This show really DID have a Nitro feel to it, what with the "Biggest main event in Raw history" ending in a non-finish and all. And THIS week they immediately leap to a backstage segment after Kane's pyro so we don't hear the crowd boo when they figure out they're not getting Kane. Also, Test is trying really hard to be Kevin Nash, "You know something..." But one thing that confuses me is that I thought Undertaker was done talking when his music hit, but instead Test comes out on his own motorcycle. I'd really rather have a table between me and the announcers, yes. My favorite part about the Rock's promos about Triple H is when Rock makes the angry Triple H face. That cracks me up. I hope that Fozzy didn't expect to not get their performance pissed on by the crowd, considering that Mongoose McQueen did a pretty good job of pissing them off and all. Wakka Wakka Wakka! Not a super fantastic amazingly awesome show, but I enjoyed it.
The Rock's promos were Ok. UT's promos weren't that bad. It is just that people are so jaded about patriotism lately.
But the main problem with the show IMHO: Bischoff saying that the people are here for T&A and b+p matches, not to see women wrestle. I began thinking how they can make anything positive out of this. Wait a minute. The mud can cushion people's falls. What's the problem with women's wrestling in the WWE, besides te storylines? Limited moveset due to fear of injury. If that factor is reduced greatly, could it be possible that they can do All-Japan in the mud? Nah, mud is too slippery. Ain't going to work, no way.
(edited by deadbeater on 20.8.02 0813) "Business has just picked up" says JR. Then right on cue, Molly enters the arena! Never was JR any better in introducing someone. --Raw 7/15
Yeeeesh. I usually seem to have a much better tolerance for promos & other non-wrestling activities than most of the posters here. And through a lot of the times when many of the posts were "that show sucked", I was doing OK -- not great, but OK. But most of this show was just boring-Boring-BORING. We hardly need to waste CRZ's marvelous recapping abilities on this show -- a court reporter would do just fine for most of it.
I actually went back & re-scanned my tape. In the first hour, there were (exactly) 6 minutes of wrestling. That was the hardcore match, which was an OK gimmick, not exactly a great match, but at least it was a wrestling match. I cannot use the term "wrestling" to refer to the mud spectacle. (I was astonished that Trish didn't get hurt on the bump into the pool -- that for me was more of a "Don't DO that!" than a "Wow, cool!") Neither the UnAmericans' runin on the Undertaker's (long!) promo nor Flair's "objection" to Jericho's promo made me feel like I'd seen a wrestling match.
In the second hour we got a decent match with the UnAmericans vs GoldBookTaker -- that was another 6 minutes of actual wrestling. However, I was finding it pretty annoying that JR & Jerry were so busy talking about SummerSlam that they largely ignored the match. Now maybe by this time I was just getting a little crabby, but RVD vs BigShow looked to me like "go slow & don't get hurt", for the whole 2 minutes before Bisch stopped it. Then we get more talking, & more talking, with very little that could be construed as plot advancement. (Maybe Bischoff "not sanctioning" the match will turn into something -- maybe its just there as a tease of how brutal the fight will be.) I generally love Rock's promos, but this was just long & dumb.
I had 2 big problems with the Fozzie segment. If we'd been getting match after match of good wrestling, a brief musical interlude wouldbe fine with me. But no. And ... he's a heel. Soooo ... the band finishes the song, and ... what's the crowd's reaction supposed to be? Even if it were a good crowd (which it sure seemed *not* to be), is the crowd supposed to go "Yea Fozzie; boo (heel) Y2J" ? I found it to be a pretty ill-concieved concept.
Rock & HHH finally get under way just about the second hour boundary. By this point they'd over-hyped this match so badly, that anything short of great was going to be disappointing. Now maybe by this time I'd gotten REAL cranky, but I thought this started off really slow too. (HHH did a real pretty cartwheel off the ring early on -- I did like that.) I eventually started to get into it, & the meyhem of the run-ins was pretty good. (I do feel for the cameraman who got whacked on the way up the ramp.)
It was good that we saw Shawn work a little -- I'm a bit more confident that The Fight might be interesting after all. And hopefully, everybody else will be well rested for Sunday. There will actually be some wrestling in the show on Sunday, won't there? :-)
It was pitiful and boy, would I have been spitting bile and venom if I had paid for it.
You're all so WONDERFUL. Why did they ever have to remove you from the continuity? You'd have made for MARVELOUS stories. You WILL make marvelous stories. And the FIRST story of the new world will be a story of REVENGE! -- The Psycho Pirate, Animal Man 23, May 1990.
Originally posted by FantomasI think the insane amount of interviews killed the crowd.
THANK YOU THANK YOU, DAMMIT WE WERE A GOOD CROWD, WE WERE A GOOD CROWD!!! LOL, this is my new mantra.
Sorry, but I had to chime in again.I Wish I could convey to all of you how much the crowd was MURDERED by the all the interviews and the Fozzy segment. Especially the Fozzy segment. Just terrible. HHH has never buried Jericho as bad as Jericho did himself last night.
And speaking of HHH, He is really stinking the place up. His interviews are just rambling, and he looks bad just walking to the ring. If it wasnt for his music/ entrance he may be getting X-Pac heat. Seriously.
Ill say it again, there was WAY too much going on. Especially since Norfolk is a small crowd. Scope only seats about 8000, so its hard for the crowd to focus and pop for anything, if theyve got too much happening. Like in the main event, the crowd didnt know what to look at. They sent the Rock into the crowd after Brock diverting all our attention at the same time HBK takes his top rope bump.
Anyway, I guess Im rambling, but all the negative reviews of the show bug me. I guess I feel cheated because its my second live show and I really wanted it to be a good one.
and DAMMIT WE WERE A GOOD CROWD....
When a chicken in this neighborhood gets angry, it will chase you down...
Last week everyone was raving about RAW, this week...
It was a total snoozefest!!!
I mean, I know you have to hype the PPV that's coming up, but really, every segment!!!
There needs to be some sort of training for people who are going to have to speak...
The interview were just so terrible.
Undertaker talking about being a proud American badass with no emotion what-so-ever. Then Test comes down and says..., what did he say anyhow?? I think I dozed off!!! I was hoping he would come down and claim he was the Un-american badass!!
HHH is just so damn boring on the mike. I had high hopes when Jericho interupted, but that was just as bad.
The Rock is the only one that seems to speak with any sort of emotion on the mike.
The whole Fozzy thing has got to go. Geesh Jericho can't sing worth a lick.
As for the wrestling, well, it was OK. Hopefully we get a good payoff at Summerslam to some of these feuds. Just don't let them talk!!!
---------- And the real wonder of the world is that we don't jump too ----------
rock/hhh actually put me TO SLEEP. I woke up 1/2 way into oblvious and had to rewind. Bischoff, I hope Molly hunts down and strangles the jackass who wrote that line about no one caring about women's wrestling. I hope Trish defects to SD and whenever Lita and Jazz get better they do too. RVD is always gold, but even he didn't have much to work with. Does the Island boyz beatdown mean he's bannished to Heat. Heat is rapidly becoming unwatchable, and raw is following close behind. RVD needs to ask the writing team what THEY'VE been smoking, cause it ain't the good.
"My parents said I could be anything, so I became an ASSHOLE!"
Originally posted by FantomasNet Hack, BUT: Did noone else notice how Michaels/HHH was cleverly manuevered into being perceived as the main attraction? Final minutes of Raw.. Michaels comes out.. Here comes Brock (The monster heel in the main event of summerslam, right?) Crippled-ass shawn michaels goes 'oh * yawn * get off the apron you big goof' and superkicks him out of the segment. Rock goes for HHH - HHH says 'oh no you don't, who do you think you are, the star?' gives him some of that devastating knee-related offense, and Rock rolls out of the ring and the segment. And then IT'S ON, here's the match we REALLY WANT TO SEE! Not the MAIN EVENT FOR THE TITLE, oh no sir! We want to see HHH fight his buddy with the bum back! We end the show not with - "Brock vs Rock OHMYGOD WHO WILL WIN?!?!" But with "HHH! MICHAELS! FOR, UH, PRIDE AND STUFF! IT'LL BE METHODICAL, THAT'S FOR DAMN SURE!SEE YOU AT SUMMERSLAM!"
This was because they can still hype the Brock-Rock match on Smackdown since Brock in on the show, this was the last big chance to hype the HBK-HHH match.
* Was it me, or was Jericho's mic turned down too low? He sounded to me like he was drowned out by the guitars, though that might've been a blessing in disguise.
* The first rule of Wrestling-Related Merchandise: HEELS GENERALLY DON'T SELL MERCHANDISE WELL. Given that Jericho's been in swarmy-heel mode for months now, this was very bad timing for a performance. Hey, let's condition the crowd to boo the guy who's trying to sell albums!
* When was the last time that a musical performance during a wrestling show _worked_? I can't really think of one.
* If you're going to interrupt your show for a musical interlude, make sure it's an artist or a band that you already know much of your audience LIKES. Kid Rock was painful to watch, but at least he was recognizable to most. KISS in WCW... we'll, let's not go there. To most, Fozzy was "Hey, it's Jericho with a no-name band."
* The pacing of the show was pretty bad overall, which didn't help Fozzy's segment one bit.
* Quoth the Heenan, "Get the gong."
As for the rest of the night, I remarked on the women elsewhere.
Bischoff's lines were off regarding The Tool. Don't say "You have three minutes" and have the beatdown start five seconds later -- at least say something like "You crossed the line... three minutes ago." The MATCH didn't go three minutes.
Promo packages, promo packages, yawn. Did they actually suggest that the Rock does a certain set of side-to-side exercises FOR THE SAKE OF THE PEOPLE'S ELBOW?
On paper, this is a very good PPV this weekend. So why am I not at all excited about it?
"No society has managed to invest more time and energy in the perpetuation of the fiction that it is _moral, sane and wholesome_ than our current crop of _Modern Americans_." -- Frank Zappa
Why did they bother setting up a wrestling ring for last nights show?
These commercials are superfine because they pay for the production costs of putting CHRIS MOTHERFUCKING BENOIT on my GODDAMN TV SCREEN! I will GO GREYHOUND! I am thinking OUTSIDE THE BUN! – Dean Rasmussen 8/1/2002 Smackdown Workrate Report
See, this is all the negativity that people talk about. Why can't you people just enjoy the show???........Oh yeah, I just remembered, because it sucked! I'm pretty easily entertained, and have enjoyed the last few offerings really well, but if I could have given the whole show three minutes, I would have.
The Rock promos have really been getting worse and worse. He needs somebody doing quality control for him, maybe make him realize that not all the stuff he comes up is either cute and/or funny. I'm mean, the crap that he was coming up with that female co-worker would get all the rest of us slapped if we tried it. Maybe it works for the Rock, because he is the Rock, but flaunting stupid lines that he can get away with the ladies is not exactly entertaining to me. Now the last few weeks, I've thought that once he turned his attention to his opponents, his promos were still OK. This week, even his Triple H stuff seemed to be a waste of time.
And waste of time is a good way to put this week's show. Because they sure did. I'm not one of these "Storm could have had two more minutes if not for this promo" guys, but damn, I would at least like to see a little more wrestling on the program.
I'm not overly offended by the mud wrestling. But it hurt, too, because stuff like this hardly elevates the show. It can be a good time-wasting distraction, but this show didn't need any more time-wasting distractions. There was nothing worthwhile to begin with. And I agree with another poster, Trish shouldn't bother with the crazy bumps during a match like this. It's pointless (and she pretty much had to no-sell it anyway, given the nature of the match), so why take the risk.
Fozzy sucks! Maybe the actual band is OK, but Jericho is absolutely horrible as a lead singer. I don't think it would have matter if he wasn't a heel, that performance would have still been booed. And it should be, Chris has no talent as a singer.
I guess what little wrestling there was (was it only 4 matches? I don't count the mud wrestling) was OK. Still, nothing great. As the show approached the end, I knew only a great main event could save the show, but that didn't even START until the 10pm hour had already hit, so it just simply wasn't going to get enough time (which is inexcusable, given the lack of material for the rest of the show).
They are going to need a strong Smackdown!, because I doubt they sold many PPV's last night.
No, Iceman, The Big Show was given the Three Minute Warning after his match with RVD. It kind of surprised me a bit too ... I was certain that we were going to see one last jump, with The Big Show going to Smackdown after completely devestating RVD. I thought they were completely setting it up with the pre-match interview and Show's comments after RVD walked away. I expected him to smash RVD with the steps and walk out, and have Bischoff catch up to him in the parking lot berating him, asking him why the hell he's screwing with their chance to bring the IC belt back to Raw, and then out of nowhere Stephanie would say "because, Eric ... he's no longer a Raw talent! He wants the IC belt to stay where he'll be -- on SMACKDOWN!"
Ah well, at least Jamal and Rosie picked on someone their own size this time. lol.
Bischoff talking to Trish/Stacy- He pretty much shot the women division right between the eyes.
Yeah, I know Bisch is supposed to be a heel and all, but totally burying the division after they`ve spent the whole year building its credibility was NOT a good thing. At least Trish got in an "Excuse me?" at him. Where was Molly anyway?
I`m surprised no one (not even our Recapping Host) pointed out that the Rock called himself "Dwayne Johnson" to that girl backstage. Has he ever done that before, in character? I remember Vince calling him "Dwayne" once years ago on a RAW, but that was it.
"Hollywood Hulk Hogan lost his hair match to Mother Nature, dude!"
As a professional sound guy, I promise you, Jericho's mic was turned down on purpose. Anytime you're mixing a band with a terrible singer, you try to hide them as much as possible.
They were terrible, but that's not what surprised me. WWE has kind of always had a knack for using music (PPV themes, promo trailers, etc.) that was at least relevant to the times. These guys sounded like something out of 1979. That's not a bad thing, in general. I mean, I like Sabbath and Zeppelin as much as the next guy. But the music was so irrelevant to the "current trend" image the company usually tries to put out there. It was just weird.
"I'm in collision with every stone I ever threw." - David Gray
So you all are saying that... I lucked out last night by missing big portions of the show to cook a paella (rice dish)? What I saw didn't impress me, but I thought what I missed would redeem that. But then, my VCR failed me and I wound up not recording anything. So, going by everyone here, I didn't miss much.
I did see the Bischoff killing the Women's Division and the subsequent mud match. To repeat what I wrote an another thread: Most people don't give a damn about the Women's Division because the WWE has objectified women so much, people only feel they're good for rolling around in goo and ooze. Not all people feel this way, but watching those people around the mud pool, you'd know they didn't care about Trish's dive into the pool or that DDT she did on Stacy.
Every time I came out of the kitchen, (No, we don't have a tv in the kitchen), someone was talking. I didn't see but 2 matches, the Mud match and HHH vs. Rock. I did see the Fozzy concert. Jericho sounded like he was doing a bad impersonation of James Hetfield from Metallica. The music kicked ass though. Maybe Jericho strained his voice from that promo and screaming 'Flair' a lot.
Originally posted by Spiraling_Shape[quotemidI`m surprised no one (not even our Recapping Host) pointed out that the Rock called himself "Dwayne Johnson" to that girl backstage. Has he ever done that before, in character? I remember Vince calling him "Dwayne" once years ago on a RAW, but that was it.
I think that was a subtle sign that the Rock is moving away from using his wrestling name. If hes truly serious about being a movie star then he cant use the name "the Rock." Especially since that name is copyrighted by WWE.
When a chicken in this neighborhood gets angry, it will chase you down...
Here in Canada, we're behind -- King of the Ring JUST came out on DVD here this week, and Vengeance isn't due until Nov. 19. I dunno why the delay, but it's always been that way here. We get the DVD's for $20 Canadian though.