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The W - Current Events & Politics - Powell's Iraq Case (Page 3)
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Net Hack Slasher
Banger








Since: 6.1.02
From: Outer reaches of your mind

Since last post: 3498 days
Last activity: 1918 days
#41 Posted on
I'm a little scared to say this but I agree with OSH. I still don't see the necessary connection between 9/11 and Saddam Hussan or Iraq. 9/11 was a huge tragedy but taking that date and giving a free pass to attack any country you have a problem with doesn't seem to work.

This is very Minority Reportish, you are attacking someone for something that hasn't happened yet and you suspect it happen. This wouldn't hold up at any court of law in America, but speculation of what might happen is enough reasoning to have a full out attack on someone.

If that is the case, why not attack North Korea, how about attacking the Soviet Union and dropping bombs over Moscow during the cold war.

Atleast a decade ago you had Saddams men marching into Kuwait. What do you have now. America is being the aggressor, it looks really bad.

Lets call it as it is. This isn't protecting America, this is all about Oil. Bush wants oil, Iraq has it. If he can control Iraq he has the supply that he wants and he doesn't have to worry about pain in the ass trading partners like The Saudi's, or the environmentalist in Alaska. And I didn't even mention the headaches with Venezuela right now.



Oh they have the internet on computers now!
PalpatineW
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Getting Rowdy

Since last post: 2739 days
Last activity: 2581 days
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#42 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.44

    Originally posted by Net Hack Slasher
    Lets call it as it is. This isn't protecting America, this is all about Oil. Bush wants oil, Iraq has it. If he can control Iraq he has the supply that he wants and he doesn't have to worry about pain in the ass trading partners like The Saudi's, or the environmentalist in Alaska. And I didn't even mention the headaches with Venezuela right now.


Ah yes, oil. You know we get most of our oil from Venezuela? Here, let me posit a couple hypotheticals for you.

1.) Bush, in a "humanitarian" move, drops sanctions against Iraq. Saddam gives us oil in exchange.

2.) Bush takes over Iraq, gets oil.

Given the world climate, I think number one is much easier. The French would no doubt love us for it, as they get a good amount of oil from Iraq, as I believe the Russians do also.

This war might involve oil interests, but they are not American.



Damn your eyes!
TheBucsFan
TheChiefsFan








Since: 2.1.02

Since last post: 40 min.
Last activity: 1 min.
#43 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.42
"And, Bucs: You think American is trying to take over the world? Check the facts. What happened after WWII? Last I checked, the Soviets took over huge swaths of land, while the Americans REBUILT EFFING EUROPE, so they could oppose us decades later. If we were truly an Imperial nation, we would have done exactly what the Soviets did, and there would be no France or Germany today. And if we wanted Empire, why go through the freaking UN? If we wanted to take over the whole Middle East, we would have done it by now. Who is going to stop us, Canada and it's 55,000 man army? The case that America is an imperialist nation has zero grounding. Our history is rife with opportunities for land grabs and massive imperialism (remember, we had the nuke before anyone else), and we passed up on them."

I didn't mean to say the US was trying to take over the world. I was pointing outthe double standard of whomever posted what I was responding to, saying that mass killings would be excusable for America.

And America being friendly pre- and post-WWII is completely irrelevant. I wish this country had the attitude now that it appears to have had back then.
PalpatineW
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Getting Rowdy

Since last post: 2739 days
Last activity: 2581 days
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#44 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.44
Again, you're not looking to merit or motive. I will agree that all killing is a loathsome thing. I will not agree that all killing is wrong. Is it wrong to shoot a man who is trying to rape your wife?

Granted, that analogy is not perfect, but it does (I hope) prove my point that killing is sometimes necessary.

What if the DC sniper was using a human shield, and the only way to take him down was to take the human shield with him? Would that be justified? I say yes. I suspect you disagree.

And America's track record after WWII is completely relevant; it refutes your (later-retracted) claim that we're an Imperialist nation.

(edited by PalpatineW on 9.2.03 1459)


Damn your eyes!
oldschoolhero
Knackwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: nWo Country

Since last post: 1896 days
Last activity: 1830 days
#45 Posted on
"And America's track record after WWII is completely relevant; it refutes your (later-retracted) claim that we're an Imperialist nation."

Although I do agree that America is not an Imperialist nation-just an arrogant one-I do have counterpoint to this. Using past track records is pointless when debating America's current actions; the entire argument for Iraq is based around preventative measures and sensible action to protect future interests. Now, correct me if I'm wrong, but there was little long-term thinking dedicated to the decision to, y'know, ARM certain Middle Eastern despots during the Cold War.





"Here's the thing: I don't give a tupenny f*ck about your moral conundrum, you meatheaded shit-sack. That's pretty much the thing." Daniel Day-Lewis as Bill "The Butcher" Cutting, Gangs Of New York. You'd be surprised at how many statements this can be used as a response to.

PalpatineW
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Getting Rowdy

Since last post: 2739 days
Last activity: 2581 days
AIM:  
#46 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.44
    Originally posted by oldschoolhero
    "And America's track record after WWII is completely relevant; it refutes your (later-retracted) claim that we're an Imperialist nation."

    Although I do agree that America is not an Imperialist nation-just an arrogant one-I do have counterpoint to this. Using past track records is pointless when debating America's current actions; the entire argument for Iraq is based around preventative measures and sensible action to protect future interests. Now, correct me if I'm wrong, but there was little long-term thinking dedicated to the decision to, y'know, ARM certain Middle Eastern despots during the Cold War.




I think the US was more concerned with keeping the rest of Europe, and the world, out from under the Iron Curtain at the time. So maybe we can accuse US leadership of lack of foresight, but arrogance? The Cold War was as much for Europe's freedom as America's.

(edited by PalpatineW on 9.2.03 1729)


Damn your eyes!
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