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The W - Current Events & Politics - Obama approval rating drops (Page 2)
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lotjx
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Since: 5.9.08

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#21 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.82
    Originally posted by DrDirt
      Originally posted by lotjx
        Originally posted by DrDirt
          Originally posted by lotjx
          I doubt the American people would elect a guy who the moment Obama was elected stated he was going to succeed from the Union and also from a state like Texas that is perceived to be the home of the worst Presidents in history. The succession thing is a noose around him like Palin quitting. Perry can motivate the value conservatives, but I think fiscal ones would rather vote for a guy who didn't just send in his state spiraling into debt after cutting education, government jobs and so on.


        I believe, being from the state, that Ohio holds the distinction of producing the worst presidents, not Texas. And the SECEDING from the union statements really wont matter.


      Yeah it will, because it shows he has no desire what so ever with working with anyone not in the GOP. To win the Presidency you can't just appeal to the base. You have to be broader then just being conservative. The very idea he would succeed from this country is about as traitorous as you can get. To be fair as soon as he made those comments, I would have had the Reserves capture his ass and send it to Gitmo, but I am a person who shouldn't be President. It will hang on him as well as the 23 billion dollar debt. LBJ and two Bushes counter anything Ohio has.

      (edited by lotjx on 13.6.11 0951)


    I am not trolling but I am curious as to your visceral hate regarding the elder Bush and while LBJ has the albatross of Vietnam hanging around his neck, from 1964-1966, he managed to accomplish several major feats. While Bush the elder wasn't a top ten president, he was competent and overall did an adequate job.


Such a great job Bush Sr, he lost a landslide of re-election. He invented wars like Panama to make himself look strong. Then in Iraqi, he didn't finish the job all the while the Vodoo Economics of the 80s came home to roost. Yes, LBJ pushed through Civil Rights, but he had to. It was embarrassing for the United States to claim the USSR was this terrible place to live while the police were beating the crap out of people on live TV. Vietnam to me outweighs what little got accomplished in the Civil Rights Era.

(edited by lotjx on 13.6.11 1442)


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KJames199
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Since: 10.12.01
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#22 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.96
    Originally posted by lotjx
    Sounds like succession to me
Jiminy Christmas.

SECESSION. MEANING "TO SECEDE."
Sec19Row53
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Since: 2.1.02
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#23 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.24
    Originally posted by lotjx
    Sounds like succession to me as well as a threat.

Please do many of us a favor and look that word up in the dictionary.
wmatistic
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#24 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.08
    Originally posted by AWArulz
    want to identify the 23 billion in debt he created?

    I don't find it.

    Here's what I found - Governor since 2000

    from 2008 to 2010, as California lost 1.2 million jobs, Texas added 165,000.

    the state Senate passed $23 billion in cuts, and the state house $11 billion


    (edited by AWArulz on 13.6.11 1529)


Of course Texas added jobs, he created a perfect environment for businesses. Which ended up creating a ton of debt he couldn't pay for and now we get those "cuts" you mentioned which are killing our school system. Notice how the "cuts" you mentioned match the debt figure the other guy did? It's because state law says we can't have a budget deficit. So to make up for his retarded policies that yes attracted businesses, but screwed the rest of us with debt, he's cutting the hell out of school funding. Rather than change what clearly is a flawed idea, he'd rather screw over the kids. What a guy.

Plenty of other reasons I hate him, but you definitely don't want to try and paint his economic policies as a great model for America.



edit: although I did find one nice sidenote to his economic idiocy. After the fundamentalist McElroy rewrote our textbooks to be more Jesusy, at Rick's request, the state now can't pay for the new textbooks anyway.

(edited by wmatistic on 13.6.11 1410)
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Since: 9.12.01
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#25 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.69

    "Oh, I think there’s a lot of different scenarios," Perry said. "Texas is a unique place. When we came in the union in 1845, one of the issues was that we would be able to leave if we decided to do that.

    "You know, my hope is that America and Washington in particular pays attention. We’ve got a great union. There is absolutely no reason to dissolve it. But if Washington continues to thumb their nose at the American people, you know, who knows what may come out of that? So. But Texas is a very unique place and we’re a pretty independent lot to boot."


That's the statement.

http://www.politifact.com/texas/statements/2010/apr/22/rick-perry/gov-rick-perry-recaps-his-comment-texas-seceding-u/

At this time, the transcript is not available on the right links area, but the mp3 still is.




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Since: 28.1.02
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#26 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.07
Which I posted as well, a couple messages up.

But the context is that he was as a rally where there were a bunch of people shouting secede! secede! and he was being asked about it.

so he had to speak to it.

and, frankly, I don't see any issue with it. We are the United States, and if one (or more) of those states is no longer in Union, then they might go. One of the issues with the Civil war was that most people didn't get to vote for secession or anything, the state legislatures took it on themselves, and then there was the fighting and all of that.

I mean, I vote for California to secede right now. With my blessing.



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Since: 7.2.02

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#27 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.22
    Originally posted by AWArulz
    One of the issues with the Civil war was that most people didn't get to vote for secession or anything, the state legislatures took it on themselves, and then there was the fighting and all of that.


Given that both blacks and women couldn't vote, I would venture to say that MOST people couldn't have voted for secession regardless.

    Originally posted by AWArulz
    I mean, I vote for California to secede right now. With my blessing.


Hey, I'd vote for us to secede as well! Taking 13 percent of the US GDP with the 8th largest world economy without having to fund wars and such would probably be a boon for the state.

Hell, we might even be able to set our own functional immigration policy, no longer follow NAFTA, have Qualcomm, Apple, and Google all headquartered within the country of California. And it's not like we don't have a strong agricultural base. You just might be on to something.

Others can decide which of us is being more facetious.
DrDirt
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Since: 8.10.03
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#28 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.71
Lotjx, while I admire the passion a couple of facts. Bush the elder lost due to the economy and hardly in a landslide. If you look up the popular vote, Clinton won the electoral vote easily but the popular vote was split three ways. And what hurt him with the base was the "Read my lips, no new taxes," followed by raising taxes.

Whether or not you will concede the point, it took courage and a fair number of Republicans for LBJ to push through Civil Rights legislation. And I would encourage you to really study the history of the Vietnam and Cold War. Having the benefit of living through and being cognizant of events from JFK's assassination forward, I have the benefit of experience and the time to have considered what I lived through. This was a complex time involving much more than just Vietnam but Vietnam was the the focus.

Everyone is entitled to their views, but we must strive to base them in facts.



Perception is reality
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Since: 11.2.03
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#29 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.32
    Originally posted by AWArulz
    Which I posted as well, a couple messages up.

    But the context is that he was as a rally where there were a bunch of people shouting secede! secede! and he was being asked about it.

    so he had to speak to it.



Well, if one of us unpatriotic liberals had been at a rally where such a chant arose, I'm thinking he would have said something about loving this country and not being able to imagine leaving it.
AWArulz
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Since: 28.1.02
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#30 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.18
    Originally posted by Peter The Hegemon
      Originally posted by AWArulz
      Which I posted as well, a couple messages up.

      But the context is that he was as a rally where there were a bunch of people shouting secede! secede! and he was being asked about it.

      so he had to speak to it.



    Well, if one of us unpatriotic liberals had been at a rally where such a chant arose, I'm thinking he would have said something about loving this country and not being able to imagine leaving it.


Perhaps. But I would hope that any true American could echo these words, as do I:

"When....it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another..."

I don't think that is any less valid today than it was then.



We'll be back right after order has been restored here in the Omni Center.

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lotjx
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#31 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.83
    Originally posted by AWArulz
      Originally posted by Peter The Hegemon
        Originally posted by AWArulz
        Which I posted as well, a couple messages up.

        But the context is that he was as a rally where there were a bunch of people shouting secede! secede! and he was being asked about it.

        so he had to speak to it.



      Well, if one of us unpatriotic liberals had been at a rally where such a chant arose, I'm thinking he would have said something about loving this country and not being able to imagine leaving it.


    Perhaps. But I would hope that any true American could echo these words, as do I:

    "When....it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another..."

    I don't think that is any less valid today than it was then.[/q

    It is less valid. The problems we have as a country are not enough to break it apart. We are not as wealthy as we were before, deal with it. We are still better off then 90% of the planet. Yes, Education is in the crapper thanks to No Child Left Behind and Governors who think slashing education is somehow going to create jobs. That slashing any job is a good thing makes no sense.

    You don't like Obama, tough. We are stuck in a bunch of conflicts and half of those have nothing to do with the current leader, but the guy you people loved. It amazes me how the GOP switched from fighting freedom everywhere expect if there is a Democrat in the Presidency. Real patriotic. Yet, when he does get the guy behind it all, someone starts a thread ie this one where its treated as meaningless. If it was fucking meaningless why did we spend a trillion or so dollars in the first place?

    Even the GOP people I know thought the debate this week was a joke. Pepsi or Coke? Really? Really? At a time when we should rallying behind a President which we told we were supposed to do for Bush, we find the same people trying to destroy him. Its hypocrisy at its highest point. There is nothing going on right now that vindicates any of this crybaby states want to leave, because we have someone who actually wants to make sure we get healthcare. God damn him for making us more healthy. The only problem I see is a two party system designed now to tear us apart and a big part of that is coming from the GOP side. The Dems are guilty of this two, but they are not smart enough to know how to do it.

    (edited by lotjx on 16.6.11 1437)


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DrDirt
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Since: 8.10.03
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#32 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.71
The problem is not the two parties, the problem is us. If we demanded that they worked together and find solutions they would make the effort. If we thought and responded instead of feeling and reacting, we would have better pols in office.

I thought that a pretty substantial number of Dems voted to authorize the wars, not just W and the Reps. And I seem to recall some Republicans backing actions such as in Libya.

Both sides share a huge amount of the blame but we put them there. Remember the old saying: "We get the government we deserve."



Perception is reality
lotjx
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Since: 5.9.08

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#33 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.83
Republicans aren't backing Lybia and close to impeaching Obama over it. Dems stupidly thought voting for the war would save their careers and it didn't. The GOP used the no votes as campaign ads. The Iraqi war vote was more of if you want war Bush, we leave it up to you and wash our hands of it. Which again, the GOP used as ammunition. Yes, we deserve the government we get, but it doesn't help when one of those parties will destroy the country to get what they want while we play this game of "Oh all parties as bad as each other." Thats crap.



The Wee Baby Sheamus.

Twitter: @realjoecarfley its a bit more toned down there. A bit.
CRZ
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Since: 9.12.01
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#34 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.85
    Originally posted by lotjx
    Republicans aren't backing Lybia and close to impeaching Obama over it.
1. L-i-b-y-a
2. Dennis Kucinich is not a Republican.
3. Don't make me give you a timeout.



lotjx
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Since: 5.9.08

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#35 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.83
My bad and yes, I should have added the little man who has a ridiculous hot wife. The point is Obama has no real GOP support for a military effort.



The Wee Baby Sheamus.

Twitter: @realjoecarfley its a bit more toned down there. A bit.
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Since: 11.12.01
From: Catlin IL

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#36 Posted on

    Originally posted by lotjx
    Yes, LBJ pushed through Civil Rights, but he had to. It was embarrassing for the United States to claim the USSR was this terrible place to live while the police were beating the crap out of people on live TV. Vietnam to me outweighs what little got accomplished in the Civil Rights Era.


Ok, no.

Without LBJ, the Civil Rights acts of that time don't get passed at all. One of the biggest reasons Kennedy had him in as vice president was because JFK knew he couldn't get the southern Democrats to side with him on anything, especially civil rights.

...and if you really think "little" got accomplished during that era then you've veered into completely insane territory.



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AWArulz
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Since: 28.1.02
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#37 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.18
I feel no need to answer your convoluted logic.

Don't lump me in "you people". I thought were were discussing Rick Perry and his alleged agreement or alignment with secession. My point is that secession is not traitorous, or even wrong, if the people will it to be so. The secession that occurred during the war between the states was unlawful not because secession occurred but because there was no poll of the people to see what their will was.

If, say, 75% of Texans want to change their constitution and secede, I say that is their right.

But, I also don't think Perry said he was in favor of it. He just said people were talking about it. I think it's unlikely it would ever happen. But if things continue to go bad, who knows? No country has lasted forever yet.

I don't think it had a lot to do with the current president because, well, he has done so little to deserve it, or not deserve it. He's just done little. Yes, he's followed some of his promise (health care and the social engineering that is the new military) and not not others (we ARE still in Iraq, right? Gitmo is still open). But otherwise, not much. I had nothing good to say about the previous president either except he mostly left the social engineering alone. He did spend like it was going out of style. The problem we have is long term. It pretty much began in the 30s somewhere. When the federal government became so strong compared to the several states. There are many (I being one) who do not believe that is the meaning or intent of the Constitution.

That being said, I will be more than happy to get back to the states tomorrow. If nothing else, there are more plentiful bathrooms and they do not cost half a Euro to take a piss.

Libya's an interesting issue to raise. The guys in my class this week from the UK and Belgium wonder why the US are such pussies (their word) on Libya. All those years of being imperialistic and now we're pussies.



We'll be back right after order has been restored here in the Omni Center.

That the universe was formed by a fortuitous concourse of atoms, I will no more believe than that the accidental jumbling of the alphabet would fall into a most ingenious treatise of philosophy - Swift

shawnpatrick
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Since: 31.7.07
From: Leesville SC

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#38 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.67
There's no difference between the Democrats and Republicans except for one thing.

The Democrats like to screw you directly while the Republicans screw you from behind.

The only reason the Republicans are speaking about Libya is because of Obama. If a Republican was president, the congress republican wouldn't be crying about the action in Libya (it would be the democrats)

Obama has done exactly what he said he would do. Like him or hate him.

shawnpatrick
Kishke








Since: 31.7.07
From: Leesville SC

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#39 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.67
    Originally posted by lotjx
    Republicans aren't backing Lybia and close to impeaching Obama over it.


THe republicans aren't THAT STUPID to try another impeachment that will fail.
CajunMan
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Since: 2.1.02
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#40 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.56
(deleted by CRZ on 18.6.11 0059)
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And I can respect that opinion. I don't agree with it, but respect it. I'm of the opinion that governments are established for the express purpose of establishing society and one of those functions is removing those who break societal rules.
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