Actually, the band seemed half-decent but Jericho can't sing.
I always wanted a Y2J/Flair feud. I never could have imagined it would wind up being so incredibly lame.
It wasn't a "bad" show, but alot of things just seemed a little off. The hardcore match, the six-man, the whole HHH/HBK/Bichoff non-sanctioned match thing and even the Rock's promo. Nothing flat out terrible, but something was missing.
Too many people are still cheering for HHH. At least he was wearing the polo and slacks again this week. Nothing says evil like a pink polo shirt.
And dear lord would somebody please stick a pencil in Lawler's larynx.
My highlights of the show....
-Heyman's outfit -UT's jingoistic promo (and the big "Raven" sign behind him) -Y2J (at least trying) to get a little comeuppance on HHH (only to have Trips steal his stealing of the Rocks "talk to the hand" shtick - that bastard!) -the B&P Mud Match (normally I hate this crap but some reason tonight's entertained me) -HBK's super kick -and the slew of new video packages
Hmmmm, maybe it was a bad show.
And Liz Hurley is one of the great underrated babes of our time.
Please excuse the randomness of my comments, back-to-back fourteen hour work days will do that to ya.
Another Rollback saves the day!
"All right, maybe he can fool the chicken" -Nike Presto #2
Geez, that was a lousy dive Shawn did -- it looked like he wasn't going to clear the top rope, and even with about 50 guys out there to catch him he almost managed to miss them all. I hope he has the sense to leave the high-flying alone on Sunday.
And once again, it is time to dust off the "Shut. Up. Lawler." What the hell did he think he was doing, talking through Fozzy's performance? I thought it was underwhelming, yes, but would it have killed Lawler to show the teeniest bit of consideration?
Anyway, shall we let the wild, poorly-thought-out speculation about what Kane's latest video message means begin? I'm sure everyone is gonna say "the devil's mistress" just HAS to refer to Stephanie, meaning Kane is going to Smackdown. On the other hand, Vince McMahon himself is Satan, and nearly every woman on both shows has been involved with him at some point, so it's a broad field ...
Well, Raw was certainly "there". It was a decent show and good enough for a Scaia special (thumbs in the middle). BUT...this was NOT the blowaway show that WWE was hoping for and I have a feeling ratings will reflect that. Here's hoping they don't panic and push that damn "reset" button.
GOOD: -Hardcore Madness: Give the bookers A MILLION POINTS for FINALLY AND MERCIFULLY killing the 24/7 rule, hopefully once and for all. Why this wasn't done over a year ago still astounds me. I, for sure, had a title change pencilled in, but they actually kept the belt on Tommy Dreamer. That isn't a bad thing, that's a good thing. That cane shot on Bubba was WICKED!
-The Six Man: Good stuff here with the right team going over. The Un-Americans are becoming a force and that's always a good thing, even IF one of those guys is Test.
-Summerslam Hype: WWE has hyped Summerslam as a HUGE event and that's good! The title match has been hyped to no end and the title seems a lot more important now than it did a few months ago during Undertaker's reign of terror. Tonight's show made me want to get the PPV and that's all anybody can really ask for.
BAD: -The Crowd: Was it me, or was the crowd horribly out of it? Everything from the Un-Americans to Rocky himself were seemingly given anemic reactions. I thought I died and went to Long Island.
-Fozzy: Well, that's certainly an interesting way to throw Chris Jericho a bone. But a Commandment in Pro Wrestling Canon is that "Thou shalt not bring in musical guests". Add Fozzy to the long list of bands that made us all want to change the channel. That includes Master P, Megadeth, KISS, Chad Brock, and Kid Rock (but props for getting an F-bomb past the USA censor). Stick to your day job, Chris.
-HBK: Sorry HBK fans, but if tonight didn't scare you, I don't know what will. I REALLY hope the way Shawn clutched his back after that superkick was just for show and not real, because that could be a bad sign. And what used to be a thing of beauty has now become ugly. Shawn used to fly over the ropes with the greatest of ease and tonight he nearly killed himself on a routine tope. Sunday's going to be VERY ugly! And can somebody tell me why the Invincible Next Big Thing, whom you're hyping as the unstoppable challenger, is getting knocked around by a cripple? My inner cynic says "Clique politics", but let's not jump to conclusions.
-The Main Event: Tonight's Rock/HHH match was not good. It would have been decent, but the lack of an ending puts it in "bad" territory. But things could always be worse. I thought Triple H would actually have it changed to a title match at the last second and leave with the belt just to put ALL the spotlight on him and Shawn at the PPV and put the screws to Brock, but I'm glad I was wrong. If that happened, I'd have to call him the New PoocHHHie.
Overall, tonight's show fell somewhat flat. I blame it on an anemic crowd. The fans really DO make a difference.
(edited by It's False on 19.8.02 2026)
(edited by It's False on 19.8.02 2031) "That's right! You suckas better FIND somewhere to run! 'cause it's me - Booker T - not only am I the Scorpion King, but I'm the five-time WCW Champion - and I got a sword, too! Now can U dig THAT - SUCKAAAAAS" -Booker T, Hollywood's next big superstar!
And that's the bottom line, because it's false! It's DAMN false!
It was a bad show. I think something happened backstage, because the Dudley Boyz vs. Regal/Norwinski match was canned. The feel of a big Raw wasn't there after Taker's promo and it left me when Bischoff destroyed the Women's Division tonight. The nail in the coffin came when Big Show squashed RVD.
Jesus, they did a lot of stupid things tonight. For all the groaning people are doing about the Main Event, I thought it was the highlight of a rather bad show. HBK's Superkick on Brock got the crowd going and HHH/Rock was good till the clusterfuck. I think HBK/HHH is going to be great and Brock/Rock will be the weaker of the matches since we already know the outcome.
A Fan- Destroying the Women's division, squashing most of the faces, letting Jericho sing and not giving a winner in the Rock/HHH match. Yeah, it was a very bad Raw.
Ok, I agree that the show didn't suck, and that something *was* just a tad off kilter. RVD vs. Show? Eh. You'd have thought that after last week, BookerT and Goldust would have wanted revenge on the Fat Samoans. I *almost* made a post in my "Next week's Raw and Smackdown" thread calling the 6man tag between the UnAmericans and Taker, Goldie, BookaT, but oh well. I think *everyone* saw that coming. Remember, not every show can be super. It should have been a great show, but the crowd wasn't into it. How the hell can TripleH vs. Rock be boring? I know it's the Rock and TripleH, but damn did it seem like they were having a by the numbers match. If I would have booked it, I would have left the majority of the show alone. I would have nixed the Fozzy performance and let Jericho and Flair go toe to toe on the mic. Then, the Rock/TripleH main could have been longer and less rushed. Also, how cool would it have been if RVD came back to fend off the Island Boyz after they took Show out? Either that, or I would have had Benoit there to do the run in on RVD. Then he and Show could have *killed* RVD. Of course this would be reciprocated on Smackdown when RVD shows up out of nowhere and hits the FSFS on Benoit. Oh well, one can dream. Even this mediocre Raw won't spoil my SummerSlam. Oh, one last thought. They haven't even announced Eddy vs. Edge on Smackdown, yet there it is in the SummerSlam promo. It'd be cool to have Bischoff show up Thursday(well, technically Tuesday) and take credit for announcing a match that Steph hasn't even signed yet.
Memo to production crew: DON'T EVER give me that camera angle of JR again! (YOU know which one).
Undertaker and Test at SummerSlam. We can only hope this match gets THREE MINUTES.
Is it REALLY a wrestling match when the only way you can tell which woman is which is by the size of their breasts? Although I give MAD props to Trish for doing that belly flop from the stage.
So Megaforce Records has been reduced to this. MAN Fozzy sucks. MAN Lawler sucks. MAN Fozzy sucks. MAN Flair rules. MAN Fozzy sucks.
The hardcore match was about what you should expect. I’m glad Dreamer kept the belt. I don’t see the point in ending the 24/7 rule…or throwing in plot points you’re not even going to use (“Stay away from that…3, no 6 minutes…”)
Kane’s entrance has cryptic messages! "Mistress"?!? They hired Tori back?
I can’t officially say I loved the six-man tag because I can’t bring myself to like ANYTHING Test is involved in. But if you accounted for the rest of the show’s average...
I agree with the ending of the main event basically because there was no other reason for HHH and Rock to be wrestling again. Shawn looked pretty scary on that rope leap...Lesnar actually took a pretty decent fall from Shawn’s superkick. But I think it set up the main and the “unsanctioned” matches pretty well. And by the way, when did Bischoff suddenly start caring about ANYBODY’s well-being or being sued?!? This WAS the same guy who had the Island Boys squash a female ring announcer and two elderly women.
Uncle Eric Sez: "The truth is, no one cares about women's wrestling, so let's give the fans what they want. A Bra and Panties mud match." The scary thing is, that may be what the marks really DO want.
The Mud Match itself: Oh, Stacy, it's so sad. Even in a ridiculous gimmick match, you still can't beat Trish. Why do I feel that this was just a fanservice/comedy skit to further humiliate "Howard the Coward"?
The 6 Minute Hardcore Match: Not only did Dreamer get to keep the title, but the old, cracked belt is back, and the 24/7 rule is GONE! YES!
Fozzy: Well, the band was good, and they even had the Swinus guy from their Mockumentary! Thank God that Flair didn't interfere until AFTER the song was over! And why in the blue hell was the King talking throughout the song?
The Main Event: Wow. Brock Lesnar just got superkicked right out of the arena! And that splash HBK did (or at least TRIED to do) on Triple H, He was STRUGGLING to get over the top rope! I hope that Shawn doesn't REALLY end up crippled after Summerslam!
After lots of thinking I finally came to a theory: Any non-wrestler who gets attacked by the Island Boyz will immediately recieve praise from the Wienerville community. There's no other way to explain it.
Six man tag - 2 legal guys in the end, and the heels cheat to get the victory
Hardcore match - goodbye 24/7 and hello kitchen sink. For some reason, I really liked that.
Opening of Rocky vs HHH - this match started off good, but we all knew it would turn bad, didn't we?
Fozzy - I liked it. I really did. Jericho's gotta work on his vocals, but the band itself is truly killer. And Flair at the end was insane, with all the blood.
The Bad :
Yap, yap, yap - Would you believe I read the entire sports page in the talking segments? Sure they garnered some cheap heat, but I'd be pissed off with buying a ticket for that much talking.
Island Boyz Squash - The idea is, they took out a giant at Bischoff's bidding. Whoopdy-freakin-do.
Ending of Rocky vs HHH - sorry, I hate when the show ends like this. Its pointless, and it told us nothing we didn't know before. Brock and Rock want to fight. Shawn and Hunter want to hurt each other. Big news flash.
The Ugly :
B&P Match - I like T&A as much as anyone, but please, don't display it using the competitors in a match, and please, please, don't pretend that Stacy can wrestle.
I give this show a B-/C+. Worth watching, but you may need a book in the middle.
I can't precisely recall everything from tonight's show, as I was sadly a bit distracted. I did like a fair bit of what I saw, but I'll go ahead and do a good/bad thing, too.
Hardcore Revamp: It's about bloody time! This reminded me of that big Hardcore battle royale from Wrestlemania 2000, but in a good way. Lots of fun chaos and a fitting epitaph to the 24/7 rule, a cute joke that outlived its usefullness. And Bradshaw didn't win! Woo hoo!!! Go Dreamer. Oddly, I was never a big fan of his in ECW, probably because I just felt the hardcore thing was oversaturated there sometimes. In WWE, however, his style is something of a change of pace, and yet it's safe enough that I don't worry about him seriously injuring himself.
Flair, BABY!: God, was Flair on tonight or what? From his interruption of Jericho, to his blading from the beatdown, to his absolutely killer blood-soaked freak-out, Flair proved that he can still be the most entertaining damn person on any wrestling show, in any year.
Bischoff- I thought he was in kind of a tweener role tonight, but that's okay. Bischoff has simply proven himself to be something a lot of people in wrestling aren't: a good actor. He comes off completely believable in his interactions with others, genuinely justifies what he does, and is a consistent character.
The Mud Match - No, the workrate was nonexistent, but it was cute for what it was. It was worth it just for the super-bump with extra oomph that Trish took off the stage into the mud. That girl's got guts.
Fozzy - Well, I liked it, but I'm used to being in the minority on musical opinions.
Six-Man Tag - Taker seemed off tonight, even for him, but Booker and Goldust brought the goods, baby! Booker's moves were really crisp, especially the axe kick and that spinning heel. I loved Goldust double-checking to make sure the ref was distracted before hitting the Shattered Dreams. And here's hoping that the U-A going over here means we get Book-Dustin with the titles at SS!
Rock/HHH - Was it anything near as good as their classic matches? No. Was it bad? Definitely not. HHH was showing the old heel psychology again, Rock was selling pretty well. Neither guy's never exactly been known for their huge moveset. I took it for what it was, and managed to like it. Brock did what he needed to do, and Shawn got to show off a bit. Hey, leave the tope alone, huh? I'm amazed he got as much height as he did. At least he's showing he's gonna TRY, rather than just half-ass a match on autopilot.
RVD/Big Show - RVD really, really tried here, but there's only so much you can do. I don't mind Show squashing lower card guys so much, but RVD is soooooooo above the BS it's not even funny. The Three Minute warning was a good idea, but the executed beatdown kinda left me flat.
Rock's Interview - I dunno, the baby thing wasn't funny. Crowd didn't seem that into it either, although they weren't into ANYTHING. Coach's look of amusement seemed forced, too. I generally LOVE the Rock's micwork, but that one left me flat...until the end. When they actually got to Lesnar and he lost his temper, then he showed serious intensity and made it work. It just all came about five to six minutes too late.
HHH interview = *yawn* Although I liked Jericho really telling Hunter like it is.
I guess I did like most of the show, but you're right about there just seeming to be an element missing. It did seem off. Maybe they were trying too hard? I dunno...Despite all the stuff in the good, I also will go thumbs in the middle.
"All I ever asked for in life is an unfair advantage." Microchip, Punisher Annual #2
What was going on with that mud? I've never seen one of those matches where the ladies were so completely covered head to toe. It stuck right to them and never dripped off. And, Trish's hatchet face looked a lot better tonight than ever before. I don't know why, but she was looking good tonight.
I think this RAW missed something no previous RAW ever has. Good wrestling. There wasn't a match on that show I liked. I thought the women's match was just plain bad, the Hardcore match was poop and Rock/Triple H was sloppy. RVD/Show? No comment needed. The six man was okay, I don't know, Christian seemed a little off to me, tonight.
First week in awhile I think Smackdown will look a hell of a lot better than RAW.
Also, little storylines bits like Booker and Goldust looking for Jamal and Rosie weren't there. And for once, I think there was WAAAAAY too much talking. Undertaker promo, with Goldust and Booker T coming in. Rock cut two long ass promos in one show, Triple H/Jericho was long as hell and Fozzy was good musically but lacked in the vocals department (CD's good, all I care about anyways). As for Nowinski/Regal, I'm not going to say I missed them, but there not being there was noted.
The only thing is, I think the show was too much buildup for what is going to obviously be the best pay per view in terms of matchups I've seen in awhile. I figure this'll either be the best wrestled pay per view in a loooong time, of it'll be a really big disappointment.
Also, have Rock and Brock faced each other at house shows? I know they were in the triple threat in England, but have they faced each other any other time? I'm really looking forward to this match, but question the logic in putting these two in the ring together for the first time, literally. I want a match that delivers, not a clash of styles, or a decent or poorly executed first time outing.
Show was still better than the crap they were doing immediately following Wrestlemania. But, still, thumbs down from me on this one. Can't wait until Smackdown!
The REAL question is, "Who Bettah Than Cory Dillon"!?
Oh, and re: Fozzy: I actually liked the performance. And I didn't think Jericho's vocals were that bad. However, I've already made my thoughts on Lawler known earlier, so I'll leave it at that. Maybe we're just spoiled from the relatively good shows earlier.
Fozzy rocked... Sadly, Jericho sounded like "guy with sore throat singin' karaoke" tonight. But, damnit, Fozzy kicked ass. Jerry "AH LIKE TO HEAR MAHSELF TAWLK~" Lawler needs a kick in the pants.
I actually enjoyed tonights show... I don't know why, but on a whole, I did enjoy it. Of course, I also willingly and delightfully consume balogna, and consider it fine dining. The Rosie and Jamal beatdown on Show left me with a "what? that's it? that's all their doing? What the hell is up with that?" feeling. I was happier'n a fat man at an all-you-can-eat for 5.99 buffet when the "no more 24/7 rule" was announced as being denounced.
If you don't want to read offensive language skip my post, because I've never been so pissed off seriously pissed of as I am RIGHT NOW
Hey ERic or whoever wrote that fuckin women wrestling isn't entertaining shit. I suggest you get a big damn pool ready because not a goddamn thing was over tonight, I mean matches, interviews, backstage stuff NOTHING. So get ready to dump H and Taker and Unamericans and Jericho and everyone else because the women/intergender matches was as over as any of the shit that was out there tonight
This show fuckin sucked so BAD. Not a damn segment worth noting, nothing surprised me, nothing left me wanting to see SummerSlam. Actually going in today SummerSlam was as sure thing of a buy as there is. BUT GUESS what WWE you LOST me. I'm not paying a damn cent for this PPV after the horrible BS you did tonight.
-Taker interview- I very unimaginative interview for an very unimaginative angle. And ending with Test saying "I thought america sucks but so do you" OHH the writing... Funny how Taker talks about America being free if we had a decent heel commentator he could joke about U.S being the free just behind canada, britian, scandinavia, western europe you know to be cleaver and funny but Lawler hasn't been clever or funny in years.
-harcore match- Bischoff was right the first time 3 minutes would be enough. This was stupid the only entertaining part was Crash pinning Bradshaw. Other then that too confusing. Oh by the way this garbage was match of the night. Which shows something
-Bischoff talking to Trish/Stacy- He pretty much shot the women division right between the eyes. So you telling me that the months of women division that was more damn entertaining and get more response from the live audience then half the shit the men do means nothing. You telling me the time I put into these characters mean nothing And you want them just to be stripper in mud.. FUCK YOU.
-Trish v. STacy- Why the hell did Trish even bother taking that scary stage dive? WHY? it's not going to help her any. Everyone's going to forget. Lita takes a safer bump they make a big deal. Trish takes a dangerous bump into a small pool and it's just a start of a smut match. Nothing good out of this match, anyone who finds it sexy is fucked. It's degrading. I could live with B&P matches this is just dehumanizing women and treating them like common stripper.
If you want to do something like this do it untalented slugs like Terri or dust off JAckie Gayda and let her do that. Trish worked to damn hard to be treated like shit.
-Triple H interview- the shit just keeps on coming. Hey H if you want us to be interesting in what you have to say, why don't you stop acting like you haven't slept in 5 days, slugging around leaning forward on the rope... Get's worse out comes Jericho, and he cut the worse interview of his life. I was totally confused. He talked about how he had a lot in common with H then how he had NOTHING in common with H. Then talked about Flair then talked about his band and then talked about Flair again. He was all over the page tonight. Oh Flair comes out and puts a garbage can over Y2J head. Oh pulling pants down one week garbage over someones head this week. Oh how intense.
-Unamericans v. Taker/BookDust- Can this crowd be any deader? A few half-hearted USA chants but nothing really, Bad guys win with no reaction... Shows when you have no personalities behind a tired played out gimmick does.
-Big Show v. RVD- RVD called Show a "tool" well first amusing thing all show... RVD did good I liked how he worked body parts on show, but the face IC contender had to be saved by the heel GM, with the fat samoans come in and knock Big Show around to zero heat. Humm I guess knocking midgets and old women didn't make people give a shit about you or is it that they dont' care about Show. Whatever the case No Contest finish . blah
-Fozzy concert- your wasting 10 minutes on a rock concert. Lawler was right (for once) this should be on MTV. MTV HEAT... Camera guy almost got killed by Flair.
-HHH v. Rock- Rock said it himself they fought 999 thousand times so why is this special? Never heard the crowd so dead for a Rock match in recent memory. Rocks worse match since his return. Slow and stupid. And of course A NO FINISH. Because god forbid H loses to the world champ even with HBK interference. We rather have a no finish crap ending. HBK almost kills himself leaping over the ropes... Funny line from Ross saying the atmosphere will be great for SS (humm Unlike here right Ross).
-backstage stuff- who wrote this crap? Rock talking to that girl was as stupid as I've seen the Rock...H teling Bishoff to bend over to see his ass what? the hell... Rock interview with the coach sucked (saying you and H fought 999 thousands times just says what is wrong with the WWE) The comment on what's on Heymans tape was funny "I dont' want to see Heyman naked on the beach watching Brock workout" that was one of 2 things that put a smile on my face... That was IT!!
Line of the night Rock "I dont' want to see Heyman naked on the beach watching Brock workout" and RVD calling Show a "tool"
I swear this was the worst show I've seen in a long time. Bad is one thing but turning me off like this show did for not just the women thing but everything! This show made me hate wrestling.
lets see we had.. crappy hardcore match + 1st degree homicide of the women division + heatless 6 man tag with main event guys from last week + a crappy concert + 2 awful in ring interviews + 2 non finishes + heatless crowd = As bad a show can get. This was worse then the worst Nitros.
Heck I remember awful nitro with Major Gunns v. STacy in mud (atleast no talent was wasted there) and rock concerts and 999 thousand meeting of two same guys in the main event with a NO Finish. This sucked just as bad, and I STOPPED WATCHING NITRO and for the time being I'm stop watching RAW
Like I said this last TV push show pushed me over the edge and I'm not buying SummerSlam because of it. And really guys don't expect me to read any more reviews of next week shows by me. I need a break from Raw.
I don't get it, everyone loves rats, but they don't want to drink the rats milk?
OUCH--- this hurts, I was at the show and I can explain why the crowd was dead. They killed us with the pace of the show. THere was too much goin on in the six man match. The bra and panties match could not be seen by 90 % of the crowd. And the Fozzy part was AWFUL, as soon as the Crew started setting up the bands gear, the "Fozzy SUCKS" chant started. During the performance everybody was sitting on their hands. I have no idea why they threw this at us. There was too much talking, HHH wasnt out there 3 minutes before everyone got bored and starting throwing "WHATS" at him. Even the Rock, got to be a little much with two long segments. Just a weird show, I didnt think we were THAT bad. Booker got lots of love. So did Taker. Rock of course, especially during the "Desire" video they showed before the show.
In closing WE WERE A GOOD CROWD...lol. We just didnt get shit to work with. Way too much talking, too much going on in each match. Overbooked is I think the word that is used. They shouldve left out the fozzy crap, let HBK come out during HHH's promo, Let Booker do a damn spinaroonie, and no more Bra and Panties matches, in mud.
I still had a ball...
Interesting factoid that may interest only me: Stone Cold is STILL on the cover of the WWE programs.
When a chicken in this neighborhood gets angry, it will chase you down...
Net Hack, I don't know what it is, but I always agree with just about everything you say.
This Raw wasn't very good, I think the insane amount of interviews killed the crowd. They were pretty hot for the 'taker thing, but then that HHH thing (I fastforwarded, I hate HHH) seemed to kill it dead.
I liked the idea there with the hardcore match. I'm not sure when this happened, but somewhere along the way I became a Tommy Dreamer fan. I always kind of saw him as a pathetic suck-up in ECW as well as during the inVasion. I remember one specific moment from last year where austin was stunning all the invasion guys in the ring, and dreamer crawls across the ring obviously dying for a stunner by the great steve austin. At the time, i thought it was a sad display, but now I kinda root for the poor slob.
Hey great idea, have the big show squash RVD. Just what we needed, another Big Slow push.
And the bischoff women's division thing.. What can you say? The fans do seem to want the mud wrestling more than the real wrestling. I still think the WWE could re-program the fans if they really committed to it, but they seem pretty content to use the divas as boob support.
I'm a HHH-hater, so you may want to skip the rest of this because my hatred of the guy is probably coloring my judgement. BUT: Did noone else notice how Michaels/HHH was cleverly manuevered into being perceived as the main attraction? Final minutes of Raw.. Michaels comes out.. Here comes Brock (The monster heel in the main event of summerslam, right?) Crippled-ass shawn michaels goes 'oh * yawn * get off the apron you big goof' and superkicks him out of the segment. Rock goes for HHH - HHH says 'oh no you don't, who do you think you are, the star?' gives him some of that devastating knee-related offense, and Rock rolls out of the ring and the segment. And then IT'S ON, here's the match we REALLY WANT TO SEE! Not the MAIN EVENT FOR THE TITLE, oh no sir! We want to see HHH fight his buddy with the bum back! We end the show not with - "Brock vs Rock OHMYGOD WHO WILL WIN?!?!" But with "HHH! MICHAELS! FOR, UH, PRIDE AND STUFF! IT'LL BE METHODICAL, THAT'S FOR DAMN SURE!SEE YOU AT SUMMERSLAM!"