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The W - Pro Wrestling - Chris Benoit passes away (Page 12)
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emma
Cherries > Peaches








Since: 1.8.02
From: Phoenix-ish

Since last post: 43 days
Last activity: 4 days
#221 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.95
The guys may be "Our Heros", but they are also just humans. And humans are very complex and, sadly, fallible things.

This is a very sad & very tragic event.
Phantom
Frankfurter








Since: 17.3.02

Since last post: 2382 days
Last activity: 2358 days
#222 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.67
    Originally posted by StingArmy
      Originally posted by Phantom
      Do people still talk about how O.J. Simpson was such a great running back?

    Um, yes? Where have YOU been?

    - StingArmy
Apparently somewhere that people haven't talked about O.J. in the context of his running for a very long time.

But I agree with Skarecrow. It's way, way too early to start pinning this on steroids, or wrestling, or any other scapegoats that people may come up with. We can certainly speculate that those things played a role, but nobody has any solid evidence about why this happened or what the motive could have been. From the description of the press conference (where reporters asked three times if steroids were found before confirmation was given) it sounds like the media has already determined the story they want to write, and are choosing their facts to fit the story. Let's wait until the official investigation is completed before we do the same.
Alessandro
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Worcester MA

Since last post: 90 days
Last activity: 6 days
#223 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.04
    Originally posted by Skarecrow
    Does this sound like a man who was right in the head? He was an ok guy for years, and suddenly he starts killing people?

    Wait for the toxicology report. Wait for the autopsy. My bet is that something was seriously and legitimatly messed up in his head, and when he killed his family he didn't know what in the hell he was doing.

    My guess is that when he came to, realized what he'd done, he went and said prayers over his wife and child (hence the bibles) and then killed himself.

    Fact is we may never know what happened in there this past weekend, but there is no need to assume that a guy that has been a pillar of the wrestling community for years was rationally and sanely planning on killing people all along.

    Wait.


Like the NFL's recent investigations into concussions, WWE is going to have to take a long hard look at what their current work practices are doing to the long-term mental well-being of their employees ... Maybe it's time to seriously consider an "off-season" for pro wrestling (three-four months out of the year to rest and recuperate). Maybe only have the wrestlers wrestle twice a week (RAW performs Monday, Smackdown and ECW perform Tuesday, then all three brands perform one house show each in different cities during the weekend). I dunno, do something. ANYTHING. If Benoit losing control of his mental faculties was brought on by years of head trauma and steroid use (which is certainly still speculation at the point) then someone has to look at this as a wakeup call.





Mean Green Boston Celtics Message BoardUnofficial Boogeyman Fan Club MemberAre you ready for a web site so hot its gonna feel like somebody took a trayful of cookies and BAKED EM UP IN YOUR ASS


JustinShapiro
Scrapple
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Since: 12.12.01
From: Pittsburgh, PA

Since last post: 1 day
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#224 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.53
It's tough. "Hoping" for roid rage and/or concussion depression seems weird, just like "hoping" that maybe Chris Benoit's wife killed their son. I've reacted to this almost entirely selfishly so I question whether talk of that kind of cause and motive is just to make me feel better or whether it really is the main thread of the story. Honestly, I think it's both, so I welcome all talk of the steroid factor even if it seems like the media is writing that story ahead of time, but at the same time I guess I still see it for what it is both in terms of me and those reporting.

(edited by JustinShapiro on 26.6.07 1620)
Skarecrow
Polska kielbasa








Since: 5.5.05
From: Maryland

Since last post: 2166 days
Last activity: 2129 days
#225 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.00
    Originally posted by Alessandro


    Like the NFL's recent investigations into concussions, WWE is going to have to take a long hard look at what their current work practices are doing to the long-term mental well-being of their employees ... Maybe it's time to seriously consider an "off-season" for pro wrestling (three-four months out of the year to rest and recuperate). Maybe only have the wrestlers wrestle twice a week (RAW performs Monday, Smackdown and ECW perform Tuesday, then all three brands perform one house show each in different cities during the weekend). I dunno, do something. ANYTHING. If Benoit losing control of his mental faculties was brought on by years of head trauma and steroid use (which is certainly still speculation at the point) then someone has to look at this as a wakeup call.




I don't disagree, if that's the case then such things need to be looked into. However, I'll make the video game/music analogy. Doom never made anybody kill people anymore than frisbee or croquet or simcity did. Marilyn Manson never made anybody kill people any more than the beatles or the beegees or beethoven did. The pressures of the wrestling business and the drugs associated with it may have pushed someone who was borderline over the limit, but in-and-of itself I don't think the wrestling business causes people to kill other people (well, not anymore. 30 years ago may have been a different story).

I agree that an off-season would be a tremendous idea for both mental and physical health reasons. Perhaps rotating shifts where 1/4 of the roster is off for any given quarter of the year would better suit the WWE's business plan, who knows. As it stands now, due to serious injuries from workers who continually work with minor injuries, we're already almost at the "1/4 of the roster is off" point anyway.

I still have a hard time wrapping my head around the idea that benoit has been planning on killing people, his own family no less, for a significant period of time. Perhaps it's true, but I'm not about to 100% condemn him yet. If you'd told me that iron shiek did it perhaps, that wouldn't come as such a surprise. but benoit? I just don't know.

I'd like to know what those text messages to chavo said.

(edited by Skarecrow on 26.6.07 1624)


Evil Inside =X=
thecubsfan
Scrapple
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Since: 10.12.01
From: Aurora, IL

Since last post: 26 min.
Last activity: 26 min.
#226 Posted on | Instant Rating: 10.00

    I'd like to know what those text messages to chavo said.


On a radio appearance, Bryan Alvarez said it was estate info.



thecubsfan.com - CMLLBlog
DirtyMikeSeaver
Boudin rouge








Since: 19.5.02
From: Toronto

Since last post: 36 days
Last activity: 36 days
#227 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.27
Is it really wrong to think that a guy, who according to Meltzer's site and AP, used an electrical cord to strangle his wife, and then, the next day, killed his son, was an evil fuck? I mean, it sounds like in the timeline, he didn't kill them both around the same time, which means this wasn't a case of some guy who was delusional in the moment (plus he also bound her hands together).

A lot of people hide who they really are to people. All reports I read said that Benoit was a quiet dude who no one really knew and kept his distance from most wreslters. Maybe there was a reason for that. Ever since this thread started, everyone has said (justifiably) that we should wait before we judge to hear all the facts, but the more we hear about what this man did, the more excuses we come up with. Sometimes, there are just evil people with evil intentions. We've all seen through the OJ trial that people aren't what they seems. My current gf was married before to a guy who was a prince to her before they got married, then he shows his true colours. When the allegations came out, no one (friends, co-workers, family), then she started getting calls from other women talking about the abuse. We're already hearing about possible domestic abuse and a seperation.

Listen, the most tragic thing is (obviously) that three people, especially a 7 yr old, is dead and I hope that some higher power has mercy on Chris's sold, but I'm sorry, I'm not chalking this up to some 'isolated incident' or 'some guy just going crazy at one moment'. I mean, he LIED to the WWE about why he left (saying that his family was coughing up blood). What we he going back there for? He forgot to drywall? Even if this was 'roid rage', it's his responsibility to do something about it. His best friend goes through all this trouble and possibly dies from the complications, and he STILL does it (albeit allegedly and it was all 'legal' perscription)

If anything, I'm taking from this that we can't judge people (good or bad) by their public persona or just because they run fast, or execute German suplexes well. If you can look at this guy's career and not have it tainted, then good on you. We all have different opinions. I'm choosing to remember him.... differently.



Kevin Kelly: "Mr. Austin, would you like to comment on Wade Keller's Take that endorsing the XFL hurts your anti-authority character?"

Steve Austin: "Oh shit, he actually said that? I thought the boys in the back were ribbing me!"

Kelly: "No, he really said that. Did they tell you the part about you sitting in the stands, looking all skeptical?"

Austin: "AHAHAHAHAHAHA. Yeah... oh man that was too much."
BigDaddyLoco
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02

Since last post: 12 hours
Last activity: 12 hours
#228 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.47
From a selfish standpoint I don't know if I will ever be able to enjoy a Chris Benoit match ever again. That really makes me sad because it is something I have done for the past 13 years or so.

I just can't get over the fact that not only did he kill his wife in gruesome fashion, but the kid was in the house when it happened and had to be in the house with a man totally out of his mind for God knows how long. Then Benoit hangs out in the house for another day with the bodies. It's really disturbing stuff.

Obviously what happened to his wife and kid is the saddest part of this whole thing, but I feel like I've also had some innocence stolen from me as well. I just feel wierd and I have never ever felt this way about a public figure before.





komarkaze
Mettwurst








Since: 9.1.03
From: VA

Since last post: 2203 days
Last activity: 2200 days
#229 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.64
The more information that the police are revealing, the more stronger picture being shown that Chris is the real villain. He killed his family. Whether he is a world famous wrestler or not is irrelevant. This awful tragedy is primarily on his hands and he is ultimately responsible for his actions.

As for whether WWE can do anything about the wellness of their workers, I support the idea of a rotating offseason. The typical worker is on the road 300 days out of the year. I say use the brand extension and broadcast Raw, Smackdown and ECW each for four to six months out of the year. For example, Raw can go from January to April, Smackdown goes May to August, and ECW goes September to December. So those timeframes can be considered TV seasons for each show. That way, WWE will still have year round TV coverage, and they don't have to have all their workers available week after week. You can keep some PPVs as multibrand events.



Can't stop the Signal
geemoney
Scrapple








Since: 26.1.03
From: Naples, FL

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 10 hours
AIM:  
#230 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.51
    Originally posted by komarkaze
    The more information that the police are revealing, the more stronger picture being shown that Chris is the real villain. He killed his family. Whether he is a world famous wrestler or not is irrelevant. This awful tragedy is primarily on his hands and he is ultimately responsible for his actions.

    As for whether WWE can do anything about the wellness of their workers, I support the idea of a rotating offseason. The typical worker is on the road 300 days out of the year. I say use the brand extension and broadcast Raw, Smackdown and ECW each for four to six months out of the year. For example, Raw can go from January to April, Smackdown goes May to August, and ECW goes September to December. So those timeframes can be considered TV seasons for each show. That way, WWE will still have year round TV coverage, and they don't have to have all their workers available week after week. You can keep some PPVs as multibrand events.

You could still have all brands go all year, just have 4-5 guys from each brand take rotating three week breaks or something. So 5 guys each from ECW, Smackdown and RAW would be off at a time.

(edited by geemoney on 26.6.07 1734)


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fx772k1
Loukanika








Since: 18.6.07

Since last post: 2074 days
Last activity: 1661 days
#231 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.42
    Originally posted by komarkaze
    This awful tragedy is primarily on his hands and he is ultimately responsible for his actions.


Exactly. Trying to blame others (which many will try) is pointless. Ultimately, no one forced Benoit to do what he did.
CajunMan
Boudin blanc
No longer registered








Since: 2.1.02
From: Give me a Title shot!

Since last post: 1106 days
Last activity: 243 days
#232 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.97
    Originally posted by emma
    The guys may be "Our Heros", but they are also just humans. And humans are very complex and, sadly, fallible things.

    This is a very sad & very tragic event.


ditto



I'm CajunMan and I approve this message.
majikx
Haggis








Since: 6.9.05
From: Elizabethtown

Since last post: 2471 days
Last activity: 2466 days
#233 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.16
This is going to be a hard time to be a fan of Chris Benoit as a performer or be a wrestling fan in general. The majority of society is going to think Chris Benoit is a complete monster. The media is going to compare him to people like the woman in Texas who drowned her kids. And honestly at this point the only difference between them is the lady in texas never made us mark out when they finally won the world title. Its ok to be a fan of Chris Benoit the performer and still despise what he did to his family. Just like it was ok to be a fan of Nirvana, but to be repulsed by how kurt cobain killed himself because he could not deal with being famous. There are a lot of people who have it worse off than these athletes, celebrities, even wrestlers, and they deal with their hardship and pain everyday. Sometimes the hardest part of being a normal person is NOT acting out, not hurting yourself or others. So perhaps the quickest way to get over this is to forgive Chris Benoit for being weak and taking the road he did, and look at ourselves to see how we can be better men and women. I apologize if this sounds like a promo, I just see a lot of hurt out there and worry for the world.
JustinShapiro
Scrapple
Moderator








Since: 12.12.01
From: Pittsburgh, PA

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 1 hour
#234 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.53
WWE.com going into self-preservation mode calling Benoit a pre-meditated killer is creepy. In a sense I'm not sure they have much of a choice because this is shaping up to be a "shit storm" that will make 1990-92 pale in comparison. At the same time it's stunningly cold.

(edited by JustinShapiro on 26.6.07 1810)
Tribal Prophet
Andouille








Since: 9.1.02
From: Winnipeg, MB, Canada

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 11 hours
#235 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.27
    Originally posted by majikx
    This is going to be a hard time to be a fan of Chris Benoit as a performer or be a wrestling fan in general. The majority of society is going to think Chris Benoit is a complete monster. The media is going to compare him to people like the woman in Texas who drowned her kids. And honestly at this point the only difference between them is the lady in texas never made us mark out when they finally won the world title. Its ok to be a fan of Chris Benoit the performer and still despise what he did to his family. Just like it was ok to be a fan of Nirvana, but to be repulsed by how kurt cobain killed himself because he could not deal with being famous.


I wouldn't say it's "Just like" Kurt Cobain at all. Cobain killed himself, and himself only. Benoit was a murderer. One of his victims was his own 7 year son. The other was his wife. I'm not so sure that the majority of society wouldn't be right if they did in fact think he was a monster. This was a horrible horrible tragedy that I only wish could have been prevented.

As far as being a fan of him as a performer still, I'm not saying which side is right or wrong. I'm not making a conscious effort to 'never enjoy watching a benoit match again', I simply know that I never will be able to.


Tribal Prophet
kentish
Andouille








Since: 19.8.05
From: My Old Kentucky Home

Since last post: 43 days
Last activity: 4 days
#236 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.50
I have been thinking back regarding his leave of absence last year, and wondered if that might be related to problems at home. I heard mixed reports at the time that he wanted to "heal up some nagging injuries", and "recharge his batteries", but never heard for sure what it was. Anyone know? He was gone for most of the summer.




Dean! Have you been shooting dope into your scrotum? You can tell me! I'm hip!
cfgb
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Ottawa, Ontario

Since last post: 4 days
Last activity: 1 hour
#237 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.50
I have spent nearly 24 hours trying to digest what I've heard, and it gets worse, and worse, and worse with every passing hour.

The room got a little dusty during Malenko and later Edge's words about Chris last night ...

I still sit back and remember the night he won me over for good. In the semi-finals of the tag-team tournament in February 1999, when after getting pulled out of the cage by Vincent, he realized his only way back in was over the top. So he climbed at the same moment Malenko threw a dropkick, and then threw himself off the top with the diving headbutt to end all diving headbutts. I won't ever forget that.

As I'm absorbing the news, my headache is growing louder and my stomach is in knots. This can't be the same guy I've watched on TV for years, right? This isn't Paul Bernardo. This isn't Susan Smith. This isn't John Wayne Gacy, or anyone of that ilk. This is Chris Benoit, dammit.

And ... now he's the same as any one of them, except with fame prior to the crime.

I keep wanting to believe this is all an elaborate setup, but I'm neither naive, nor downright stupid.

I can't hate him. But I'm wondering if I'll feel guilty watching his matches and enjoying them anymore .... Wrestling is just wrestling, it's not life - and asking me to combine fantasy and reality with something this epic is difficult.

I've never quite experienced any kind of emotional attachment to any athlete, performer, or celebrity before, let alone anything quite this powerful.
gater
Bauerwurst








Since: 29.1.02
From: Palatine, IL

Since last post: 2410 days
Last activity: 1589 days
#238 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.78
I'm wondering how much information the wrestlers had before they gave their testimonials... Many spoke specifically about being a good father. Lawler's insistence on making sure to talk about Daniel and Nancy makes me feel like he knew more to the story as well.
StaggerLee
Scrapple








Since: 3.10.02
From: Right side of the tracks

Since last post: 15 hours
Last activity: 9 hours
#239 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.41
CNN has just reported that Daniel had needle marks in his arms and that he may have been taking growth hormones. Not sure if that means he had a legit need for them or not.

They also said it appears that Daniel was killed with "a choke hold".




Sad and incredible and hard to believe.



RIP Nancy and Daniel.

Fuck Chris Benoit. He's the lowest type of trash possible.
Mayhem
Scrapple








Since: 25.4.03
From: Nashville, TN

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 1 day
#240 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.14

Bob Ryder posted something interesting in that Nancy supposedly had a saftey deposit box with evidence of past incidents.

http://www.1wrestling.com/news/newsline.asp?news=29059

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