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The W - Pro Wrestling - RAW #947 7/18/11 (Page 4)
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John Orquiola
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Since: 28.2.02
From: Boston

Since last post: 172 days
Last activity: 172 days
#61 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.94
Perhaps I was too harsh on RAW last night. When I said the show was a "reset button", I meant that I have been long bored with the format and my personal lack of interest and involvement with the product on a weekly basis. I felt that coming off a revelatory Money in the Bank, and the high I felt off such a boldly booked show, WWE would sustain that momentum and deliver a product reflecting some of the edginess they displayed during the PPV. Instead, it was business as usual; there was a tournament with a couple of good matches and a great overall performance by Rey Mysterio, but the show wasn't exciting and didn't feel new or edgy. It was the same kind of show we always get, just without Punk cutting promos.

And NO, I DID NOT EXPECT OR WANT TO SEE CM PUNK. He's gone. What I hoped for was a little bit of the chaos he created infused in the rest of the product somehow. Maybe loosen the reins a little on the rest of the roster, let them shine through more. People like Dolph Ziggler, Kofi Kingston, Maryse, Internet darling Zack Ryder, to name a few, are 50 times more interesting on Twitter than they ever are on TV, where they're kept under strict, monotonous control.*

Instead, Vince cut a speech teasing Cena being fired, the roster wrestled, the Divas came out and left in another 60 second special, the World Title match promised was postponed, and the whole show held its breath for... Cena fired? No... something better... The Latest Chapter of As The McMahons Turn.

When I said the show was "shitty", I meant it was shitty. For those reasons. Because I was bored again. 24 hours after Money in the Bank I was bored with WWE again. They really wasted no time to hit the reset button and get me from Excited About What Would Come Next to About To Resume My Weekly Ritual of Falling Asleep During RAW as I tend to do almost every week.

So, no sirs, I did not like RAW last night. It was just like every other RAW. It was not exciting. It was "business as usual", a safe show, mechanical and by the numbers, with everything once more hinging on another Crazy Vince Loses His Power twist. How many times has Vince lost control of WWE now? Shane. Triple H and Stephanie. Flair. Trump. Are there others? That's already too many. It's never believable that Vince isn't running the company in storyline because we know he is, regardless of who's storyline in charge. That's why a Vince appearance is always Important, because we KNOW he's The Boss no matter what.

But whatever, there's always next week. Having slept on things a bit, maybe Triple H as the new storyline leader of WWE may actually lead to some changes in the product. Make it exciting and unpredictable. Surely, CM Punk cutting promos and breaking kayfabe isn't the only way RAW can be a little more cutting edge. (Though I did like Vince calling Punk a "turd".)

Perhaps Triple H will indeed reveal himself as the Anonymous RAW GM all along, thereby it makes sense that the "Board of Directors" would grant him control of the whole company. If he's Anon. GM, then he's had a year long tryout as the Guy in Charge.

Of course, Triple H is also the guy who spearheaded bringing in Sin Cara, who just got suspended for steroids. You'd think that might be a strike against him the Board would have taken into account before his sudden rise to ultimate WWE power. But that's confusing reality with storyline.

What was my point? That I think RAW sucked last night.

THANK YOU VINCE.

*But I recognize that may be too much to ask for one show last night. Maybe in coming weeks with Triple H in charge the product will gain some more, er, attitude. After all, Rome wasn't built in a day, nor was it ruined in a day, nor can it be rebuilt in a day.

(edited by John Orquiola on 19.7.11 0655)

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Tyler Durden
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Since: 22.2.04
From: Frankfurt, Germany

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#62 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.99
    Originally posted by The Internet
    ) bla bla nothing happend on RAW bla bla Punk was barely even mentioned


Don't you get it? Something did happen: they declared the title vacant, had a tournament, cleared the Cena- and the Mr McMahon-situation and - in storyline - try to go on without Punk from now on (while Punk keeps the tweets coming at the same time).

So, things did happen, lots of to be honest. This - all of this - IS the storyline! It's ALL about Punk! It just doesn't say so in big blinking letters.
lotjx
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Since: 5.9.08

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#63 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.71
To be honest, I am actually a little disappointed that we didn't get more of Vince. He was only really there for one week. He really brought his A game with this storyline, so I don't get this need to get Vince off of TV. It would have made more sense for Vince to actually fire Cena and then screw Rey or Miz out of the title and crown Alberto as champ.

I just don't understand why Vince got fired, he didn't fuck the Punk deal, Cena did. Vince was ready to sign and Cena fucked it up. So, I am not really sure why Vince is out and Cena is employed? Unless they are going to say Vince was the GM then it would probably make sense, but to me this is all Cena's fault for calling Punk, a terrorist, losing his cool during the contract signing and agreeing to a match that he knew if he lost he would get fired. To me, it would have been better to play the Cena is fired card for a few weeks, bring him back before SummerSlam after Vince does a ton of wacky stuff for HHH to oust him. It just felt rushed.



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Twitter: @realjoecarfley its a bit more toned down there. A bit.
dMp
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Since: 4.1.02
From: The Hague, Netherlands (Europe)

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#64 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.82
Of course WWE will not go this route.

But the best thing about doing Raw without mentioning Punk is that it makes em look like bigger douches.

If they completely ignore him for a month, then I'll be worried they will 'forget' this ever happened.

If he shows up -somewhere- on the WWE radar next week or the week after, standing "I am the true champion" it'll be so much better.

And having him do that before a new one has been crowned doesn't make much sense.

Besides, who knows what the new boss will do.
HHH might hire Punk back

Btw. The most shocking and interesting they could do is allow CM Punk to hang out at an ROH show or two. Not wrestle, but just be there with that title.
Rumors will run wild once again.




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Dr Unlikely
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Since: 2.1.02

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#65 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.76
They definitely built the vanity movie production business around the wrong member of the extended family, since Vince acted circles around HHH last night. HHH must only be able to do crying on pre-taped segments. And, to echo a sentiment back from the first page, that was indeed a top-notch jacket choice from Vince.

What this show needed was a more chaotic feel. I appreciate what I think was the intention, that they were trying to put on a front of "all is well", but someone quitting the company while champion is supposed to have been the ultimate Doomsday Scenario for WWE, the very nightmare that led to the creation of the Evil Vince character, so they really needed to work in some frayed edges of things going wrong, the veneer crumbling, to really keep everyone engaged and sell that Vince had lost control over the last week and that the Board of Directors had real reason to move in now rather than later.

Biggest dropped ball was completely passing on the chance to let Ziggler have his week declaring himself the #1 Raw Superstar as the only remaining singles champion. Would have done a ton for him and his belt. Del Rio could/should have put in the same kind of claim, that having the contract for a shot at the vacant title should make him the champion by default.

Just build on this supposed sense that this has never happened before, and that there's now a massive power void that has left everyone either paralyzed or scrambling to fill the void. Doing all that and then having HHH come out at the end as the nuclear option to save the company from Vince would have made a stronger story for the show to keep people hooked and maybe let them appreciate the fine work Misterio and Miz did on their end.

John's notion that HHH should reveal himself as the GM, and that it was a test run that Vince gave him that has now blown up in Vince's face, is a fine one. Is there anything that contradicts HHH as the GM? I don't remember him having any moments with Cole/the computer during the UT build-up, and the GM was certainly a snarky, audience-and-wrestler-baiting asshole, so the personality stuff fits. If they go that route, though, he'd still need to institute a new Raw GM, since I think we're supposed to assume that HHH is the full-on Acting Chairman of WWE, not just for Raw.
Matt Tracker
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Since: 8.5.03
From: North Carolina

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#66 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.28
    Originally posted by dMp
    Btw. The most shocking and interesting they could do is allow CM Punk to hang out at an ROH show or two. Not wrestle, but just be there with that title.
    Rumors will run wild once again.



I read often that the WWE is so protective of the belts that they wrestlers aren't allowed to travel with them anymore. Allegedly, they are handed the belts at events and hand them back for officials to keep an eye on. But Punk is all over Chicago with the title.

He kinda doesn't need to go on ROH. Between Twitter and ESPN, he's very visible.



"To be the man, you gotta beat demands." -- The Lovely Mrs. Tracker
JimBob Skeeter
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Since: 2.1.02
From: MN

Since last post: 7 hours
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#67 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.00
Ah, I kind of see what you're saying here. I was all ready to come on and ague about how they fired Vince because he was ready to fire WWE's #1 money maker. I COULD see them maybe have done that, y'know, let Cena get fired for a while them HHH comes out in a couple of weeks to do the same thing, re-hire Cena back, blahblahblah. But then, didn't they just do this whole thing at the end of the Nexxus crap? I think we all hated that, so I'm kind of glad they just bit the bullet and didn't even bother to can Cena.

-edit - sry, this was a reply to lotjx

(edited by JimBob Skeeter on 19.7.11 0901)
Oliver
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Since: 20.6.02
From: Kolob

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#68 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.51
    Originally posted by shawnpatrick
    And Alex Riley is just awful out there now. Having Evan Bourne out there would have been so much better. Please end the experiment.
I disagree. I really dig Riley...he has charisma and has the crowd behind him. He's not championship material, but he would be perfect for a US or IC title reign.

I'm just wondering why Bourne wasn't in the tournament.

I'm wondering if Vince saying WWF means anything. I'd be one to think it was a slip of the tongue, but I can't help but think there's more to it than that.

(edited by Oliver on 19.7.11 0801)


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wannaberockstar
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Since: 7.3.02
From: MA

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#69 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.19
    Originally posted by JimBob Skeeter
    -edit- I can't tell from the glare, but is Cena's name plate gone from the belt? If so, Punk should make his own np with tinfoil and a sharpie.

    (edited by JimBob Skeeter on 19.7.11 0808)


You could tell from the photo he sent earlier that Cena's name was still on the belt.. which is actually a pretty neat tidbit since putting a name plate on on belt would just legitimize his reign in the eyes of WWE rather than keep it as the whole "I'm holding it hostage" plot.
JimBob Skeeter
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Since: 2.1.02
From: MN

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#70 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.00
    Originally posted by wannaberockstar
      Originally posted by JimBob Skeeter
      -edit- I can't tell from the glare, but is Cena's name plate gone from the belt? If so, Punk should make his own np with tinfoil and a sharpie.

      (edited by JimBob Skeeter on 19.7.11 0808)


    You could tell from the photo he sent earlier that Cena's name was still on the belt.. which is actually a pretty neat tidbit since putting a name plate on on belt would just legitimize his reign in the eyes of WWE rather than keep it as the whole "I'm holding it hostage" plot.


Oh, I agree. I just kind of dug that Punk might have preid Cena's nameplate off and eventually rig his own plate to go on, not having an actual 'E sanctioned plate.
kentish
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Since: 19.8.05
From: My Old Kentucky Home

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#71 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.62
Well, after the best PPV in at least 5 years, they follow it up with a decent show with a lousy ending. It's nice to have that much wrestling on the show, but the bait and switch ending was unnecessary (assuming it wasn't booked on the fly). Just say going in that the finals will be next week. Instead we get Vince and HHH crying.

I do like the idea of a potential HHH/Punk angle, but this was a lame first step to get there. However, after a great last few weeks and PPV, I will give them a shot to bounce back next week.




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KJames199
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Since: 10.12.01
From: #yqr

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#72 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.03
    Originally posted by John Orquiola
    Perhaps Triple H will indeed reveal himself as the Anonymous RAW GM all along, thereby it makes sense that the "Board of Directors" would grant him control of the whole company. If he's Anon. GM, then he's had a year long tryout as the Guy in Charge.
How does that make sense? The anonymous Raw GM has been a big ol' douche. Why give that guy more power?

Personally, I'd like the anonymous GM to be revealed as Kevin Nash. They've got him signed, he can talk, he can't wrestle, it makes sense for him to behave like a heel (who will be a dick to fellow heels when it suits his needs), and it makes sense that he'd get the job since his buddy HHH has all this power.

I really don't get why everyone disliked Raw so much. There was lots of wrestling by wrestlers and some of it was even pretty good and there were mostly clean finishes.

As for the Vince thing... I dunno. It felt somewhat different from the times before when they'd write him out, and I think the crowd helped that - they went from singing the goodbye song to chanting "thank you Vince" within seconds once they started to get the sense that he was really writing himself out. So who knows. Maybe this is the same ol' shit, and maybe this will lead to HHH vs. Punk, but I'll give them the benefit of the doubt for now - I really liked that PPV.
JimBob Skeeter
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Since: 2.1.02
From: MN

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#73 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.00
    Originally posted by kentish
    Well, after the best PPV in at least 5 years, they follow it up with a decent show with a lousy ending. It's nice to have that much wrestling on the show, but the bait and switch ending was unnecessary (assuming it wasn't booked on the fly). Just say going in that the finals will be next week. Instead we get Vince and HHH crying.



Yeah, but up until Vince came out, you THOUGHT there was going to be one more match, didn't you? After the first two matches of the night were done, I started paying attention to the time left, wondering how they were going to fit those last five matches in yet, along with teh Vince firing Cena thing and MAYBE an appearance of Punk in the crowd holding the belt up and running (not holding my breath there). Anywho, with five minutes before the hour, we all thought the last match was going to happen, at least until "No Chance" hit, and there you have it. Did you see THAT coming?
lotjx
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Since: 5.9.08

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#74 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.71
I didn't think people are complaining about the wrestling even though I question a one legged Miz beating Kofi, but it was still a good match. The wrestling was top notch and turned a rather bizarre Raw into at leas the very least a good one. The general complaint for Raw is nothing really happened with CM Punk, the guy who helped pull off these last few weeks of awesome.

Yes, we did get the tournament, Cena was un-fired for the second time in an almost a year and Vince was written out for the second time in a year. HHH coming out was an interesting twist, but HHH alone with a mic can be a very dangerous thing. He pretty much buried the roster during his Mania run, so people have a right to be skeptical to see this play out. It just seems like a letdown from the awesome cutting edge promos we were getting from Punk, Vince and Cena to the end to Vince crying in the ring.

Again, it also doesn't really make sense to fire Vince for almost firing a John Cena who made the situation 1000 times worse then what it could have been. I do think JimBob does have a good point of biting the bullet now instead waiting. Yet, I wish they would have given us a better explanation then Vince was off his rocker for trying to screw Punk which HHH has stated on numerous occasions he was ok with Bret, and firing Cena who was the one really at fault for this mess. If its just a way to move on from Punk then ok, but again it was really out of nowhere for Vince to be fired. No, I did not see that coming, but that doesn't mean it was a good move either.



(edited by lotjx on 19.7.11 0933)


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Twitter: @realjoecarfley its a bit more toned down there. A bit.
texasranger9
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Since: 9.1.11

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#75 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.01
I missed RAW. The only thing that noone has mentioned is it a new WWE title? Did they show a graphic of it? Was it on a podium? Is it the one in the black bag Teddy Long almost gave JBL before anouncing Batista was drafted to Smackdown? Remember Punk said "That thing has been too ugly for far too long." And I dobut they would just bring back a clone of the spinner Punk has.
Dr Unlikely
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Since: 2.1.02

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#76 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.76
    Originally posted by KJames199
      Originally posted by John Orquiola
      Perhaps Triple H will indeed reveal himself as the Anonymous RAW GM all along, thereby it makes sense that the "Board of Directors" would grant him control of the whole company. If he's Anon. GM, then he's had a year long tryout as the Guy in Charge.
    How does that make sense? The anonymous Raw GM has been a big ol' douche. Why give that guy more power?
Aside from the brief reign of Commissioner McFoley - who was still kind of an asshole - this has been the way for all non-Linda authority figures in the post-Gorilla era, hasn't it? Strike that, Mike Adamle was a good dude.

    Originally posted by KJames199
    Personally, I'd like the anonymous GM to be revealed as Kevin Nash. They've got him signed, he can talk, he can't wrestle, it makes sense for him to behave like a heel (who will be a dick to fellow heels when it suits his needs), and it makes sense that he'd get the job since his buddy HHH has all this power.
I don't know if Vince putting in that one-sided phone call to hire the Anonymous GM makes sense if it's supposed to have been Nash. But maybe it does, maybe he called Nash on the old nWo Hotline he used to inject his company with a dose of lethal poison. But logic aside, I would be all over Nash as the GM, emboldened by his friend Paul as Acting Chairman. More importantly, I'd want Nash to be the laziest GM of all time. He should literally be sitting four feet away from someone asking him important questions, but instead of using the energy required to turn his head and look at/talk to the person addressing him, Nash would type on his iPhone and make Cole get up and Have Our Attention Please to read every response from GM Nash. That would seriously be the best.

I'm also imagining GM Nash rolling around in a wheelchair, not because he's injured, but because he doesn't feel like walking, and he likes the respect that the wheelchair affords him, and hey, they already have a ramp.
thecubsfan
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Since: 10.12.01
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#77 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.63
    Originally posted by texasranger9
    I missed RAW. The only thing that noone has mentioned is it a new WWE title? Did they show a graphic of it? Was it on a podium? Is it the one in the black bag Teddy Long almost gave JBL before anouncing Batista was drafted to Smackdown? Remember Punk said "That thing has been too ugly for far too long." And I dobut they would just bring back a clone of the spinner Punk has.


They did not show an actual live belt during the show, but the graphics for the tournament all used the spinner belt.



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Since: 2.1.02
From: Seattle, WA

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#78 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.97
If the whole CM Punk-angle since June 27 was an action movie, last night' RAW was the scene where the good guy cop/investigator/superhero gets suspended/sent home/banished after failing to prevent the big bad guy's master plan from succeeding. I've decided it was necessary to move the storyline along to the next level, but they were pretty clumsy about it.

Also, I hope ADR *doesn't* cash in his MitB shot next week, if only because the Miz carrying around the briefcase for like five months was pretty cool.



Holy fuck shit motherfucker shit. Read comics. Fuck shit shit fuck shit I sold out when I did my job. Fuck fuck fuck shit fuck. Sorry had to do it....

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Since: 14.1.02
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#79 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.39
With the rise of social media, especially with how hard they are pushing it on the air, they didn't need to mention Punk last night.

Speaking of Punk, wouldn't you know he's going to be a guest on the BS Report with Bill Simmons, apparently.



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#80 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.71
If Punk has a Toy Fare picture of Cobra Commander supervising the destruction of the Spinner into the Cobra Belt, I may have a nerd heart attack.

(edited by lotjx on 19.7.11 1032)


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Twitter: @realjoecarfley its a bit more toned down there. A bit.
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Man the Diva's division feel apart around 2005-06. That was when the women who helped support the "Golden Age" of women's wrestling started leaving the company.
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Related threads: RAW #946 7/11/11 - RAW #945 7/4/11 - RAW Roulette #944 6/27/11 - More...
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