With this Thursday looming and Brock taking the belt off Kurt a near-foregone conclusion, I propose a different way to take this... bear with me.
Put the title match in the first hour. Have Kurt and Brock go over a half-hour, and shock ALL the fans by having Angle pin Brock after a top-rope Olympic Slam, but have him be in obvious pain, clutching his neck and all of that. Carry him out on a gurney with the belt laid on top of him.
Later that night, have Steph come out and give the report that Angle is seriously hurt, can't compete at Wrestlemania, etc, etc. Vince comes down and strips Angle of the belt right then and there, and proposes the new Wrestlemania main event -
A one-night, 15 man title tournament. Fits in with the whole March Madness theme of the nation and would add excitement back to the SD matches. Put these guys in it:
Brock Lesnar (1st round bye for winning the Rumble) A-Train Big Show Chris Benoit Chavo Guerrero Eddy Guerrero Charlie Hass John Cena Hulk Hogan Tajiri Nathan Jones Rhyno Rikishi Shelton Benjamin Undertaker
Or thereabouts. Best-case scenario is Benoit beating Taker in the finals, ending his WM win streak and giving him the strap. But no matter what, it'd be high drama and a lot of fun.
That's a LOT of matches to put in, without giving RAW (or any other titles/feuds any matches at all. I don't know how much a normal crowd could watch guys like John Cena, Rikishi, A-Train, or Chavo wrestle 4 times in a row.
It's a nice idea, and I'm sure if they ever put the rosters back together they could get rid of some dead weight and fill out the tournament nicely, but the reason the WWE stopped the King of the Ring at 2 rounds only is because people just don't care about a tournament because they don't have any emotional attachment.
It's a rigged sport, so "who beats who" doesn't matter much to most fans. It needs people to care about what they're seeing because they care about the feuds the guys are in.
Wrestling exists in the eternal present. What is, has always been, and when it no longer is, it never was. It has no past and no future, and sometimes even today is in question. - Madame Manga
Originally posted by JWstormi wouldnt want to see it
The idea of WrestleMania is that every match could be a main event on a weekly TV show, They just cram 10 weeks of awesome wrestling awesomeness into four hours of compacted awesomeness, then shill it for six months until we're all amped to see it.
I'd rather just see a straight-up match between Benoit & Brock, but that's just me.
The Chase Is On: 8th: Oilers [29-23-8-8] 74pts; 14 games left 14th: Flames [23-31-10-4] 60pts; 14 games left Flames must win 7 more games than the Oilers do to make playoffs Any combination of 7 Oilers wins or Flames losses eliminates them from the playoffs
If I was going to do a tournament for the WWE title, I think I'd do it like this:
Brock gets a bye as #1 Contender
Undertaker vs. A-Train (Match is likely to happen anyway, so give it some more meaning. Let 'taker get his Wrestlemania win only to be attacked by Big Show after the match and chokeslammed through the Spanish announce table.)
Eddie Guerrero vs. John Cena (They've had an issue in the recent past, so the match has at least a bit of meaning. Have Guererro go over by cheating to pave the way for a further feud.)
Chris Benoit vs. Rhyno (Have Rhyno turn on Benoit on Smackdown, thus giving this match meaning as well. Have it go at least 15 minutes and have Benoit win via the Crossface.)
Brock gets yet another bye because Undertaker is unable to continue after the attack by A-Train & Big Show.
Eddie Guerrero vs. Chris Benoit (Obviously, the match itself will be great and there's plenty of history with which to hype it. Have the match go at least 20 minutes with Benoit winning by a cheap, but clean, roll up.)
Which leads to Brock vs. Benoit for the title. Except Benoit is exhausted from having already wrestled over 30 minutes whereas Brock is completely fresh, having received 2 byes. Have this match go yet another 20 minutes or more which Benoit nearly claiming victory on multiple occasions only to finally succumb to fatigue and lose clean to Brock.
Brock would get a clean title win in a (likely) great match to solidify him as a legitimate champion even though he didn't beat the last champ clean. Benoit loses the match clean yet still comes out looking great because he already won 2 other matches before this one, but since Benoit nearly won on several occasions, it won't look like Brock just beat an already dead opponent.
Of course, that would require them to give Benoit around an hour of match time on a four hour show, so I don't expect anything even remotely similar to happen, but it makes for a good story, doesn't it?
The tournament's not a *terrible* idea, persay, but you'd have to do the overwhelming majority of it on free television... At most, you'd want the semis and the final actually taking place at Wrestlemania.
"It's like you lost your keys in the garage, but you look for them in the living room because the light is better." -Bill Maher, on the impending war in Iraq
That's why I like my tournament booking, it only involves 5 matches, 1 of which is likely to be on the show anyway and 3 of which involve Benoit with the remaining match being Eddie Guerrero, so there shouldn't be anything that sucks about it that wouldn't have been on the card anyway. :)
Originally posted by Hogan's My DadProblem is that tournies don't draw and never have. So they like to shy away from them.
As for Angle going thirty minutes and winning with a top-rope Angle slam...Uh, do you want him to die, Cubswoo?
I liked InVerse's idea. 4 rounds is way too much for the current viewer's attention span, not to mention the RAW brand and 4 hour limit on the show anyway... but 7 would work just fine.
Hogan's My Dad - I think Angle can squeeze a half-hour out of his neck. Have the match be worked light and that be the only major spot. He's going to be taking an F-5, most likely, so why not let him do one more top-rope spot before he spends a year on the shelf. Either way, my VCR's going to be rolling Thursday night.
Originally posted by CubsWooHogan's My Dad - I think Angle can squeeze a half-hour out of his neck. Have the match be worked light and that be the only major spot. He's going to be taking an F-5, most likely, so why not let him do one more top-rope spot before he spends a year on the shelf. Either way, my VCR's going to be rolling Thursday night.
i think what was being said was that he can't wrestle another match, especially one with a spot like you're suggesting. i think they're going to have to find another way to get the belt off of angle than a match.
Survivor Series 1998 is a great example of a tournament being done right (although I know I'm in the minority on this one). I also though the 32-man tournament for the WCW title (the one Bret Hart won) was really good too.
If you have prelim matches that fit in with current feuds, more than a few realistic winners, a couple of side-stories going on to compliment "who' going to win," give the eventual winner a good story to follow through the whole thing, and enough time, it can be (dare I say it) magical.
At WM, you should be able to fit in a 4-man, and maybe an 8-man (although you'll probably need a couple byes or really short matches to make it work).
(edited by MoeGates on 10.3.03 1209) It seems that I am - in no particular order - Zack Morris, John Adams, a Siren, Janeane Garofalo, Cheer Bear, Aphrodite, a Chihuahua, Data, Cletus the Slack Jawed Yokel, Amy-Wynn Pastor, Hydrogen, Bjork, Spider-Man, Boston, and a Chaotic Good Elvin Bard-Mage.
I agree with Moe that both Survivor Series 1998 and the 32 man WCW tournament were both done right. But the WCW tournament only had the semis and finals right? And the Survivor Series the whole show was dedicated to the tournament so I think if you have a tournament it has to be short and start right away. I'd say make it just 8 men.
Lesnar Kanyon Rhyno Eddie Benoit Cena Taker A-Train Have the first round on Smackdowns from now until mania.
Have the semis on Wrestlemania like the WCW tournament that Bret won. Lesnar, Eddie, Benoit, and Taker make the semis Benoit gets past Taker to give him his first Mania lost, but then Lesnar wins in the Finals. So even though Benoit loses he looks good by beating Taker. Reminiscent to the WCW tournament (if i remember correctly) the two semis matches will be at the very beginning of the card, while the finals will be closer to the end.
(edited by Quezzy on 10.3.03 1426) Lance's Response:
This is my friends.Angle the insane man he is decides to go agianst doctors orders to give the people what they want...Brock vs Angle at Mania and teases us till Mania...meaning we can have our 3 way tag title match of Team Angle vs Los Guerreros(the no.1 contenders currenltly)And the Manimals(Benoit/Rhyno)
Or we can do something else*shrug*how bout Brock Lesnar faces the entire smackdown lockerroom...at once?
Also concearning Benoit why does everyone want him to turn heel for his possible match with Brock? I mean really I think he should be face,they put in all that work to make him a face and all. And have Rhyno take on Team Angle by himself if the 3 way doesn't work.
on the subject of wrestler payoffs... I remember hearing an interview with James Harris (kamala) and he was saying how he got screwed in his WWF run when he was working his program with The Undertaker.