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The W - Pro Wrestling - WWE suspends 10 wrestlers (Page 3)
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CEOIII
Boudin rouge








Since: 25.7.02
From: Franklin, PA

Since last post: 25 days
Last activity: 9 hours
#41 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.63
    Originally posted by CajunMan
    What was Orton's punishment when he went Roid Rage in a hotel room in Europe?


It was more Spoiled Dickhead Rage than Roid Rage, but I believe he caught 30 days. (Angle "broke his ankle" with 3 ankle locks to explain his little vacation.)



I'm Charlie Owens, good night, and good luck.
hansen9j
Andouille








Since: 7.11.02
From: Riderville, SK

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 17 hours
#42 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.33
    Originally posted by CEOIII
      Originally posted by CajunMan
      What was Orton's punishment when he went Roid Rage in a hotel room in Europe?


    It was more Spoiled Dickhead Rage than Roid Rage, but I believe he caught 30 days. (Angle "broke his ankle" with 3 ankle locks to explain his little vacation.)


Nope, Europe was in 2007. His punishment was to go home early (causing the 60 minute match between Michaels and Cena), and then job at Backlash (which he probably was doing anyway).

Edit: Wrong year, I'm an idiot.

(edited by hansen9j on 31.8.07 1711)


Proud member of the Dwight Army of Champions. And also a Communist.

Word Up, Thome
JustinShapiro
Scrapple
Moderator








Since: 12.12.01
From: Pittsburgh, PA

Since last post: 7 days
Last activity: 12 hours
#43 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.67
I think the suspension in 2006 was 60 days. He was gone a couple weeks after Wrestlemania and came back just before One Night Stand in June. I don't think that was a Wellness Policy suspension, either, but a behavioral one, even if part of the last straw had to do with him smoking a joint.

Orton's punishment for this spring was being sent home and the intention was to give him a burial for a while, but instead of continuing his job streak against Shawn Michaels at Judgment Day, Shawn's injury along with Undertaker's sending Edge to Smackdown made Orton the top heel by default and the burial was cancelled. Although because the suspensions were anonymous at this point, I guess it's possible he also could've been on a work-for-free stay-on-TV suspension.
Super Shane Spear
Bierwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: Sector 7 Slums

Since last post: 1591 days
Last activity: 1591 days
#44 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.62
Also from wo.com

He invented getting released!

"WWE fires one person on the list

Mike Bucci, although he had incredible heat on him from his regular job in talent relations and was on the bubble before his name surfaced."
Mr. Boffo
Scrapple








Since: 24.3.02
From: Oshkosh, WI

Since last post: 451 days
Last activity: 412 days
#45 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.12
    Originally posted by Super Shane Spear
    Also from wo.com

    He invented getting released!

    "WWE fires one person on the list

    Mike Bucci, although he had incredible heat on him from his regular job in talent relations and was on the bubble before his name surfaced."

No more Simon Dean?

This is a sad day.
TheOldMan
Landjager








Since: 13.2.03
From: Chicago

Since last post: 114 days
Last activity: 13 hours
#46 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.07
And now, a humorous interlude:

Local CW affiliate WGN here in Chicago had a report on tonight's newscast, which directly followed SmackDown. Intrepid reporter newsreader Dina Bair managed to report (as best I recall it, visualize a picture of the scratch logo over her shoulder) "10 Wrestling Entertainment employees were suspended yesterday for failing a steroids test. The names of those suspended will be released in November."

I kid you not. Argh.




It's the Big "W", I tell ya! The Big "W"!
redsoxnation
Scrapple








Since: 24.7.02

Since last post: 479 days
Last activity: 479 days
#47 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.57
    Originally posted by hayden
      Originally posted by Venom
      Question: Anyone forsee any of the suspened and publicly embarassed guys turning on Vince and ratting him and the company out for their hypocritical stance due to all of this?


    Not unless they get fired. People still employed by the company simply don't speak critically of the company when it comes to serious issues like this.






But what happens when subpoenas from Congressional Committees start flying around? If, by some fluke, someone is competent on the committee, they just have to go with this line of questioning throughout their 5 minutes allotted time:
To Wrestler X: Have you used steroids?
Follow-up: Have you used Human Growth Hormones?
If yes, has Vincent Kennedy McMahon or anyone in a position of authority within the company encouraged you to use these substances?
You would just need one person who fears perjury and is willing to take immunity to crack to really blow things up. The subpoena list will be even more interesting than the suspension list. Plus, Vince under oath could be hysterical if he doesn't take the 5th. After all these years, does Vince actually know what the truth is?

(edited by redsoxnation on 31.8.07 2318)
shawnpatrick
Kishke








Since: 31.7.07
From: Leesville SC

Since last post: 889 days
Last activity: 771 days
#48 Posted on
Like I said earlier, it's possible the WWE doesn't suspend all ten immediately. They could rotate the suspensions. Regal would be easy to replace, Coach is still the #2 man on the show anyway.

Rather than the WWE do a storyline about them missing, McMahon should simply issue a statement like he did for Benoit on Smackdown of what happened and that the WWE will continue with it's current superstars to entertain you at their highest level.

I guess if someone is going to a house show this weekend, they can confirm if any of the ten are on those cards.

Maybe we'll get Sgt Slaughter/Ron Simmons/Hacksaw Jim Duggan to get wins on Raw this week.. lol

My question is there appears to be a bunch of baseball players on that list of getting illegal performance enhancing drugs but their names haven't been released yet. I wonder why?????????



oldschoolhero
Knackwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: nWo Country

Since last post: 1987 days
Last activity: 1921 days
#49 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.00
    Originally posted by redsoxnation
      Originally posted by hayden
        Originally posted by Venom
        Question: Anyone forsee any of the suspened and publicly embarassed guys turning on Vince and ratting him and the company out for their hypocritical stance due to all of this?


      Not unless they get fired. People still employed by the company simply don't speak critically of the company when it comes to serious issues like this.






    But what happens when subpoenas from Congressional Committees start flying around? If, by some fluke, someone is competent on the committee, they just have to go with this line of questioning throughout their 5 minutes allotted time:
    To Wrestler X: Have you used steroids?
    Follow-up: Have you used Human Growth Hormones?
    If yes, has Vincent Kennedy McMahon or anyone in a position of authority within the company encouraged you to use these substances?
    You would just need one person who fears perjury and is willing to take immunity to crack to really blow things up. The subpoena list will be even more interesting than the suspension list. Plus, Vince under oath could be hysterical if he doesn't take the 5th. After all these years, does Vince actually know what the truth is?

    (edited by redsoxnation on 31.8.07 2318)


Except "encouraged to use steroids" is a really woolly and vague phrase. Vince ain't dumb - there's no way that he himself has ever specifically said to someone "hey, go shove a needle in your arm and we'll talk". So what it would boil down to is one wrestler's story of Vince making vague allusions to body mass and pushes versus the WWE's high-priced team of lawyers. I don't think anyone's brave enough to tak eon that whistleblowing role - they'd be savaged, and their credibility absolutely bulldozed.



To those who say people wouldn't look; they wouldn't be interested; they're too complacent, indifferent and insulated, I can only reply: There is, in one reporter's opinion, considerable evidence against that contention. But even if they are right, what have they got to lose? Because if they are right, and this instrument is good for nothing but to entertain, amuse and insulate, then the tube is flickering now and we will soon see that the whole struggle is lost. This instrument can teach, it can illuminate; yes, and it can even inspire. But it can do so only to the extent that humans are determined to use it to those ends. Otherwise it is merely wires, and lights, in a box.-Edward R. Murrow
Jackson
Sujuk








Since: 4.1.02

Since last post: 1990 days
Last activity: 1515 days
#50 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.85
    Originally posted by Peter The Hegemon
    Really? You think Jericho returning and Benjamin to ECW are THAT outlandish? It's not as though I said they were locks, just things they SHOULD do (or try to do, in the former case).


Yeah you're right. It's not outlandish at all. Maybe you could e-mail Stephanie about it. She makes great decisions like this all the time.

Be sure and include the Lesner/Goldberg part especially.

(edited by Jackson on 1.9.07 0359)


The Guinness.
Morcilla








Since: 24.4.05
From: San Diego, CA

Since last post: 6 hours
Last activity: 4 hours
AIM:  
#51 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.53
    Originally posted by Jackson
      Originally posted by Peter The Hegemon
      Really? You think Jericho returning and Benjamin to ECW are THAT outlandish? It's not as though I said they were locks, just things they SHOULD do (or try to do, in the former case).


    Yeah you're right. It's not outlandish at all. Maybe you could e-mail Stephanie about it. She makes great decisions like this all the time.

    Be sure and include the Lesner/Goldberg part especially.

    (edited by Jackson on 1.9.07 0359)


Jackson. Please leave Peter alone. You are wrong with your attack. Think about it....think about it.
oldschoolhero
Knackwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: nWo Country

Since last post: 1987 days
Last activity: 1921 days
#52 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.00
    Originally posted by Jackson
    >Be sure and include the Lesner/Goldberg part especially.


You mean the part where he said Lesnar and Goldberg would likely never be in WWE again?

Did you even read his post?



To those who say people wouldn't look; they wouldn't be interested; they're too complacent, indifferent and insulated, I can only reply: There is, in one reporter's opinion, considerable evidence against that contention. But even if they are right, what have they got to lose? Because if they are right, and this instrument is good for nothing but to entertain, amuse and insulate, then the tube is flickering now and we will soon see that the whole struggle is lost. This instrument can teach, it can illuminate; yes, and it can even inspire. But it can do so only to the extent that humans are determined to use it to those ends. Otherwise it is merely wires, and lights, in a box.-Edward R. Murrow
Venom
Boudin rouge








Since: 15.1.03

Since last post: 2605 days
Last activity: 2575 days
#53 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.66
    Originally posted by oldschoolhero
    Except "encouraged to use steroids" is a really woolly and vague phrase. Vince ain't dumb - there's no way that he himself has ever specifically said to someone "hey, go shove a needle in your arm and we'll talk". So what it would boil down to is one wrestler's story of Vince making vague allusions to body mass and pushes versus the WWE's high-priced team of lawyers. I don't think anyone's brave enough to tak eon that whistleblowing role - they'd be savaged, and their credibility absolutely bulldozed.


I agree with you in the sense that no one who's in a comfy position with the company is gonna turn on Vince since they have so much to lose.

However, this is rapidly boiling down to the ending of every drug movie ever made ("Goodfellas" and "Traffic" come to mind)...blame it on the other guy. By suspending the ten wrestlers, Vince is pretty clearly saying "Hey, we didn't do anything, they bought it and used it!" It's smart PR, but when you have one guy getting fired (Bucci) and another with a well documented attitude problem (Orton), I think some bitterness might start setting in. When people start pointing fingers and laying blame on other people is when they start getting pissed off and start fighting back. I can see Orton and Bucci testifying against Vince, but not in any heroic capacity. Pretty much "You screwed me, so I'm gonna screw you over."

Also, there are a plethora of bitter, angry, financially struggling former WWE employees who I think would be all too happy to come crawling out of the woodwork and blame all their problems on Vince (as well as get some limelight and positive press for being 'the sole consceince of the wrestling community').

You're also right in the sense that it'll all boil down to hearsay, since no one has evidence on Vince or the company for making wrestlers take steroids. Right now, the only people I can see testifying with any credibility, either for or against Vince, would be guys like The Rock or Mick Foley...guys who are semi-retired, are well known in the main-stream, and have no reason to cover Vince's ass if it gets into hot water since they've branched out into other financial venues. Plus, Foley's made his displeasure with Vince's business decisions clear on several occaisions, albeit in a tame and controlled manner.

I'm pretty sure someone will spill the beans on Titan Sports sooner or later, either in the press or in the committee hearings. How the media handles it will detirmine whether or not it means anything when Blue Meanie calls Vince a steroid pusher. And Vince isn't exactly known for running a mature and reasonable PR department to deal with these attacks (XFL, PTC, WWF, the night of his RAW return, etc.)

(edited by Venom on 1.9.07 0352)


WoW Wisdom:
"And then there's aggro to worry about."
"What's 'aggro'?"
"Well, it's complicated. But loosely translated, it means 'the priest dies.'"
edoug
Summer sausage








Since: 13.2.04
From: Maine

Since last post: 93 days
Last activity: 18 hours
#54 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.56
He's already beaten the rap once. If someone does come out and accuse McMahon, they had better have some strong evidence.



Venom
Boudin rouge








Since: 15.1.03

Since last post: 2605 days
Last activity: 2575 days
#55 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.66
    Originally posted by edoug
    He's already beaten the rap once. If someone does come out and accuse McMahon, they had better have some strong evidence.


Oh, I don't think anyone testifying and saying "Vince told me to do steroids" will be enough. What I'm saying is that once his workers start taking the blame and eventually turn on Vince is when this whole thing will blow up and turn into a war, with all of wrestling's dirty little secrets being put on trial.

I don't think Vince will get out of this one unscathed.



WoW Wisdom:
"And then there's aggro to worry about."
"What's 'aggro'?"
"Well, it's complicated. But loosely translated, it means 'the priest dies.'"
oldschoolhero
Knackwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: nWo Country

Since last post: 1987 days
Last activity: 1921 days
#56 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.00
But *why* would any wrestler turn on Vince? He's the major domo of American pro-wrestling, and it's gonna stay that way for a long, long time. If, say, Orton busts on Vince, he gets sent down to TNA to earn less money, before maybe going jobless if/when it folds. The WWE will survive, but any whistleblowers will face a near-impossible task of maintaining a successful North American wrestling career when a)they're a known steroid abuser and b)they've burnt their bridges with the one true big-money player in the country.

Taking the heat in a congressional hearing then going back to work for the best paid, best known, and - like it or not - the most health-conscious wrestling company in the Western hemisphere would be vastly preferable to speaking out against Vince and getting blacklisted from ever making serious money in American wrestling. The industry is like the Mob, and Vince is the capo of capos - he's never going to get taken down from the inside. He's got too much power and too much influence.

(edited by oldschoolhero on 1.9.07 0654)


To those who say people wouldn't look; they wouldn't be interested; they're too complacent, indifferent and insulated, I can only reply: There is, in one reporter's opinion, considerable evidence against that contention. But even if they are right, what have they got to lose? Because if they are right, and this instrument is good for nothing but to entertain, amuse and insulate, then the tube is flickering now and we will soon see that the whole struggle is lost. This instrument can teach, it can illuminate; yes, and it can even inspire. But it can do so only to the extent that humans are determined to use it to those ends. Otherwise it is merely wires, and lights, in a box.-Edward R. Murrow
BigDaddyLoco
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 1 hour
#57 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.31
    Originally posted by Venom
    Plus, Foley's made his displeasure with Vince's business decisions clear on several occaisions, albeit in a tame and controlled manner.


Speaking of Foley it makes the end of his second book that much more of a head scratcher. Here's a guy that's been in every promotion and worked with just everybody and he was pretty sure that wrestlers were just taking protien shakes. He's either the most naive guy in the world or one heck of a company puppet.

Venom
Boudin rouge








Since: 15.1.03

Since last post: 2605 days
Last activity: 2575 days
#58 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.66
    Originally posted by oldschoolhero
    But *why* would any wrestler turn on Vince? He's the major domo of American pro-wrestling, and it's gonna stay that way for a long, long time. If, say, Orton busts on Vince, he gets sent down to TNA to earn less money, before maybe going jobless if/when it folds. The WWE will survive, but any whistleblowers will face a near-impossible task of maintaining a successful North American wrestling career when a)they're a known steroid abuser and b)they've burnt their bridges with the one true big-money player in the country.

    Taking the heat in a congressional hearing then going back to work for the best paid, best known, and - like it or not - the most health-conscious wrestling company in the Western hemisphere would be vastly preferable to speaking out against Vince and getting blacklisted from ever making serious money in American wrestling. The industry is like the Mob, and Vince is the capo of capos - he's never going to get taken down from the inside. He's got too much power and too much influence.

    (edited by oldschoolhero on 1.9.07 0654)


And if that analogy is true, how was the mob taken down? From the inside, when all the petty thugs, hitmen, accounants and drug runners got caught and ratted out the boys in charge of the operation to avoid jail time.

I think you're right in the practical sense, since no one in their right mind would screw Vince over if they want to make it North American wrestling. But that's dealing with people in their right mind. If the 10 guys on that list get called up, or anyone else for that matter who's being publicly outed (by the WWE) and end up looking the legal system in the face with issues like perjury, obstruction of justice and illegal substance abuse, I think the rats are gonna bite and claw their way off the sinking ship regardless of who stands in their way.

This has been a fun argument, simply from the speculative nature of it, since this could all be forgotten tomorrow if the media catches wind of a bigger story to cover. I think it's going to be very interesting to see just what happens to the industry in the wake of all this.

Question: The 10 guys in that list...what specific legal charges could they be facing? From what I understand, they've just been linked to the doctor, and that's who the feds are going after right now. Could the wrestlers themselves be charged with anything based on his records?



WoW Wisdom:
"And then there's aggro to worry about."
"What's 'aggro'?"
"Well, it's complicated. But loosely translated, it means 'the priest dies.'"
oldschoolhero
Knackwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: nWo Country

Since last post: 1987 days
Last activity: 1921 days
#59 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.00
The wrestlers themselves aren't being charged with anything.



To those who say people wouldn't look; they wouldn't be interested; they're too complacent, indifferent and insulated, I can only reply: There is, in one reporter's opinion, considerable evidence against that contention. But even if they are right, what have they got to lose? Because if they are right, and this instrument is good for nothing but to entertain, amuse and insulate, then the tube is flickering now and we will soon see that the whole struggle is lost. This instrument can teach, it can illuminate; yes, and it can even inspire. But it can do so only to the extent that humans are determined to use it to those ends. Otherwise it is merely wires, and lights, in a box.-Edward R. Murrow
JustinShapiro
Scrapple
Moderator








Since: 12.12.01
From: Pittsburgh, PA

Since last post: 7 days
Last activity: 12 hours
#60 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.67
The same situation more or less came up with Vince's 1994 trial. Other than Kevin Wacholz (Nailz), who was pretty transparently lying just to try to bury Vince, the only person who testified that Vince had encouraged him to take steroids was Rick Rude. But his conversation with Vince was vague enough ("you don't look too good; your work and promos are good but I'm concerned about your appearance; When you’re down and sore is when you need to push yourself") to where you could still argue that he wasn't talking about steroids.

I'd guess Vince has probably never told anyone to take steroids. His attitude is entirely reflective in who he hires and who he pushes, which gives guys maximum incentive to take stuff: do it and have a shot at a job or don't and have next to no chance; do it and have a better chance of getting noticed and pushed or don't and get made fun of for being small. But that kind of wrestling ins-and-outs is especially hard to convey to people who don't follow wrestling, many of whom don't even grasp why wrestlers would need to take steroids since there's no physical competition (even though so much of the equation really is physique competition). Even with the two most public blatant incidents -- Vince telling Orton his neck looked like a stack of dimes and Hunter burying Masters for losing 50 pounds in a month or whatever his line was -- it's still "in character" and hard to understand without context. And as the Lawler lawsuit proved, people outside of wrestling have a really hard time understanding that context. Not that I blame them, because it's pretty weird.

Any current wrestler turning on Vince seems pretty far-fetched for all the reasons oldschoolhero has explained. The blog entries and TV appearances by the Ken Kennedys and Gregory Helms and Chavo Guerreros seem to indicate that many of the WWE wrestlers are pretty indoctrinated and far more concerned with Protecting The Biz than what you'd think would be their own self-interests -- because their actual self-interests seem to have far less to do with their health and far more to do with getting people to leave wrestling alone and let them keep doing things the way they always have.

(edited by JustinShapiro on 1.9.07 1652)
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Eh, I could still see Shane as a GM on Smackdown. Theu kind of alluded to him not liking Bischoff, and this could lead to a new era of competition for both shows. Also of note, the dreaded other S-word with the last name McMahon wasn't mentioned either....
- WhoBettahThanDeion, Shane is Alive!!!!! (2002)
Related threads: WWE responds to Congress. - Cogressional committee request WWE drug-testing records - Rene Dupree has been released - More...
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