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The W - Movies & TV - South Park vs Family Guy, 4/5/06 (Page 3)
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BOSsportsfan34
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Since: 2.1.03
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#41 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.89
    Originally posted by Leroy
      Originally posted by The Vile1
      It still befuddles me that one really annoying and egotistical movie star gets South Park censored after all these years.


    You most certainly won't like this:

    "South Park" Censored (Yahoo.com)



      The scene depicting the Islamic prophet handing a football helmet to a character from Family Guy (at least that's how another of the show's title cards put it) really was nixed by Comedy Central.

      A source close to the show said safety concerns were behind the move. Earlier this year, the Danish publication of newspaper cartoons about Mohammed sparked deadly rioting throughout the world. Any rendering of the prophet is considered insulting by Muslims.


    It's all too strange. A story about Fox censorship turns into actual censorship. It's almost TOO coincidental.

    This came up shortly after I posted the link above:

    'South Park' Creators Skewer Own Network

    (edited by Leroy on 13.4.06 1632)


Funny, they censor an image of Muhammad but Jesus crapping all over Bush and the American flag is ok to show. I guess it's alrigtht to offend Republicans and Christians but not Muslims. Then again...

1. Christians are evil, so it's ok to offend them.

2. Republicans are evil too, and mostly white and straight, so it's ok to offend them.

    Originally posted by Hogan's My Dad
    Meh. Considering all the shit that went down with the Danish cartoons, they shouldn't even be going there period. You can whine censorship all you want, and where it'll get you is straight back into an age-old debate about whether or not "freedom of speech" includes the right to yell fire in a crowded movie theatre.

    I'm not sure that most Christians appreciate the fact that in Islam the image of the prophet Muhammad is strictly prohibited, though not by all versions of the religion. What is unanimously agreed upon, however, is that disrespectful images are blasphemy. It's pretty common knowledge but the news didn't really mention this fact when they were widely covering the (not always violent) protests that resulted from the cartoon. There is no similar rule in Christianity with regards to depictions of Christ, thus his face is plastered everywhere like a corporate logo. That's to the detriment of Christianity I think, as Jesus can now be used to sell pop tarts if someone decides they want to go that way and wants to hide behind the first amendment so they can justify it.

    In any case, I'm not a big fan of South Park, but I'll side with anyone in a war with Family Guy, which has the same artistic value as Jerry Springer. Family Guy clearly has nothing to say and is offensive for the sake of being offensive. While it does have its (uncreative and constantly repeated) moments, they're only funny once, whereas the Simpsons has as high a "rewatchability" factor as anything ever on television.

    Even putting these moments aside, McFarlane is obviously a piece of a garbage. It seems the only argument anyone can make defend this show is to say that you "shouldn't take it seriously", or that you're "being puritanical", but to me there's always going to be the question of whether you should say something just because you can. I watched a bit of American Dad which is just as rank as Family Guy but worse, because it doesn't even have its moments, but the Natalie Wood joke kind of made me wish these people would contract something incurable. I mean, Natalie fucking Wood? A drowning victim? Can anyone coherently argue that this is a target worthy of mockery? I'm no big South Park fan, but whenever I drop in from time to time they (usually) seem to direct their venom at people who have done something questionable to bring themselves into the line of fire, not just everyone and everything because they secretly hate themselves.


As for "yelling 'fire' in a crowder theater" vs showing muhammed and offending certain muslims; apples and oranges, dude.

On your dislike of South Park and loathing of Family Guy; I like both Family Guy and South Park, and I have no problem if you don't like either. However, as for the rest of your post, to quote a recent episode of South Park: SMUG ALERT!!! Please, you are a bit long-winded in your bashing. The phrase "Thou does protest too much" comes to mind. To echo what guru said.....

    Originally posted by Guru Zim
    Lighten up, Francis.


(edit: I spelled Lighten wrong - Guru)

(edited by Guru Zim on 13.4.06 2051)


"Speaking of Thomases, I loved your recent Atrocious GM Summit column, although I think that you flatter Isiah Thomas far too much by suggesting that he is merely one of a number of atrocious GMs. The truth is that Rob Babcock and Billy King are Einstein next to him. The mess he is creating right now in New York will be studied by business school students 50 years from now alongside Enron and pets.com."

Malcom Gladwell, from an e-mail exchange column with Bill Simmons.
BigDaddyLoco
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02

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#42 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.76
So, did Comedy Central really not want to show the Muhammad image or was that part of the joke? I'm thinking it was part of the joke, but I've been known to not get all of CRZ's hints either.
BOSsportsfan34
Pepperoni








Since: 2.1.03
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#43 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.89
    Originally posted by BigDaddyLoco
    So, did Comedy Central really not want to show the Muhammad image or was that part of the joke? I'm thinking it was part of the joke, but I've been known to not get all of CRZ's hints either.


Click on the link to the yahoo story in Leroy's post. I guess the censoring of Muhammed was real.



"Speaking of Thomases, I loved your recent Atrocious GM Summit column, although I think that you flatter Isiah Thomas far too much by suggesting that he is merely one of a number of atrocious GMs. The truth is that Rob Babcock and Billy King are Einstein next to him. The mess he is creating right now in New York will be studied by business school students 50 years from now alongside Enron and pets.com."

Malcom Gladwell, from an e-mail exchange column with Bill Simmons.
Hogan's My Dad
Andouille








Since: 8.6.02
From: Canada

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#44 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.90
See, this is the problem with people who like Family Guy. They can't come up with credible arguments. If you like it, fine, you like it. I didn't say you don't have to like it, but if you don't have any argument whatsoever, why even comment? Wanna have intelligent debate? Let's! But "lighten up" is not an argument, and neither is "smug alert".

And "thou does protest too much" in its usual context, means I am against something because it mirrors a hidden truth in myself. "The lady doth protest too much, methinks" from Hamlet, Queen Gertrude always professing her love of the dead husband her son believes she helped kill. So I guess you're saying is I'm overreacting because I'm insecure about my cartoon being too offensive? Not sure I follow you.

I'm not trying to be smarmy, but it is frustrating because I run into this problem with every Family Guy fan I meet. And no, I don't preach to them, but they don't understand why I dislike it and insist on arguing with me, then counter-argue like that. Can we go idea for idea here, instead of personal attacks on debating style, or is that too much to ask?



It hurts to be a wrestling fan.
BOSsportsfan34
Pepperoni








Since: 2.1.03
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#45 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.89
    Originally posted by Hogan's My Dad
    See, this is the problem with people who like Family Guy. They can't come up with credible arguments. If you like it, fine, you like it. I didn't say you don't have to like it, but if you don't have any argument whatsoever, why even comment? Wanna have intelligent debate? Let's! But "lighten up" is not an argument, and neither is "smug alert".

    And "thou does protest too much" in its usual context, means I am against something because it mirrors a hidden truth in myself. "The lady doth protest too much, methinks" from Hamlet, Queen Gertrude always professing her love of the dead husband her son believes she helped kill. So I guess you're saying is I'm overreacting because I'm insecure about my cartoon being too offensive? Not sure I follow you.

    I'm not trying to be smarmy, but it is frustrating because I run into this problem with every Family Guy fan I meet. And no, I don't preach to them, but they don't understand why I dislike it and insist on arguing with me, then counter-argue like that. Can we go idea for idea here, instead of personal attacks on debating style, or is that too much to ask?


The "protest too much" comment" was directed at your long diatribe against the show. I don't know if it reveals some hidden truth about youself, you tell me.

I don't care if you like Family Guy or not, but your last post seemed like you were trying to make people who are fans of it look like doucebags. Do you think fans of Family Guy are bad people?


(edited by BOSsportsfan34 on 14.4.06 0031)


"Speaking of Thomases, I loved your recent Atrocious GM Summit column, although I think that you flatter Isiah Thomas far too much by suggesting that he is merely one of a number of atrocious GMs. The truth is that Rob Babcock and Billy King are Einstein next to him. The mess he is creating right now in New York will be studied by business school students 50 years from now alongside Enron and pets.com."

Malcom Gladwell, from an e-mail exchange column with Bill Simmons.
ges7184
Lap cheong








Since: 7.1.02
From: Birmingham, AL

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#46 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.81
I think Family Guy is overrated too, but I'm not willing to get into an "intelligent debate" with fans over it. Afterall, it is just a cartoon. Now granted, maybe in most cases it is fans that insist on arguing with you. But in this thread, it appears that you took it upon yourself to start a debate that nobody else really cares to have. I mean, is it really that worthy of discussion? Some people like Family Guy. Some don't. To each their own.

(edited by ges7184 on 13.4.06 2331)


The Bored are already here. Idle hands are the devil's workshop. And no... we won't kill dolphins. But koalas are fair game.
Hogan's My Dad
Andouille








Since: 8.6.02
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#47 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.90
Well then, I apologize. That wasn't what I was trying to do, and I didn't mean for it to come off that way. Of course they're not necessarily bad people, though anyone laughing at Civil Rights put-downs or mockeries of the disabled and dead by drowning is at the very least insensitive.



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CRZ
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Since: 9.12.01
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#48 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.89
I believe the argument breaks down thusly:

Me: I enjoy Family Guy!
You: (thousands of words)

Hey, but at least you managed to keep from making some kinda reference to somebody cornholing somebody else with some foreign object like you've been known to do during your wrestling arguments! 1/2 ;-)

As for ol' Muhammad, he was depicted in cartoon form on the "opening credits" of Mr. Show sketch "Crazy Religious Beliefs" as part of an episode which even very VERY recently was shown in the TBS Friday rotation without anybody making so much as a peep. (Don't tell the Muslims, though! Keep it on the down low! I enjoy Mr. Show too!)





CRZ
J. Kyle
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Since: 21.2.02
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#49 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.00
X-E's co-Worst Poster of all time! JKyle.com says:

Briefly (as I can be)
South Park wasn't going to do anything but show Mohamed hand Peter a helmet.

The Danish cartoons depicted him as a terrorist, when ALL Muslim extremists are bastardizing virtually everything the man ever taught.

One of those is the fire in a crowded theater scenario, one is not.

When BO points that out, you overlook it completely by saying he made no points. Then precede to say that no Family Guy fan can take part in an intelligent discussion.

So it appears (from here) that discussing it won't do anything except give you an excuse to stand on your proverbial soapbox some more.

Hence, all Guru has to say is "Lighten up."



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Hogan's My Dad
Andouille








Since: 8.6.02
From: Canada

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#50 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.90
    Originally posted by CRZ
    at least you managed to keep from making some kinda reference to somebody cornholing somebody else with some foreign object like you've been known to do during your wrestling arguments! 1/2 ;-)


No fair. I only did that, like, five times.



It hurts to be a wrestling fan.
ShotGunShep
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Since: 20.2.03

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#51 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.37
You can't compare yelling fire in a crowded theatre to showing Muhammed on South Park. I really don't understand the abroad Muslim community. Sure they should get mad if a Muslim breaks their own laws. Maybe even a non-Muslim in an Islamic country. But why RIOT when someone who doesn't believe in Sharia violates it?
The reaction seems almost childish. But I guess that's what you get in the absence of liberalism.
And I hate how we in the West have to walk around on eggshells over this. People are irrationally getting mad about something that has no effect on their own lives, and we appease that behavior.

RIOTING and killing your own people is not directly and deterministically caused by the West depicting Mohammed. Therefore since there is no causal relationship, we can place no blame on cartoonists for depicting Mohammed. We may call them jerks or insensitive, but we cannot hold them responsible. In fact in many circumstances we should call them courageous (see Theo van Gogh)
There are few and rare cases when people can abuse free speech
http://supct.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/historics/USSC_CR_0249_0047_ZO.html
read that for more on the law regarding this subject.
Jaguar
Knackwurst








Since: 23.1.02
From: Phoenix, AZ

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#52 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.66
"What kind of wood doesn't float?"

"Natalie Wood!"

That joke has been around for years, and I'm really not ashamed of my parents for telling it to me.



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Domination of me is frustratingly hard
JustinShapiro
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Since: 12.12.01
From: Pittsburgh, PA

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#53 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.46
    Originally posted by HMD
    In any case, I'm not a big fan of South Park, but I'll side with anyone in a war with Family Guy


Hells yeah. Family Guy is a horrible show for horrible people like CRZ. South Park irks me for its self-righteousness, but they even poked fun at themselves for that. So it was a glorious pair of episodes. You think DAT's bad ...

    Originally posted by BOSports
    Funny, they censor an image of Muhammad but Jesus crapping all over Bush and the American flag is ok to show. I guess it's alrigtht to offend Republicans and Christians but not Muslims. Then again...

    1. Christians are evil, so it's ok to offend them.


Isn't it definitely more okay to offend Republicans and Christians? If only because they don't kill people over such offenses?


    Youur last post seemed like you were trying to make people who are fans of it look like douchebags. Do you think fans of Family Guy are bad people?


One thousand times yes.

    Originally posted by CRZ
    I enjoy Mr. Show too!


Okay, nevermind.

(edited by JustinShapiro on 14.4.06 1437)
BOSsportsfan34
Pepperoni








Since: 2.1.03
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#54 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.97
    Originally posted by JustinShapiro
      Originally posted by HMD
      In any case, I'm not a big fan of South Park, but I'll side with anyone in a war with Family Guy


    Hells yeah. Family Guy is a horrible show for horrible people like CRZ. South Park irks me for its self-righteousness, but they even poked fun at themselves for that. So it was a glorious pair of episodes. You think DAT's bad ...

      Originally posted by BOSports
      Funny, they censor an image of Muhammad but Jesus crapping all over Bush and the American flag is ok to show. I guess it's alrigtht to offend Republicans and Christians but not Muslims. Then again...

      1. Christians are evil, so it's ok to offend them.


    Isn't it definitely more okay to offend Republicans and Christians? If only because they don't kill people over such offenses?


      Youur last post seemed like you were trying to make people who are fans of it look like douchebags. Do you think fans of Family Guy are bad people?


    One thousand times yes.

      Originally posted by CRZ
      I enjoy Mr. Show too!


    Okay, nevermind.

    (edited by JustinShapiro on 14.4.06 1437)


HA!!! Good post.

Now excuse me, being an evil person because I like Family Guy, I have to plan my weekend accordingly. Let's see..

1. Torture some puppies tonight

2. Tomorrow, rob a liquor store

3. Sunday, head up to the Arctic Circle and club some baby seals



(edited by BOSsportsfan34 on 14.4.06 1714)


"Speaking of Thomases, I loved your recent Atrocious GM Summit column, although I think that you flatter Isiah Thomas far too much by suggesting that he is merely one of a number of atrocious GMs. The truth is that Rob Babcock and Billy King are Einstein next to him. The mess he is creating right now in New York will be studied by business school students 50 years from now alongside Enron and pets.com."

Malcom Gladwell, from an e-mail exchange column with Bill Simmons.
Zeruel
Thirty Millionth Hit
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Since: 2.1.02
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#55 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.05
According to this screen cap found on Wikipedia, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Southparkseason10opening.png , Muhammad has been in the "opening-title-all-characters-freeze-frame" since "Smug Alert."



He's in the red box in the right center of the pic.





"You want to tempt the wrath of the whatever from high atop the thing?" --Toby, West Wing

kentish
Andouille








Since: 19.8.05
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#56 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.05
I haven't kept up with SP the last year or so, but this 2 parter was awesome. Manatee?? Idea balls?? Brilliant. And frankly, both shows are hilarious in different ways. There is usually a method to their madness, unlike other shows like Drawn Together, which seems to just be raunchy for the sake of being raunchy.



The only reason you're not unconscious, is because I don't want to carry you.
DJ FrostyFreeze
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Since: 2.1.02
From: Hawthorne, CA

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#57 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.49

My apologies in advance if this thread is too old to be brought back up, but I thought this was funny (and relevant!): A Family Guy fan strikes back at South Park.

I like both shows, but if forced to choose one I'd pick Family Guy over South Park. Especially because it seems like SP only is bashing & lampooning things lately that they know will get a rise out of people for the sole purpose of getting a rise out of people, as opposed to writing things that they think are funny that HAPPEN to get a rise out of people, and that always turns me off.




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NickBockwinkelFan
Frankfurter








Since: 10.4.02
From: New York City, NY

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#58 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.28
    Originally posted by BOSsportsfan34


    Now excuse me, being an evil person because I like Family Guy, I have to plan my weekend accordingly. Let's see..

    1. Torture some puppies tonight

    2. Tomorrow, rob a liquor store

    3. Sunday, head up to the Arctic Circle and club some baby seals



    (edited by BOSsportsfan34 on 14.4.06 1714)


You forgot to mention # 4

Order the TNA PPV

edit: sorry, I didn't realize this thread was so out of date

(edited by NickBockwinkelFan on 21.4.06 0154)

"Well, you can't involve friendship with business. It has to be one or the other. It's either business or friendship, or hit the bricks!"
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whatever
Lap cheong








Since: 12.2.02
From: Cleveland, Ohio

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#59 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.85


Wow, that was well done!

You know, I like both shows, but I would also have to side with Family Guy over South Park if it came down to it. I actually have purchased Family Guy on DVD, and I can't say the same for South Park.



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