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The W - Pro Wrestling - Survivor Series: What the hell!?!?!? (Page 3)
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ekedolphin
Scrapple








Since: 12.1.02
From: Indianapolis, IN; now residing in Suffolk, VA

Since last post: 127 days
Last activity: 18 hours
#41 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.52
Wasn't able to watch Survivor Series, but I'll share my opinion on the new champions:

To me, having The Big Show as WWE Champion and Shawn Michaels as WCW Champion could actually be considered a step backwards from Lesnar and Triple H. And I'm no huge fan of either one of them, either. How about... Kurt Angle and Booker T? Certainly wouldn't hear any complaints from me on that.

Shawn Michaels is WCW Champion, though, and that brings a rather obvious question to my mind-- does this mean he's back, full-time? Having watched WCW during its glory years, and suffering through Hogan's non-defense of the belt for so long, the last thing I want to see is a champion who won't show up for months at a time. Will Shawn Michaels start wrestling on RAW shows as well, or is he going to defend the belt strictly on pay-per-view?

Or will he take it and vanish for six months? We'll have to see... but I hope that WWE takes the opportunity to build up new stars, and not build up to yet another HHH-HBK match. So many other guys could use the rub, and we don't need RAW to be The Clique Show. We all know about the danger of bad long-term planning.

The Big Show as WWE Champion? Damn. Why does Big Show have to be the one to defeat Brock? Big Show, the guy who was out of breath after a two-minute match in which he kicked the shit out of Matt Hardy? There are so many other guys who are more over, have more credibility, are better wrestlers and are in better shape. And they give the belt to the giant Showpotamus.

I won't try to hide my disappointment about that, and since I wasn't able to catch the show I won't argue with those who say The Big Show finally hit his heel stride that he's been missing for years. What I am saying is, there are so many other guys on SmackDown that deserved the title far more than The Big Show.

Los Guerreros as WWE Tag Team Champions? YEAH! Great to see them get the push. I'm looking forward to seeing who they're going to feud with-- will it be Edge and Mysterio, or Benoit and Angle? And will Benoit and Angle finally throw it down?

Victoria as Women's Champion? Pretty cool! The women's hardcore match must've been something to see... now bring on Hell in a Cell! LOL...

Billy Kidman as Cruiserweight Champion? Umm... OK... I'm a fan of his high-flying work, but does he have a character yet?



“When am I gonna meet someone normal for a change?”
--Tommy Vercetti, Grand Theft Auto: Vice City

Two-Time, Two-Time Randomly Selected Wiener of the Day, 5/27/02 and 7/3/02

Certified RFMC Member-- Ask To See My Credentials!

Excalibur05
Knackwurst








Since: 19.1.02
From: Minnesota

Since last post: 13 days
Last activity: 1 day
AIM:  
#42 Posted on
I did a write-up for the PPV. It's not entirely...acurate...but all the results are there.




Since everyone else is doing it (ok, not EVERYONE, but...)

Vikings (3-7) - Where the hell has THAT team been?
Badgers (6-6) - Bowl bound! Oh wait...
Buffy 7... Earns Pi x 2 points...Uh...Not really sure what I'm supposed to thing...That was one friggin' weird episode...
Scott Summets
Sujuk








Since: 27.6.02

Since last post: 3906 days
Last activity: 3875 days
#43 Posted on
If, and this is a big IF, HBK can defend it, I will be happy. Maybe its because my friend and I just watched Hart Foundation vs Rockers, Rockers vs Brainbusters best 2 out of 3, and HBK vs Foley at Mind Games, but if Shawn can work at HALF that level and has regular matches, honestly, who can complain?



Midterms suck, but not as bad as necro angles.
joe-joe
Cotto








Since: 31.5.02
From: NJ, USA

Since last post: 4331 days
Last activity: 4331 days
#44 Posted on
HBK winning the belt was cool to see, but please, job him asap. I repect his wrestling legacy, but he
is very tiny and weak and gay-looking (I know, I know, he's married to Whisper). Also, could pseudo-
Rick-Martel break kayfabe any louder. He only yelled across the whole arena for Jeff to knock him
off the ropes.
Simba
Frankfurter








Since: 7.8.02
From: Boston, MA

Since last post: 2505 days
Last activity: 2113 days
#45 Posted on
Just have some patience with the HBK decision. Pretty soon, you'll all be happy when Jericho takes the belt from him.



How 'bout now?
tarnish
Frankfurter








Since: 13.2.02
From: Back in the Heart of Hali

Since last post: 501 days
Last activity: 1 day
AIM:  
Y!:
#46 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.03

It's times like this that I wish I was cool enough to hang with all you folks who are totally upset and/or underwhelmed by Survivor Series and the WWE in general.

Obviously I'm too easy to please and I'm the problem with the WWE today. I don't complain enough, I'm obviously not discerning enough (having been entertained by last night's show); let's face it, my taste in wrestling obviously sucks.

Somebody made an analogy to movie reviews. Yes, on movie review sites you see a lot of negative comments. But if I go to a movie review site and the only movies they give a decent rating to are Kurosawa films from twenty years ago, then I'm very quickly going to stop going there unless I want a review of a Kurosawa film.

I'm not sure at what point someone decided that ``loudest whiner wins'' but I really wish it weren't that way...






/tarnish...

how come you're so afraid of things that dont make any sense to you? do you water your raisins daily? do you have any raisins? is there anything that does make sense to you? are you afraid of twelve button suits? how come you're so afraid to stop talking?
dskillz
Landjager








Since: 2.1.02
From: Houston Texas

Since last post: 3200 days
Last activity: 2905 days
#47 Posted on
I totally enjoyed the PPV. I don't know what people expected, but this is what a good PPV is, IMO. Big Show seems to actually give a damn again and did great in his role as heel the past month. Stiener's debut was cool. The Chamber rocked beyond belief, even with injuries to 2 of the participants. The tag match rocked and a great opener with the Dudleys re-united, and it feels so good. But people are STILL complaining? Going to the Torch today, people gave the show a .3 and 3.5? Were they watching the same show as I did?
Sit down and enjoy a show for once. Don't try to pick it apart and find things wrong with it. I really liked this PPV. I will be getting the DVD as well.



January 4th 1999 - The day WCW injected itself with 10 gallons of Liquid Anthrax...AKA...The day Hogan "Defeated" Nash to win the WCW title in front of 40,000.
Swordsman Yen
Frankfurter








Since: 16.2.02
From: Shaolin

Since last post: 3938 days
Last activity: 3921 days
#48 Posted on | Instant Rating: 10.00
From the desk of Swordsman Yen
It seems like the Torch readers are basing their ratings on what they read on the live coverage page. If you read the Torch's recap and didn't see the show, you would think it was a pure snoozefest, especially when they leave out key details like BROCK LESNAR F-5'ING THE BIG SHOW!



"I don't care what people think. People are stupid." -- Charles Barkley

Cowboys 3-7-0. ...so how 'bout them Spurs?

Spurs 6-4. *sigh*

Yao Ming Watch - Tracking Yao's efforts to elevate his game to Shawn Bradley's level. Good luck Yao!
(through 11/18/02)

PPG: Bradley 9.5, Yao 6.2
RPG: Bradley 8.3, Yao 3.8
BPG: Bradley 2.9, Yao 0.4
DVD
Chipolata








Since: 28.7.02

Since last post: 2677 days
Last activity: 2165 days
#49 Posted on
Ok, first things first. I didn't watch the PPV. My lame ass forgot to pay the cable bill so it was a week late, which means no PPV. Boy was I pissed. Anywho, from reading the results, I'm really ticked that I didn't get to see the show. Let's break it down.

Table Match: I *wanted* to see this and even called it as being the opener. What I didn't see coming was DVON!!!! Thank god!(no pun intended). Sure, it means their singles push didn't work out, but the Dudleys are like one of the few teams that should *stay* a team. The crowd always pops for 3D. I figured they'd push Jeff more coming out of this match, but if it means the Dudleys are back in business, then I have no complaints.

Cruiser Match: Kinda wish they'd waited one more month, and added Torrie in Kidman's corner, but oh well. You know what'd be cool? Start a storyline up where Kidman shows Torrie the belt and keeps trying to prove himself to her, but she's not interested anymore. So each week he does something bigger and better to prove himself to her. That'd rule. "I just won the Cruiserweight Championship. Isn't that good enough?" "Billy, I really don't have time for this. My father's gonna marry Dawn Marie!" "Lucky guy." "What was that?" *rubs his eye* "I said I've got something in my eye." It'd rule. Anyhow, here's hoping Kidman becomes the Bret of the CW division and defends against absolutely everyone.

Women's Match: From what I heard, too short and the finish(a snap suplex?) came out of nowhere. Still, Victoria will make a fine champ. But who will she defend against besides Trish? Jackie? Yeesh.

WWE Title Match: I was *so* looking forward to this one, and I still am, even though I know who wins. I agree with everyone on here who said that Big Show is finally reaching his potential. Sure, he *was* jobbing to Jeff Hardy a few months ago. *But*, this is the WWE. They don't remember their own history, and probably never will. Just look at the whole Kane/HHH stuff. Kane didn't go to keggers, he was supposed to be locked away in an asylum. But that's wrestling for ya. And besides, this means that they a) have a champ that can defend the belt, b) put even more heat on Show, esp. with PaulE there now, and c) have one pissed off Lesnar looking for revenge and his title. Kudos to the WWE and PaulE for writing such a complete storyline. Maybe Show shouldn't have beaten Brock, but Brock had to lose at some point. And at least this storyline makes *sense*. WCW would have had Brock just give up the title like they did so many times with their own belt.

Tag team title match: I'm glad they didn't go balls out and kill themselves with this one. I *wanted* them to, but Angle and Rey look to be hurt, so you can't ask too much of them. And Eddie gets his first tag strap in the WWE(along with Chavo), which is just icing on the cake. Where do they go from here, though? Does Eddie and Chavo feud with Edge and Rey? Not with Rey out. Angle and Benoit? Nope, Angle's hurt and he's got singles issues with his partner. Their team has done what they were meant to do. Bring prestige to the WWE Tag Team Championships. So as long as the Dudleys are back in business on Raw, as soon as Bradshaw's healthy, bring him over(I don't care how they do it) and reform the APA.

Elimination Chamber match: Brutal, brutal, and more brutal. I really hope RVD didn't injure his knee, because that would totally bite. Book went out way too early too. Jericho laying it in to *everyone* sounded cool, and I can't wait to see it. Esp. when he took on HBK. Talk about a dream match. And if it's for the World Title? Hell yeah, sign me up. I'm guessing Shawn won't hold the belt too long, *but*, we don't know how well he can still go. Again, wait and see. But that's just it. You *want* to see what will happen again. People are talking about Raw again. The ratings won't reflect it, but the WWE is trying to turn business around. I agree that Booker or RVD should have won, but again, this storyline makes sense. Anyone else find it ironic that Vince wouldn't give Hogan the WWE title, but he'll give the World title to HBK? Can't wait to see Raw and Smackdown this week.
redsoxnation
Scrapple








Since: 24.7.02

Since last post: 480 days
Last activity: 480 days
#50 Posted on

    Originally posted by Super Shane Spear
    Good God with gravy on top. I hope the Big Show retains this fucking title for the next ten years just to spite everybody. WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT FROM HIM?? He's been awesome since he's starting on Brock. Do you think Benoit would've taken those chairshots on Smackdown with his Frankenstein neck? Do you....you know what. I'm just going to fucking quit right now, but it's not worth me crippling my fingers to type to a brick wall.

    I hope you all quit watching WWE like you threaten to every time you don't like what's on TV. You'll be back. You bunch of fucking liars.

    Big Show 4 Life.


    (edited by Super Shane Spear on 17.11.02 2043)






If you quit, why are there posts after this one?



I want you to know, I agree with everything I've just said.
mountinman44
Sujuk








Since: 8.5.02
From: San Diego, CA

Since last post: 1252 days
Last activity: 1098 days
Y!:
#51 Posted on
I will say this. I did not watch the show, and honestly, I'm glad I didn't. Not because I think the show sucked from the results, but because I knew who was going to win both title matches last week. It was too damn predictable. Like when Austin turned on the WWF at the Invasion PPV. It would have been too disappointing. Count this as $35 saved.

(edited by mountinman44 on 18.11.02 0749)


"Don't feel bad. I've been wrestling wolves since you were on your mother's teet!" -- Groundskeeper Willie
El Nastio
Andouille








Since: 14.1.02
From: Ottawa Ontario, by way of Walkerton

Since last post: 1 hour
Last activity: 1 hour
ICQ:  
#52 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.33
    Originally posted by redsoxnation

      Originally posted by Super Shane Spear
      Good God with gravy on top. I hope the Big Show retains this fucking title for the next ten years just to spite everybody. WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT FROM HIM?? He's been awesome since he's starting on Brock. Do you think Benoit would've taken those chairshots on Smackdown with his Frankenstein neck? Do you....you know what. I'm just going to fucking quit right now, but it's not worth me crippling my fingers to type to a brick wall.

      I hope you all quit watching WWE like you threaten to every time you don't like what's on TV. You'll be back. You bunch of fucking liars.

      Big Show 4 Life.


      (edited by Super Shane Spear on 17.11.02 2043)




    If you quit, why are there posts after this one?




He's refering to the fact he's going to quit from commenting on the whole "Big Show sucks and shouldn't be champ this is aweful and the worse thing ever" posts which sadly seem to be quite the fad recently.

I was going to post something about this last night, but Thanks Triple S's, your post sums up my opinion very nicely, so it saved me time from writing the same thing =)

(edited by El Nastio on 18.11.02 1055)



Next VG Review: GTA: Vice City.
Next OSVG Review: Blaster Master

~EL NASTIO!
skorpio17
Morcilla








Since: 11.7.02
From: New Jersey

Since last post: 2410 days
Last activity: 2410 days
#53 Posted on
I thought it was a great PPV. It was this year's second best after Summerslam. It was better than Mania.

If you didn't see it, please SHUT UP. You don't know what you missed.

For everyone who says how predictable it was, go check out the Wienerville predictions and see how many people picked Booker T and Brock. It was not nearly as predictable as the last PPV.

As to HBK winning the title, I'm enjoying it while it lasts.

Survivor Series 02 –Live Report

Ringmistress
Lap cheong








Since: 15.1.02
From: Philly

Since last post: 2676 days
Last activity: 2675 days
#54 Posted on

    Originally posted by skorpio17
    I thought it was a great PPV. It was this year's second best after Summerslam. It was better than Mania.

    If you didn't see it, please SHUT UP. You don't know what you missed.

    For everyone who says how predictable it was, go check out the Wienerville predictions and see how many people picked Booker T and Brock. It was not nearly as predictable as the last PPV.

    As to HBK winning the title, I'm enjoying it while it lasts.

    >



I admit to predicting Brock and Booker, but you know what? I enjoyed it anyway, especially the Chamber. For the first match, I thought it was good, and definitely something I'd love to see more of. I actually paid attention to an entire Women's title match for the first time since the Days of Stephanie McMahon-Helmsley (Lita, to be exact). It was fun, and I LOVE Victoria! I was also ecstatic that Los Guererros won the tag titles too. I admit, these "reluctant tag teams" can only get along for a limited amount of time, so I wasn't too surprised with the outcome. I totally missed the Dudley's reunion, but I did tape it so I'll watch that later. As soon as I heard Scott Steiner's F-Bomb, his crazy promos all came back to me. Raw needs him now more than ever, especially to cripple Shawn Michaels :-). All in all, I think that I missed the first match, the Chamber match and the Tag title match, but I didn't care. I had fun, so mission accomplished.

Ringmistress



Ringmistress - A bitch among heels.
SKLOKAZOID
Bratwurst








Since: 20.3.02
From: California

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 8 hours
AIM:  
#55 Posted on
Firstly, I did not see this PPV. If that immediately disqualifies my opinion in your eyes so be it, but keep in mind that one does not have to watch WWE TV to get an overall sense for the direction and booking philosophy WWE currently has.

I'll only comment on the parts that matter, those being the two title matches.

It's nice that they're actually doing something with the Big Show. I think he's been very underutilized since he first arrived in WWE and it's about time he did something meaningful with the money they're paying in his contract. Brock's injury must have been pretty detrimental to his push for Vince to call this decision, but it was a very poor decision.

Let's reflect on what happened over the summer: Brock plowed through everyone from the day after WrestleMania up until his title match at SummerSlam. He destroyed everyone in the KOTR tournament, he ended Hogan's career (for all we know) and had Hogan's blood all over his hands, then he beat The Rock (the #1 babyface in the company) cleanly in the second biggest PPV of the year. Momentum was clearly on Brock's side until last night. The unbeatable monster was making life so miserable for everyone on SMACKDOWN! that Benoit & Angle decided to just say "screw this!" wrestled each other every damn week because they were too scared to face him.

Obviously, there was someplace to go with this Brock push: someone had to beat him. Someone had to make a name for himself. This was WWE's opportunity to build a star and tell an epic story in the world of wrestling, which the lack of has led to declining ratings. At least WWE tried to build up the Big Show as a star, but I don't think he's the answer. This decision was made on the fly. They did the best they could (if Big Show going over was necessary), but there were a number of different directions they could have taken this. Brock F5'ed Big Show, which means he could have won that match. After that, they could do an angle where he gets suspended on SMACKDOWN! and buy him some time to recover by taking him off TV for a few weeks.

If Brock wrestles at Armageddon next month, then WWE proves that there really was no need to have the Big Show go over.

Now, as for the other title, a man who is permanently injured and can't work a regular schedule gets that belt. Actually, out of the six people involved in that match, I'd rather have seen HBK go over instead of someone else who would have inevitably had his career ruined by HHH in the longrun.

HBK has had it all over HHH during this run that HHH is due for a win over HBK, which is probably how he wants it, but dramatically-speaking it makes more sense as opposed to HHH-Foley where Foley didn't even get one victory over HHH. It was really a win-win scenario for HHH last night and, despite the injury, he'll be back on RAW either tonightor next week to ruin everyone's career like he always does.

The Elimination Chamber sounded pretty well-booked, although notice how HHH was in the match the WHOLE TIME and survived all the way to the end. You know he's going to milk that one. Of course, it does make more sense for the heel to be in there the whole time until he loses (it's an old Royal Rumble/War Games trick best pulled off by Flair). Knowing HHH, though, it's also another way politically to keep himself looking better than everyone else.

Keeping all of this in mind, I don't see how anything good can come out of it in the longrun. Big Show is either going to lose it to Angle or back to Lesnar so they can have their WrestleMania match, which means even less now because Brock is no longer undefeated. HBK's reign has potential for matches we've never seen before (HBK-Jericho, HBK-Booker, HBK-RVD), but must inevitably end with a Pedigree so that HHH can avenge all of the trauma HBK has caused him.

Nothing changed last night at all, except a bunch of gold props and Lesnar's buildup coming to an abrupt halt. Those aren't good changes, either.

Survivor Series sounded okay, but not as great as what I'd usually expect out of an MSG PPV. Nothing was accomplished for anyone, and much was destroyed. That Elimination Chamber sure did look cool, though.

(edited by SKLOKAZOID on 18.11.02 0850)
InVerse
Bierwurst








Since: 26.8.02

Since last post: 3 days
Last activity: 12 hours
#56 Posted on

    Originally posted by SKLOKAZOID
    Firstly, I did not see this PPV. If that immediately disqualifies my opinion in your eyes so be it, but keep in mind that one does not have to watch WWE TV to get an overall sense for the direction and booking philosophy WWE currently has.


I didn't actually read your post. If that immediately disqualifies my opinion in your eyes so be it, but keep in mind that one does not have to read Wienervilel posts to get an overall sense for the direction of bullshit posters currently have.

While I don't like the way they did it, Brock doesn't need to be an undefeatable monster anymore. He's a face now. As a heel, he needed to seem undefeatable to give him a mystique, but as a face, he has plenty of other things going for him. Goldberg needed his undefeated streak intact as a face because he had nothing else going for him. Brock has something that Goldberg never did... talent.

Wrestlemania usually (not always, but usually) dictates that the face should go over. It's the biggest show of the year and the WWE wants people to leave feeling happy. If an undefeated monster Brock were to defeat Kurt Angle, it would be a bit of a let down. Yay, Brock beat Kurt Angle just like he's beaten everybody else he's ever faced. However, if a defeated Lesnar who lost his title in a screwjob were to go into Wrestlemania as a face who was chasing Angle for the title, the crowd would pop huge when Lesnar defeats Angle for the belt. A face Lesnar going over a heel champion Angle is the best way they could do Wrestelmania X9 (in my opinion.)

In fact, if they want to give the title true meaning, I'd like to see Brock come back *after* Show loses the title to Angle and just completely ignore Big Show. Have Show goad him and Brock flat out say he'd rather have the title than revenge and blow off Show until after Lesnar wins the title back. Then set the stage for a Show/Lesnar rematch.

For those that say nothing good can come of a Big Show title reign, to you I say this. Sure it can, you're just too stupid to see it.
mountinman44
Sujuk








Since: 8.5.02
From: San Diego, CA

Since last post: 1252 days
Last activity: 1098 days
Y!:
#57 Posted on

    Originally posted by InVerse
    For those that say nothing good can come of a Big Show title reign, to you I say this. Sure it can, you're just too stupid to see it.



Agreed. If Show were on RAW, I could see this becoming a disaster, but Heyman will write this one correctly.



"Don't feel bad. I've been wrestling wolves since you were on your mother's teet!" -- Groundskeeper Willie
redsoxnation
Scrapple








Since: 24.7.02

Since last post: 480 days
Last activity: 480 days
#58 Posted on

    Originally posted by mountinman44

      Originally posted by InVerse
      For those that say nothing good can come of a Big Show title reign, to you I say this. Sure it can, you're just too stupid to see it.



    Agreed. If Show were on RAW, I could see this becoming a disaster, but Heyman will write this one correctly.





Heyman is the one who had the Justin Credible World Title reign, right? And he was also the one who decided to flush away his TV contract with the idiotic 'Network' angle. Give Paul talent, and he can work with it. Give Paul crap, and he won't be able to do that much with it.



I want you to know, I agree with everything I've just said.
Spaceman Spiff
Knackwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: Philly Suburbs

Since last post: 9 days
Last activity: 15 hours
AIM:  
#59 Posted on

    Originally posted by DVD
    So as long as the Dudleys are back in business on Raw, as soon as Bradshaw's healthy, bring him over(I don't care how they do it) and reform the APA.

No. No. No. No. No. No. No APA.

And did they even say whether D-Von was going to be on Raw? Until we see him on Raw, we can't make that assumption. And unless they turn the Dudleyz heel & cut out the "Wazzup" spot and the overused table spots, I couldn't really care less if the Dudleyz were reunited or not.



Matthew: You would've loved it, David. A week in a foreign country, strange people, strange customs...
Dave: Oh, I know what you mean. I've been to Canada.
Phantom
Frankfurter








Since: 17.3.02

Since last post: 2376 days
Last activity: 2352 days
#60 Posted on
I thought the show was decent enough. I have no problems with Show as champ, due to the way it was done -- Brock had him clean, but Heyman had freaked himself into thinking that Show would win and foolishly switched sides. And kudos to Show -- Lesnar did the work on the F5, but who would have thought that Show could take a Belly-to-Belly Suplex?

The Elimination Chamber -- Jericho came out of that match looking like a million bucks, I thought. He had pinfalls over both Kane and Booker, bumped like a freak, and I honestly thought HHH was going to tap out when Jericho pulled him away from the ropes. If HHH really is out, then I hope next month is headlined by Jericho/Michaels. The drama was really killed when Booker was eliminated, though, since the next two falls seemed to be given -- no one expected Kane to do anything in that match, and Jericho didn't seem to have a shot of winning going in to the match.

The Women's Title -- this was the most overall impressive match for me, just because I didn't expect it to be as intense as it was. Kudos to both Trish and Victoria.

The opener -- 3D!!! 'Bout time they put back the true Dudley Boyz back together! Seeing D'Von was the first true markout moment of the show! (And Jeff's wobbly botched rail-runner was the first cringe moment of the show -- I fear for him now).

And the tag match was good, but that's been done to death now.
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Computer has been not functional for over a month at this point. But its working again so figured start sharing these here thoughts with the Weiner readers again. What Worked TKG:
Related threads: The Big Ol' Survivor Series Preview/Prediction Thread - (SPOILER) Survivor Series Main Event - Survivor Series Predictions - More...
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