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The W - Pro Wrestling - Raw 8-9-04 (Page 3)
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geemoney
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Since: 26.1.03
From: Naples, FL

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#41 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.90
    Originally posted by ekedolphin
    Benoit also defended the World Heavyweight Title against Rhyno on the night of the draft lottery. And later against Shawn Michaels, for that matter.

    Considering the fact that Triple H almost never defended the World Title on RAW when he had it, I have to think you're kinda grasping at straws here.



How many months ago was the draft lottery, though?

I don't wanna sound like I'm complaining, it just seems like he rarely defends the title. When Triple H didn't defend the title, it didn't seem like such a big deal, because he was in every other segment of the show. The champ, with rarely hype or an interview, just goes out for his tag match every week. Just seems a little....odd to me.



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Matt Tracker
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Since: 8.5.03
From: North Carolina

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#42 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.97
I was impressed at how bad-ass Benoit was as the main event began. I wish he'd been allowed before this to present that verbal intensity or wallop three Evolution members for so long. Good move calling himself The Wolverine to follow in the footsteps of Triple H, HBK and Austin.

Mrs. Tracker and I weren't digging the contract signing, but we agree that Lita has turned (we notes the wardrobe), and we think her marriage to Kane will culminate in driving him nuts by demanding late-night snack runs. Matt, however, should have walked away and scooped up a wannabe diva for rebound lovin'. I don't see how this angle does anything for his character. he ditches her to turn heel, turns again to save her from Kane, woos her, almost proposes, learns she cheated on him (because he couldn't defend himself from Kane) and got knocked up, promises to help her raise the kid even if it's not his, is told flat-out it isn't and risks wathcing her marry Kane if he loses on Sunday. And I gotta think he will lose; Kane's due for a PPV win. So how does this help our perception of him as a competitor? It doesn't read as chivalry. It might be the case, but the story isn't showing me that.



"To be the man, you gotta beat demands." -- The Lovely Mrs. Tracker
dMr
Andouille








Since: 2.11.02
From: Edinburgh, Scotland

Since last post: 42 days
Last activity: 6 hours
#43 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.39
    Originally posted by geemoney
    I don't wanna sound like I'm complaining, it just seems like he rarely defends the title. When Triple H didn't defend the title, it didn't seem like such a big deal, because he was in every other segment of the show. The champ, with rarely hype or an interview, just goes out for his tag match every week. Just seems a little....odd to me.


Personally I'd say its for the best. Wrestling is what Benoit does well. Mic work is quite evidently not. I think they've done a pretty good job of building him as the no nonsense, less talk more action, kick ass champ. Sure it'd be nice if he made with the banter now and again but I don't think he's much cop at it, so playing to his strengths by having him wrestle instead makes sense to me. Especially given that they often do a decent job of progressing stories in ring.

As for the lack of title defences, I'd imagine thats just simply so that the matches at PPV's seem that bit more special. Having the Heavyweight title on the line every other weak devalues the PPV or leads to endless, predictable screwball endings, neither of which would be much fun.



Evil Antler God
Potato korv








Since: 10.1.02

Since last post: 2937 days
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#44 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.25
That was actually the most impressed I've been with Benoit in a while. They almost let him be halfway clever with the "see the footage? What footageCROSSFACE" thing
A Fan
Liverwurst








Since: 3.1.02

Since last post: 3555 days
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#45 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.55
Honestly, if Raw tells you anything tonight, its the HHH show. They are hyping Eugene/HHH all the while Orton/Benoit is going which should bet the focual point of the show. The belt should the star of the show. However, Bad Blood was another telling sign were it was the first time in Raw PPVS only that the belt wasn't the main event. Raw is HHH unless they get a divorce, that is how its going to be.

Benoit is a great champion and honeslty, I want him to keep till Mania, but he'll never get the expousre he'll need to stay champ. The fans are really starting to bite into Benoit and honeslty, they would be morons to take the belt off him right now. The problem with Raw is that besides Evolution and Kane, there are no crediable heels. On the flip side, only HBK and Benoit are the only main event faces on the show. Jericho has been stuck in mid-card hell since 2002 and Edge, Shelton and Eugene aren't ready. If they do put the belt on Orton and turn him face, he's stuck in the same hole Benoit is in. He could fued with Edge, but honestly it won't mean much.

They really need to make another major heel that isn't a monster or in Evolution. Christian is great, but he doesn't have the chops for it. I do think they are stuck on what to do after SummerSlam. I hate to say it, but turning Jericho heel could help, he has been world champ and he has amazing chemistry with Benoit. My vote is for Benoit to keep it and have Jericho with a returning Christian beat the hell out of Edge. I highly doubt this will happen though.
Ticamo
Boerewors








Since: 19.7.02
From: Trenton, NJ, USA

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#46 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.80
    Originally posted by Mayhem
    Triple H vs. HBK was at Summerslam 2002 ... funny how time flies.


See... That's why I'm the perfect WWE fan. My short term memory is shot. Damn you, Vince!! Well, it's either that or the Copaxone.



Meg: Being a single mother is hard, but the real challenge is having a baby that's addicted to crack. Right Stewie?

Stewie: What's that? Oh yes, yes, I love crack. I'm absolutely cuckoo for crack.
Mayhem
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Since: 25.4.03
From: Nashville, TN

Since last post: 38 days
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#47 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.70
    Originally posted by Quezzy
      Originally posted by Mayhem

      Was I the only one that wondered if when Kane was signing the contract, he signed it as "Kane Bearer"?


    Actually I was wondering if they had to sign using their wrestling names or their real names. That's be great if Matt started to sign and said "Glen?? Your real name is Glen??"



    Also this is off topic a littl bit, but talking about Jericho turning heel made me think of it. Is Hurricane turning heel? After the encounter with Flair last week I thought he would drop the super hero gimmick all together, but after the Rosey promotion and the Hurricane match on Heat, in which he was acting very heelish, it looks like maybe he is turning heel against Rosey instead.

    (edited by Quezzy on 10.8.04 0826)


I missed Heat ... what sorta of heel antics was the Hurricane doing? ... since he may be out for some nose/nasal surgery, it would be the perfect time to have him come back and denouce his superhero gimmick and become that cocky little prick like they seem to be doing with Spike on SD.



You're a jive soul bro, a jive soul bro
And you're always lyin' to you friends
You're a jive soul bro, a jive soul bro
And you'll never get nothin' in the end
The Vile1
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Since: 4.9.02
From: California

Since last post: 2010 days
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#48 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.36
    Originally posted by geemoney
      Originally posted by ekedolphin
      Benoit also defended the World Heavyweight Title against Rhyno on the night of the draft lottery. And later against Shawn Michaels, for that matter.

      Considering the fact that Triple H almost never defended the World Title on RAW when he had it, I have to think you're kinda grasping at straws here.



    How many months ago was the draft lottery, though?

    I don't wanna sound like I'm complaining, it just seems like he rarely defends the title. When Triple H didn't defend the title, it didn't seem like such a big deal, because he was in every other segment of the show. The champ, with rarely hype or an interview, just goes out for his tag match every week. Just seems a little....odd to me.


I also just remembered. Benoit defended the title against Kane in June after Bad Blood, and against Eugene on the RAW after Vengeance. So he defended the title 3 times last month, and I would hardly say he defends it "rarely" on TV.

(edited by The Vile1 on 10.8.04 0929)



"Don't compare my arm to your cheap arm!"
-Edward Elric
BigSteve
Pepperoni








Since: 23.7.04
From: Baltimore, MD

Since last post: 2839 days
Last activity: 2567 days
#49 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.93
Raw really sucked. A lot. Does anyone else seem to notice how much Raw drags lately? There are too many segments where it's Jr and King talking, or you have the smackdown rebound, or you show "Moments Ago" recaps. Or you have Lita/Kane and the divas. The Edge - Y2J match was really good but everything else was mediocre to mind numbingly horrible.
Pizza Delivery Jones
Chourico








Since: 27.6.04

Since last post: 862 days
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#50 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.86
Wpob: "As for the Diva search, I was embarrassed for myself. I usually watch RAW alone in the other room while my wife watches whatever. But tonight she was doing some planning for our son's birthday party and sat in the room with me. When the ice cream segment came on, she started to watch and was getting increasingly horrified. She looked at me and said "I can't beleive you watch this crap". I can't beleive I did either. This is the worst long term angle ever. I just wish instead of dodge ball, the would have to wreslte the Divas in a battle royal and the last Diva Wannabe would be declared the winner."

Worst long term angle ever? I'm guessing you missed Leslie Nielsen & George Kennedy searching for the real UNdertaker...
Wpob
Lap cheong








Since: 21.11.02
From: Williston Park, NY

Since last post: 3 hours
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#51 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.77
Wpob: "As for the Diva search, I was embarrassed for myself. This is the worst long term angle ever.

    Originally posted by Pizza Delivery Jones
    Worst long term angle ever? I'm guessing you missed Leslie Nielsen & George Kennedy searching for the real UNdertaker...


I will stand by that statement forever. Nothing is this bad. It is painful to watch these women on screen and the Diva tests they have them doing (Kamala, ice cream) is insulting to us the viewers. And now they get an actual "match" on the second biggest PPV ever? And you just know they are going to win. The crowd is booing them unmercifully, the internet is trashing them all over the palce and yet each week, here they are taking valuable time away from some real wrestlers who could use the exposure. At least Nielsen and Kennedy had a few cominc moments. The Diva angle has no redeeming value. And none of these women are hotter than ANY of the existing Divas.



Inigo Montoya: Who are you?

Westley: No one of consequence.

Inigo Montoya: I must know...

Westley: Get used to disappointment.

Inigo Montoya: 'kay.
Mr Shh
Toulouse








Since: 9.1.02
From: Bergen County, NJ

Since last post: 8 hours
Last activity: 6 hours
#52 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.65
    Originally posted by Wpob
    And now they get an actual "match" on the second biggest PPV ever?

So are Paul London and Spike Dudley. I call it a wash.

    Originally posted by Wpob
    The crowd is booing them unmercifully...

Not only is "unmercifully" a bit strong (and inaccurate), but there are some who aren't even getting booed.

    Originally posted by Wpob
    The Diva angle has no redeeming value.

Perhaps the redeeming value is to host a "reality show" that brings in new viewers (that goal hasn't quite been achieved yet, but whattaya gonna do...they're not losing viewers.) Plus, the winner of the show becomes a character on TV who will play a part in storylines.

    Originally posted by Wpob
    And none of these women are hotter than ANY of the existing Divas.

Subjective. There are three of them that I think are hotter than ALL the current Divas.
Matches
Haggis








Since: 23.9.03
From: Cleveland

Since last post: 847 days
Last activity: 749 days
#53 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.73
The diva search.. god.. Might have been alright but why on earth would you use your HEEL ANNOUNCER as the MC of the events?

You have to admit, the concept is not as bad as the reality of it has turned out to be. Granted your typical "wrestling" fan who doesn't watch the WWE for the T&A fix is going to react negatively to it, probably no matter what. But for your casual fans, and the guys that got no problem with the "E" in WWE.. To have a bunch of skinny women come out in bikinis and basically be their vapid selves, dance around, etc.. Seems like a no-brainer. Crowd pops for Stacy, the crowd pops Trish, the crowd pops for Torrie.. They'll surely pop for 10 girls generally their aesthetic equals, right?

Well, not when you have your biggest heel announcer who the crowds hate conducting the proceedings! Whether or not they boo Coach because he sucks or because he's doing a good job as a heel is up for debate but, the fact is, Coach's voice ellicits nothing but negative-energy heat in every arena. That's how they built him up. So why are you using this guy to introduce something that's supposed to attract and make fans happy? Horrible decision. King I guess would have been a better choice given his persona and the fact that he's not so much a heelish announcer that he still gets face pops when in the ring doing his "puppies" schtick. Boggles my mind that they're using Coach for this. Hell, best idea would have been to use an actual wrestler for this. Give Val Venis something to do for crying out loud. You won't see him wrestle anymore but making him host of the Diva Search is right up his character's alley. Granted it's a tired character but this is at least something a little different for him to do. I can't see him being that much worse at exetmporaneous announcing as Coach has been for this. Just a lot of "oh wow," and "Turn around for us Kimberly." Morley is no fool in his own right, I think he'd be alright. If not then let him team up with Coach.. Using Venis to introduce the women immediately sets a T&A tone, locks people in positively rather than hearing Coach's grating voice hollering all the time.. Even after all these years that "Hello ladies" still gets a nice reaction, rather than the boos you get whenever coach comes out. Using Venis in this role de-heels Coach a little and lets the crowd get beyond that aspect of the recent Coach character and enjoy watching the models try to do their thing.

Maybe this wouldn't have mattered anyway...the events still have been brutal, it interrupts the flow of the show and the models have for the most part been brutally awful in their performance. But this would have given it a shot, hopefully getting it out on the right foot.


Matt Fact: Matt has a low sperm count.
Quezzy
Knackwurst








Since: 6.1.02
From: The Moon

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#54 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.89
    Originally posted by Mayhem
    I missed Heat ... what sorta of heel antics was the Hurricane doing? ... since he may be out for some nose/nasal surgery, it would be the perfect time to have him come back and denouce his superhero gimmick and become that cocky little prick like they seem to be doing with Spike on SD.


Well first of all he did the offer the hand shake and then fake them out and pull back, he also did an eye gouge (although that might not be as much of a heel tactic as it once was). He also did a lot of show boating and posing, but it wasn't in a fun babyface way, it was more of a cocky, showing up the other wrestler way. Who knows, maybe I was just reading into it too much.

Also Stevie and Victoria had a pretty good backstage segment, makes me wonder why they don't do an angle with them instead of Kane/Lita



Lance's Response:

THAT IS AWESOME!
Hogan's My Dad
Andouille








Since: 8.6.02
From: Canada

Since last post: 3 days
Last activity: 13 hours
#55 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.27
Do all you people hatin' on the Diva Search have some kind of aversion to the remote control? I mean, I get it, you don't like it. I wasn't a fan of the Ice-Cream, except for that one girl who licked it like it was a cock, but if it's so bad and has been for so many weeks try changing the channel.

It takes a really demented person to continually and willfully expose him/herself to something he/she finds appalling. Some of you are just gluttons for punishment. I for example, after having gotten my fill of the Divas, skipped the bathing suit stuff later on in the show. And for that matter the beginning and end of the show, since Orton was in those segments. If you know you're going to hate something, save yourself the irritation by avoiding it, and in the process save everyone in your periphery from your hearing your complaints.

I love Jericho, by the way. He was pretty good tonight. Crowd seemed confused, the same way they were with Benoit/Eugene a couple weeks ago. Hopefully my home town will do the right thing and cheer the Ayatollah of Rock and Rollah instead of Captain Bland.






Hot Virgins-The World's Most Steadily Shrinking Commodity
Wpob
Lap cheong








Since: 21.11.02
From: Williston Park, NY

Since last post: 3 hours
Last activity: 18 min.
#56 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.77
Hogan's My Dad,

The problem is, it is tough to skip it becuase of the fact that most people are expecting SOMETHING to happen to them. I expected Trish and Co. to beat the tar out of them either one by one during the ice cream segment or collectively during the bikini segment. So, I am stuck watching this crap as to not miss ANYTHING resembling entertainment. Also, I hate changing channels during RAW because if I get sucked into a game, like my beoved Mets teasing me with a potetnial win, I may turn back to late and miss sonethign else.

Also, the only way to get the WWE to change their programing is to voice an opinion. RAW will always have decent ratings, that is a given. But when people voice their opinion on a segment, via booing it live at the arena or via the internet, then maybe, just maybe, someone will hear it.



Inigo Montoya: Who are you?

Westley: No one of consequence.

Inigo Montoya: I must know...

Westley: Get used to disappointment.

Inigo Montoya: 'kay.
fuelinjected
Banger








Since: 12.10.02
From: Canada

Since last post: 3259 days
Last activity: 3259 days
#57 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.05
Usually if there's bad segments or a bad show, I find it pretty hard to really get that mad about it. I was planning on watching wrestling anyways so my time really wasn't wasted. If I had something better to do during those 2 hours and 15 minutes, I'd tape RAW and do it. If I knew the show would more then likely suck (RAW 02-03, recent SD), I'll tape it and watch it at my leisure with the good ol' fast forward button.

I don't think HMD's saying not to voice your opinion but all the overblown hyperbole about WORST SHIT EVER and I'M NOT BUYING THE PPV NOW and so on is silly.



WWE now serving only -> "DIET CHAVO - All the taste - Half the fat!"
JoshMann
Andouille








Since: 17.11.03
From: Tallahassee, FL

Since last post: 2290 days
Last activity: 2287 days
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Y!:
#58 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.85
The Random Sheet, Here Comes The Pain! Edition.

Ever try to move a couch up a 3rd floor walkup by yourself using a handtruck and basically doing about 35 curl lifts to get it up there? It's a below average feeling. It took a heroic effort and after that I put it where I wanted to I took a 20-count on my new carpet all the while reaching for my cell phone and calling in for the cavalry, which did get there an hour later...a fun day to say the least, but also thank God I have a job where I don't have to move around a whole lot, considering walking has become a protest activity.

Aaaaaanyway....

RAW DIVA SEARCH DISTRACTION OF THE WEEK: Boxes. Lots of them.

-Apparantly Randy Orton is trying to give a whole new generation to the FAT BOY IN THE 2ND ROW that has followed Ric Flair around for over 20 years. For the record, they were off in their own continuity and it wasn't the long ago: the 6-man elimination, Randy uncled to a Sharpshooter.

(by the way when I was 24 I was working in a publishing house and sharing a 2-bedroom apartment and driving a 5- year old Mazda 626...so perhaps Orton has a point)

-Lita's gone from Indie Chic to Goth, and usually it happens the other way around, but this has nothing to do with 90% of the girls I went to college with...which falls under the same rule of thumb that had Steph wearing HHH's leather jacket at Armageddon 99. Besides, the Wednesday Addams thing fits her monotone better. Odds that happens: 6/5. Odds that it comes out that this whole time, she wasn't even pregnant and it was a big rouse to fuck with Matt: 5/1. But if she is, has it occured to anyone that (character-wise) neither one of them has last names? Are they going to have to break character to give the kid one or are they just going to give it a first name and that's it? [/Bill Simmons] I'm brimming with questions here [off]

-Speaking of dealing with children, Eugene sneaking out of the hotel is the reason why you have child locks on your car door. I'm still not sure how a comedy midcarder and a main eventer like HHH mesh in the match...probably a bit of both.

-Great great GREAT match between Edge and Jericho, and it just goes to prove that not all babyfaces are valient and stupid, since Jericho just walked away. You'd say that they'd never turn Edge heel in his hometown, but then again CHRISTIAN turned heel in his hometown (of course by perpetrating an act against someone ELSE from Toronto, but that's neither here nor there)...so Edge's best bet would be to do something to a Toronto/Canadian babyface, but there are no babyfaces in Canada anymore.

-Like I keep saying, my favorite aspect of Benoit's title reign has been that it could end at any moment, and because of that it needs to be savored. I would actually prefer that if it came down to HHH beating Benoit for the title and Orton beating Benoit for the title, I'd prefer Orton, if only because winning the title means nothing except for vanity for HHH at this point, but it CAN do something for Randy Orton's career...they need to make as many main eventers as he can, and it's low-risk, since they can call an audible and take the title off him at any point.

Next Week On Raw: I take a drink everytime JR says "what a performance in a losing effort by Eugene"... Shawn Michaels breaks up a wedding (ironically during the prayer section)...Chris Benoit begins a two-month program with Tyson Tomko...and tune in next week when you'll hear J.R. say:

"what a performance in a losing effort by Eugene"



(edited by Blanket Jackson on 11.8.04 1139)

People who know me know what The Diesel is coming to do. Period. P-u-r-e-d. Period
geemoney
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Since: 26.1.03
From: Naples, FL

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#59 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.90
    Originally posted by dMr
    As for the lack of title defences, I'd imagine thats just simply so that the matches at PPV's seem that bit more special. Having the Heavyweight title on the line every other weak devalues the PPV or leads to endless, predictable screwball endings, neither of which would be much fun.

Yeah, but some of Triple H's better title defenses on RAW in his first go 'round were against Al Snow and Taka Michinoku- guys who really had no chance of winning, but Trips gave them a couple of near falls and the crowd was way into it. He doesn't have to be fighting the same guys every week, or even the guys he fights on the pay-per view. There are plenty of guys that could use the rub from just BEING IN a title match one week.





Movies, Sports, and More!: Experience It
JoshMann
Andouille








Since: 17.11.03
From: Tallahassee, FL

Since last post: 2290 days
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Y!:
#60 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.87
    Originally posted by geemoney
      Originally posted by dMr
      As for the lack of title defences, I'd imagine thats just simply so that the matches at PPV's seem that bit more special. Having the Heavyweight title on the line every other weak devalues the PPV or leads to endless, predictable screwball endings, neither of which would be much fun.

    Yeah, but some of Triple H's better title defenses on RAW in his first go 'round were against Al Snow and Taka Michinoku- guys who really had no chance of winning, but Trips gave them a couple of near falls and the crowd was way into it. He doesn't have to be fighting the same guys every week, or even the guys he fights on the pay-per view. There are plenty of guys that could use the rub from just BEING IN a title match one week.




I'll do that sentiment one better...particularly in the case of a heel champion, it's one thing to just have them run their mouth every week, but it's another to see them victorius week after week after week* if you as a fan want to see that person lose. So when someone DOES beat them, it makes it just a little more special after seeing them win all the time.

*Of course, in the case of HHH, we saw him as champion go over just about every week AND run his mouth to no end every week, so as a heel champion it was the best of all worlds. :P



People who know me know what The Diesel is coming to do. Period. P-u-r-e-d. Period
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Yeah, Bradshaw's dismay segment was just an excuse to allow him to swear on national television. (Y'know, like what he did on the 9/13 SmackDown). Damn it. They haven't been building it up as a threat like they should.
- ekedolphin, Building up the NWO threat (2002)
Related threads: So what if Orton DOES win? - RAW house show, 7/31/04, Austin TX. - RAW WORKRATE REPORT 8/3/04 - More...
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