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The W - Pro Wrestling - Raw 10-13-03 (Page 3)
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asteroidboy
Andouille








Since: 22.1.02
From: Texas

Since last post: 1241 days
Last activity: 149 days
#41 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.95
    Originally posted by Underwater
      Originally posted by asteroidboy
      There's a word that Jericho's been using in his promos that I don't understand. It sounds like "recoculate."

      I think he said it last night when talking about the match between Shane and Test - "When Stone Cold booked that recoculated match!!!"

      Anyone know what it means?


    RiCOCKulous, y'know instead of RiDICulous. I know a ton of poeple who say that all the time.


Ah... THAT'S what he was saying. Thanks for clearing it up. I never understand song lyrics, either.



-- Asteroid Boy


Wiener of the day: 23.7.02

"My brother saw the Undertaker walking through an airport." - Rex
"Was he no-selling?" - Me


Kevintripod
Andouille








Since: 11.5.03
From: Mount Pleasant, Pa.

Since last post: 4 days
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#42 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.45
    Originally posted by Kevintripod
    Even if they decide to turn Michaels heel, fans will still cheer him and boo Goldberg just like they did when Goldberg wrestled the Rock.


I dunno, as long as they actually book Michaels as a heel they should be able to pull it off. Hell even have Michaels start off face in the match and book a fairly even match until Evolution run in and beat the jeebus out of Goldberg. Michaels then makes to lay out Flair with a chair before turning and beating on an already bloody Goldberg. Voila! Insta-face sympathy for young Bill.


Shawn Michaels is practically a God in fans eyes (no pun intended).......he will never get full heel heat. Fans will end up boo-ing Goldberg just like they boo-ed him when he wrestled Rock.



"This just got a hell of a lot better." - Stifler, American Pie
Tenken347
Boudin blanc








Since: 27.2.03
From: Parts Unknown

Since last post: 3 days
Last activity: 3 hours
#43 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.57
The real thing about Austin stunnering Stacy, the thing that really upset me, is that afterwards, he looks at the camera and shrugs, and he has this look on his face like, "Hey, what a lovable scamp I am! Also, I beat women!" What, I ask you, what the hell is up with that?
geemoney
Scrapple








Since: 26.1.03
From: Naples, FL

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 11 hours
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#44 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.04
Austin's whole gimmick is that he's an asshole, and he does "what he wants, when he wants." Wasn't that a phrase of his? I think it's just funny Austin would get mad over someone not liking beer.
Madame Manga
Kolbasz








Since: 16.1.02
From: Silicon Valley

Since last post: 11 days
Last activity: 2 days
#45 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.41
    Originally posted by Tenken347
    The real thing about Austin stunnering Stacy, the thing that really upset me, is that afterwards, he looks at the camera and shrugs, and he has this look on his face like, "Hey, what a lovable scamp I am! Also, I beat women!" What, I ask you, what the hell is up with that?


Worse than disgusting, because it was confusing. Man beats up woman for no reason! Heel turn? Apparently not. Either because the rules have all changed, or because Austin is still booked as entirely above the law, which reminds me exactly why I never liked him EXCEPT as a heel. A "face" who can always be as big a jerk as he wants to be and get away with it is nothing but a spoiler for every other character and storyline.

MM
darkmatcher
Bockwurst








Since: 12.2.03
From: New York, USA

Since last post: 2488 days
Last activity: 1563 days
#46 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.32
    Originally posted by Kevintripod
    Shawn Michaels is practically a God in fans eyes (no pun intended).......he will never get full heel heat.


Unless they bring him to Montreal, of course.




YO MAMA
Tribal Prophet
Andouille








Since: 9.1.02
From: Winnipeg, MB, Canada

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 7 hours
#47 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.21
    Originally posted by geemoney
    Austin's whole gimmick is that he's an asshole, and he does "what he wants, when he wants." Wasn't that a phrase of his? I think it's just funny Austin would get mad over someone not liking beer.


Shit, I remember back when Austin would get mad at people who GAVE him the beer! You know what, that was also when he was at his best. His problem is that he's gotten so watered down the past few years (ever since the moment he came out and defended a kid on RAW when a fake Santa was rude) that he needs to go back to being unstable. No faces fear him anymore because he's always on their side. Of course, none of this will work if Jim Ross can't keep his relationship with life-partner Austin to himself for more that 5 minutes at a time.

I say let him go back to just snapping on people for no good reason.

No, I don't care that Stacy got stunnered either, or that Austin was the one that did it. Stacy's been getting the shit kicked out of her week in and week out for months now, and I don't feel cool calling Austin names like "Shit eating cockmaster" It's a wrestling tv show. I hope he stuns her again next week when he goes to apologize.


Tribal Prophet



Wrestling exists in the eternal present. What is, has always been, and when it no longer is, it never was. It has no past and no future, and sometimes even today is in question. - Madame Manga

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Nate The Snake
Liverwurst








Since: 9.1.02
From: Wichita, Ks

Since last post: 3560 days
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#48 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.45
    Originally posted by Madame Manga
    Worse than disgusting, because it was confusing. Man beats up woman for no reason! Heel turn? Apparently not. Either because the rules have all changed, or because Austin is still booked as entirely above the law, which reminds me exactly why I never liked him EXCEPT as a heel. A "face" who can always be as big a jerk as he wants to be and get away with it is nothing but a spoiler for every other character and storyline.

    MM


I think it may well mean a change of some sort for Austin... not because he stunnered Stacey, randomly attacking people has been a part of Steve Austin's character for just about as long as he's been "Stone Cold". They don't call him "The Rattlesnake" because JR wears boots made out of his skin. (And for the record, I do think something like that should be a heel thing... the problem is, Austin was too much fun a heel to stay one.)

But that whole bit after Jericho's "save Trish" segment... there was something to the way Austin was acting there. "People 'round here need to lighten up" with that big, kinda odd smile... I was thinking double-turn there for a bit, but now I'm not so sure what it means. If it were just the dialogue I could blame it on wierd writing, but it was the way Austin was playing it that struck me as strange.



Kansas-born and deeply ashamed
The last living La Parka Marka

"They that can give up essential liberty to gain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin
TheLurkingHorror
Bauerwurst








Since: 14.7.03

Since last post: 3709 days
Last activity: 3709 days
#49 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.00
    Originally posted by Madame Manga
    Worse than disgusting, because it was confusing. Man beats up woman for no reason! Heel turn? Apparently not. Either because the rules have all changed, or because Austin is still booked as entirely above the law, which reminds me exactly why I never liked him EXCEPT as a heel. A "face" who can always be as big a jerk as he wants to be and get away with it is nothing but a spoiler for every other character and storyline.

    MM


Shades of grey! Have you not listened to Russo in the last five years? I didn't have a problem. If people are upset over a Stunner to a woman, I don't know how they coped when the Dudleys were continually putting women through tables a few years ago. The whole angle is that Jericho is building a group of people who are unsatisfied with Austin as GM. Now you can add Stacy to that group.

    Originally posted by darkmatcher
    Unless they bring him to Montreal, of course.


Well, I'd normally say that, but he received a huge pop at No Way Out, and that was in Montreal. In fact, it was one of the biggest face reactions of the night. I think Montreal is over it as far as HBK is concerned.
darkdragoon
Bockwurst








Since: 26.8.02

Since last post: 3508 days
Last activity: 3508 days
#50 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.00
[quote Net Hack Slasher. One of the first moves out of the gate was the belly to belly by Steiner (didn't reports say that move was banned? !



but it was a side one...not overhead.
SirBubNorm
Salami








Since: 2.1.02
From: Under the table

Since last post: 3404 days
Last activity: 3354 days
#51 Posted on
Do you think the reason everyone is so confused on this one, is because they may actually be showing signs of forward thinking? I mean we already have a match for a PPV that's 5 weeks out (and isn't the "next" PPV on the WWE schedule). We have the whole little Johnny thing. Austin's doing the "slow" burn towards heeldom (Yeah you've got the whole Stacey thing which every one has mentioned, but you've also got the fact that when asked about the car that almost ran over Goldberg, he just blew the whole thing off. Lance Storm can attest to the fact that he didn't do that last time ) We've got the whole Nature Boy/Shawn Michaels/Maven/Orton thing which just screams of Maven and Orton ending up on one side and Flair and Michaels on the other...




Dilbert's Words Of Wisdom: You've just got to accept the fact that some days you're the pigeon, and others you're the statue.
Madame Manga
Kolbasz








Since: 16.1.02
From: Silicon Valley

Since last post: 11 days
Last activity: 2 days
#52 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.41
    Originally posted by TheLurkingHorror
    Shades of grey! Have you not listened to Russo in the last five years?


Five years ago, I wasn't watching wrestling. I don't see that as shades of gray. I see that as "Austin is God". A deus ex machina with a beer in his hand isn't good characterization; it's boring to watch him always come out on top. But I realize that many people are content to worship at his altar and that he still pulls in fans. He can be very entertaining--he's a talented guy. Unfortunately, the way his character is treated these days drains all the possible excitement out of his segments--they are dull retreads of all his past successes.


    I didn't have a problem. If people are upset over a Stunner to a woman, I don't know how they coped when the Dudleys were continually putting women through tables a few years ago.


Is this a good time to mention that I'm not fond of the Duds either except as heels? This isn't about trained women wrestlers taking bumps; this is about balance. In that respect, untouchable, godlike characters throw everything out of whack. Even if Austin makes a heel turn, can you really say he will ever get a storyline comeuppance of any kind?

MM
TheLurkingHorror
Bauerwurst








Since: 14.7.03

Since last post: 3709 days
Last activity: 3709 days
#53 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.00
    Originally posted by Madame Manga
    Five years ago, I wasn't watching wrestling. I don't see that as shades of gray. I see that as "Austin is God". A deus ex machina with a beer in his hand isn't good characterization; it's boring to watch him always come out on top. But I realize that many people are content to worship at his altar and that he still pulls in fans. He can be very entertaining--he's a talented guy. Unfortunately, the way his character is treated these days drains all the possible excitement out of his segments--they are dull retreads of all his past successes.


My Russo comment was a little tongue-in-cheek, I think there needs to be a sarcasm detector built in on the board. Anyway, his character has always been like that, it's that very essence that draws the fans in unfortunately.


    Is this a good time to mention that I'm not fond of the Duds either except as heels? This isn't about trained women wrestlers taking bumps; this is about balance. In that respect, untouchable, godlike characters throw everything out of whack. Even if Austin makes a heel turn, can you really say he will ever get a storyline comeuppance of any kind?

    MM


Well, the Duds were heels when they were putting Terri et al through tables, so they don't really change much from heel to face except for their trademark spots. There is a slight resemblance in that regard between the Duds and Austin.

I was under the impression that it was the male on female violence that was upsetting people, not the characterisation of Austin in this instance. You're right though, Austins character is detrimental to the show at the moment, due to the fact the logical outcome of this storyline won't happen.



oldschoolhero
Knackwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: nWo Country

Since last post: 1799 days
Last activity: 1733 days
#54 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.59
The problem is the inconsistent storytelling. One of the crucial reasons for the fans' supposed hatred of both Test and Scott Steiner is that they physically abuse Stacy. Then Austin does the exact same thing to the exact same woman, and whaaa? How are you supposed to react? Is he a heel? Well, that makes no sense. Is he still a face? Well there goes Test and Steiner's heel cred, as well as JR's for being so damn anti-abuse the previous week. Unless it's leading somewhere serious (ie. the aforementioned Austin heel turn), which I doubt, then it's some of the worst storytelling the fed's done in recent months. And that's saying something.



And Lo, The Urine Shall Flow Freely In The Aisles, As Small Children And Frail Old Ladies Flee Before The Brutality, The Might, The Sheer Viciousness...Of ~EVIL COACH~!

BoromirMark
Potato korv








Since: 8.5.02
From: Milan-Ann Arbor, MI

Since last post: 83 days
Last activity: 83 days
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#55 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.53
The storytelling was a bit confusing, to be sure, especially with Austin coming down ostensibly to stop Steiner from doing anything to Stacy.

But as Tribal Prophet said, this is old skool Austin. He may be a face, but he's a face that DTA and nobody is safe around him. He offered a gesture of goodwill to Stacy, the beer, and she didn't like it. The beer was 'disgusting'. You don't insult Austin's beer, KICK WHAM STUNNER. And I second Tribal Prophet's, in that it would be funny if she got stunnered again when he went to apologize. It's AUSTIN. He rules. End of story.

(edited by BoromirMark on 15.10.03 1550)


"People use freedom of speech to make up for freedom of thought, which they lack." - Kierkegaard
emma
Cherries > Peaches








Since: 1.8.02
From: Phoenix-ish

Since last post: 23 days
Last activity: 5 hours
#56 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.47
    Originally posted by geemoney
    Austin's whole gimmick is that he's an asshole, and he does "what he wants, when he wants." Wasn't that a phrase of his?
Actually, "What I Wanna Do, When I Wanna Do It" is a HHH T-shirt (shopzone.wwe.com). (I don't recall Austin using it, but that doesn't mean it didn't happen.)


On the bigger question of Austin stunnering Stacy:

Stacy is not a wrestler (in plotline, even though she may be able to take the occasional bump in reality). Male wrestlers exercising extreme physicality against non-wrestler women is "a bad thing", & should always garner the reaction of "He's a bad (or psycho) guy." Never "It was funny. He's so cool."

More importantly though, Stacy was just standing there, declining to do what some guy wanted her to. That is never-ever an acceptable provocation for a man to inflict violence on a woman. If your girlfriend doesn't want to give you a blow job, should you slap her arond a bit? Oh, only if you're really cool, like Austin. Then it'd be funny. Hey, maybe if you go ahead & do that, it'll automatically make you cool, like Austin. Well there you go then.

Bad, bad message. Not acceptable.
darkmatcher
Bockwurst








Since: 12.2.03
From: New York, USA

Since last post: 2488 days
Last activity: 1563 days
#57 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.32
    Originally posted by emma
    More importantly though, Stacy was just standing there, declining to do what some guy wanted her to. That is never-ever an acceptable provocation for a man to inflict violence on a woman. If your girlfriend doesn't want to give you a blow job, should you slap her arond a bit? Oh, only if you're really cool, like Austin. Then it'd be funny. Hey, maybe if you go ahead & do that, it'll automatically make you cool, like Austin. Well there you go then.

    Bad, bad message. Not acceptable.


Very good point, Emma..never mind the man who happens to be sending the message. And besides that, I don't recall Austin's face character EVER being about attacking innocent women. I seem to recall the only woman he ever attacked back then being Chyna-which was entirely different obviously, and I even remember in one of those incidents he being hesitant at first before stunning her when she didn't back off. So the "its old school Austin" arguement doesn't really work.
And hey, as I said, my problem was not with Stacy or women in general being attacked, it was with this particular situation..the hypocrisy, shitty message and overall pointlessness.

"Well, I'd normally say that, but he received a huge pop at No Way Out, and that was in Montreal. In fact, it was one of the biggest face reactions of the night. I think Montreal is over it as far as HBK is concerned."

Wasn't it in Montreal where they did the recent Raw addressing the screwjob on the Hi-lite Reel, where HBK received those heavy(and off-base) "you screw Bret" chants? Then again, maybe they were over it until WWE decided to remind them.

(edited by darkmatcher on 16.10.03 0015)


YO MAMA
Big G
Morcilla








Since: 21.8.03
From: the people who brought you Steel Magnolias....

Since last post: 12 days
Last activity: 5 hours
#58 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.03
    Originally posted by emma
    .... If your girlfriend doesn't want to give you a blow job, should you slap her arond a bit? ....


I can just see myself trying that on Mrs Big G. I'd be the one wearing a stunner (followed by a Peoples Elbow, Tombstone, Unprettier, Widowmaker, etc).



Warrior Quote: "Presuming initial consensualness, where exactly do we draw the lines of our judgment pinning down the responsibility and accountability inextricably attached to each human life? "

Umm Indeed!
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- count olaf, less than 1,000 seconds left! (2003)
Related threads: Test/Steiner/Stacy angle - RAW WORKRATE REPORT 10/6 - Raw 10-6-03 - More...
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