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The W - Pro Wrestling - Murderer?! Not Cool!
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Ringmistress
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Since: 15.1.02
From: Philly

Since last post: 2641 days
Last activity: 2640 days
#1 Posted on
I want to come straight out and say this, and I think that this is one of the rare moments that we can all agree: This is total and utter BULLS**T! To be honest, set up or not, I had lots of fun watching the RAW Roulette. Hell, I was laughing quite a bit (especially at Regal), and it ended with a fun TLC (I rooted for Christian). Then, they had to go and end it with Kane as a MURDERER?! First of all, it's not cool to do any "murder" angles after 9/11, and even after the random shootings in DC this week, and second of all, there's no way they'll make us buy it in two weeks. I don't understand why they even thought of doing this now, but I don't like it one bit. The way it was before the murder thing was bearable for me, but now I'm seriously skipping RAW for Smackdown, where Kurt Angle is waiting to entertain me again. As a matter of fact, I'll go on the WWE feedback system and tell them how I feel. I'll post what I wrote (which will be as polite as I can make it) after I send it off to them. I know I'm not alone in my appalled state, and this is probably the first time in god knows how long that I'm angered at Hunter (his announcement at the end) for actually KILLING my buzz! I know you agree, so share your rage with me.

Ringmistress

(edited by Ringmistress on 8.10.02 0859)


Ringmistress - A bitch among heels.
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InVerse
Bierwurst








Since: 26.8.02

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 14 hours
#2 Posted on
I'm willing to bet there was no murder. She died via suicide or car wreck or some such thing and Kane feels responsible even though he's not. Maybe a mushy love angle where Katie & Kane were in love but Katie's parents forbid them from every seeing each other and so she killed herself and Kane feels like it's his fault. I don't see why everyone is spending so much time bitching about less than 30 seconds of a 2 hour show that they have NO IDEA where it's headed. It could very well turn out to be a highly compelling storyline.

And anybody that gives me the spiel of "It's the WWE, their track record proves it's going to suck." is an idiot for continuing to watch a show that they're positive is going to suck no matter what.
Ringmistress
Lap cheong








Since: 15.1.02
From: Philly

Since last post: 2641 days
Last activity: 2640 days
#3 Posted on
That's true, InVerse. But they blew a lot of sure things, things that even you and I wouldn't this year. And they only have two weeks, what could they possibly do to make this believable in less than two weeks?

Ringmistress



Ringmistress - A bitch among heels.
mountinman44
Sujuk








Since: 8.5.02
From: San Diego, CA

Since last post: 1217 days
Last activity: 1063 days
Y!:
#4 Posted on
In my book, this is right up there with Bossman/Big Show. It's stupid, and I honestly can't see how they are going to work their way out of this one.

And when in the hell did HHH turn into Magnum PI?

(edited by mountinman44 on 8.10.02 0936)


"Don't feel bad. I've been wrestling wolves since you were on your mother's teet!" -- Groundskeeper Willie
Grimis
Scrapple








Since: 11.7.02
From: MD

Since last post: 1235 days
Last activity: 1032 days
#5 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.29
And then Eric Bischoff comes out and says Katie was pissed at Kane because he couldn't last three minutes...

All kidding aside, this angle seems completely ridiculous and way over the top. When HHH said Kane was never going to be the same again, I was figuring on some sort of gruesome injury HHH had in store, not this flaming pile of crap. This is bad, even for WCW.

God if they go this route you'll turn around and see New Jack here soon...
vsp
Andouille








Since: 3.1.02
From: Philly

Since last post: 2999 days
Last activity: 213 days
#6 Posted on

    Originally posted by Ringmistress
    First of all, it's not cool to do any "murder" angles after 9/11,


What in the world does 9/11 have to do with any of this? Is next week's revelation going to be that Kane flew a plane into Katie Vick?



"No society has managed to invest more time and energy in the perpetuation of the fiction that it is _moral, sane and wholesome_ than our current crop of _Modern Americans_."
-- Frank Zappa
StaggerLee
Scrapple








Since: 3.10.02
From: Right side of the tracks

Since last post: 4 hours
Last activity: 3 hours
#7 Posted on

    Originally posted by mountinman44
    And when in the hell did HHH turn into Magnum PI?

    (edited by mountinman44 on 8.10.02 0936)



I just wish he would turn into Magnum TA (before the crash)
InVerse
Bierwurst








Since: 26.8.02

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 14 hours
#8 Posted on

    Originally posted by Ringmistress
    And they only have two weeks, what could they possibly do to make this believable in less than two weeks?


Remember, they don't have to RESOLVE it in two week, only explain it enough to have it give more purpose to the match at No Mercy. And since you asked, here's how I'd do it.

Next week, we have Kane obviously tormented about whatever it is that has happened. Perhaps book him and Hurricane in a title match with The Island Boys and have them drop the belts because Kane is too depressed to bother competing. As a result, Gregory Helms begins doing some investigative reporting to find out exactly what happened.

There are all kinds of comic opportunities here. Imagine Helms showing up on Smackdown to interview The Undertaker (who would just say he didn't even know Kane 10 years ago) and taking one last shot at Matt Hardy while he was there.

Then at No Mercy, they air an interview between Gregory Helms and Paul Bearer (yeah, he's no longer employeed with the WWE but he left on good terms, so I'm sure they could do a single interview) where Paul refuses to go into details about what happened (stating that it's not his place to reveal details of Kane's life) but he states emphatically that Katie's death was NOT Kane's fault, he only feels responsible. This can allow Kane to remain a face without actually explaining what happened. Hurricane (or perhaps Paul Bearer or even The Undertaker, since it'd be a PPV) could give Kane a pep talk and get him fired up enough to beat HHH and become the champion again.

Then, the next night on Raw, HHH goes a step lower. He goes into detail about how Katie looked when she died, describing exactly what she looked like, what she was wearing, etc but never actually stating how she died. This causes Kane to go into even deeper despair, despite the fact that he just won the world championship. They could even go so far as to have HHH bring out a Katie look-a-like on the next show which would finally push Kane over the edge and into isolation.

The next week, Raven finds Kane in the basement of the building. Kane is at the most vulernable he's been in years and is in perfect position to be influenced by someone with ulterior motives. Little by little, Kane reveals the story to Raven and we learn that Katie and Kane were in love but Katie's parents forbid her from seeing Kane because he was a freak. This eventually led to Katie killing herself because she couldn't bear to be apart from Kane, thus Kane feels that it's his fault that Katie died.

At SummerSlam, we have the HHH/Kane rematch for the title. During the match, Raven turns on Kane, costing Kane the title. At this point, Kane snaps and we have the return of the big red monster. Kane faces off against Raven in some type of stipulation match (inferno or casket probably) and utterly decimates him. Then Kane returns his focus to HHH once more and they're set to square off for the title once more at Armageddon. After long, hard fought match, Kane finally wins the title back complete with JR screaming "HE DID IT FOR KATIE. HE DID IT FOR KATIE." We now have monster Kane as the champion after a 3 1/2 month battle and all is well.

Of course, even if they did this, I'm sure HHH would win the title back the next night on Raw and the Katie look-a-like would end up being the winner of Tough Enough 3 and would turn Kane into an obsessed stalker, but oh well.


-InVerse
Ringmistress
Lap cheong








Since: 15.1.02
From: Philly

Since last post: 2641 days
Last activity: 2640 days
#9 Posted on
What you ask? That was the deliberate murder of thousands, which made people say the world has changed. And here we are, watching something that takes our minds off the real world, and what do we have to sit through? A murder angle?! Maybe it's like what InVerse says, it's an accident, and Kane blames himself. I don't know, and I really don't care anymore. Hunter hurt my feelings my ruining my good mood, and I feel like being not wrong in hating this!



Ringmistress - A bitch among heels.
WhoBettahThanDeion
Bockwurst








Since: 4.1.02

Since last post: 4350 days
Last activity: 4186 days
#10 Posted on
Hey Yo...


    Originally posted by mountinman44
    In my book, this is right up there with Bossman/Big Show. It's stupid, and I honestly can't see how they are going to work their way out of this one.

    And when in the hell did HHH turn into Magnum PI?

    (edited by mountinman44 on 8.10.02 0936)



Couldn't have said it better myself. I hated the whole show, couldn't even tell you why. Once Booker was done for the night my interest peaked and count me as disinterested. I was plain bored the WHOLE time. I hated that entire show, it just didn't entertain me. Regal/Goldust would have normally been funny to me. And the whole murder thing just made me scream, "Who writes this crap!?" Of course, I'm sure someone just read that and is all ready to respond with Triple H. But, this story is garbage. The only fued I'm looking forward to on this show is Booker/Jericho. PERIOD.

Anyone else notice the absence of Jamal and Rosie?



What's the thin line one crosses from being a fan to being a loser? Answer THAT one...

"Pootie Tang? More like Dootie Tang!" -Chris Rock

One word: BUCKEYES! With that being said, BLAM! In your face!
redsoxnation
Scrapple








Since: 24.7.02

Since last post: 445 days
Last activity: 445 days
#11 Posted on

    Originally posted by StaggerLee

      Originally posted by mountinman44
      And when in the hell did HHH turn into Magnum PI?

      (edited by mountinman44 on 8.10.02 0936)



    I just wish he would turn into Magnum TA (before the crash)






That's what happenened, Kane didn't do it. She died because Dusty Rhodes was jealous and cut her brake line.



I want you to know, I agree with everything I've just said.
Shem the Penman
Toulouse








Since: 16.1.02
From: The Off-Center of the Universe (aka Philadelphia)

Since last post: 229 days
Last activity: 28 days
#12 Posted on
Maybe The New TNN's demanding that the WWE provide some more promotion for the rest of the network. Coming soon, a Raw/CSI crossover!
Lexus
Bierwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: Stafford, VA

Since last post: 9 days
Last activity: 1 day
AIM:  
#13 Posted on
I have no qualms with the murder angle. It's standard Bischopf kitch, no more, no less. I'm tired of hearing the post 9/11 bullshit. When you go out of your way to change a behavior, especially to criticize so trivial an issue as a wrestling angle, due to it, you've gone too far.

And as far as the DC shootings, it's really called the DC Metro Area shootings. See, I live not 2 miles from where one of the shootings took place, in Stafford, and F'burg is where I usually hang out. It sorta hits home for me, and I don't mind watching a murder mystery as a result.

I mean, come on! What follows Raw? CSI. What is CSI about? Murder. We don't go off on a tangent about CSI because of 9/11 or people in real life dying. Most people just sit and watch it, and are thoroughly entertained.

HOWEVER, even though I am not offended, I still think it's a dumb ass idea. In fact, I'm noticing a pattern.

Flair= Harley Race, the ex-legend now managing.
HHH= Vader, the unstoppable heel
Kane= Sid, the big goofy git

Only time will tell who'll pan out to be our new Sting.

PRAISE ALL BECAUSE EARLY 90'S WCW IS BACK WITH ATTITUDE!



In the name of good taste, I will no longer say anything about people who run wrestling websites and cats.
InVerse
Bierwurst








Since: 26.8.02

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 14 hours
#14 Posted on

    Originally posted by Lexus
    Only time will tell who'll pan out to be our new Sting.


I've said for quite some time that Edge could easily be the WWE's Sting with proper booking.
redsoxnation
Scrapple








Since: 24.7.02

Since last post: 445 days
Last activity: 445 days
#15 Posted on

    Originally posted by Lexus
    I have no qualms with the murder angle. It's standard Bischopf kitch, no more, no less. I'm tired of hearing the post 9/11 bullshit. When you go out of your way to change a behavior, especially to criticize so trivial an issue as a wrestling angle, due to it, you've gone too far.

    And as far as the DC shootings, it's really called the DC Metro Area shootings. See, I live not 2 miles from where one of the shootings took place, in Stafford, and F'burg is where I usually hang out. It sorta hits home for me, and I don't mind watching a murder mystery as a result.

    I mean, come on! What follows Raw? CSI. What is CSI about? Murder. We don't go off on a tangent about CSI because of 9/11 or people in real life dying. Most people just sit and watch it, and are thoroughly entertained.

    HOWEVER, even though I am not offended, I still think it's a dumb ass idea. In fact, I'm noticing a pattern.

    Flair= Harley Race, the ex-legend now managing.
    HHH= Vader, the unstoppable heel
    Kane= Sid, the big goofy git

    Only time will tell who'll pan out to be our new Sting.

    PRAISE ALL BECAUSE EARLY 90'S WCW IS BACK WITH ATTITUDE!






Does this mean Kane is going to buy Flip-Flops for when he and HHH blow up Edge's boat and leaves him and orphans stranded. And, most importantly, will he stab Arn before he gets a World Title shot?



I want you to know, I agree with everything I've just said.
Pool-Boy
Lap cheong








Since: 1.8.02
From: Huntington Beach, CA

Since last post: 1281 days
Last activity: 47 days
AIM:  
ICQ:  
Y!:
#16 Posted on
The whole "YOU"RE A MURDERER!" thing really bothered me. Not for any post-9/11 inappropriate reason (there are too many of those) but for the fact that it was way too over the top, and not thought out very well. Raw has been doing that a lot with good ideas of late... look at the reintroduction of the World Title. Great idea... but they just handed it to HHH. They did not think it through that people would want to see a tournament, or something, to decide the champion. So they backpedaled, and a few weeks later, damage control indicated that other wrestlers should be mad that he was handed the title too- clearly not what they originally had in mind. Why wasn't Bubba in HHH's face on day one callin ghim a punk for holding a title he did not earn? Why didn't JR scream bloody murder?
If they wanted a cliffhanger last night... why didn't HHH end with -"How happy is Katie Vick now Kane? Oh yeah, I know all about her..." And then LEFT! We would all be pulling out our hair trying to figure out who this person was! It would have been a great cliffhanger after a really good show, and then they could have gone on with the "Kane blamed himself for her death" angle when more time could be devoted to explaining out the history...
Raw's writing sucks.... how about a little subtlty?



Craig Reade
"Pool Boy"

Detroit Lions! 1-3!
On the road to oh and sixt... Wha?
InVerse
Bierwurst








Since: 26.8.02

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 14 hours
#17 Posted on

    Originally posted by Pool-Boy
    Why wasn't Bubba in HHH's face on day one callin ghim a punk for holding a title he did not earn?


He was in HHH's face from day one. Not half an hour after HHH was handed the title, Bubba cut a promo on him. Flair referenced it that night too, which is what led up to the Flair/HHH match. I believe someone else said something as well, so it was never a matter of back peddling because they realized they'd screwed up, they were headed that way the entire time.

As for the ending to last night's Raw, I do think the murder accusation was mistimed but I'm going to wait and see where they go with it. Maybe it was poorly planned or maybe it wasn't. Just look at how much attention less than 30 seconds of the show is getting on this board. People might not like the angle but they sure can't seem to stop talking about it and that's what the WWE wants.
asteroidboy
Andouille








Since: 22.1.02
From: Texas

Since last post: 1395 days
Last activity: 303 days
#18 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.95

    Originally posted by Lexus
    I mean, come on! What follows Raw? CSI. What is CSI about? Murder.


Do NOT try to use that as an out. Because there's one big difference. CSI runs credits at the end of the show, while the announcers on RAW act like their signing off on a sports broadcast. Yes, they're more open about the business being a big work, but that's not enough. Until I see something like:

Kane -------- Glenn Jacobs
Triple H ---- Paul Levesque
Ric Flair --- Richard Fleihr

and so on, it's not the same as a friggin staged TV show. So angles like murder carry a different connotation.


This whole thing is bull-fucking-shit. And it's not gonna get better until they replace that 25-year-old wrestler groupie who's rehashing bad USA movies with a real writer.





"My brother saw the Undertaker walking through an airport." - Rex

"Was he no-selling?" - Me
spf
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02
From: The Las Vegas of Canada

Since last post: 51 days
Last activity: 1 day
AIM:  
#19 Posted on

    Originally posted by WhoBettahThanDeion

      Originally posted by mountinman44
      In my book, this is right up there with Bossman/Big Show. It's stupid, and I honestly can't see how they are going to work their way out of this one.

      And when in the hell did HHH turn into Magnum PI?

      (edited by mountinman44 on 8.10.02 0936)



    Couldn't have said it better myself. I hated the whole show, couldn't even tell you why. Once Booker was done for the night my interest peaked and count me as disinterested. I was plain bored the WHOLE time. I hated that entire show, it just didn't entertain me. Regal/Goldust would have normally been funny to me. And the whole murder thing just made me scream, "Who writes this crap!?" Of course, I'm sure someone just read that and is all ready to respond with Triple H. But, this story is garbage. The only fued I'm looking forward to on this show is Booker/Jericho. PERIOD.

    Anyone else notice the absence of Jamal and Rosie?

Damn, this MUST have been a bad show if you don't have anything positive to say about it. Seriously though, I am glad the only thing I watched was the TLC match, and turned it off the second HHH came out onto stage afterwards. Once again, the lesson learned from Summerslam seems to evade the writers. The most anticipated PPV this year was built on simple themes of people who want the title, or are fighting for pride. And the card delivered huge. Instead of continuing along those lines though, we get a freaking murder angle, and a feud over Jericho being mad at having his rock band mocked. Oh well, the TLC match was great to watch at least.



Bears Take Group Field Trip to ER:
Buffalo 33, Chicago 27
Bears go to 2-2 (next vs. Green Bay)
Congratulations to the Brisbane Lions for beating my Collingwood Magpies for the AFL Premiership...we'll get you next year though!
Brisbane 10 15 75
Collingwood 9 12 66
InVerse
Bierwurst








Since: 26.8.02

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 14 hours
#20 Posted on

    Originally posted by asteroidboy
    and so on, it's not the same as a friggin staged TV show. So angles like murder carry a different connotation.


So you know the show is fake but you refuse to treat it as such unless they come out and state as such every week? It must suck to be so anal and not be able to enjoy simple fantasy.
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