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The W - Pro Wrestling - report says Heyman writing again?!?!?!?
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knightvibe
Salami








Since: 12.7.03
From: st louis, missouri

Since last post: 3519 days
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#1 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.88
report from wrestlingnewsworld.com----


Itís been revealed that the current Smackdown! General Manager, Paul Heyman, is once again involved with the backstage creative process in WWE concerning the Smackdown! Brand.

Itís been said that most of the recent skits have been down to Heyman, as heís been creating and applying many storylines recently on the brand.

Not only is he creating storylines for others, heís also scripting his own segments. However, heís not yet back as an official member of the creative team, heís still classed as talent, not management.


This could make for a great road to Wrestlemania for Smackdown!





and thats all i have to say about that!
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Nag
Landjager








Since: 10.1.03
From: Enter your city here

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#2 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.53
You know, I was wondering if he has a hand in some of the Raw bookings as well. I just get a heymanesque feeling to the Orton/Foley story and the Benoit build.
geemoney
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Since: 26.1.03
From: Naples, FL

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#3 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.19
I've read that Heyman is only booking his own segments, and he likes not having to put up with the "political" stuff that comes with being a head writer.



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InVerse
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Since: 26.8.02

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#4 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.87
    Originally posted by knightvibe
    Itís been revealed that the current Smackdown! General Manager, Paul Heyman, is once again involved with the backstage creative process in WWE concerning the Smackdown! Brand.


So... Did Eddie Guerrero go to steal a black curtain and accidentally discover Paul Heyman furiously writing Smackdown storylines behind it?
ParagonOfVirtue
Salami








Since: 20.8.03
From: New Jersey, USA

Since last post: 3271 days
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#5 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.50
Regardless of whether or not he actually is, the WWE should just spread rumors around the internet that Heyman is writing simply so the smarks would have a more favorable impression of the program. That's often what ends up happening with smarks--there's a tendency to let our opinion of the man booking a certain angle to subconsciously dictate our enjoyment of it. Of course, it has to be well-booked to begin with, but if in the back of our minds, we know that a net favorite is writing an angle it enhances the overall quality of the segments.

If WWE randomly circulated a rumor among journalists that Vince handed ALL of the company's booking duties to Paul Heyman, Mick Foley, and Ultimo Dragon, they could easily lessen much of the hatred that the small internet population has against many of their ideas. It's a winning proposal, I say.
fuelinjected
Banger








Since: 12.10.02
From: Canada

Since last post: 3209 days
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#6 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.15
    Originally posted by ParagonOfVirtue
    Regardless of whether or not he actually is, the WWE should just spread rumors around the internet that Heyman is writing simply so the smarks would have a more favorable impression of the program. That's often what ends up happening with smarks--there's a tendency to let our opinion of the man booking a certain angle to subconsciously dictate our enjoyment of it. Of course, it has to be well-booked to begin with, but if in the back of our minds, we know that a net favorite is writing an angle it enhances the overall quality of the segments.

    If WWE randomly circulated a rumor among journalists that Vince handed ALL of the company's booking duties to Paul Heyman, Mick Foley, and Ultimo Dragon, they could easily lessen much of the hatred that the small internet population has against many of their ideas. It's a winning proposal, I say.


Except that Meltzer has enough variety of sources to know that it wasn't true...
ParagonOfVirtue
Salami








Since: 20.8.03
From: New Jersey, USA

Since last post: 3271 days
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#7 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.50
The solution to that is to have secret closed-door booking meetings where the talent can not see or speak to Heyman, Foley, and Ultimo Dragon at all. The three of them simply plan out the events and then various WWE staffers communicate the plans to the talent, who will then go back to Meltzer about this new covert booking team. That's modern kayfabe for you. Then if the net sees a bunch of restholds on Raw, we won't be complaining about how this is so Triple H can keep up with the rest of the roster but rather how innovative of a style the new team has come up with. It'll all work out in the end..trust me.
T.i.O a B.m.F
Mettwurst








Since: 25.10.03
From: T.i.O in U.s.A

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#8 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.00
Heyman is quite possibly the most overrated man in wrestling. How many "stars" has Heyman made in this business. Sure his ECW guy might of been over with a small smark group but once they went to the big 2 almost all of them failed. Look at Dreamer, Credible, Storm, Sandman, Awesome and many more. His booking style and characters dont bring in casual viewers. I remeber when he was booking Smackdown and every week we had the same matches and Undertaker would open a big gift every week. Thoose were some of the worst Smackdowns I can remeber. Bottom line is Heyman really annoys me, and it annoys me how he is praised as a god.



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JustinShapiro
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Since: 12.12.01
From: Pittsburgh, PA

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#9 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.36
"Sure his ECW guy might of been over with a small smark group but once they went to the big 2 almost all of them failed."

Doesn't that speak to Heyman's talent in utilizing guys or making them seem better than they actually are (Public Enemy)?

"Undertaker would open a big gift every week"

That was the month after Heyman was demoted.
T.i.O a B.m.F
Mettwurst








Since: 25.10.03
From: T.i.O in U.s.A

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#10 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.00
Yeah but the fact is Heyman couldnt cut it when ECW went national. He has some good ideas but he shouldnt have sole booking abilities. He needs to work with someone else that knows how to make stars that will appeal to everyone, not only smarks. Heyman knows how to book internet friendly, McMahon knows how to make stars to a wider audience.

Right now I tihnk RAW has some of the best writing and booking Ive seen in a long time. The show runs along very smoothly with nice transitions and all the wrestlers are constantly interacting with each other. I want to know whos booking RAW...



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GreekPhysiqueJohnnyO
Haggis








Since: 19.11.03
From: Brooklyn, NY

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#11 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.88
#1 I thought it was pretty obvious who was booking the show, or at least Heyman's speaches. HEYMAN>

#2 You CANNOT pin the shit WWE does with guys like Storm, Awesome, etc etc on Heyman, instead you praise the man for hiding their weaknesses and making them HUGE when they were a part of his company. He could make fucking Matt Morgan look like... well... Bryan Adams, but YOU GET MY POINT!

#3 Heyman made some bad choices, but his company wasn't run by his dad for 50 years before he came in to take over and simply... get fucking lucky. McMahon is a very lucky guy he got Hogan when he did, and he just hit his stide at the right time as wrestling took off at that point. Heyman revitalized wrestling, created an entire new style of wrestling which was stolen and is still used today by the rest of the... well, by WWE. Heyman took alot of that from Mexico and Japan I assume.

Heyman is not overated, nor is he underated. He's Paul fucking Heyman. He's done this business good.

And thank God he finally wears nice suits to the televised prorams. Before he looked like a bum.



Kings of Chaos
ParagonOfVirtue
Salami








Since: 20.8.03
From: New Jersey, USA

Since last post: 3271 days
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#12 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.50
    Originally posted by T.i.O a B.m.F
    How many "stars" has Heyman made in this business. Sure his ECW guy might of been over with a small smark group but once they went to the big 2 almost all of them failed. Look at Dreamer, Credible, Storm, Sandman, Awesome and many more. His booking style and characters dont bring in casual viewers.


Not even close.

Heyman was excellent in creating stars because a lot of the stars he created were shit to begin with. It's not so much that Heyman was responsible for the failures of a Sandman or Dreamer in the big-time, but rather it's that Heyman conditioned his fans to appreciate hard work from almost any guy in the ring, regardless of their skill level. If they went out there and the fans could tell the wrestler was trying to entertain them, they eventually got over. In that respect, he was goddamn brilliant. In terms of his booking style not being appropriate for a mainstream audience, you forget that those smarks you speak of WERE his main audience. Why would he book watered down mainstream angles when he wasn't even trying to target the mainstream for almost all of ECW's existence?

And like I said, ECW and WWF/WCW were structured much differently. ECW was able to condition the fans to appreciate a certain level of entertainment. WCW/WWF had a different perception of what professional wrestling is because they were catering to a different and wider audience. When Justin Credible went out there and was in the second match of the night in watered down, punch-kick wrestling, of course he didn't get over. The fans of WWF/WCW had different levels of how a wrestler got over than the anything-goes style of ECW. You can't take a small-budget bounce-checking group operating inside of a bingo hall and apply the same standards to them as you do a huge multimillionaire company.

I'm not a blind Heyman fan but to deny how innovative he was with what he had is totally unfair.
StaggerLee
Scrapple








Since: 3.10.02
From: Right side of the tracks

Since last post: 4 days
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#13 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.21
Heyman gets a lot of bashing for the type of wrestling that was put out by his company, and granted, the hardcore shit all the time did wear thin. But, look back on the angles that played out in ECWs heyday, and see, even then it was the best booking going. Raen and Dreamer was classic, with Raven getting ALL the heat, and the Fans just LOVING Dreamer, yet dreamer had to wait until Raven was going out the door to even get a win over him. (and, it didnt even make him lose his 'heat' to lose for what, 4 years running)

He made Public Enemy a realistic threat. PUBLIC ENEMY. Two guys who couldnt work to save themselves and he made them stars. If you ever, EVER have any doubt that Heyman can make a star, get a hold of a tape of Public Enemy when they were about 4 months into thier run. OVER cant even discribe how much they were, well, over.

Shane Douglas, who the wrestling world hates, was a star, and like him or not, had fantasticly entertaining matches.

RVD, well, spotfests arent mything, but you cant argue with the fact that Van Dam would be NOWHERE if it wasnt for Heyman's booking him and Sabu as a team that hated each other. Plus, he held the TV title for what, 18 months?

Sandman and Raven, another classic angel, Raven takes Sandmans kid.

The entire Mic Foley run.

Bringing the US Lucha Libre on a large scale, and making it a viable style for WCW to rip off.

Paul Heymans only problem when TNA went national is that all the stars that he DID make were taken at that point, and all he was left with was Rhyno, Credible and a few others.
dr beavis
Weisswurst








Since: 29.1.04

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#14 Posted on
    Originally posted by ParagonOfVirtue
    Heyman conditioned his fans to appreciate hard work from almost any guy in the ring, regardless of their skill level. If they went out there and the fans could tell the wrestler was trying to entertain them, they eventually got over. In that respect, he was goddamn brilliant.

heyman's brilliance was recognizing that the 400 mutants who packed his arena wanted to watch human beings suffer. so he gave it to them. the rottens in barbed wire bat matches, tommy dreamer going through stacks of tables, women being beaten up regularly. fans didn't appriciate the "hard work", they liked watching people get hurt.

mick foley said it best, the ecw fans were the puppet masters. they pulled the strings and the moronic wrestlers did whatever it took to get over with them. heyman didn't train the fans to appriciate anything, he did his best to constantly satisfy their blood lust.

that's not to say that he wasn't a good booker, because ecw had plenty of notable storylines. heyman produced lots of good characters. they had an edgy, entertaining product years before wwf.

but ultimately those things mattered more to outsiders looking in at ecw than it did to the diehard fans who went to the arena. when did the fans chant "ecw", when someone cut a great promo? when a good angle took place? no, when someone did something dangerous and crazy. the bottom line for the diehards was the "extreme" nature of the show. as soon as ecw got on tnn and couldn't rely on bloodbaths and barbed wire, the company started slipping into irrelevance until it was gone.
Spaceman Spiff
Knackwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: Philly Suburbs

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#15 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.05
    Originally posted by Nag
    You know, I was wondering if he has a hand in some of the Raw bookings as well. I just get a heymanesque feeling to the Orton/Foley story and the Benoit build.

I think it's been reported that Foley came up with and was writing the Foley/Orton feud.

As for Heyman, I don't know about this story, but it was reported that Heyman was contributing to the creative end, but that it was mostly confined to house shows, not to the televised SD's.



BigVitoMark
Lap cheong








Since: 10.8.02
From: Queen's University, Canada

Since last post: 3324 days
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#16 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.10
I agree with whoever already raised this point...Heyman's strength was not that he was about to create the next Hulk Hogan or Steve Austin, but that he got the most he could out of what he had available to him.

You can't really blame him for the fact that ECW tanked by the time it went national...if Mass Transit hadn't set that whole process back three years and Heyman went national with Douglas, Raven, the Dudleyz, Taz, Sabu, etc instead of having to go with Mike Awesome and Justin Credible on top who knows what would have happened. The fact was any time a wrestler with talent got legitimately over he jumped ship for a bigger payday with a bigger company. You can only revamp the upper tier of your talent roster so many times before you run out of feasible main event workers.

The other thing that Heyman deserves credit for is the introduction of the cruiserweight/lucha libre style of wrestling to the North American masses. Aside from the Jushin Liger vs. Brian Pillman matches in WCW, that style of wrestling wasn't very highly exposed. It was in ECW that guys like Benoit, Guerrero, Malenko, Mysterio, Psychosis, Juvy, and the like got their first big break. To say that all Heyman did was find a bunch of hacks to hit each other with things simply isn't fair. Without him, there's a good chance cruiserweight wrestling never really breaks into the mainstream on this continent.

If Heyman is back writing Smackdown, it can only be a good thing. Despite his flaws one thing I always enjoyed about his writing last year was the fact that everyone on the show had a purpose. This is the one thing I give Vince Russo credit for, and I'll do the same for Heyman. If two guys are in the ring, there's almost always a reason for it. Compare that to Raw where most of the time the matches seem like they were made because two guys needed a match rather than for any underlying purpose. I don't enjoy everything Heyman comes up with, but I can see his mind working as it comes across.

And if nothing else, let's remember who it was that pushed the Smackdown Six so hard last year compared to who it was that insisted Matt Hardy's push should go to A-Train...Heyman is a positive influence, like him or not.



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fuelinjected
Banger








Since: 12.10.02
From: Canada

Since last post: 3209 days
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#17 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.15
Without Paul Heyman's ECW, there is no "WWF Attitude Era", plain and simple. Vince took Heyman's concepts and with better talent, better production values, better TV, and better business sense, created a monster. Once WWF Attitude hit, that was pretty much it for ECW. It had served its purpose.

The reason Heyman's ECW product was full of hardcore garbage wrestling was because didn't have the talent to work with so he worked with what he had. He didn't put Jim Fullington in a wig and have him do WHACKY VIGNETTES~!, he made him The Sandman.

That's what allowed Heyman to do more with the Big Show in a couple of months then WWE had done with him in YEARS.

Perhaps Vince has finally found Heyman's proper place in the creative process because he's proven more then almost anyone in that company that he has A LOT to offer in that department.
StaggerLee
Scrapple








Since: 3.10.02
From: Right side of the tracks

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#18 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.21
    Originally posted by dr beavis
    heyman's brilliance was recognizing that the 400 mutants who packed his arena wanted to watch human beings suffer. fans didn't appriciate the "hard work", when did the fans chant "ecw", when someone cut a great promo? when a good angle took place? no, when someone did something dangerous and crazy. the bottom line for the diehards was the "extreme" nature of the show. as soon as ecw got on tnn and couldn't rely on bloodbaths and barbed wire, the company started slipping into irrelevance until it was gone.



Fans didnt appreciate the hard work? Did you see the Jerry Lynn v RVD matchcups? Fans clapping for MAT/CHAIN WRESTLING.
See the Rey matches? Fans going batshit for the LUCHA wrestling.
And, when ECW came to St Louis, there were about 9,000 fans there, not just 400 mutants.

Some of the best TECHNICAL wrestlers got over with the fans, and were rewarded with paychecks that would not bounce from WWF and WCW.

Back when John Kronus and Perry Saturn were tagging, they were being billed as the best tag team in the world, and if you think they wouldnt make the current WGTT look like crap, you are sadly mistaken. The Eliminators relied on mat wrestling, and high flying assaults, not just weapons.

If Heyman can make John Kronus look like a wrestling superstar, he is indeed genius!
T.i.O a B.m.F
Mettwurst








Since: 25.10.03
From: T.i.O in U.s.A

Since last post: 3788 days
Last activity: 3787 days
#19 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.00
I remeber towards the end ECW had some of the worst booking imaginable. I remeber one of their last PPV's where all it was about was sex and the valets giving out blowjobs in the back.

It was not booking that drove ECW but great match ups. The wrestlers werent limited to a certain style. WWE has all the same talent and could put on just as good matches but doesnt want to have spot matches and increase injuries.

If anything ECW hurt wrestling a lot. ECW brought down fans attetion to the point where they are always expecting big bumps and high flying spots.



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Freeway
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Since: 3.1.02
From: Calgary

Since last post: 251 days
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#20 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.96
    Originally posted by T.i.O a B.m.F
    I remeber towards the end ECW had some of the worst booking imaginable. I remeber one of their last PPV's where all it was about was sex and the valets giving out blowjobs in the back.

    It was not booking that drove ECW but great match ups. The wrestlers werent limited to a certain style. WWE has all the same talent and could put on just as good matches but doesnt want to have spot matches and increase injuries.

    If anything ECW hurt wrestling a lot. ECW brought down fans attetion to the point where they are always expecting big bumps and high flying spots.


No Vince Russo & Crash TV brought down the attention span of casual fans. I remember tuning into ECW TV to see good 10 minute main events on Friday nights. Now? RAW matches are maybe 5 minutes long, tops, except for the main event. It's gotten so predictable, and it's Russo's fault.

As for Heyman...he was awesome on a small scale with good workers. It just so happened that most of the good workers were already snatched up by WCW & WWF by the time the TNN deal went through, so that NOBODY WAS LEFT except those damned Dudleys. Still, without ECW, there would be no Attitude, no Stone Cold Steve Austin, no Three Faces of Foley, and no mixture of luchalibre and puroreso on American TV.



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