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21.9.14 1124
The W - Pro Wrestling - ROH Weekend of Champions Cleveland show
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Dawg
Chourico








Since: 2.6.03
From: Detroit area

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#1 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.99
Since we need more ROH threads:

The card straight from the ROH site:

World Title vs. Pure Title (To Be Contested Under Pure Rules)
Bryan Danielson vs. Nigel McGuinness

Tag Team Title Match
Austin Aries & Roderick Strong defend vs. Jimmy Rave & Alex Shelley

Grudge Match
Samoa Joe vs. Claudio Castagnoli

Jim Cornette will lead ROH against Super Dragon & Necro Butcher

Rematch From Last Time In Cleveland
Christopher Daniels with Allison Danger vs. Matt Sydal

Special Challenge Match
Chris Sabin vs. Delirious

Six Man Mayhem
Jimmy Yang vs. Jimmy Jacobs with Lacey vs. Jay Fury vs. Spud vs. Trik Davis vs. Flash Flanagan

Bonus Tag Team Attraction
Irish Airborne vs. Colt Cabana & To Be Determined

This should be a good card especially with the recent addition of Joe vs Claudio and the continuation of ROH vs CZW. Things should be pretty nuts. Edit - Also, Chris Sabin vs Delirious was added within the past week and promises to be good. Will anyone else be in attendance? I'll be there with my brother rocking the general admission seats.



(edited by Dawg on 26.4.06 2043)
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TheBucsFan
TheChiefsFan








Since: 2.1.02

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#2 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.42
    Originally posted by Dawg
    World Title vs. Pure Title (To Be Contested Under Pure Rules)


I know nothing about ROH, have never seen a show, don't know any of the wrestlers or angles and haven't really made much of an effort to change this.

I clicked this thread out of curiosity and saw this match here and was wondering what the "Pure Title" was, so I went and looked up the Wikipedia entry on it and it sounds like it could be pretty cool, with the limit on rope breaks and closed fists. Are the matches typically fun to watch?

More importantly...what a stupid name for a title.
sergeial
Boerewors








Since: 27.2.02
From: Minneapolis

Since last post: 3005 days
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#3 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.82
I've often wondered what made the Pure title different, so when I read the above I found the wiki article BucsFan referenced. For those curious, but not curious enough to look for it, here's what it says:


    Every wrestler has three rope breaks that he can use to break a pin or submission. Submission maneuvers that involve use of the ropes are legal after all three rope breaks are used. Closed fists are illegal. The first time a wrestler uses a closed fist he is given a warning. If he uses a closed fist again he loses one of his rope breaks. If the wrestler already used all of his rope breaks, and uses a closed fist, he is disqualified. There is a 20 seconds countout.


Interesting...

I've looked at the ROH website several times, and I've looked at streaming video of wrestlers I'm interested in, such as Joe, but never noticed anything about the Pure rules or the Code of Honor. They would be well advised to do more to sell the things that set them apart from other indie promotions...



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Since: 28.6.04
From: Troy, NY

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#4 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.61
    Originally posted by TheBucsFan
    Are the matches typically fun to watch?

Typically, I've found that they are. In particular, it adds the psychology of the rope break, such as the strategy a wrestler could use of getting his opponent to use up all of his rope breaks. I like the idea of a title that has its own unique rules in its defense which are clearly defined and stated before the beginning of every match, which is very helpful for newcomers to Ring of Honor.

That's always been my gripe with the TNA's X Title...to us "it's not about weight limits but no limits" means that it's primarily going to be smaller guys being a little spotty. I wonder though if the casual fan stumbling upon TNA asks what it's about after making the assumption it's a Cruiserweight Title and seeing someone like Samoa Joe holding it. Anyways, I digress.

    Originally posted by sergeial
    I've looked at the ROH website several times, and I've looked at streaming video of wrestlers I'm interested in, such as Joe, but never noticed anything about the Pure rules or the Code of Honor. They would be well advised to do more to sell the things that set them apart from other indie promotions...

Absolutely. In fact, there's not much on that site to really sell you on Ring of Honor if you're not either familiar with the product or have heard about it extensively from other fans. The video roster is a nice touch, but they'd be better off having a roster page with videos for certain wrestlers, as someone might not want to sit through nine minutes of video just to see who a handful of the wrestlers are.

As for the card: I'll probably order the DVD whenever it comes out. In particular, I'm really looking forward to the Danielson/McGuinness match, mostly because for myself, McGuinness is the most fun heel to watch in all of wrestling. I've only seen a couple Claudio Castiglioni matches, and I still don't see what the big stink is about him (perhaps I've just seen the wrong matches).



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Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02
From: The Las Vegas of Canada

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#5 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.57
    Originally posted by sergeial
    I've looked at the ROH website several times, and I've looked at streaming video of wrestlers I'm interested in, such as Joe, but never noticed anything about the Pure rules or the Code of Honor. They would be well advised to do more to sell the things that set them apart from other indie promotions...

Part of that stems from the fact that they have slowly deemphasized the Code of Honor and the issues stemming from that over the last year or two. Pretty much the only vestige of the original idea is the prematch handshakes. But the idea that all matches would end cleanly and no one would interfere and all that has ended as ROH has shifted to being a storyline-driven promotion, albeit one that still puts on some amazing matches. If anything it seems like they are trying to become more ECW like by having very clearly defined faces and heels, a broader mix of matches on the cards, and a willingness to sacrifice match quality to move a story forward. You would have never seen a no-contest in early ROH, but as of late, especially with the CZW/ROH feud, they are happening from time to time in order to keep the angle going strong. Speaking of which I really need to get the dvd's from this as everyone mentions how the crowd heat is insane stemming from this.

The Pure Title matches are an interesting change of pace and as DM said it does change the flow of the match. Some of the little things you get used as being natural movements in the flow of a match get changed so you're always a bit more on your toes watching it.

As a thought to anyone who has seen Joe in TNA and liked his work, please believe it when I say his ROH stuff is even better and you would not likely be disappointed checking it out.



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Dawg
Chourico








Since: 2.6.03
From: Detroit area

Since last post: 123 days
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#6 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.09
Thanks for the ROH tag, mods.

Admittedly, I haven't seen many Claudio matches yet but his match last time in Detroit was good and I picked up a DVD while there, Showdown in Motown, that had Claudio in a pure title match against Nigel that was very good. Flying European uppercut to the outside~! I think Joe will kill him for turning on ROH, though

Speaking of Joe, his ROH matches are better because he has more varied opponents and they've given more time in the ring. His matches with Fallen Angel and Styles are awesome but TNA throws in too many squashes. Joe vs Danielson, Joe vs Aries, and Joe vs Punk is where it's at!

I see the pure title as a nod to wrestling purists out there, tons of matwork and it fits the European style perfectly. Honestly it probably *is* the defintion of European title.

In addition to the 100th show with CZW/ROH, the shows from last month in Detroit & Chicago featuring japan-based Dragon Gate are worth checking out (when they're finally released). Reports from the people that went to all three are that the Detroit show from 03/29 was the best of the series.
The Vile1
Lap cheong








Since: 4.9.02
From: California

Since last post: 1980 days
Last activity: 1712 days
#7 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.28
This is a very interesting looking show.

What intrigues me the most is Nigel vs. Danielson, title vs. title. If the match is under pure title rules, doesn't that mean Danielson could theoretically lose his title if Nigel gets him disqualified?

I really don't know how the match is going to end. Nigel's really been dynamite as pure champion, and probably the best ROH pure champion of all time. And the longest reigning one as well. I think he's held it 8 months as of today which puts him over John Walters.

Will it be a draw? Or will Danielson win the title getting one step closer to becoming a triple crown champion? I kind of hope it ends with neither guy losing their title. What I want to see is either Alex Shelley, Jimmy Rave, or Colt Cabana take the pure title.
Hokienautic
Liverwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: Blacksburg VA

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#8 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.54
Brief aside re: the pure title rules.

Am I remembering wrong, or did the AWA try something somewhat similar to this in their dying days, before the "team" concept" that finally killed them? I remember reading something about a "card" system similar to soccer where you'd get carded for various offenses like closed fists and the like, and if you accumulated enough cards you'd be automatically DQ'ed. Was that AWA, or perhaps one of the PWI-type magazines proposing it? Anyone else remember this?
Matt Tracker
Scrapple








Since: 8.5.03
From: North Carolina

Since last post: 7 days
Last activity: 1 day
#9 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.90
Can someone clarify the Aries/Strong punishment from TNA involving ROH? I know they were blatanatly de-pushed in TNA. Were they "advised" not to work ROH anymore?



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Scrapple








Since: 4.1.02
From: Dorchester, Ontario

Since last post: 2 days
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#10 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.40
    Originally posted by Matt Tracker
    Can someone clarify the Aries/Strong punishment from TNA involving ROH? I know they were blatanatly de-pushed in TNA. Were they "advised" not to work ROH anymore?


I don't think they were forbidden from working ROH, since that creates a double standard with guys like Joe and Styles. Rather just told if they were booked for a TNA PPV, then it should be their first priority. I have no doubt we'll see these guys in TNA again, and they'll be booked as threats once their 'punishment' time is up.



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The Vile1
Lap cheong








Since: 4.9.02
From: California

Since last post: 1980 days
Last activity: 1712 days
#11 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.28
    Originally posted by Matt Tracker
    Can someone clarify the Aries/Strong punishment from TNA involving ROH? I know they were blatanatly de-pushed in TNA. Were they "advised" not to work ROH anymore?


They weren't blatantly de-pushed, they were suspended for arriving to the Against All Odds PPV late and risked missing the show. TNA booked earlier flights for them and the other ROH workers scheduled to be on the PPV because of the horrible weather. Shelley, Lethal, and Homicide all took the early flights out to make it to the PPV in time. Strong and Aries stayed to perform at the ROH show.

I think the suspension was wrong, but I guess I see both sides.

Supposedly Aries has already fulfilled all his dates in his contract and TNA has no plans to use him further.

They used Strong for a couple matches before Lockdown but that was it.
Karlos the Jackal
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Since: 2.1.02
From: The City of Subdued Excitement

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#12 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.00
    Originally posted by The Vile1
    Supposedly Aries has already fulfilled all his dates in his contract and TNA has no plans to use him further.
Where did you hear this?

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Since: 17.1.02
From: New F'n Jersey

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 2 days
#13 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.75
    Originally posted by Hokienautic
    Brief aside re: the pure title rules.

    Am I remembering wrong, or did the AWA try something somewhat similar to this in their dying days, before the "team" concept" that finally killed them? I remember reading something about a "card" system similar to soccer where you'd get carded for various offenses like closed fists and the like, and if you accumulated enough cards you'd be automatically DQ'ed. Was that AWA, or perhaps one of the PWI-type magazines proposing it? Anyone else remember this?


I'm sure someone like Redsoxnation can tell more and remembers more, but it was the AWA that had the "revolutionary" concept of the Team Challenge Series, with three teams that fought each other and got points for certain things. The only thing I remember was a Thanksgiving Turkey being used and Jake "The Milkman" Milligan being a part of this travesty.

By the way, I am not a fan of the Pure Title and its rules. It is just silly to get excited over rope breaks, and most of those matches still just end with the same type of finish you would see in the normal matches. But I won't deny that it's nice to see Nigel McGuiness with a title of any kind because his heel work, both on the mat and on the microphone are top notch in my book.



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The Vile1
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Since: 4.9.02
From: California

Since last post: 1980 days
Last activity: 1712 days
#14 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.28
    Originally posted by Karlos the Jackal
Where did you hear this?

--K


It's been reported on-line like PWI and the Torch. It seems supported by the fact that Aries in his latest online commentary stated that he's not heard from TNA about bringing him back or working any dates.

For ROH 4/29, so can anyone clarify this Nigel/Danielson situation? Supposedly Nigel won the match tonight via count out. But the match was under pure title rules. So doesn't that mean the title can change hands, or would it only be Nigel's pure title if Danielson won via count out? Just a little confused.
Freeway
Scrapple








Since: 3.1.02
From: Calgary

Since last post: 273 days
Last activity: 13 days
#15 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.07
    Originally posted by The Vile1
      Originally posted by Karlos the Jackal
    Where did you hear this?

    --K


It's been reported on-line like PWI and the Torch. It seems supported by the fact that Aries in his latest online commentary stated that he's not heard from TNA about bringing him back or working any dates.

For ROH 4/29, so can anyone clarify this Nigel/Danielson situation? Supposedly Nigel won the match tonight via count out. But the match was under pure title rules. So doesn't that mean the title can change hands, or would it only be Nigel's pure title if Danielson won via count out? Just a little confused.


Pure Title CAN change hands via countout, but the ROH Title cannot. Both guys keep their titles.




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Dawg
Chourico








Since: 2.6.03
From: Detroit area

Since last post: 123 days
Last activity: 4 days
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#16 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.10
Yeah, as it turns out the match was under pure title rules but it was only realized by everyone, including the ring announcer that it was ONLY the pure title that was contested under pure rules. It makes sense, but I think ROH swerved us into thinking that the world title could be won in that manner for that night only. At the end, Nigel was in the crowd laid out and Sinclair the ref was doing the 20 count. Dragon did a suicide sommersault from the top rope into the crowd (!) and Nigel hit him with a chair as he came down! Nigel then got into the ring by the count of 18 and Dragon didn't make it back up.

So, everyone thought that Nigel was new champ and they most were happy with the finish. The announcer said "New World champ, Nigel--" then Sinclair interrupted to inform that only the pure title would change due to countout and that both men retained. Bullshit ending if you ask me, but the match was pretty amazing.

Another great showing from ROH up and down the card, giving me even less of a reason to ever watch WWE again...
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