEY going to ECW and Smackdown?



djp
Morcilla








Since: 16.2.07
From: 3rd Floor, NW window

Since last post: 188 days
Last activity: 35 days
#46 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.47
    Originally posted by BigDaddyLoco

    I'm actually starting to question how good MVP even is. Is he better than Shelton Benjamin? Not in the ring. MVP only seems to bring his A game when working with a top worker, which makes me wonder if he is just a good dance partner. It doesn't help that his gimmick doesn't make a whole lot of sense anymore.



I think MVP's main problem right now is that his character is not good as a face. He's still that cocky, better-than-you sports star with the same music, (mostly) the same entrance and run-up to his matches. He's still doing the things that brought him heat as a heal but is now throwing t-shirts into the crowd. D-Lo did the same thing a few years ago. He started waiting for the crowd to acknowledge a few of his moves, gave a nod, then performed. That alone was not enough to get him over as a face. MVP works best as a heal, much like Santino.
kentish
Andouille








Since: 19.8.05
From: My Old Kentucky Home

Since last post: 28 days
Last activity: 17 hours
#47 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.79
    Originally posted by djp
      Originally posted by BigDaddyLoco

      I'm actually starting to question how good MVP even is. Is he better than Shelton Benjamin? Not in the ring. MVP only seems to bring his A game when working with a top worker, which makes me wonder if he is just a good dance partner. It doesn't help that his gimmick doesn't make a whole lot of sense anymore.



    I think MVP's main problem right now is that his character is not good as a face. He's still that cocky, better-than-you sports star with the same music, (mostly) the same entrance and run-up to his matches. He's still doing the things that brought him heat as a heal but is now throwing t-shirts into the crowd. D-Lo did the same thing a few years ago. He started waiting for the crowd to acknowledge a few of his moves, gave a nod, then performed. That alone was not enough to get him over as a face. MVP works best as a heal, much like Santino.

Agreed. There seems to be a bad trend lately of ill advised face turns, including MVP, Morrison, and Santino, who would all work better as heels, IMO. Going back a year or so, you could include Finley and Carlito to that list.




"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ."

-- Mahatma Gandhi
The Game
Boudin rouge








Since: 5.5.09

Since last post: 439 days
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#48 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.16
I thought Raw had its good moments but also its bad.

Like Geemoney,I agree it looked possible for The Colons to regain the unified tag belts. It wasn't a bad match and I dare say Carlito and Primo are the most fun to watch tag team right now.

Having Miz get a match out of Cena was an improvement. Instead of being squashed, Miz lost in a more respectable way. Cena is one of the last people that is capable of making another wrestler look legitimate or pushing them a little bit.

Show vs. Kofi would have been better if it wasn't even on at all; a double count-out in a match that lasted a few minutes is not a good match at all.

I was quite surprised with some of the people of the trade; Jack Swagger coming to Raw was probably my biggest shock. I still say he should have been on ECW to develop more but the WWE better not waste Swagger and should automatically put him in the upper mid-card level. He is not a main-eventer but has all the potential to be one. Raw better not mess this one up.

Mark Henry is back on Raw where he has always been stagnant. His best run was when he was the ECW champion. I was quite surprised the crowd reaction he got when he pinned Orton in the gauntlet match. Still, it is hard to imagine Henry being pushed on Raw when in previous times, there was nothing for him there.

If anyone should have gotten traded, Christian should have been to Smackdown but his feud or rivalry per say is kind of interesting and Christian does help some of the potential on ECW look credible.

Evan Bourne was another surprise and when I think about it, that could have been perhaps a bigger surprise than Jack Swagger because I thought the WWE would build up Evan Bourne more but a feud with Kofi would probably be a good one between the two high-flyers.

The Hart Dynasty is a little iffy for me because I honestly don't know if they were ready to move past ECW. They were building some credibility but I think a tag team feud would have been better for them on ECW then moving them up a notch to Smackdown.
BigDaddyLoco
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 25 min.
#49 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.21
    Originally posted by kentish
    BigDaddyLoco,

    You forget the history of this very site. At one point or another, there were numerous posts (including my own) saying Santino, Carlito, and Kennedy deserved to be pushed to the top.


Let's throw Santino out for now because he is mainly a comedy act and look at Carlito and Kennedy. Both these guys did get good pushes, more than once actually and everytime they shot themselves in the foot by working sloppily, getting injured, suspensions or just by having their heat kind of fizzle out. I mean how much harder could the WWE machine have gotten behind Kennedy and most guys don't even get the kind of push Carlito was getting a couple of years ago. So, what are we getting at? The people who posted were wrong the WWE was wrong and I was split on the two guys liking Carlito and not Kennedy and so I was wrong too.

They got pushed. The only difference is the internet will crucify the WWE for being wrong about Chris Masters, but will never admit when they are wrong themselves.



    And as geemoney pointed out, Matt Hardy vs. MVP was a highlight to many people in 2007, as both seemed to be elevating each other to the next level. Not to mention Matt's feud against Edge, which was the hottest thing in the WWE in 2005 before they screwed that up.


Why wasn't that run with MVP that keeps getting brought up good enough for some people? I'm aware that it happened and was good, but the WWE also knew this and gave them the long Smackdown matches and even a title belt. Matt Hardy is a guy that only makes magic happen once in awhile with the right opponet in the right feud. How can the WWE get behind Matt any harder when his matches with most wrestlers are, I don't want to say dull, but maybe uninspiring and I can't remember a good promo coming from him since the Edge feud. I would say Matt Hardy is properly pushed, Matt is what he is at this point there's not much more upside.

MVP, still might have that upside or he might be one of those guys like Lamar Odom who just really show up every so often when motivated. It's tough to tell with his odd gimmick not helping. He's just not a guy that makes me want to plunk down my money to see him perform.



    Just because you disagree about all these guys in hindsight after they didn't make it, doesn't mean there wasn't a time when all of them were red hot, but for various reasons fell of the map.



I already said that the WWE is missing out on The Miz. I don't see him being any hotter than he is right now, but he isn't getting the Kennedy treatment from the WWE or even a Matt Hardy like push. He's getting the red hot guy that the WWF just stole from WCW or ECW and then depushed and made a joke out of push.


Psycho Penguin
Liverwurst








Since: 24.6.07
From: Greenacres FL

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#50 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.73
    Originally posted by drjayphd
      Originally posted by Hokienautic
        Originally posted by R-Dub
        Isn't Tiffany off the hook, since Trump orchestrated this trade?


      Uhhh, he still needed the other GMs to approve it.


    I'd assume WWE.com would've left out the BOATLOADS OF MONEY going to ECW and Smackdown?


And what does ECW use it for.. SEAMUS AND YOSHITATSU!

I'm not complaining, though. FECW rules.



http://www.gamefaqs.com/features/recognition/9471.html

IT'S TRUE! IT'S DAMN TRUE!

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I can see what you guys were saying about the Rock now. It really isn't funny how he is using the announcers as cannon fodder. This is getting old really fast. On the up side, his match with Benoit was freaking awesome.
- Dirty Dan, The Rock's "new" gimmick pt. 2 (2002)
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