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The W - Pro Wrestling - RAW #769 2/18/08 (Page 2)
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Brian P. Dermody
Liverwurst
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Since: 20.9.02
From: New York, NY

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#21 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.00
For me, the MVP of tonight's show was the completely overdue addition of Santino Marella's douchy sunglasses.

Hornswoggle (still spelled with two "O"s and no "A", people) looked great in an angle that should lead to an awesomely stiff brawl at Mania.

I like the Brand New Sin version of love theme from Big Show (which is what they used Monday), but more than that I like that King couldn't figure out what Jeff's band buddies were called (EndeverafteR, who I can only assume used to be Peroxwhy?gen). Kennedy's new theme is pretty terrible though.

And they did a great job of making Big Show look like a bitch. He should have shoved Mayweather, or decked him, or at the very least not flinched. He just sold for a guy a third his size. I get that Floyd has to look like a threat, but the broken nose did it for me.



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Since: 19.5.02
From: Toronto

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#22 Posted on
The Floyd Mayweather face thing isn't going to work. I can't imagine why the WWE thinks he would be cheered. He's the biggest villian in boxing (did they not see any of the HBO buildup to De La Hoya/Mayweather?). He's got TONS of charisma, and I'm a huge fan of him. but this isn't going to work. They should pair him up with MVP, because I think the dynamic would work really well with them. And I think against Show/Shane, it would be a pretty good match.

All that said, I love the fact he came into "I Get Money". THAT'S a great intro theme.



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Since: 2.1.02
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#23 Posted on
    Originally posted by DirtyMikeSeaver
    The Floyd Mayweather face thing isn't going to work. I can't imagine why the WWE thinks he would be cheered. He's the biggest villian in boxing (did they not see any of the HBO buildup to De La Hoya/Mayweather?). He's got TONS of charisma, and I'm a huge fan of him. but this isn't going to work. They should pair him up with MVP, because I think the dynamic would work really well with them. And I think against Show/Shane, it would be a pretty good match.

    All that said, I love the fact he came into "I Get Money". THAT'S a great intro theme.


Can't remember where (sorry ... maybe rajah.com) but I recall reading that a possible plan would be Floyd/Rey versus Show/Shane. If that's the case, perhaps expect Shane to eat the pin so Show doesn't have to lose in his return. Or maybe Rey since he'd then have surgery? Dunno.
JimBob Skeeter
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Since: 2.1.02
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#24 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.16
    Originally posted by Hokienautic
      Originally posted by DirtyMikeSeaver
      The Floyd Mayweather face thing isn't going to work. I can't imagine why the WWE thinks he would be cheered. He's the biggest villian in boxing (did they not see any of the HBO buildup to De La Hoya/Mayweather?). He's got TONS of charisma, and I'm a huge fan of him. but this isn't going to work. They should pair him up with MVP, because I think the dynamic would work really well with them. And I think against Show/Shane, it would be a pretty good match.

      All that said, I love the fact he came into "I Get Money". THAT'S a great intro theme.


    Can't remember where (sorry ... maybe rajah.com) but I recall reading that a possible plan would be Floyd/Rey versus Show/Shane. If that's the case, perhaps expect Shane to eat the pin so Show doesn't have to lose in his return. Or maybe Rey since he'd then have surgery? Dunno.


I've r3ead that too, and the first thing that I thought of was the dueling intros between Floyd's "I Get Money' and Shane's "Here Comes The Money". That alone would be worth teh $50 for WM alone.
Torchslasher
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Since: 17.1.02
From: New F'n Jersey

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#25 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.00
I thought the Hornswoggle angle was basically done perfectly. They have been flirting with the fact that someone will eventually hurt Hornswoggle for months now. Each time, he and Finlay find a way to outsmart people.

Vince McMahon was so great in this as well. He wanted to show Horny a lesson, but he just couldn't really do the deed himself, and so he "hires" JBL. Then at the end he sees what his notion of "tough love" has wrought, and even the evil chairman has to admit he might have gone too far.

Finlay made this angle work with his passion. The "You are NOT sorry for this" yell at McMahon was perfect.

This angle made me want Finlay to kill JBL, so I think it worked, and I'm sure others will feel that way.



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Since: 25.4.03
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#26 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.77
    Originally posted by Torchslasher
    This angle made me want Finlay to kill JBL, so I think it worked, and I'm sure others will feel that way.


I agree 100% with you ... I dare say that this is probably the biggest push in Dave Finlay's career. He is mad over.

And here I thought the pairing of him with a "leprauchan" was going to be a career killer.
Cerebus
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Since: 17.11.02

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#27 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.48
I like JBL, but watching that fake beatdown he was giving the midget was kinda disturbing and I can't wait for Finlay to bet the shit out of him. A Finlay/JBL match might be the stiffest worked match EVER!

Big Show seems to get the matches that will draw the non wrestling fans to WRESTLEMANIA, remember the Sumo match with Akebono (SP?)? This is another match up like that but more slanted towards the American audience this time. I hope he has fun with it this year. To bad I have no clue as to who this Maywether guy is though. It's a shame they couldn't have gotten Lennox Lewis or Holyfield... boxers I know.

I'm actually looking forward to the RAW Title match at MANIA this year, I'd love to see Orton and Helmsley not allow Cena to get the belt back.





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oldschoolhero
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Since: 2.1.02
From: nWo Country

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#28 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.00
Lewis and Holyfield are so ridiculously irrelevant to the boxing world today that they would stand zero chance of scoring crossover buys from non-wrestling fans. It'd just be two former champions, now all but retired, making yet another non-boxing appearance. Getting Mayweather for an angle is HUGE, and I'm shocked they kept it so quiet.



To those who say people wouldn't look; they wouldn't be interested; they're too complacent, indifferent and insulated, I can only reply: There is, in one reporter's opinion, considerable evidence against that contention. But even if they are right, what have they got to lose? Because if they are right, and this instrument is good for nothing but to entertain, amuse and insulate, then the tube is flickering now and we will soon see that the whole struggle is lost. This instrument can teach, it can illuminate; yes, and it can even inspire. But it can do so only to the extent that humans are determined to use it to those ends. Otherwise it is merely wires, and lights, in a box.-Edward R. Murrow
emma
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Since: 1.8.02
From: Phoenix-ish

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#29 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.22
    Originally posted by kentish
    Maybe I am wrong, but it seems to me that the main event if WM features 3 guys who the fans can't agree upon, or don't really care about. I mean really, outside of DX, do the fans REALLY like HHH? They certainly aren't entirely behind Cena, and could care less if Orton is there or not. This is making me really not interested in the title match, and they still have 7 weeks to drag this out.
" ... The fans can't agree upon" -- you're very correct. "... Or don't really care about." -- there I have to disagree with you. Randy has never been so interesting or over, if for no other reason than the third of the audience who rabidly hates Cena. The two-thirds who love Cena are staunch & vocal about that. The dueling fans at No Way Out made the Cena/Orton match all sorts of entertaining, & the guys fed off of it. Yes, there is indeed a very large contingent of fans who REALLY like HHH. And we certainly know there's a faction who will rag on anything he does. I'd say almost every member of the fanbase at large has a strong opinion about at least one or two of the three. I don't think it's important at all that the fans agree -- in fact, I think that's exactly what will make the match fun!

As far as the build goes, I'm fascinated to see whether Randy can man up enough to be the only pure heel up against two very charismatic, very skilled (mostly) babyfaces. (I actually think Randy's going to need to have HHH in the mix, just to help him out in promo-land. That's still a weak area for young Randall. Just don't bring back John Cena's father!)
Hogan's My Dad
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Since: 8.6.02
From: Canada

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#30 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.88
    Originally posted by oldschoolhero
    Lewis and Holyfield are so ridiculously irrelevant to the boxing world today that they would stand zero chance of scoring crossover buys from non-wrestling fans. It'd just be two former champions, now all but retired, making yet another non-boxing appearance. Getting Mayweather for an angle is HUGE, and I'm shocked they kept it so quiet.


Yeah, but boxing in general has zero relevance. It's all about UFC right now, and while I understand that it's not in MMA's best interests to have anything to do with WWE, even if virtually all of their success is based on mimicking the McMahon model of how to sell a PPV, something tells me WWE didn't even try to contact them. History suggests, since this is the company after all that brought in Limp Bizkit years past their peak, and courted the Jackass boys years past theirs, that they just don't see the writing on the wall when it comes to "what the kids are into these days". Another sign Vince and anyone in a position of prominence is out of touch.

Awful RAW. Jeff continues to be a bright spot. I really wish Kennedy would go away. He's like another Orton to me, only not as good(!). They better pick up the pace.



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Since: 20.6.02
From: I am the Tag Team Champions!

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#31 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.89
    Originally posted by oldschoolhero
    Lewis and Holyfield are so ridiculously irrelevant to the boxing world today that they would stand zero chance of scoring crossover buys from non-wrestling fans. It'd just be two former champions, now all but retired, making yet another non-boxing appearance. Getting Mayweather for an angle is HUGE, and I'm shocked they kept it so quiet.


To back your point further, they actually DID get Holyfield for Saturday Night's Main Event just a few months ago and it did squat. At the end of the night, it was just another segment.

Mayweather's still in his prime, hasn't lost a match, and is fresh off demolishing Ricky Hatton on PPV. He's going to draw big money for WM. I still can't put my finger on why he's getting a heel reaction, though.

Unless people STILL remember when he and Oscar De La Hoya put the world to sleep with their anti-climactic PPV fight. People don't forget wasting $50 on crap (wrestling PPV's notwithstanding, of course).




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Since: 2.1.02
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#32 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.16
    Originally posted by Hogan's My Dad
    Yeah, but boxing in general has zero relevance.

Considering Mayweather's last two fights have generated over 3.2 million combined buys, and the De La Hoya fight is the biggest PPV event in history (doing double what any UFC or WWE PPV has ever done) I'd say he's still pretty relevant.




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Since: 2.1.02
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#33 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.40
    Originally posted by Hogan's My Dad
    Yeah, but boxing in general has zero relevance.


That's why the WWE chose a boxer as a non-wrestling personality for an angle at WM? Is that the case?

This isn't boxing sponging off wrestling to try to draw interest - it's clearly the other way around.



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Since: 16.2.07
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#34 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.10
    Originally posted by Cerebus
    A Finlay/JBL match might be the stiffest worked match EVER!
    Find a way to mix in Hardcore Holly and THERE is your triple-threat WM Main Event.
Hogan's My Dad
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Since: 8.6.02
From: Canada

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#35 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.88
SPF and JayJay-

I'm not saying boxing is a dead entertainment form, but it is dying. Mayweather and De La Hoya did well due in no small part to the fact that it is boxing's last superfight. At least for the next several years. And despite that, Mayweather is still not a household name. Certainly big among fight fans, but not a crossover celebrity like Tyson was.

WWE is doing this angle about as well as it can be done, and it'll get some coverage, but I'm not sure what this "big money" talk is spawned by, honestly. Wrestlemania is a smash every year. It would have been with or without Mayweather. All this is doing is putting him in a position to be criticized by sportswriters for sullying the good name of boxing (heh) by getting involved with the evil WWE, and putting Floyd in a position to get booed and look really, really small. I guess as long as Floyd gets paid, and WWE gets coverage, everyone's happy.

But hey, for me, I long for the days when celebrity involvement was limited to timekeepers, special refs, and Bob Uecker getting choked.



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too-old-now
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#36 Posted on
    Originally posted by Hogan's My Dad
    But hey, for me, I long for the days when celebrity involvement was limited to timekeepers, special refs, and Bob Uecker getting choked.


I long for the day Drew Carey was a celebrity entrant in the Royal Rumble - especially every time I see him on TPIR.
BendyStraws
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#37 Posted on
    Originally posted by emma
    Randy has never been so interesting or over, if for no other reason than the third of the audience who rabidly hates Cena. The two-thirds who love Cena are staunch & vocal about that. The dueling fans at No Way Out made the Cena/Orton match all sorts of entertaining,


I agree with this strongly. I don't understand how some people can claim that "the fans still don't care about Orton." The fans have been rabid in all Orton matches during this title reign. He really has evolved into his role nicely. I don't think he's become "great" or anything yet, but he is much improved and playing his part well this time around. The dynamic of the three most contraversial wrestlers in WWE in the main event of Wrestlemania should make for an absolutely electric crowd.


(edited by BendyStraws on 21.2.08 0254)
dMr
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Since: 2.11.02
From: Edinburgh, Scotland

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#38 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.20
    Originally posted by Hogan's My Dad
    SPF and JayJay-

    I'm not saying boxing is a dead entertainment form, but it is dying. Mayweather and De La Hoya did well due in no small part to the fact that it is boxing's last superfight. At least for the next several years. And despite that, Mayweather is still not a household name. Certainly big among fight fans, but not a crossover celebrity like Tyson was.

    WWE is doing this angle about as well as it can be done, and it'll get some coverage, but I'm not sure what this "big money" talk is spawned by, honestly.


Can't speak so much for the North American market, but it should get them plenty money in Europe (especially the UK).

He was only known to boxing fans beforehand I'd say, but Mayweather is a huge deal over here after the Hatton fight. Not Tyson-huge I'll grant you, but he got an absolute ton of coverage and respect for that fight.

The respect thing's the big plus for Mayweather over Tyson. At the time Tyson got involved, he was largely viewed as a freak show and it was covered here as "Hey, Mike's in the WWF, he MUST be desparate". Mayweather obviously needs neither the money or the fame so it comes across as more real, and in a lot of ways, a much bigger deal.

Couple of my mates who haven't really watched wrestling for donkeys have already dropped intrigued "see Floyd Mayweather's meant to be at wrestlemania?" comments.

If nothing else, Sky love him and they're past masters of plugging guys like Mayweather (peak of his career, gives good copy, undefeated) so he'll probably be all over their WM ads in the next couple weeks and should generate a good number of buys.

Longer term I don't see it doing much in terms of holding on to new/lapsed fans, or prompting other boxers and celebrities to get involved with WWE, but short term they should do just fine out of it.
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#39 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.40
    Originally posted by Hogan's My Dad
    I'm not saying boxing is a dead entertainment form, but it is dying.


So is wrestling, then, right? Oh, it isn't? Well, neither is boxing. Both sports (if I can apply that to wrestling as well) go up-and-down, but they both bounce back, too. Boxing is DEFINITELY in a bounce-back period. People don't paid the kind of cheddar boxers get when their sport is "dying". When boxing isn't on HBO, Showtime, ESPN, ESPN2, etc., every week, let's have the "boxing is dying" conversation then.


    Mayweather and De La Hoya did well due in no small part to the fact that it is boxing's last superfight.


Until the next one, just like always.



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Since: 2.1.02
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#40 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.00
Also, Mayweather may not be a household name, but you're kidding yourself if you think Mir, Lesnar, Liddell and Coutoure are.



To those who say people wouldn't look; they wouldn't be interested; they're too complacent, indifferent and insulated, I can only reply: There is, in one reporter's opinion, considerable evidence against that contention. But even if they are right, what have they got to lose? Because if they are right, and this instrument is good for nothing but to entertain, amuse and insulate, then the tube is flickering now and we will soon see that the whole struggle is lost. This instrument can teach, it can illuminate; yes, and it can even inspire. But it can do so only to the extent that humans are determined to use it to those ends. Otherwise it is merely wires, and lights, in a box.-Edward R. Murrow
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