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The W - Baseball - Rolen, Rolen, Rolen
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odessasteps
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02
From: MD, USA

Since last post: 15 hours
Last activity: 11 hours
#1 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.41

Anyone want to buy a Scott Rolen Phillies jersey?

*sigh*

I have tickets to see the Phils play Cardinal Nation in three weeks and I know will have the pleasure of seeing Rolen and J.D. Boo coming to the Vet as visitors.
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evilwaldo
Lap cheong








Since: 7.2.02
From: New York, NY

Since last post: 3222 days
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#2 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.00
Rueben Amaro was on 610 this morning trying to defend the trade. The morning crew just ripped him and made him and the organization look like the biggest idiots ever to walk the face of the earth.

I can't wait to hear Rolen's first comments about the Phillies organization.





Prime evil of Kaiju Big Battel is very mysterious and expensive doctor.
odessasteps
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02
From: MD, USA

Since last post: 15 hours
Last activity: 11 hours
#3 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.41

I'm surprised WIP could be bothered to talk about Rolen with the Iverson stuff happening yesterday.

I didn't even think WIP knew the Phillies existed.
Papercuts!
Potato korv








Since: 3.1.02
From: Springfield, Mo.

Since last post: 4280 days
Last activity: 4190 days
#4 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.00

    Originally posted by odessasteps
    J.D. Boo coming to the Vet as visitors.
You guys gonna throw batteries at him again? lol



--Jason Baldwin
Contributing Writer
Kevin Smith's Movie Poop Shoot dot com
Grimis
Scrapple








Since: 11.7.02
From: MD

Since last post: 1084 days
Last activity: 881 days
#5 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.09
I think the Phils did what they had to do. They needed to get something for Rolen(as opposed to letting him walk via free agency) and with the potential labor situation negating any draft pick compensation, they had to strike while the iron was hot. Bud Smith has a tremendous upside and they may be able to move Timlin to a contender who needs veteran bullpen help(Anaheim?)

Best rumor for now is Cliff Floyd on the move(again) to Atlanta via Oakland.
Spiraling_Shape
Bratwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: PA

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 14 hours
#6 Posted on
Yeah, as a Phillies fan, this is certainly a sad thing, but we knew he wasn`t coming back. At least we got some players with potential..Polanco`s no Rolen of course, but he`s not a total stiff. Bud Smith is a young pitcher with an upside, and Timlin`s a veteran reliever. This isn`t like all the teams just handing their players over to the Yankees for a bag of baseballs. And Rolen apparently wants to stay with the Cards, so he`s not just a rent-a-player for them.



"Hollywood Hulk Hogan lost his hair match to Mother Nature, dude!"
Tom Dean
Bockwurst








Since: 30.8.02
From: New York, NY

Since last post: 3121 days
Last activity: 2490 days
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#7 Posted on
Rolen's kind of tough to judge. He's clearly the best third baseman in the NL, and yet, I still don't think he's a "superstar". If all the young 3B around like Hank Blalock, Sean Burroughs, and Adrian Beltre develop as they should, then Rolen will not look so great. A lot of his perceived value is simply due to the fact that there happen not to be a lot of good third basemen right now. Then again, Rolen himself is still young enough to improve. It's tough to say how much he is worth. But, surely he does help St. Louis this year, as they gave up nothing they needed. And surely, Philly should have realized that they had no chance to re-sign him and traded him before the season started. Then they presumably could have gotten more for him.

I guess St. Louis decided that Pujols wasn't a third baseman. Pujols/Edmonds/Drew could be an all-time OF if Drew were ever healthy.

I really hope MLB realizes just how bad it will look if Montreal trades off players.



"How YOU Doin'?"
- Tom Dean, weekly at [slash]
"History is being make-ed... somebody here is getting their head completely shaved off"
- David McLane, PPV opening promo

gonna build a giant drill and bore straight into hell releasing ancient demons from their sleep-forever spell so they can walk upon the earth and get recituated and run the diet pill pyramid that MC Pee Pants has created
Grimis
Scrapple








Since: 11.7.02
From: MD

Since last post: 1084 days
Last activity: 881 days
#8 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.09
Pujols' average is 70 points higher as a LF than as a 3B. Plus there's the defensive issue...

As far as young 3B, you can exclude Burroughs; he's down at AAA Portland learning to play 2B. San Diego has a kid even better than Burroughs named Xavier Nady who plays 3rd. And don't forget Mark Teixeira, the switch-hitter for Texas who will make people forget about Hank Blalock is he stays consistent up the line.
Spiraling_Shape
Bratwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: PA

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 14 hours
#9 Posted on
Rolen`s offense hasn`t lived up to his potential, but the guy is the best defensive third-baseman in baseball.

Last week, he made a great play behind our debuting rookie starter Brett Myers. Myers said in the press conference that he`d never had someone playing that calibre of third base behind him, and a reporter said back, "Don`t get used to it." :(



"Hollywood Hulk Hogan lost his hair match to Mother Nature, dude!"
Guru Zim
SQL Dejection
Administrator








Since: 9.12.01
From: Bay City, OR

Since last post: 3 days
Last activity: 1 day
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#10 Posted on

    Originally posted by Grimis
    Pujols' average is 70 points higher as a LF than as a 3B. Plus there's the defensive issue...

    As far as young 3B, you can exclude Burroughs; he's down at AAA Portland learning to play 2B. San Diego has a kid even better than Burroughs named Xavier Nady who plays 3rd. And don't forget Mark Teixeira, the switch-hitter for Texas who will make people forget about Hank Blalock is he stays consistent up the line.



Don't believe all the hype about Nady. They've been telling us that he plays second, third and short for a long time, but we've had openings at almost every one of those positions for the last two seasons and he hasn't been up once.

This, while we have picked up Rule 5 guys at key positions like Short....

I'm sure he will be good, but Klesko and Nevin have apparently made it clear that they would rather be at third and first for at least this season. They are team players and will make the move to make room if they have to, but it really seems like they prefer it where they are now.



Your a retarted looser.
evilwaldo
Lap cheong








Since: 7.2.02
From: New York, NY

Since last post: 3222 days
Last activity: 3003 days
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#11 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.00

    Originally posted by odessasteps

    I'm surprised WIP could be bothered to talk about Rolen with the Iverson stuff happening yesterday.

    I didn't even think WIP knew the Phillies existed.



Amaro called into the show. That alone shows his intelligence level.



Prime evil of Kaiju Big Battel is very mysterious and expensive doctor.
odessasteps
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02
From: MD, USA

Since last post: 15 hours
Last activity: 11 hours
#12 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.41

Im surprised the Phillies didn't sacrifice David Brazier instead, since he (used to be at least) is a regular guest on the morning show.
Big Bad
Scrapple








Since: 4.1.02
From: Dorchester, Ontario

Since last post: 37 min.
Last activity: 37 min.
#13 Posted on
As a former Jays fan, I can state that any team that trades for Mike Timlin is making a BAD DAMN MOVE.



I was born in a manger, like that other guy. You know, he wore a hat?
Zaphod
Chorizo








Since: 24.2.02

Since last post: 4104 days
Last activity: 4096 days
#14 Posted on
Well, so ends the Reds' hunt for the NL Central title. With Rolen on board, I think the Cards will now be uncatchable. It would've been worth it for us to positively shower the Phillies in prospects just to keep him out of St. Louis, but our chickenshit owner nixed the deal that would've gotten him for Brandon Larson and Scott Williamson (far more than the Cards shelled out for him). *grumble*
Rudoublesedoublel
Potato korv








Since: 2.1.02
From: Kentucky - Home of the 8 time NCAA Champ Wildcats

Since last post: 5 days
Last activity: 9 hours
#15 Posted on
I'm a Cardinal fan who is trying to be happy about this trade. I think that Bud Smith is going to be a star one day. If memory serves the Cardinals traded Steve Carlton to Philadelphia a long time ago; I just hope this isn't a case of history repeating itself. Palanco is an excellent player. He may not have the power of Rolen, but he hits for a better average and has more speed. He may not be as good as Rolen defensively, but he's no slouch with the glove either. I don't know about Timlin. I haven't followed the box scores closely enough to know how well he was playing, but I do know it isn't a good idea to give up contributing pitchers for the pennant run.

The question is, will Rolen stay in St. Louis? The easy answer is "McGwire and Edmonds liked St. Louis enough to stay, so Rolen will too." If Rolen stays, then the Cardinals made a decent deal; if Rolen takes the big money in the off-season, then the Cardinals will have given away a future big time pitcher and a very versatile player for nothing.

One thing, who are Brandon Larson and Scott Williamson and why are they a better "tag team" than Bud and Placido?
Tom Dean
Bockwurst








Since: 30.8.02
From: New York, NY

Since last post: 3121 days
Last activity: 2490 days
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#16 Posted on
Larson is a rookie third baseman, 26 or 27 years old so not a prospect really, but he has played well so far this year since he was called up maybe a month ago. Williamson was the '99 Rookie of the Year as a closer... they tried to make him a starter in '00, which was working pretty well, but then he got hurt and missed all of '01 with an injury. This year, back in the pen, he has been solid although not amazing. That probably is a better package than what the Cards offered. Would have been a good trade for the Reds too, although their main need really is starting pitching, as far as I can see.



"How YOU Doin'?"
- Tom Dean, weekly at [slash]
"History is being make-ed... somebody here is getting their head completely shaved off"
- David McLane, PPV opening promo

gonna build a giant drill and bore straight into hell releasing ancient demons from their sleep-forever spell so they can walk upon the earth and get recituated and run the diet pill pyramid that MC Pee Pants has created
Zaphod
Chorizo








Since: 24.2.02

Since last post: 4104 days
Last activity: 4096 days
#17 Posted on

    Originally posted by T.R.
    Larson is a rookie third baseman, 26 or 27 years old so not a prospect really, but he has played well so far this year since he was called up maybe a month ago. Williamson was the '99 Rookie of the Year as a closer... they tried to make him a starter in '00, which was working pretty well, but then he got hurt and missed all of '01 with an injury. This year, back in the pen, he has been solid although not amazing. That probably is a better package than what the Cards offered. Would have been a good trade for the Reds too, although their main need really is starting pitching, as far as I can see.


I won't argue with you about the Reds needing some starting pitching. Moehler didn't look too bad last night against the Dodgers, aside from that 4-run inning he gave up (the bullpen then proceeded to let the horse out of the barn), and it looks like Gullett MIGHT be getting Dempster back on track. Still, I don't understand optioning one of their best pitchers, Chris Reitsma, back to AAA to make room for the returning Gabe White. They needed another lefty reliever, since Bruce Chen is all potential and no payoff, but Reitsma shouldn't have been the one to go. I'd rather release or risk losing via waivers someone like Joey Hamilton, but that's just me. But back to the subject at hand, I still maintain that, even if Rolen wasn't really a piece the Reds needed, it would have been worth getting him just to keep him out of the Cards' clutches. His presence makes the already scary Cardinal lineup even more dangerous, since it allows them to go lefty-righty-lefty-righty and prevent opposing managers from capitalizing on match-ups.

As for Larson, while not exactly a prospect, he fits the Phillies better than Polanco does. Don't get me wrong, I think Polanco is a fantastic utility man and a servicable starting third baseman. That said, the Phillies desperately needed somebody who could hit with some power, which is the one thing Larson does that Polanco can't really do.

As for Williamson, although it appears he peaked early and may never regain his '99 form, he's still sometimes absolutely overpowering and can serve any role in the bullpen. More importantly, he's a lot younger than Mike Timlin, and since the Phillies need youth in order to rebuild, he'd be a better fit there.
SerWolfe
Landjager








Since: 11.1.02
From: st louis

Since last post: 4028 days
Last activity: 4028 days
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#18 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.00
Eh. I think this trade is a great trade if Rolen stays in st. louis. He wants to play for a competitor and have the majority of support behind him. Polanco is a great ballplayer.... useful at many positions... and bud smith can be a great pitcher... maybe. Timlin is an average reliever.

We picked up and All-Star third baseman.... a guy that can have better numbers with the lineup cushion the redbirds will give him. We got him for a good utility player (everyday third baseman now) a average reliever..... and a pitching prospect that is more control then power obviously... i would take that trade any day.

They have a great chance now for the post season now i believe. Now if we can get williams or stephenson healthy.



I've torn myself apart.... and tried to figure out why... but the only answer i was ever given... that really fits..... is the fact... that women are crazy.
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If this was the A.L. Central of 3-4 years ago, I'd think Kansas City was on the right track and a break here, a break there, and they might hover around .500 and contend.
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