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The W - Pro Wrestling - Steelcage matches, a question.
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griff
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Since: 26.2.04
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#1 Posted on
Does anybody know of any steelcage match which has ended with the wrestler winning by actually leaving through the door. Does anyone know what idiot thought of this stipulation and why? The only reason I could see it being there is for wrestlers who would be too big to climb the cage. What else does it achieve?
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Since: 10.10.02
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#2 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.28
Bob Backlund beat Pat Patterson this way years ago. Actually he kind of slid down the steps on his back. This is the first clip of the Steel Cage DVD that WWE put out last year (which buy the way I picked up for less than fifteen dollars last night!)
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Since: 15.10.02

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#3 Posted on | Instant Rating: 10.00
Also on the Bloodbath DVD, Bruno Sammartino beat Ivan Koloff the same way: by beating the hell out of him enough to simply walk out the door. The full match is there, as well as the full version of Backlund-Patterson.



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Since: 6.11.03
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#4 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.42
    Originally posted by griff
    Does anybody know of any steelcage match which has ended with the wrestler winning by actually leaving through the door. Does anyone know what idiot thought of this stipulation and why? The only reason I could see it being there is for wrestlers who would be too big to climb the cage. What else does it achieve?

The real reason the stip is there as far as I can tell is for the spot where the face gets the door slammed on him as he's trying to exit it. I want to say it was a Von Erich match that first used it but the most recent "famous" usage came during a Flair/Hennig match (it's been done more recently than that, but not during a more dramatic moment).



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#5 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.99
The Von Erich match was a Kerry Von Erich/Ric Flair World Title match (I think) where Terry Gordy of the Freebirds was the special ref and Michael Hayes was in charge of the door. Hayes slammed the door on Kerry's head and thus was born the Von Erichs-Freebirds feud of the 80s that RULED World Class Championship Wrestling which RULED until Von Erichs started dropping dead.

(edited by JayJayDean on 5.3.04 1001)


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Since: 19.6.03
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#6 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.79
I always saw the door as being a logical element of the cage anyway - why should they have to always climb out? Here's another way to get out and it brings with it (hopefully) the suspense of watching two wrestlers going at it in order to make sure the other can't get to the door and win. Otherwise, you just have people being pulled down constantly from the cage as they climb up, and that repetitive after a while.

Don't most of these matches also allow for pinning the opponent to count as a win? In that case, why bother with the cage at all if a win can occur with a pin? No, I see the door as being a logical addition to the cage to help heighten the suspense of the match.

Besides that of the obvious "I'm leaving - opps, I just got my head rammed in by the door" situation.
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Since: 20.3.02
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#7 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.79
If you count the entire cage wall as a door, Austin beat McMahon when he swung out with the wall and dropped to the ground.
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Since: 13.1.03
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#8 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.43
    Originally posted by SKLOKAZOID
    If you count the entire cage wall as a door, Austin beat McMahon when he swung out with the wall and dropped to the ground.


The same thing happened on Nitro when Russo (with a protective helmet) won the world title, IIRC.
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Since: 24.7.02

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#9 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.47
    Originally posted by Snookum
    I always saw the door as being a logical element of the cage anyway - why should they have to always climb out? Here's another way to get out and it brings with it (hopefully) the suspense of watching two wrestlers going at it in order to make sure the other can't get to the door and win. Otherwise, you just have people being pulled down constantly from the cage as they climb up, and that repetitive after a while.

    Don't most of these matches also allow for pinning the opponent to count as a win? In that case, why bother with the cage at all if a win can occur with a pin? No, I see the door as being a logical addition to the cage to help heighten the suspense of the match.

    Besides that of the obvious "I'm leaving - opps, I just got my head rammed in by the door" situation.






The old NWA generally had the steel cage rule that it was a normal match with the cage only existing to prevent people from interfering, and the match could only be won or lost on pinfall or submission. The WWF always had the philosophy of escape the cage as the only method of victory. That's why the old NWA style is the method I've personally enjoyed for cage matches.



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Since: 4.1.02
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#10 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.52
I saw a clip of the Austin/Vince Valentine's Day Masacre cage match the other day on the Austin "What?" DVD (which I got for five bucks at Walgreens), and it got me thinking- when was the last time the old WWF style blue bar cage was used? That match may have been the last time (though the bars were painted black instead of blue). I used to hate the blue bars when I was younger, thinking that the NWA's use of the fence caging looked cooler and deadlier, but now that the bars are gone I miss 'em. The other most recent use of the bars I can think of was the match where the New Age Outlaws joined DX in '98- a year before Austin/Vince.

The fencing that WWE uses just does not look menacing at all with all the give it has, and how the corners don't even look like they are connected. Way too flimsy. I guess that's due to time saving issues since it is a cage they can just lower from the ceiling instead of construct.

Oh, and I've always hated the door rule too. Haven't there been numerous heels to win with the door escape the last few years? Even as a little kid I wondered why the faces continually passed the chance to walk right out the door when the other guy was clearly nowhere near able to stop him. Looks even faker than the slow ladder climbing in ladder matches. I do like the climbing over the top of the cage aspect though. The rules in all cage matches should be pin, submit or escape over the top- with BIG BLUE BARS!



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Since: 22.2.04
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#11 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.24
    Originally posted by Eradicator
    I saw a clip of the Austin/Vince Valentine's Day Masacre cage match the other day on the Austin "What?" DVD (which I got for five bucks at Walgreens), and it got me thinking- when was the last time the old WWF style blue bar cage was used? That match may have been the last time (though the bars were painted black instead of blue). I used to hate the blue bars when I was younger, thinking that the NWA's use of the fence caging looked cooler and deadlier, but now that the bars are gone I miss 'em. The other most recent use of the bars I can think of was the match where the New Age Outlaws joined DX in '98- a year before Austin/Vince.

    The fencing that WWE uses just does not look menacing at all with all the give it has, and how the corners don't even look like they are connected. Way too flimsy. I guess that's due to time saving issues since it is a cage they can just lower from the ceiling instead of construct.

    Oh, and I've always hated the door rule too. Haven't there been numerous heels to win with the door escape the last few years? Even as a little kid I wondered why the faces continually passed the chance to walk right out the door when the other guy was clearly nowhere near able to stop him. Looks even faker than the slow ladder climbing in ladder matches. I do like the climbing over the top of the cage aspect though. The rules in all cage matches should be pin, submit or escape over the top- with BIG BLUE BARS!


I agree, I've loved the blue bars ever since seeing the Bret/Owen cage match where one of them (cant remember who dammit) got his legs caught in it and ended up hanging upside down because of it. Pretty cool spot thats impossible to do with the fence style cages.



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Since: 21.1.04
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#12 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.37
    Originally posted by Barbwire Mike
    The real reason the stip is there as far as I can tell is for the spot where the face gets the door slammed on him as he's trying to exit it. I want to say it was a Von Erich match that first used it but the most recent "famous" usage came during a Flair/Hennig match (it's been done more recently than that, but not during a more dramatic moment).

The most recient use was when Lita and Victoria (I think) were in the First Ever Women's Cage Match, the week after Matt turned on Lita. Lita tried to crawl out of the door, but Matt slammed it in her face, then he got chased away by Christian.

    Originally posted by SKLOKAZOID
    If you count the entire cage wall as a door, Austin beat McMahon when he swung out with the wall and dropped to the ground.

That happened a few months ago to RVD, when Kane (?) and him were going at it, and the entire wall by the ramp swung open when Rob was thrown into it. Eric, though, said it didn't count and the match had to continue.




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Since: 17.11.03
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#13 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.53
Actually, the most famous cage match EVER finished out the door (not the best, just the most famous):

The whole point of the Snuka-Muraco finish was that Muraco was to be thrown out the door by fluke, pissing Snuka off enough to put some SERIOUS hurts on him, and since you can't "accidentally" throw someone over the top of a cage, it worked in that case.

Also, Steamboat and Savage after WM3 used that finish at house show cage matches.



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Since: 15.10.02

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#14 Posted on | Instant Rating: 10.00
    Originally posted by samoflange
      Originally posted by Eradicator
      I saw a clip of the Austin/Vince Valentine's Day Masacre cage match the other day on the Austin "What?" DVD (which I got for five bucks at Walgreens), and it got me thinking- when was the last time the old WWF style blue bar cage was used? That match may have been the last time (though the bars were painted black instead of blue). I used to hate the blue bars when I was younger, thinking that the NWA's use of the fence caging looked cooler and deadlier, but now that the bars are gone I miss 'em. The other most recent use of the bars I can think of was the match where the New Age Outlaws joined DX in '98- a year before Austin/Vince.

      The fencing that WWE uses just does not look menacing at all with all the give it has, and how the corners don't even look like they are connected. Way too flimsy. I guess that's due to time saving issues since it is a cage they can just lower from the ceiling instead of construct.

      Oh, and I've always hated the door rule too. Haven't there been numerous heels to win with the door escape the last few years? Even as a little kid I wondered why the faces continually passed the chance to walk right out the door when the other guy was clearly nowhere near able to stop him. Looks even faker than the slow ladder climbing in ladder matches. I do like the climbing over the top of the cage aspect though. The rules in all cage matches should be pin, submit or escape over the top- with BIG BLUE BARS!


    I agree, I've loved the blue bars ever since seeing the Bret/Owen cage match where one of them (cant remember who dammit) got his legs caught in it and ended up hanging upside down because of it. Pretty cool spot thats impossible to do with the fence style cages.

That also happened between Edge and Christian at Rebellion 2001 in Manchester, England (don't know if the place is correct). Edge took it a step further by typing Christian's boots together to literally leave him hanging.



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Since: 2.1.02
From: Bournemouth, UK

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#15 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.00
I think they used the blue bars instead of the wire mesh to make it easier on the, ahem, 'less mobile' members of the roster to climb the cage. No names mentioned.






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Since: 2.1.02
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#16 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.41
    Originally posted by JayJayDean
    The Von Erich match was a Kerry Von Erich/Ric Flair World Title match (I think) where Terry Gordy of the Freebirds was the special ref and Michael Hayes was in charge of the door. Hayes slammed the door on Kerry's head and thus was born the Von Erichs-Freebirds feud of the 80s that RULED World Class Championship Wrestling which RULED until Von Erichs started dropping dead.

    (edited by JayJayDean on 5.3.04 1001)


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#17 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.00
    Originally posted by JayJayDean
    The Von Erich match was a Kerry Von Erich/Ric Flair World Title match (I think) where Terry Gordy of the Freebirds was the special ref and Michael Hayes was in charge of the door. Hayes slammed the door on Kerry's head and thus was born the Von Erichs-Freebirds feud of the 80s that RULED World Class Championship Wrestling which RULED until Von Erichs started dropping dead.

    (edited by JayJayDean on 5.3.04 1001)


That was also not a "leave the cage" stip either. It was a conducted under non-WWF rules of pinfall/submission. Then face, Michael Hayes, was chosen by the fans to be the special ref(the Freebirds were brought into World Class as friends of the Von Erichs)for the match. Late in the match Hayes decked Flair and asked Kerry to pin him. Kerry, of course, would not accept the title this way. Hayes got up and left the cage with Kerry following and as Kerry stuck his head through the ropes Terry Gordy waffled him with the swinging door. One year later on Thanksgiving 83 they had a loser leaves town cage match(Kerry-Hayes) where Buddy Roberts tried to climb the cage to interfere only to fall and rack himself on TOP of the cage. OUCH. Sorry to ramble on but World Class talk does that to me:)
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Since: 17.12.03
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#18 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.73
didnt Backlund and Snuka have a match and Snuka did the splash and missed and Backlund snuck out the door?

I think as a way to book a cage match squash is just have one wrestler beat the hell out of one guy and just stroll out the door, close it and win the match with dignity.

Now that would put a guy over...but bury the other guy...

and with the WWE's 50/50 booking...

hmmm...maybe it wouldn't work
griff
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Since: 26.2.04
From: Manchester, England

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#19 Posted on
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I always saw the door as being a logical element of the cage anyway - why should they have to always climb out? Here's another way to get out and it brings with it (hopefully) the suspense of watching two wrestlers going at it in order to make sure the other can't get to the door and win. Otherwise, you just have people being pulled down constantly from the cage as they climb up, and that repetitive after a while.

Don't most of these matches also allow for pinning the opponent to count as a win? In that case, why bother with the cage at all if a win can occur with a pin? No, I see the door as being a logical addition to the cage to help heighten the suspense of the match.

Besides that of the obvious "I'm leaving - opps, I just got my head rammed in by the door" situation.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I can see what your saying, but I find it impossible to suspend my disbelief when wrestlers try to escape by climbing up a huge cage when the option is there to just 'walk out'. I think the match should stipulate one way or the other depending on the wrestlers.
redsoxnation
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Since: 24.7.02

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#20 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.47
    Originally posted by bigtotoro
      Originally posted by JayJayDean
      The Von Erich match was a Kerry Von Erich/Ric Flair World Title match (I think) where Terry Gordy of the Freebirds was the special ref and Michael Hayes was in charge of the door. Hayes slammed the door on Kerry's head and thus was born the Von Erichs-Freebirds feud of the 80s that RULED World Class Championship Wrestling which RULED until Von Erichs started dropping dead.

      (edited by JayJayDean on 5.3.04 1001)


    That was also not a "leave the cage" stip either. It was a conducted under non-WWF rules of pinfall/submission. Then face, Michael Hayes, was chosen by the fans to be the special ref(the Freebirds were brought into World Class as friends of the Von Erichs)for the match. Late in the match Hayes decked Flair and asked Kerry to pin him. Kerry, of course, would not accept the title this way. Hayes got up and left the cage with Kerry following and as Kerry stuck his head through the ropes Terry Gordy waffled him with the swinging door. One year later on Thanksgiving 83 they had a loser leaves town cage match(Kerry-Hayes) where Buddy Roberts tried to climb the cage to interfere only to fall and rack himself on TOP of the cage. OUCH. Sorry to ramble on but World Class talk does that to me:)




I'll ramble a bit more on World Class, going off on 'fan voting': When they elevated (in their minds at least) the Americas Title to the World Title and allowed fan voting for Rick Rude's first opponent at the Parade of Champions, what possessed them to have Bruiser Brody as that contender? I know they probably wanted to make it appear it wasn't going to remain a Von Erich-centric promotion (remember, it was only May '86, only David had died at that point and Mike was coming back from toxic shock syndrome), but it was still a month before Kerry wiped out his bike, thus a former NWA World Champ could have faced Rude, making it seem like the World Class title was an equivalent to the NWA Title, as Kerry had wrestled and won that title at the event two years prior. Brody seemed too much as a vagabound, as he still was working in the AWA between the end of his heel run against Jerry Blackwell and the beginning of his face run against Nord the Barbarian.



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