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The W - Baseball - New Mangers: Lou vs. Art
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skorpio17
Morcilla








Since: 11.7.02
From: New Jersey

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#1 Posted on
Here on New York sports radio stations everyone is bashing the Mets for not getting Lou Pinella. They said that the Mets got beat by the Devil Rays. Instead of Art Howe, who did a very good job with Oakland, they say they should've gotten Lou or waited for Dusty and son. So the question is who got the best deal?

I say Seattle got the best deal. They lost a manager, but they gained an All-Star player in Randy Winn. He led Tampa Bay in Batting Average, Steals, Runs, and RBIs last year. I'm not a Mets fan, but to criticize them for refusing to part with their top minor league shortstop in exhange for a manager is unfair.

Agree or Disagree?
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pieman
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Since: 11.12.01
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#2 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.21


Agree.

The manager doesn't hit, pitch or field. He sets the tone. I'd rather have Randy Winn (who makes a lot less money than Lou) and some other dumbass filling out the lineup card.

Advantage Mariners.



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Grimis
Scrapple








Since: 11.7.02
From: MD

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#3 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.29
I agree, the M's got Randy Winn for nothing. Lou wasn't managing anywhere this year regardless, and they got a great outfielder who can hit 2nd behind Ichiro.

I do think that the Mets made a fine choice in Art Howe. His personality will work in that clubhouse and the Mets hope that he has the same kind of success the last time a low key manager who had been succesful, but never won anything came to the city: Joe Torre.

I also think it's sad Willie Randolph doesn't have a job yet. He's a good baseball man and probably could've done a better job than some of these guys(i.e. the Buck Martinez experiment in Toronto) and could be a good fit with a developing younger club in either Florida or Montreal.
pieman
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Since: 11.12.01
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#4 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.21


I think that Winn replacing the revolving left field door will add some stability to the outfield. It will be a huge defensive upgrade as well over Ruben Sierra and Mark MeLemore in left. Winn, Cameron and Suzuki will be an excellent defensive alignment.

I think Willie Randolph needs to take a job managing a minor league team. That's how Eric Wedge got his job. That's how Ken Macha got his job. It's not enough to have the "name" recognition without paying your dues. I think Alan Trammell will find out all too soon that his name will not take him very far.



He's Rolie Polie Olie - and in his world of curves and curls, he's the swellest kid around.
El Nastio
Andouille








Since: 14.1.02
From: Ottawa Ontario, by way of Walkerton

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#5 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.33
M's got the better end of the deal, no question. The Ray's will STILL go no where.

Meanwhile, the Mets made a smart move. Howe dealt with the rowdy A's crew and busted them down to size this season, and look how far they went (they won the division title). he'll do fine with the Mets.

Trammel had a head for the game and a sound baseball mind. If anyone could do the "player-to-manager" switch it'd be him. Mind you he's with the Tigers, so it'd be a long season.

And I swear EVERY YEAR since Cito Gaston left, Buck Martinez was mentioned for the Jays job. it had to be a good seven years or something like that. He still sucked though =)

(edited by El Nastio on 30.10.02 1441)


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Since: 9.12.01
From: Bay City, OR

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#6 Posted on
Technically, it's the player -> Coach -> Manager change. He was our first base coach here in San Diego.

Everything I've seen about Trammel makes me think he can do it, but man - could you pick a worse team to start out managing? I guess you get lower expectations that way...



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The Goon
Boudin blanc
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Since: 2.1.02
From: Calgary, Alberta, Canada

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#7 Posted on
When I heard that Lou was looking around, I was hoping that the Jays would sign him up. The promise of his antics would sell a few more tickets.

Isn't Carlos Tosca supposed to be an "interim" manager? Yet it doesn't seem like he's going anywhere. We'll see where Ricciardi goes with the team from here.
TheCow
Landjager








Since: 3.1.02
From: Knoxville, TN

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#8 Posted on
As odd as this may sound, I don't think that the Mets bringing in Howe will change much of anything. Right now, they're eating big contracts for underachievers (see Burnitz, Jeremy; Cedeno, Roger), which puts Howe in a bind; after all, you have to play the big-money guys, right? (Well, in theory.) The outfield is still a mess, the infield situation is shaky at best. Mo Vaughn needs to play better for the money he's making, Alfonzo's on the way out, which is going to hurt next year.

My point? Howe will do the best job he can. However, it won't matter, mainly due to the fact that Steve Phillips has signed the team into the ground for the next few years.







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skorpio17
Morcilla








Since: 11.7.02
From: New Jersey

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#9 Posted on
The Mets biggest mistake is going to be getting rid of Edgardo Alfonzo. He was their best hitter last year in terms of batting average. He can play third base, second base, and can hit for some power: 20-25 HRs. They'd rather have a Burnitz who was never better than a Rob Deer. Has HRs with lots of strikeouts and a .220 average.

Eddie Famous
Andouille








Since: 11.12.01
From: Catlin IL

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#10 Posted on


    Originally posted by Grimis
    I do think that the Mets made a fine choice in Art Howe. His personality will work in that clubhouse and the Mets hope that he has the same kind of success the last time a low key manager who had been succesful, but never won anything came to the city: Joe Torre.


That's right! Joe Torre did a wonderful job of managing the Mets!

Kidding of course, it was his first job. Howe will be fine.



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Hairy Caray
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Since: 28.10.02
From: Wrigley Field hot dog stand

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#11 Posted on

    Originally posted by Guru Zim
    Technically, it's the player -> Coach -> Manager change. He was our first base coach here in San Diego.

    Everything I've seen about Trammel makes me think he can do it, but man - could you pick a worse team to start out managing? I guess you get lower expectations that way...



IIRC, he wanted to be closer to home. That's why Tampa Bay was a prime choice.

Also, I'm sure that he will enjoy the challenge. He has such a great legacy; I don't think anything he does at TB can change that.

Now, if TB would actually move to TB....



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darkdragoon
Bockwurst








Since: 26.8.02

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#12 Posted on
Hopefully Ken Macha has learned that Barry Zito must pitch more than once to win a series... and how's Art gonna manage the mess of the Mets? Unless Bobby V had multiple personalities (anything's possible), he never came across as a by-the-book Showalteresque guy. Sure Art got the most out of Giambi etc, but those guys produced!

And Lou just got tired of Seattle and the pressure. I think he'd rather know there's very little chance of passing the Jays or Sox rather than knowing he has to fight Oakland and Anaheim each year.
JayJayDean
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02
From: Seattle, WA

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#13 Posted on

    Originally posted by darkdragoon
    And Lou just got tired of Seattle and the pressure. I think he'd rather know there's very little chance of passing the Jays or Sox rather than knowing he has to fight Oakland and Anaheim each year.


No, Lou said he wanted to go home. That's it. No "tired of Seattle." No "too much pressure." Both of his parents are old and ailing and he had to rush back to Tampa for some emeregency in Spetember and it took him 20 hours to get there. Not good. Ultimately I think his wife Anita (or as I call her from now on, Yoko) pretty much made him do it, but that's just conjecture on my part based on the TV interviews Lou did with her sitting there next to him. I never saw her much in the years Lou was here, but she's next to him in interviews, at the press conference her signed at, maybe she'll be in the dugout too.

I like the optimism about Randy Winn helping the M's out, because the attitude here is basically, "wow, there going to pick one of these four jabronies (Riggleman, Melvin, Perlozzo, or Bell) to replace Lou instead of Dusty and that sucks.



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Grimis
Scrapple








Since: 11.7.02
From: MD

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#14 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.29
Bob Melvin is going to be a good manager somewhere someday. I'm just not sure the time is right in Seattle. Riggleman and Bell won't do anything. Perlozzo is a wildcard. The M's would be better off letting Edgar Martinez be the DH/Manager and let the chips fall where they may.
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I didn't see anybody on the ballot that deserved to be in the hall. While they had great careers and great years none had hall of fame careers.
- evilwaldo, Nobody! (2003)
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