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25.10.14 0403
The W - CRZ's World - OUTSOURCED POSITION OF THE DAY
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CRZ
Big Brother
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Since: 9.12.01
From: ミネアポリス

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#1 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.07
ME.

It's been eight days that I've known about this now, so I REALLY should make a post about this and get it all out there. Last Monday, my vice president and our HR rep come in and close the door, and if you've ever had this happen to you, you probably know the feeling I got. I'll put this in hide tags so the search engines can't pick it up... { Sorry, you must be logged in to see this text! } Setting aside what a genius cost-cutting manoeuvre this is and focusing more attention on how this affects ME, my last day working here is Monday the 3d. Of course, there's some severance involved (and of course, it's not as much as it was before the multiple times they've amended the severance program, go figure) and I had a lot of vacation time in the bank, so I shouldn't be stone cold broke on the 4th, but I'd still like to think I'll have another job BEFORE then if possible.

Realistically, this is Silicon Valley and while the economy IS better, it's not SO much better that people can add headcount - companies have been operating on the theory that their existing people can work a little bit harder, and usually that's worked out for them. There's also the fact that new hires typically aren't going to come in at the senior level, and I now have ...yikes, NINE years of experience, so you can imagine there's not a LOT out there specifically tailored to a candidate like ME. I'll still do some applying at the biggies - Google, Yahoo!, eBay and Apple - and see if anything presents itself, but without an in it can be pretty difficult.

So that's the downside. The upside is *I* have chosen to look at this as "wow, I'm being given a wad of money to go find a BETTER job at a place that might actually APPRECIATE me!" And hopefully that'll be just what happens. At any rate, there's plenty of time left before I have to panic. ;-)

The server can't stay here, however. Aaron and I are looking for places and I think I've found one that'll do what we want without breaking the bank. More on that in a couple weeks.

Of course, as part of my extensive networking process I must make notice here that anyone who might have a lead for me is heartily encouraged to check out my public resume here (resumes.hotjobs.com) or bug me for the more private version.

Hopefully I'll have more better news really soon!



CRZ
Promote this thread!
Nate The Snake
Liverwurst








Since: 9.1.02
From: Wichita, Ks

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#2 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.90
Good luck, Zed.



Kansas-born and deeply ashamed
The last living La Parka Marka

"They that can give up essential liberty to gain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin
dMr
Andouille








Since: 2.11.02
From: Edinburgh, Scotland

Since last post: 46 days
Last activity: 2 days
#3 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.42
Aw man that sucks. Best of luck to you finding new employment. I've been scouring the job market over here for a few months now trying to line up a 'proper job' post graduation but to no avail yet.

Given that you're now gonna have to look for an alternative server (and more importantly one that ain't free) I seem to remember a few people saying a while back that they wouldn't mind making donations toward the running costs of such a thing should the need arise.

At the time I think Aaron said you didn't really want to go down that road incase people started to feel that you owed them something as a result.

Speaking personally anyway I'd like to say the offers there if you are gonna need help with running costs now, and the warm fuzzy feeling I get from being here is more than enough compensation for me

I'm pretty sure there's a fair few others that would also be willing to chip in with charitable donations, but if thats not the way you want to go then I'm not exactly averse to keeping my hard earned cash either :)



JoshMann
Andouille








Since: 17.11.03
From: Tallahassee, FL

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#4 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.56
    Originally posted by CRZ
    companies have been operating on the theory that their existing people can work a little bit harder, and usually that's worked out for them


Sounds like *my* office...we've lost 3 people out of a 15- person personnel staff in the last 60 days and I doubt they'll be replaced. Even though they quit for other positions as opposed to their jobs being outsourced or privatized.

Ironically, that's the very thing that's probably going to save my ass come June. But I've been a hell of a lot busier in the last month and have been given classification actions that I hadn't even seen before now.

But it could have been me too (and still could be...nothing's a mortal lock yet)...so I sympathize.

(edited by Blanket Jackson on 13.4.04 1507)


Ho-lee Mackinaw!
CRZ
Big Brother
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Since: 9.12.01
From: ミネアポリス

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#5 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.07
    Originally posted by Blanket Jackson
    Sounds like *my* office...
Yet here you are, posting from work again! ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-)



CRZ
redsoxnation
Scrapple








Since: 24.7.02

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#6 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.60
The way things are, we might all be working at 7-11's in India soon. Sucks about the job, but perhaps now is the time to remind the people at Titan Towers that you're services in influences the minds of consumers are available for the correct price. Weather's not as good, but at least you know the Earth won't swallow you up one day.



I want you to know, I agree with everything I just said.
JoshMann
Andouille








Since: 17.11.03
From: Tallahassee, FL

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#7 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.56
    Originally posted by CRZ
      Originally posted by Blanket Jackson
      Sounds like *my* office...
    Yet here you are, posting from work again! ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-)


Pot, meet kettle





Ho-lee Mackinaw!
CRZ
Big Brother
Administrator








Since: 9.12.01
From: ミネアポリス

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#8 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.07
    Originally posted by redsoxnation
    The way things are, we might all be working at 7-11's in India soon. Sucks about the job, but perhaps now is the time to remind the people at Titan Towers that you're services in influences the minds of consumers are available for the correct price. Weather's not as good, but at least you know the Earth won't swallow you up one day.
Believe it or not, I had already checked (hotjobs.yahoo.com) but didn't really see anything that applied to me. :)



CRZ
Nag
Landjager








Since: 10.1.03
From: Enter your city here

Since last post: 2179 days
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#9 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.40
Well there's an XO here in downtown Akron, maybe you can transfer. The weather avatars may lose the impact, but otherwise you will love it.

But seriously, I hate hearing that; really hate hearing that. I've just started working on a degree in CIS a year ago, and am pessimistic as hell about the future, but I'm too old to change now. They've been telling me for years, go technology, you can't go wrong son; so I went technology and the technology went to India. Hell, close to technology as I will get is pushing the new electronic shopping carts, made in India, at Wal-Mart. I know I'm going off on a tangent, but damn, this country is going straight to hell.

But best of luck to you, you got some good experience and your not too old, so you will bounce back.
Guru Zim
SQL Dejection
Administrator








Since: 9.12.01
From: Bay City, OR

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#10 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.83
This has nothing to do with India, btw.



Willful ignorance of science is not commendable. Refusing to learn teh difference between a credible source and a shill is criminally stupid.
tarnish
Frankfurter








Since: 13.2.02
From: Back in the Heart of Hali

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#11 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.03

That sucks, man. And here I thought maybe you'd managed to to find the "magic company" that might succeed at not laying everyone off for whatever reason.

But with Slowlaris 9 certification and Sendmail wizardry I suspect you'll be alright. I know you'd be fine up here in Canadia, where actual certified Solaris admins seem quite rare, but I don't suspect you're looking to leave Sunny California(tm).

You might consider seeking your way back to the wonderful and safe world of Academia. I find "living without stock options" to be bearable when it's tied to the concept of "paycheque never fails to show up."

If you weren't at XO just for the cash grab (i.e. you have no philosophical problem with working for another telco), I know that Bell Canada is always looking for Unix folk. Their mail system is quite a piece of work: 200+ 400-series Sun boxen running Intermail KX/MX, I think.

Anyways, I wish you the best of luck. If I hear/see/find anything I'll let you know. But I don't imagine the opposite part of the continent is really where you're looking




/tarnish...

Firstly, the only cavassing of users you should be doing is with a heavy tarpaulin, a stack of bricks and a deep stretch of water"
-- BOFH speaks the truth about surveys
StaggerLee
Scrapple








Since: 3.10.02
From: Right side of the tracks

Since last post: 7 days
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#12 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.49
ALl that computer talk is giving me a headache!

Anyhow, if your job is being relegated to a contractor, what are the chances of getting on with the contracting firm that is taking it over? Might mean a little less cash, but the comfort level would be there. I know a lot of Military guys who got out, and went right back to work, in the same shop, making comparable money.



Thank you for your irrelevant opinion.
SchippeWreck
Banger








Since: 26.3.03
From: Glendale, CA

Since last post: 4 days
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#13 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.76
    Originally posted by CRZ's resume
    -- preferably, a position whereby I am paid to be awesome


*Please* let me know if this line wins over any prospective employers!




"Self-esteem is for everybody,
Self-esteem is for everyone,
You can dream and be anybody,
But, self-esteem is how you get it done."
pieman
As young as
he feels








Since: 11.12.01
From: China, Maine

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#14 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.20

Much luck to you, Chris, in your career advancement. I met a similar fate back in the spring of 1984 after working in the public utility field for a couple of years. I had banked a lot vacation time and took the summer off. I happened onto healthcare that fall and have been happily employed in the healthcare field for almost 20 years. I hope your saga has a happy ending, too.




Gabba Gabba Hey!


cranlsn
Liverwurst








Since: 18.3.02
From: Sussex, WI

Since last post: 15 days
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#15 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.96

That.completely.sucks...

It always seems to be this time of year. Usually, I'm on the other side of the equation. Fortunately, or unfortunately depending on your position I suppose.

For what it's worth, I don't like it and I usually end up popping ulcer meds for a couple of weeks before and after.

You should land on your feet though. You (seemingly)have way too much knowledge not to. Good Luck.








EddieBurkett
Boudin blanc








Since: 3.1.02
From: GA in person, NJ in heart

Since last post: 7 days
Last activity: 3 hours
#16 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.14
Good luck with everything, sir. Unemployment is one of those mixed blessings. Enjoy all the free time before you get back to earning a paycheck. (Then again, it sounds like you had plenty of free time before...)

    Originally posted by Guru Zim
    This has nothing to do with India, btw.


This may have nothing to do with India, and I'm sure there are plenty others out there that don't, but India is getting all the public wrath because it puts a nice generic (ethnic) face on the problem. When I got laid off it had nothing to do with India, but its easy when reading about the off-shoring of jobs to get the impression that they have my job. At the very least, they had a job which I could have been applying for (or maybe someone else could have taken that job instead of competing with me for whatever openings were there). Although this week, Newsweek has an article about how lots of companies aren't happy with the results from Bangalore, and are bringing some jobs back. And Wired has been mentioning for a while how India is soon going to be replaced by the much cheaper Phillipines and China. So take that all for what its worth.



"Yeah, angles in the ring... someone thought of that a long time ago. They called it pro wrestling." -- the MCS

"I think mentally maybe I've just reached puberty." -- Vince McMahon (hollywoodreporter.com)

"How many poles did you get?"
"I got just enough for . . . ninja!"
The Thrill
Banger








Since: 16.4.02
From: Green Bay, WI

Since last post: 191 days
Last activity: 37 days
#17 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.25
New mandatory policy: From now until he's employed again, any Wiener going to a rasslin' show has to hold up a "HIRE CRZ" sign.

Seriously, best of luck, CRZ. And I looked...but I couldn't find an employment section of Packers.com. Sorry.



Star wipe, and...we're out.
Thrillin' ain't easy.



THE THRILL
ACW-NWA Wisconsin
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A2NWO 4 Life!
(Click the big G or here to hear the Packers Fight Song in RealAudio...or try .AU, .WAV or .MIDI!)
evilwaldo
Lap cheong








Since: 7.2.02
From: New York, NY

Since last post: 3409 days
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#18 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.00
    Originally posted by EddieBurkett
    Good luck with everything, sir. Unemployment is one of those mixed blessings. Enjoy all the free time before you get back to earning a paycheck. (Then again, it sounds like you had plenty of free time before...)

      Originally posted by Guru Zim
      This has nothing to do with India, btw.


    This may have nothing to do with India, and I'm sure there are plenty others out there that don't, but India is getting all the public wrath because it puts a nice generic (ethnic) face on the problem. When I got laid off it had nothing to do with India, but its easy when reading about the off-shoring of jobs to get the impression that they have my job. At the very least, they had a job which I could have been applying for (or maybe someone else could have taken that job instead of competing with me for whatever openings were there). Although this week, Newsweek has an article about how lots of companies aren't happy with the results from Bangalore, and are bringing some jobs back. And Wired has been mentioning for a while how India is soon going to be replaced by the much cheaper Phillipines and China. So take that all for what its worth.


This is probably getting a bit off topic but a lot of the outsourcing problem dates back to the Patriot Act which tightened visa rules. Most Indian comp-sci college students (foreign students for that matter) had to leave the US after finishing college rather than taking jobs with US firms. So they go back to India with their college degrees and have to do SOMETHING. Some started their own businesses and others went to work for Indian software companies. Being enterprising businessmen they realized that they had a very skilled workforce that was working for 1/5th the cost. So they started to market themselves and US companies listened. The Newsweek article is nothing more than pandering. Yes there have been some problems but they are isolated and the top 3 firms are still growing at a 25%+ clip with US companies beating on the doors. They are even opening offices in the US to try to counteract all the negative press.

Funny story, Accenture won a big outsourcing contract because they claimed that it was patriotic and it would create US jobs. After they signed the contract they send the jobs over to their Indian subsidiary.

But anyway, we should take this discussion to either the politics or Random forum as to not get that far off topic. I have a lot of experience in dealing with overseas workers and outsourcing and would be willing to share my experiences, good and bad.

Best of luck CRZ, I will post some tips when I get back from vacation as I am in the process of hiring someone and plan on job hunting soon. A friend of mine is a resume whiz who gave me a few excellent tips that I am willing to share.





Are you a professional halfwit or talented amateur?
Zeruel
Thirty Millionth Hit
Moderator








Since: 2.1.02
From: The Silver Spring in the Land of Mary.

Since last post: 2 days
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#19 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.05
One of those online airplane ticket companies had a call center in Charlottsville, VA and they outsourced to India and the town lost 200 jobs.

The Washington Post had an article about it a few weeks ago, I'll search their site and see if it's still there.

There IS a problem about computer jobs going to India. I am 30 creds short of my CMIS BS, but I swiched to Accounting. What's the point of getting my programming degree when there are no jobs? My neighbot 2 doors up has been looking for TWO YEARS for a job, and she was on the dean's list her jr and sr years of college, but no one is hiring in this area (east coast).




The Catastrophic Annihilation War Room

Freeway
Scrapple








Since: 3.1.02
From: Calgary

Since last post: 306 days
Last activity: 4 days
#20 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.45
    Originally posted by The Thrill
    New mandatory policy: From now until he's employed again, any Wiener going to a rasslin' show has to hold up a "HIRE CRZ" sign.


Done. See you on RAW next week.



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