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2.10.14 0941
The W - Baseball - Pujols to Angels
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Corajudo
Frankfurter








Since: 7.11.02
From: Dallas, TX

Since last post: 85 days
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#1 Posted on
10 year, $250-260 million, full no-trade clause. Wow!

Link: http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=Ain6JlZFe5hEA9tKE_WwtLQRvLYF?slug=ti-brown_pujols_angels_agree_terms_120811
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thecubsfan
Scrapple
Moderator








Since: 10.12.01
From: Aurora, IL

Since last post: 21 hours
Last activity: 17 min.
#2 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.64
HOORAY!

(points and laughs at the poor Astros, who can't escape him)



thecubsfan.com - luchablog
StingArmy
Andouille








Since: 3.5.03
From: Georgia bred, you can tell by my Hawk jersey

Since last post: 53 days
Last activity: 2 days
#3 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.03
As a dedicated listener of The Dan LeBatard Show podcast, and someone who has been watching the Pujols sweepstakes with unusually high interest (unusually high for a Braves fan, at least), all I can say is: WOWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW. Did not expect this at all.

- StingArmy
lotjx
Scrapple








Since: 5.9.08

Since last post: 21 hours
Last activity: 19 min.
#4 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.09
Well, the AL West got a hundred times more interesting. The Angels are now a lock for the division.



The Wee Baby Sheamus.







Twitter: @realjoecarfley its a bit more toned down there. A bit.
It's False
Scrapple








Since: 20.6.02
From: I am the Tag Team Champions!

Since last post: 3 days
Last activity: 6 hours
#5 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.51
**passes out**

(Get back to me. I swear I'll have thoughts on this later, but holy shit, I'm speechless!)

EDIT:

Ok, I think I'm ready now.

Well...I had a feeling the Angels would look for a 1B, because we're going on two seasons now since Kendrys Morales (supposed future franchise player) hurt himself on a walk-off HR. And how THAT happens is anyone's guess, but yeah, the Kendrys Morales Era was clearly over as quickly as it started.

But I thought the Angels would be a front-runner in the Prince Fielder sweepstakes. I only heard yesterday that the Angels would be bidding on Pujols and I don't think anyone took it seriously at all. Of course, this isn't the first time the Angels swooped in out of nowhere and scooped up the year's #1 free agent. They did the same thing in '04 when Vlad Guerrero was a sure-thing for either the Yankees or Orioles. The Angels flew in out of nowhere and snapped him up to the shock of everyone, myself included.

This is Anaheim's A-Rod signing. Pujols has maybe five years left as a marquee position player before he can be shuffled away in the DH spot. The difference is, Anaheim's fanbase will LOVE Pujols and won't turn against him the way New York has occasionally turned on A-Rod. One of the supposed draws of Miami was that Pujols would have been the face of Latin America. Nuts to that, being in ANAHEIM will make Pujols just as big a face for Latin America, especially working under a Mexican owner. This is a very loyal fanbase and Pujols will be the most beloved player since Vlad.

Oh, and stealing C.J. Wilson from the Rangers? BEAUTIFUL! THAT is a better reason to pencil in the Angels for the playoffs. And hey, a nice way to pay them back for having Mike Napoli on their roster. But no one should be crowning the Angels champions. I'm not even going to do that. And here's why.

The Angels' bullpen still BLOWS! The bullpen was among the worst in the league last year and, to my knowledge, they've done NOTHING to address it. And considering they've just blown about $400M in free agency, I can't imagine they'll be signing anybody. They'd better hope Pujols can give them 10-2 or 7-0 leads every night, because that Angels bullpen is awful! The fact that Jordan Walden is an "All-Star closer" is a joke, because his 10+ blown saves last season murdered this team. That most of those blown saves came within striking distance of a playoff spot was particularly egregious.

All in all, I'm guessing I'll be putting money down for that Angels mini-plan, after all.

(edited by It's False on 8.12.11 0911)


"This is bad comedy."
El Nastio
Andouille








Since: 14.1.02
From: Ottawa Ontario, by way of Walkerton

Since last post: 11 days
Last activity: 21 hours
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#6 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.88
    Originally posted by It's False
    **passes out**

    (Get back to me. I swear I'll have thoughts on this later, but holy shit, I'm speechless!)


I was wondering what you'd say. Oh, and someone better check to make sure PeterStork didn't throw himself through a window.

Although at this point, the Cards have a good team even without Pujols. Now they have some cash to invest in some other players.

Meanwhile, the Angel signing him for 10 years isn't a huge huge deal when you can hide him in the DH spot.
DrDirt
Banger








Since: 8.10.03
From: flyover country

Since last post: 16 days
Last activity: 3 hours
#7 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.71
As El Nastio said re the DH, Pujols moving to the AL makes sense for him and works for the Angels. While sad and upset, realistic Card fans have to understand that that huge an investment just wasn't good baseball management. they now have the money to get younger and overall better.

And this DOESN'T make them a lock to win the division, even with the rotation they now have. It certainly helps but things happen.



Perception is reality
El Nastio
Andouille








Since: 14.1.02
From: Ottawa Ontario, by way of Walkerton

Since last post: 11 days
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#8 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.88
And now the Angels sign AJ Burne....er, CJ Wilson.

Click Here (tracking.si.com)
BigDaddyLoco
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02

Since last post: 21 hours
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#9 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.67
10 year deals are terrible in general. Seattle better get serious about Prince.
Big Bad
Scrapple








Since: 4.1.02
From: Dorchester, Ontario

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 1 day
#10 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.70
Wow, what a stunner. I genuinely didn't think Pujols would leave St. Louis unless a dumb team drastically overpaid him....and along came the Angels.

Pujols may have already begun his decline phase, as last season was the second-worst of his career. Now, 'worst' is very relative, of course, since basically Pujols had a rough six weeks to start the year and was his usual superstar self afterwards, but still, when you're paying a guy $25 million a year for the next decade, you want every assurance he's still in his prime.

Say, for instance, Pujols only has five superstar years left. Then he's a huge millstone on the LAA payroll for the remaining five years. Angels fans might resent this, whereas Cardinals fans would've been "well, it's Albert, he's earned it." That's the danger in going to a new team and a new market with suddenly monster expectations.

Expect LAA to start shopping Trumbo, Morales, Hunter and Abreu to free up some payroll and/or space in the OF/DH areas.



"It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone." --- Bart Giamatti, on baseball
PeterStork
Sujuk








Since: 25.1.02
From: Chicagoland with Hoosiers, or "The Region"

Since last post: 20 days
Last activity: 6 days
#11 Posted on
    Originally posted by El Nastio
      Originally posted by It's False
      **passes out**

      (Get back to me. I swear I'll have thoughts on this later, but holy shit, I'm speechless!)


    I was wondering what you'd say. Oh, and someone better check to make sure PeterStork didn't throw himself through a window.


Meh.

The only factor that sucks is the injured legacy. The Cardinals are not a better team, nor as good of a team, without him, but anyone who thinks they will take a giant tumble have not paid close attention. The Birds are in decent shape, and now have flexibility to lock up some guys like Molina and Waino that were coming up on big paydays themselves (though nowhere in the same ballpark, particularly Yadi.)

I was willing to defend the Cardinals' offer, but only for them: eating a few years on the back end to ensure a two decade career and a ridiculous legacy that will sell tickets fifty years after you retire (see: Musial, Stan) is a fair deal for the Cards. But for no one else. Albert's production will be worth it in the short term, and 27 or 28 mil a year for a few would be eye-raising but not laughable. But this is much worse; try to make a case that it's no different than deferring money until after a five or six year contract, then you're looking at more than 30 a year for the prime years of the deal. Which are not the prime years of Albert's career...those are fading. I wouldn't have liked this money for the Cardinals, who gain much more from the deal than the Angels. For LAA, it's not good at all, and while it won't be the stumbling block it would've been for the soon-to-be oh-my-god-what-have-we-just-done Marlins, I don't think Halo fans will look kindly on this in years to come (see: Soriano, Alfonso.)

(Edit to delete horrible CJ Wilson math...brain go wacko.)

(edited by PeterStork on 8.12.11 1627)
It's False
Scrapple








Since: 20.6.02
From: I am the Tag Team Champions!

Since last post: 3 days
Last activity: 6 hours
#12 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.51
    Originally posted by Big Bad
    Say, for instance, Pujols only has five superstar years left. Then he's a huge millstone on the LAA payroll for the remaining five years. Angels fans might resent this, whereas Cardinals fans would've been "well, it's Albert, he's earned it." That's the danger in going to a new team and a new market with suddenly monster expectations.

Angels fans are pretty baseball-savvy, so if Pujols gives us five years, we'll be on that "well, it's Albert, he's earned it" train. Unless he tanks overnight (and it'd have to be a drastic tank, because he was still pretty damn good last year), then I won't worry about this. We're not talking about Vernon Wells here.

Oh, and if the Angels REALLY want to work some offseason magic, they'll box up Vernon Wells in a crate and load him up on the next available freighter, Indiana Jones-style.




"This is bad comedy."
JayJayDean
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02
From: Seattle, WA

Since last post: 29 days
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Y!:
#13 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.97
Here's what kills me about this. The Cardinals offered Albert $220 mil for 10 years (allegedly), but he signed with LA for more money. EXCEPT that according to bestplaces.net, when you compare the value of $22 million in St. Louis, it says to make the same value in Los Angeles you would have to make $35.96 million. So doing the math...

St. Louis offered $220 million.
An equivalent offer in LA would be worth $359.6 million.
The Angels offered $250 million.

Did the Angels somehow get $100 million worth of bargain here?

(For further reference, $25 million in LA is equal value to $15.3 million in St. Louis.)

I realize that there IS a point where you have enough money that stuff like this doesn't matter, but still...that is a LOT of difference.



Holy fuck shit motherfucker shit. Read comics. Fuck shit shit fuck shit I sold out when I did my job. Fuck fuck fuck shit fuck. Sorry had to do it....

*snip*

Revenge of the Sith = one thumb up from me. Fuck shit. I want to tittie fuck your ass.
-- The Guinness. to Cerebus
PeterStork
Sujuk








Since: 25.1.02
From: Chicagoland with Hoosiers, or "The Region"

Since last post: 20 days
Last activity: 6 days
#14 Posted on
    Originally posted by JayJayDean
    Here's what kills me about this. The Cardinals offered Albert $220 mil for 10 years (allegedly), but he signed with LA for more money. EXCEPT that according to bestplaces.net, when you compare the value of $22 million in St. Louis, it says to make the same value in Los Angeles you would have to make $35.96 million. So doing the math...

    St. Louis offered $220 million.
    An equivalent offer in LA would be worth $359.6 million.
    The Angels offered $250 million.

    Did the Angels somehow get $100 million worth of bargain here?

    (For further reference, $25 million in LA is equal value to $15.3 million in St. Louis.)

    I realize that there IS a point where you have enough money that stuff like this doesn't matter, but still...that is a LOT of difference.


To take it further:

    Originally posted by Joe Strauss of the Post-Dispatch on Twitter
    Given its tax ramifications and structure, value of Marlins' bid for Pujols north of Angels' winning bid, (believed around $255 million.)


Of course, that didn't include a no-trade, so there's some logic there.

DrDirt
Banger








Since: 8.10.03
From: flyover country

Since last post: 16 days
Last activity: 3 hours
#15 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.71
Gentlemen you raise valid numerical points regarding what each deal was really worth. But is that really the point for Pujols. He is still taking home a load that he would be hard pressed to ever spend.

Isn't your importance (greatness) based on the actual total dollar amount, not your net? isn't it the SIZE of the contract?



Perception is reality
JayJayDean
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02
From: Seattle, WA

Since last post: 29 days
Last activity: 14 hours
AIM:  
Y!:
#16 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.97
    Originally posted by DrDirt
    Gentlemen you raise valid numerical points regarding what each deal was really worth. But is that really the point for Pujols. He is still taking home a load that he would be hard pressed to ever spend.

    Isn't your importance (greatness) based on the actual total dollar amount, not your net? isn't it the SIZE of the contract?


I don't disagree, but since he's not getting A-Rod money (so he's not getting "the biggest contract in the history of the sport"), then it seems like someone should've mentioned those figures to him.

Of course, it's entirely possible that Albert decided "saying he got a $250 million contract and disappointing St. Louis fans" > "taking a 'less on paper/more in value'-contract and making Cardinal fans happy".



Holy fuck shit motherfucker shit. Read comics. Fuck shit shit fuck shit I sold out when I did my job. Fuck fuck fuck shit fuck. Sorry had to do it....

*snip*

Revenge of the Sith = one thumb up from me. Fuck shit. I want to tittie fuck your ass.
-- The Guinness. to Cerebus
Mr. Boffo
Scrapple








Since: 24.3.02
From: Oshkosh, WI

Since last post: 430 days
Last activity: 391 days
#17 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.28
Deadspin reported 2 weeks ago that Pujols' agent has a mountain of debt that he hopes to pay off with the 4 or 5 percent that he gets from the contract. The agent would obviously want the biggest contract value he could get, and since Pujols obviously trusts him, perhaps he could be convince that the Angels deal is the best one.
Reverend J Shaft
Liverwurst








Since: 25.6.03
From: Home of The Big House

Since last post: 3 days
Last activity: 20 hours
#18 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.52
    Originally posted by JayJayDean
    Here's what kills me about this. The Cardinals offered Albert $220 mil for 10 years (allegedly), but he signed with LA for more money. EXCEPT that according to bestplaces.net, when you compare the value of $22 million in St. Louis, it says to make the same value in Los Angeles you would have to make $35.96 million. So doing the math...

    St. Louis offered $220 million.
    An equivalent offer in LA would be worth $359.6 million.
    The Angels offered $250 million.

    Did the Angels somehow get $100 million worth of bargain here?

    (For further reference, $25 million in LA is equal value to $15.3 million in St. Louis.)

    I realize that there IS a point where you have enough money that stuff like this doesn't matter, but still...that is a LOT of difference.


The problem with that comparison is that it's comparing salaries with respect to a cost of living index. When you're talking about moderate incomes it's a valid comparison because there are certain things that everyone needs that is essential to the "cost of living".

But when you're talking obscene numbers like Pujols' contract, it doesn't really equate because he's not going to eat 50 meals a day, buy 7 houses, use 24 jigowatts(!!) of energy a month, or buy 50 cars (though if he was a car collector as many athletes are, I doubt there's much difference in price by state when you're talking premium cars).

Plus, he probably isn't going to spend all of his cash during his career, so he can live wherever he wants after his career is over.

But in case Aramis Ramirez is listening, I'm sure the Tigers would offer you 3 yrs./$30 mil. which, according to that site, equates to well north of the $40-45 mil. you are reportedly demanding if you were to stay in Chicago. :)
El Nastio
Andouille








Since: 14.1.02
From: Ottawa Ontario, by way of Walkerton

Since last post: 11 days
Last activity: 21 hours
ICQ:  
#19 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.88
He's going to be 42 at the end of this deal. Yes, he's super human. Yes, he effectively has already had a Hall of Fame career at the age of THIRTY TWO.

42 is still an old, old age. We can see with the Yankees last year what happens with aging stars.

It's possible that Pujols wanted that 10 year deal, but figured eventually it's in his best interest to eventually be able to DH, or be able to rotate games into the DH spot at some point to save wear and tear.

Fielder is laughing to the bank now, because other AL West teams might react by giving him more money.

(edited by El Nastio on 8.12.11 1431)
StingArmy
Andouille








Since: 3.5.03
From: Georgia bred, you can tell by my Hawk jersey

Since last post: 53 days
Last activity: 2 days
#20 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.03
Where does Pujols live now? St. Louis? Wherever it is, I see no reason to believe he moves his primary residence. Many (if not most) pro athletes who establish their careers in one city continue to live there even after they get traded or sign elsewhere. I see no reason to expect Pujols to do differently.

- StingArmy
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Rob Dibble, of all people, was very good talking about this on the Kornheiser show today. (I've not yet listened to the tape of the Patrick show, to see how he was on there.)
Related threads: Ervin Santana throws no hitter vs. Indians - Kendrys Morales out for the season...again - Angels trade for Dan Haren - More...
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