Originally posted by shawnpatrickSeems that the crowd actually bought Vince being removed as CEO. Of course, if this is true, they would have to make a public announcement because WWE is a public stock.
What, does the middle of the ring in Milwaukee not count as "public"?? ;-)
You know what the best part is? Some newspaper will half-ass hear about this storyline and mention it in an article that Vince has stepped down and his pro-wrestler son-in-law has taken over the company.
I think my favorite part of the show tonight was watching Albert Del Rio fighting for a shot at a title he already has two shots for. His gimmick really should be like when Ultimo Dragon had eight titles, only with Del Rio it's title shots. Have him win Daniel Bryan's briefcase, the Royal Rumble, and he's never able to cash in. Maybe he tries to cash in his MITB at one point but the briefcase gets jammed, and by that I mean JTG broke into his briefcase (Because he's black) and replaced the contract with a PB&J
Given that Punk's actually in possession of the belt, it's safe to assume that he's signed a new contract and this is a sabbatical, right? Would Vince really let an uncontracted guy walk around with the title?
Anyway, I TOTALLY get all of the bitching. There was far too much wrestling in this week's wrestling show featuring wrestlers from a wrestling company.
Also, how dare they have a segment involving two of the biggest and well known names on the roster instead of featuring a guy who storyline left the company last night.
In future, I hope that the WWE runs all potential angles by me first, so that I can ok every single week of them. I mean, I wouldn't want to let week 1 of a potentially 9 month angle be something that might have to be done for purposes later.
This Raw was always going to be a little 'reset-y'. The most entertaining character can't appear. The next 'most entertaining' is to have minimal involvement for disciplinary reasons. Plus they need to have talking to get over how they're going to deal with the vacant title situation. So they've gone for the 8 man elimination tournament in one night. Seven matches + Cena firing + promos + segways + shills in a two hour Raw. Always going to be tight for time.
Still don't get the point of Johnny Ace being on screen.
Snorted my drink out my nose during the WWE anti-bullying bit. The Bella's - anti bullying? Their whole shtick is bullying!
I like tournaments but pro wrestling tournaments have always disappointed me in execution. One day I would like to see a world cup style tournament, including the minnows. My issue with pro wrestling tournaments is that these main event guys feud for weeks and weeks and fight for 20-30 minutes on PPV to settle an issue, yet allow themselves to be beaten in 5 minutes in a tournament for the title? At least this one didn't have cheap count outs and DQ's in order to 'protect' people. So points to WWE for that.
I can buy the quick matches here as 7/8ths of the participants were in a grueling ladder match last night. Although now that makes me think: seven guys are beat up and hurt from the ladder match, and Dolph Ziggler presumably had his arse on the couch all night. You would think he should have been able to run through the tournament. The only logical conclusion I can draw from this is that in terms of impact on the male body, a ladder match is roughly equivalent to an evenings sex with Vicki. No wonder Edge had to retire!
Ziggler, Rey was the best first round match though. (I thought anyway)
Natalia is still with the WWE? Why the hell wasn't she involved in the PPV? Why is this divas 'tag' match even on the show? The show was too jammed to waste precious segments on this. Do it dark if we need to give the live crowd a bimbo fix.
Who's this Silent Rage meth lab dude? New guy?
To rehash the tournament execution issue: If all tournament matches were executed like Rey - Truth then everything would be peaches.
Like others I'm prepared to give the WWE a little goodwill based on recent outings to see where they go with this. But nothing burns goodwill faster than treating people like fools and that's what a bait and switch does. People are not idiots and they realise immediately that you never had any intention of having the final tournament match tonight. The silly thing is that I think people still would have hung round to hear how Vince was going to deal with Cena. It (the bait & switch) was unnecessary in my opinion. I'm sure it was done to add fire to the 'Vince has lost it' angle, but bad taste left.
Vince's attire would go well in a Miami Vice episode.
Being a Director in the WWE's Board has got to be a pretty easy job. They only seem to meet every 8-9 years. Was the last time when they stripped Ric Flair of his authority when he was going to fight the Undertaker?
BTW Am I the only one who cringes when people refer to their in-laws as Mom, Dad, Son, etc? Back when I had in-laws I called them by their names. My father in law is a great guy, but he wasn't my 'Pop'. And I was just the poor schmuck who married his daughter, not a son.
I think Vince has been wanting to remove himself as an on screen character for some time. Be interesting to see how HHH goes. He can be entertaining but when he's serious he's very guilty of grunting and taking forever to get the point communicated. Why use one word when five will do. In my opinion he's also been happy to put himself over at the expense of telling a story which I hope he doesn't do in what looks to be a non wrestling authority figure.
There's still the latitude for them to be entertaining and brave in the coming weeks, just as there is latitude for them to play safe and be boring. I'll keep tuning in until the WWE gives me reason to forget to.
I really don't know what people expected from this Raw. Punk is on holiday for the time being. Everyone knew this going in, and to make the angle work he HAD to take off with the belt for a while. The WWE title/Vince threads were the big issues that needed addressing, and they addressed both. And I don't see how Triple H taking over the whole company means this is "business as usual".
Honestly, it's one night removed from MitB and everyone is screaming about how they abandoned the angle. This is one of those times where I agree that over-analysis is the thing that is killing enjoyment of wrestling.
We got two solid hours of wrestling with two talking segments (that were actually compelling) at the two ends - heck, that's more then we get from the show where wrestling supposedly matters. I'd say that's a step in the right direction. Given that CM Punk essentially gave the kiss-off (storyline wise) to Vince and walked out with the belt, you can't imagine that he'd be in the build or that anyone from WWE would even mention it. That doesn't mean that things won't happen later on - we still have plenty of time. I do like those shocking endings - like we got the last two weeks - but you can't have them every week or else they lose all meaning (no matter what Vince Russo wants you to believe).
Instead they went out and let the wrestling speak for itself.
I am a sucker for tournaments, so I enjoyed this Raw. Unfortunately, I went to bed as soon as Rey won figuring Rey would win and then ADR would cash in. Guess not. Vince leaving has been done a number of times and I think isn't it this time last year that Nexus beat him up for him to go away. So, its not really anything new even with HHH being in charge. HHH being in charge if they go full out with him will be fun for a few weeks then we will remember why people got sick of the 20 minute promos. If anything I see this leading to Punk/HHH around Survivor Series.
Cena being employed is not a shock and actually a little disappointing they didn't give him time off to see what stars they could make without him being around. Yet, SummerSlam is around the corner, so I understand it would be a bad business decision. It is cool that Punk got the last laugh out of all of this.
The Wee Baby Sheamus.
Twitter: @realjoecarfley its a bit more toned down there. A bit.
Originally posted by Big GWho's this Silent Rage meth lab dude? New guy?
Aw, poor Big Andy...now he's the "meth lab guy." (He won the relaunched Tough Enough.)
I enjoyed all those matches...all pretty solid to quite good (I really liked Rey/Ziggler). As people have said, it really was the most match/wrestling-centric show in a while and no duds. (Even the women's match had the best female wrestling in the company winning...and doing *something* on TV for the first time in ages.)
Obviously Punk was at Wrigley, there were a bunch of pics of/from him on Twitter, with his championship magic giving the Cubbies luck vs. Roy Halladay... but ending the show with a weepy Vince and Hunter was just an odd sight.
I think it's great that Punk wasn't on RAW and is kind of no longer mentioned by the coporate suits. It gives this whole angle a far more realistic feel. Otherwise it would have just felt like: Yeah, I knew all along that Punk wouldn't be gone for long.
In my opinion this angle has to grow outside of WWE's ring - on Facebook, Twitter, TMZ ect. Punk should provoke WWE from the outside, because that's what he is right now: an outsider. But not in an NWO sense. More in a 2011 social media and all kind of sense.
Of course, all of the stuff that would be happening outside of WWE would have to be made known to the WWE Universe in some sort of way. Maybe by having WWE's new internet guru Michael Ole going nuts about it?
As far as the tournament is concerned, I would love to see the belt on Miz again, but I have to agree that the Mystero/Del Rio thingy looks far more logic right now.
Really trying to extend goodwill towards the 'E here, given that they gave us an amazing MITB story and Punk really broke the mold of the past several years in a tremendously entertaining fashion. (Also, I'm sending good karma their way because I'm hoping that works to get that awesome white Punk t-shirt back as a regular item, and not just Chicago-only.)
Of all the directions to go after someone established THEMSELVES as a star, the absolute dumbest one has got to be another Night O' McMahons. This story was about Punk railing against the system, against the politics and against the blandness of Cena on top... and now it's about Vince getting ousted by the Board of Directors and replaced... by Triple H? This is a bad 2002 flashback.
Again, trying to look past the 'one night' letdown, but am just taken back by how far off the rails this one just went. And I remember the Invasion and the Nexus and many, many other hot angles that fizzled.
Vince has been an integral part of the story up until now. It's baffling that people think that the show the night after Punk kayfabe left the company by spitting in Vince's eye should be all about Punk. This show was what it needed to be - Vince depserately trying to maintain his grip and return things to normal, only for it all to collapse by the end. Come on guys, think about this stuff a little instead of just jumping into "Punk good, McMahon BAD" responses.
Originally posted by Amos CochranVince has been an integral part of the story up until now. It's baffling that people think that the show the night after Punk kayfabe left the company by spitting in Vince's eye should be all about Punk. This show was what it needed to be - Vince depserately trying to maintain his grip and return things to normal, only for it all to collapse by the end. Come on guys, think about this stuff a little instead of just jumping into "Punk good, McMahon BAD" responses.
You're right, it makes perfect sense now to have Triple H return to lead the WWE out of this in-storyline mess. Silly fans!
Perhaps I came across as overly critical, but to clarify that was not my overall feeling. I quite liked the show. It did what it needed to do. We all knew they were going to wiggle out of the Cena firing, it was just a matter of how.
We got a bunch of good wrestling and both the Rey matches I thought were very good TV matches.
One final bit of analysis that I'll share occured to me whilst driving to volleyball tonight:
Why does it not make sense? Vince's reaction/compeuppance for letting Punk walk with the WWE title was a big part of the buildup. Punk is gone for a while. You CANNOT use him on the show after the night he promised to leave. It would destroy his character, and the storyline. So you tel the other parts of the story while Punk is out selling it. I feel like a lot of people just want Punk cutting promos for two hours from here on out or they won't be satisfied.
C'mon, I actualy got chills for HHH's theme when it hit last night. That's the first time in a long time (yes, not even including WM cuz we were expecting it), and the "Thank you, Vince" chants. It IS real, (dammit x2). So, next week, Miz/Mysterio, and then ADR cash-in - or trying ala Swagger. HHH eventually is going to have to cover the Punk thing. In the meantime, you have to envy Punk's current employment situation. Carry the belt around to really cool places and post pix of it online.
That's from the Cubs game last night, and then you throw in the party pix from the night before and the fridge pic, how the hell can you not envy him? No house shows? No Monday traveling? No Eurotrips? Just Punk, the belt, the couch and his comics. I can't wait for the first pic of the belt surrounded by all various action figures of Cobra Commander.
Oh, and I popped for Ricardo's return. No one does "RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRIO!!!!!!" like Little Ricky.
-edit- I can't tell from the glare, but is Cena's name plate gone from the belt? If so, Punk should make his own np with tinfoil and a sharpie.
I did not watch the show, but came on here to check if anything interesting happened that I should try to watch online. But, nope, nothing interesting happened. I agree that keeping CM Punk off TV is a good idea for now, but at least mention him. Show some of the stuff he's been doing on Twitter, have some other people backstage talking about what happened. Just do something to keep that momentum and keep people invested.
I did watch the main event microphone segment. HHH as a suit is a good choice. I find John Cena incredibly boring and actually am embarrassed for him when I see him doing his shtick. It's just ridiculous and phony. I thought that when he first got popular in the mid 2000s (he was one of the reasons I quit watching WWE) and nothing has changed for me or, it seems, for him. At this point the only that could make me interested in John Cena is if WWE can find a way to convincingly turn him into a vicious heel who is pissed off at being shit on by everybody he has been catering to. There seems to be a way to go that route now, but I'm skeptical about it ever happening.
Basically, people tuned in to see what would happen with the CM Punk situation and, not only did nothing happen, but it was barely even mentioned. I understand the slow burn but this felt more like no burn.
(edited by samoflange on 19.7.11 0915) Lloyd: When I met Mary, I got that old fashioned romantic feeling, where I'd do anything to bone her. Harry: That's a special feeling.
I heartily endorse Monday's developments as it only makes Punk more influential. He took a No. 1 contender shot and turned it into an industry crusade in which he: a) called Vince on the carpet b) in front of rabid supportive fans (chants for ICE CREAM) c) beat Cena clean d) for the belt e) clobbered a MITB challenger before he could officially contend f) left the company g) with the belt! h) which almost lead to Cena's firing i) but did lead to VINCE's firing
He won the belt, took it home, and deposed Vince. And Green Bay chanted Punk's name like was an Attitude-era main-eventer. By God, this is a parade of awesome.
"To be the man, you gotta beat demands." -- The Lovely Mrs. Tracker
We've talked this one to death, but there's really just no way that Cena turns heel or takes time off television at this point in time. Frankly, he just sells way too much merch. The whole point is not to leave money lying on the table, which is why I don't see Punk being gone for more than a month. While I agree that perhaps more could have been done to keep the momentum going on Punk while he was gone, I did like the way they did business last night, even if it was a little weird. Putting off the title match did a couple things. It fit Vince's character, it showed him putting himself and his ego above the title (which others have rightly pointed out should always be the most important thing), it gave everybody some time for the loss of the title to sink in, and hopefully it means that the Miz/Mysterio match next week will go a good, long time. I like the idea of corporate suit HHH, and while he isn't much of an actor, I do think he was successful in portraying that this is role he's not really comfortable in, which is pretty interesting to me. Finally, while we have seen Vince leave before, it never gets old to me, mostly because it means he won't be on television for a while.
Originally posted by samoflangeI did not watch the show, but came on here to check if anything interesting happened that I should try to watch online. But, nope, nothing interesting happened. I agree that keeping CM Punk off TV is a good idea for now, but at least mention him. Show some of the stuff he's been doing on Twitter, have some other people backstage talking about what happened. Just do something to keep that momentum and keep people invested.
Jesus. Fuck. You're right. Something was missing last night, something interesting, but I just couldn't put my finger on it. I am no longer invested because they didn't mention what's his name who won the title two nights ago, nor his twittering, by name. I forgot that happened and now I no longer care about the angle.
Drawing is usually easier to gague in retrospective, even if it can be distorted. When you go back to WCW in 1996, it's clear that the whole show was great, but that there was also an overall emcompasing storyline that drew people in.