It came down to Michaels because it's an exclamation point on their history. For all the bad blood between Michaels and Austin in their past, Michaels fought his damndest on behalf of Austin. These two have more history together than anyone else on Team Austin, so this was a nod to that.
But yeah, I wish Booker hadn't gotten taken out so fast. RVD I don't mind as much, since he's a tremendously dull performer. But not Booker.
Did anybody else notice that Undertaker's right elbow seemed pretty legitimately damaged after he took the shovel shot from Vince & fell into the grave? Afterwards, he was holding it in that "This is legitimately bad" way (across his body), & not using it at all.
Hopefully the "dirt pile" had a backdoor so he could get to a trainer & some ice without waiting til the crowd left.
First of all, Phantom is right on. The Austin/HBK stuff made the match at SS. HBK/Austin had a lot of history together and despite that, HBK did all that he could to save Austin's job but he couldn't. It was dramatic storytelling.
I'd say it's probably the best PPV they did this year. Lesnar submitting to Benoit, Cena's FU on Big Show, the meeting of Lesnar and Goldberg, the Molly Holly swerve, the great RAW SS match, the Austin farewell, the blade jobs of HBK and Vince, the start of the Kane/Taker feud, Goldberg destroying Evolution and HHH. Everything felt right.
Honestly, tonight I watched the grey cup but I decided to order the 11:30 PM SS replay, without knowing any results. I'm glad I did. It was a great PPV.
My honest reaction was that this was one of the weakest PPVs they did all year, simply because it was almost paint-by-numbers booking. With the exception of the order-of-elimination in the Raw Survivor Series match, Cena's F-U to Big Show, and Molly's title retention, there really wasn't anything in the way of surprise booking that was throw on us. You could pretty much guess how the pieces were going to fall based on the previous week's worth of free TV shows.
One of the highlights of the show I have to say was the fan holding the Randy "Idiot" poster, lol. Pretty good PPV, way better than I was expecting. They did a great job setting up the the Taker-Kane feud, it made me look foward to it. And Goldberg and Molly both retaining surprised the hell out of me.
Originally posted by Phantom With the exception of the order-of-elimination in the Raw Survivor Series match, Cena's F-U to Big Show, and Molly's title retention, there really wasn't anything in the way of surprise booking that was throw on us. You could pretty much guess how the pieces were going to fall based on the previous week's worth of free TV shows.
wait. you honestly thought lesnar was gonna submit cleanly to the crossface tonight? you must be the most optimistic one on this board! ;P
After scanning this thread ... PREDICTABLE BOOKING IS GOOD! PREDICTABLE IS GOOD! Predictable means they've actually thought beyond tonight, have a plan, and are following through on something long-term. 9 times out of 10, the predictable finish is predictable because IT'S THE RIGHT THING TO DO! It's the logical finish, the one that people want to see. So what if they think they're going to see it, they want it! *ahem* Want swerves, I'm sure Vince Russo is back pulling them at his video store. You can go there and rent The Matrix, take it home, put it in the DVD Player and it's Daddy Day Care ... SWERVE~!
9 times out of 10, predictable should be done so that one time that you actually want to swerve the audience, it means something.
Onto the show where I only missed 1 prediction. I think I made my point again but I digress.
The opening Survivor Series Match had some good action and good crowd heat. Nathan Jones is useless. So utterly useless. Matt Morgan needs to go back to OVW for 2 years. Angle was doing germans on his shoulder! Benoit should have got the submission last. Cena's FU was impressive. Overall, good match.
Molly vs Lita was fine for a Lita match. Good to see Molly get some heat.
Shane/Kane sucked ass and sucked it hard and dry. Good riddance to Shane and your crappy brawls and almost killing Kane with that Wannabe Cactus Clothesline.
Guerreros/Bashams was going along good but they needed more time to build. Nice little twist with Eddy getting pissed at Chavo. The boat for the Eddy Guerrero Main Event push has sailed and it's a damn shame.
The RAW Elimination Match fucking rocked. Sure they could have given the Shawn Michaels spot to someone else but I don't think it hurt anyone at all. Christian's a glorified jobber. Jericho got fluke pinned then got his heat back and they're never going to do anything with him anyways. And Orton got the pin and got the beat up Mark Cuban.
The crowd didn't buy Austin's "I'm leaving for a book tour" retirement. They know he'll be back, we know he'll be back, he knows he'll be back, they just better make it good.
Vince/Taker sucked as bad as Shane/Kane. Someone else pointed out the absurdity of the fact that Taker was buried alive and the show just moved on with him "in there". Taker's growing out his hair so all is going according to plan and you can all get your panties in a bunch for the lame ass Dead Man Gimmick Redux. Blah. Hated it then, will hate it again, will enjoy a few months of Taker-less TV.
Goldberg/Triple H was booked almost to perfection. On one leg, Goldberg took care of Evolution and beat Triple H right smack dab in the middle of the ring. Who knows? Maybe HHH feels secure enough now that HE'S MARRIED IN to start doing things the right way ... ha. Is that groin ever going to heal, btw?
Also, they've already got two, maybe three matches lined up for WrestleMania XX with Goldberg/Lesnar, Kane/Undertaker, and Austin/Jericho.
You may not agree with the plans, but I praise WWE for actually having a long term plan for once.
No complaints here. I think Benoit's just a sacrificial lamb for Brock next month while Cena continues to rise into the main event (which SHOULD include a Royal Rumble win), but Brock submitting put Benoit over big and brought back the "You tapped out!" chant. Although HOSSMANIA ran wild, seeing Cena FU Big Show was quite a sight!
HBK made an OK match into a GREAT match! This'll obviously lead to Austin's final match at Wrestlemania XX, but against who? COACH?
As for Buried Alive, I've got five words for WWE - no, no, no, no, NO!!! I don't want have to sit through Kane/UT chapter 1,312,141,145,534,678!!! It doesn't matter how well-done the setup was, but the bottom line is that it leads to ANOTHER Kane/UT feud! If they face each other at Wrestlemania XX, it'll mark the 6TH ANNIVERSARY of their first match! Think about that!
On the other end of the spectrum, WWE did everything right in the Raw title match. If that doesn't get Goldberg over, I don't know what will. I just wish WWE hadn't pissed away Chris Jericho the night after Goldberg first won the title, because they could have a golden feud ready to go. But who knows? They still might.
Place your bets! How long before this man is on the shelf again?
-Tajiri vs. Noble- Good match, really like the block of the mist with the forearms... Noble was actually put over really strong even in a loss. It's one of those feuds I think it's chapter 1 for now and hope we can see more of.
-Cena/Angle/BobHolly/Bradshaw/Benoit vs. BigShow/Jones/ Albert/Morgan/Lesner- Holly eliminated before the match even started, both Albert and Bradshaw got eliminated before the minute mark(talk about an easy PPV pay day). The match settled down, Cena got beaten down by the heels who has a 4-3 advantage, Benoit goes even with the heels squad the tag to Angle who cleans house and eliminates The Green Giants by himself. But then he gets met by an F5 by Brock and got pinned. The main event of SD is on the PPV again, Benoit makes Brock tap and Cena F5's The BigShow... Fantastic job, I admit I'm biased and I'm tickled pink with the booking and the finish of the match. So far a great opening to the PPV.
-Molly vs. Lita- Gotta say Lita looked good in there. She hit her spots well. Lita bumped well when she tried to headscissor Molly from the corner and Molly tossed Lita to the floor. Good neck bump/psychology when Molly rammed Lita back/neck into the rail. Lita misses the moonsault, Molly goes for the MollyGOround, connects and gets 2! Molly has a temper tantrum(uh oh cue loss). Molly takes out the middle turnbuckle and IT WORKS as Lita face connected with it... Wow didn't expect that outcome. Good work by the women and much like the CW match earlier, wouldn't mind seeing some more from them.
-Kane vs. Shane- Little too cartoonish for my liking but it was okay. Shane comes running in & hurls himself onto Kane and they both flip over the ropes. Shane hits the elbow from the top to the announce table in the first 3 minutes. Kane chases Shane to the back. I like how Shane ran around the corner & comes from behind and hits Kane. Shane drives an SUV into Kane who crashes through security booth... Shane calls for an ambulance buts him on a stretcher but Kane fights out & brings Shane back to the arena. Shane wiggles out & pushes Kane into the ambulance & does a silly looking tornado DDT by stepping on the side of the truck. Shane puts some sort of soft thing on Kane & does a Van Terminator from the top of the ambulance. Tries to put Kane in the truck but can't close the door. Kane pushes out & takes control, throws Shane to the side of the bus & finish him off with a tombstone on the floor in front of the bus.
-Basham Bros. vs. Los Guerreros- It was what I expected. Really enjoy Guerreros, not really for the Bashams. But they worked well with the Guerreros. Cool headscissor/ armdrag on both of the Bashams by Eddie. Shaniqua gets the frog splash... Chavo went for the tornado DDT but his legs hit Eddie he goes to check on him and gets rolled up by a Basham for the loss.
-Orton/Christian/Steiner/Henry/Y2J vs. HBK/RVD/Booker/ Dudleyz- Fabulous, I was on the edge of my seat at the end. Very nicely paced. It took 7 minutes before the first elimination. Steiner first and Booker of course first for the face side. Does The Book ever succeed in Texas LoL. Mark Henry gets pinned by 3 guys at the same time(umm okay). RVD gets pinned by Orton. Jericho & Christian eliminated the both members of the Dudleyz respectfully to make it a 3 on 1 vs. Shawn... HBK hits the superkick on Christian for a pin. Michaels is bleeding hard. Jericho gets pinned by HBK, afterwards grabs a chair & nails Shawn and gets in Austin's face. HBK & Orton are down, Orton crawls but HBK kicks out(I'm so into this right now). HBK wants to hit chin music but Bischoff grabs his leg Austin chases Bischoff away. Everyone is distracted as Batista comes in and sits down powerbomb on HBK as Orton wins. Whew
-Vince vs. Undertaker- First 8-minutes was Vince totally getting destroyed. I mean demolished. Of course Vince does color. It hard to even call this a match. Really not much to say at all. Kane came out and helped Vince get rid of the Undertaker, Kane did a good job after the match acting pretty odd afterwards... Can we please keep Vince out of matches now, it used to be a nice novelty but in 8 months we saw him having PPV matches Hogan, Gowen, Steph and Taker. And I was okay with Hogan and Gowen but now is just overkill.
-Goldberg vs. HHH- The new era of WWE main events. Where everyone knows there's no way you can deliver in ring. Interesting start to hit a spear right on the opening bell. But the interesting aspect of the match ended there. HHH worked on Goldberg’s leg. Tried to finish him off with sledgehammer but Goldberg counters it. Evolution all interferes but eats hammer... Goldberg goes gets the jackhammer in and very amateur hour cover. Does textbook covers include seeing daylight between you and your opponent and having your opponent move around under you. I guess Goldberg didn't want HHH yucky baby oil on him... Yeah I was surprised on how it ended but doesn't take away it was a pretty bland main event.
-OtherStuff- I like Cuban, I don't like paying over $30 and having Mark Cuban play wrestling theatre... For some odd reason I found it mesmerizing seeing Austin and Vince laughing backstage for no reason at all and Austin stopping mid laugh and looking pissed.
-Sigh of the Night: Worlds Fattest Man -3Stars of the Night: 1)HBK. 2)Y2J. 3)Cena.
3Stars isn't even fair, so many stepped up and worked over expectation. The Heat match was very good. The SD SurSeries match played out really well. The Women match was such a pleasant surprise. The Raw SurSeries match was special, you felt some real emotion coming out of HBK, that was just something. SD TagTitle match was about what I'd expect. Ambulance match was take it or leave it, I guess average. I think I was so worn out after such a good PPV and an excellent Raw SurSeries match the last two matches felt numb and couldn't stand up to what I just saw. I'd say this was a very good PPV.
Kane v Shane. this is the match i was waiting for, and it somewhat lived upto what i had hoped for.
At first i thought Kane had broken his friggin' neck! DAMN! that was a harsh landing over the top rope, right down on his head. But at least through the rest of the match, Shane did all he could to pop his neck back into place with repeated shots from amulnce doors...
i was a little uneasy in the early goings, i thought that Kane was being lured to a loss when he followed Shane through the crowd.
all in all, it was the same as the first one, with Kane winning on his own this time, instead of Shane killing himself. Same spots, but in different locations, and JR even refered to jumping off the top of the ambulence as "coast to coast".
but technicle issues aside, and then hearing the camera guy saying that he was "at the end of his rope" the match wasn't too bad.
and as you might have noticed, i'm a Kane-a-holic, and was both pretty shocked, and excited when he came out of the big truck to help finish off Taker. but the only thing lacking was some kind of finisher on Taker by Kane. i mean honestly, after "the decade of destruction" you think 3 punchs would put Taker down for the count? anyway, i'm hangin out for RAW now, and I hope that if they are gonna do a show cross-over, it's Taker coming to RAW, and not the other way around. I don't really like Smackdown!, i think it's pretty inferior in comparrison to RAW, so for RAW to give up Kane would suck some fat hairy balls.
and touching quickly on the Angle v Lesnar 10 man tag....anyone else think it was a little too fast? 3 men gone in all of 2 minutes, seemed a little rushed. but i guess it made a change from matches being drawn out, more exciting i suppose.
Oh, yeah, and that first bump Kane took outside the ring looked particularly scary. I mean, he was upside-down, straight vertical! Honestly, I thought it was over there; but he must have somehow broken his fall (and not his neck).
This was by far the best PPV of the year. All the matches had me into them, especially the elimination matches, and I actually thought Shawn would kick out of the Batista bomb at the end of the match. I find it hard to believe that some people hate the WWE so much that they can't give them credit when they do something right. I have seen some crappy shows, and this was not one of them. For those that missed it I would highly recommend ordering a replay or getting your hands on the tape, you will not regret it.
Mr. Burns: You are of course familiar with our state usury laws? Homer:U-sur-y? Mr. Burns: Oh silly me, I must have just used a word that doesn't exist.
Well i dont think this is the greatest PPV of the year it was pretty damn good though. I'd say Vengence (Damn knew i couldn't spell it) Esp. for the triple threat match at the end. Wow!
Royal Rumble (I know ppl say it had Steiner Vs HHH) But it also had A fantastic royal rumble and before that the unbelivable and my contender for match of the year Benoit VS Angle match
I think then WrestleMania several good matches Rock Austin Hogan Vince Angle Lesnar Hell i even enjoyed the Taker handicap match.
And then u have this one i think Survivor Series but i think also that is possible to interchange these and if u took a couple of matches from each of these PPV u would have the cream of 2003 Liked Basham's Guerruerro's best Clever finish very good match i thought keeps a feud simmering Although the RAW and Smackdown SS matches were both good Raw esp. good And Vince's Blade job Nuts! Truly crazy.
Good PPV, my only complaints are only with the Vince-Taker match. The blading came so fast I think I missed it. Vince is praying, bell rings, Taker punches him, and he's bloodied? That and the fact that Taker beats Vince down for 10 minutes, but the Undertaker loses the advantage to a handfull of dirt in the eye.
Originally posted by TaffI think then WrestleMania several good matches Rock Austin Hogan Vince Angle Lesnar Hell i even enjoyed the Taker handicap match.
I hope you're just forgetting the Shawn/Jericho match...that's the one that still sticks out in my mind from that event.
It's hysterical to me, cause everytime I watch a PPV and form an opinion on it, I KNOW that I'll come on here and see the exact opposite. Here's my take on this show:
First off, I really disagree with the match order. Somebody check the records...this has to be the first time the WWE CHAMPION curtainjerks a PPV. I mean, A PPV! This ain't Raw here. Didn't bother me much, but it had me saying "Come on guys, get your order straight".
The Buried Alive match, I really really liked, because I've said all along that there's no way I can credibly believe Vince holding his own for any amount of time against Taker...and he didn't. This was a pure ass whoopin'. Like was mentioned before, I think Kane should have done something a little more impressive to finish Taker other than 3 punches that missed horribly...but I guess the explosion counts for disorienting him or something. I really liked this match though.
Whoever said Shawn's bladejob was a 3 out of 5....you must be insane. That was freakin' grotesque. It looked like the left side of his head was lopped off. Seriously. The blood was pouring, and only McMahon's odd first-punch bladejob topped it.
And to those sick of them pushing Shawn in matches like these, you're wrong on this one. Flat out. Shawn's the one with history with Austin, and there's a reason he was out there in the end. That's some good storytelling for ya.
I was kinda expecting Lita to win...strange when she didn't. I don't know, seemed kind of deflating. I guess cause I'm not into pasty chubby girls with 80's cowgirl hair and makeup. Who knows. Molly's definitely a better wrestler than Lita...but the crowd's into Lita, and they weren't afraid to push her before.
And I don't think anybody pointed this out before, but the brand name of the bulldozer by the grave was "HOSS". Got a chuckle out of me.
Overall, I liked the PPV, but I really didn't see it as booking perfection. The match order was way too odd, the Molly win was deflating (no matter how much the board likes her here, sorry I don't), the Ambulance match was anti-climactic after all these two have done to each other, and the tag team situation wasn't resolved at all. This is a PPV...you're supposed to payoff your storylines here. It pisses me off when they do shit like this cause you know they're gonna do the heel turn or whatever resolution on Smackdown sometime soon. I long for the days of '94 when they worked the Owen/Bret thing to perfection...and payed it off ON THE PPVs.
Sorry I was all over the place but I had to capture the thoughts as they came. Like I said...I really did like the PPV a lot, but sometimes the booking/match order got me a little confused and I think probably detracted a little bit.
This was far and away the best event I've seen live.
- Kane's opening fall over the top rope looked just as sick in person. At one point, he was perpendicular to the ground. It looked like he managed to turn right at the end and land on his back, but it was close.
- The front row sign mark was awesome. My favorite was "A-Train's Christmas list: 1. Razor 2. Talent." Don't know if this was on tv, but Steiner started yelling at the guy when he whipped out a "Weak-zilla" sign. Perhaps these two can debate.
- Crowd was hot for the Austin match. And no one bought his retirement. They were too busy chanting "bullshit" after the loss. And I didn't understand the finish, for all of the reasons that Hogan's My Dad pointed out. HBK and Austin have history? Yeah, from 5 years ago. Booker and RVD have both feuded with Austin since then, and both would have benefited tremendously from being booked into HBKs position in that match. They took off the ring cover, which was full of blood and beer after this match. There was a fresh one underneath.
- Mark Cuban was more over than most of the faces on the card.
- Cena is way over, even before he FUed the Big Show.
- A lot of people took bathroom breaks during the tag title match. Eddie got pops, but not as loud as expected. Plenty of racist slurs hurled at Shaniqua. Coach, too, during the Mark Cuban segment.
- I didn't see it coming, but the main event sent everyone home happy. After the ref bump, a "Sledge-ham-mer" chant started, but then I realized that 5 people can't get a good chant going.
- The Buried Alive match seemed rushed. It seemed like they were running out of time after the Team Austin/Bischoff match. Vince's blade job was absolutely disgusting. From our vantage point, we couldn't really see what Kane did to Undertaker. There was a loud explosion and fire burst, then Taker cam staggering from the side of the bulldozer, clutching his chest. Kane punched him on top of the grave, and Vince hit the switch. Then Kane made little dirt angels in front of the tombstone.
-- Asteroid Boy
Wiener of the day: 23.7.02
"My brother saw the Undertaker walking through an airport." - Rex "Was he no-selling?" - Me
SS was worth staying up till 4 for. I couldn't believe it when Goldberg defeated Triple H. Liked the Austin/Michaels show of respect. Glad that Cena pinned Big Show to win the match. Vince's blade job was awful. Best PPV in ages imo.
"My honest reaction was that this was one of the weakest PPVs they did all year, simply because it was almost paint-by-numbers booking. "
Which, as fuelinjected pointed out, is a VERY GOOD THING.
-I was pissed with Tajiri/Noble being bumped to Heat-especially with it's replacement being a lame attempt to get into the mainstream sports press-but the rest of the show made up for that oversight. -Cena's FU on Show was around 3.5 times as impressive as Brock's 500lb F5-although it did look as though it was giving Cena a hernia just standing there. -Molly held Lita's crappy offence together exceptionally well, and keeping the belt on the heel is always smart booking, especially in a division as depleted as the Women's roster. -Shane/Kane did what it was supposed to do with room to spare. Think about it: Shane hurls EVERYTHING he's got at Kane, and what's the big guy left doing at the end? Curled up in a fetal ball of agony? Breathing from an oxygen mask? No. Laughing his ass off. Now THAT'S a monster heel. -Everything that should be said about the Raw ten-man has already been covered. Michaels' role was expertly played-up via more advanced booking (see his discussion with Austin two weeks ago) and I'm looking forward to some Austinless shows. -Buried Alive did it for me, simply because a)Vince got MASSACRED, and b)I'm a big fat mark for the Phenom Undertaker. -If Goldberg still fails as a top face after that amazing booking job, then I'll be happy to let the fed wash their hands of all responsibility. -6 out of 8 in the predictions-and the two I missed were both decisions I liked immensely, so it's all good. Excelsior!
Murdoch Had Just Made A Mistake That No Man Ever Should-He Kissed A Big Angry Black Guy
Was at the taping tonight for the December 23 show. They're taping nearly a week ahead due to the holidays and wanting to give everyone a couple of weeks off. For those of you who do get to watch it, I'll add some spoiler space here: