OK, so if an inward forward flip off the top rope is called a "Swanton Bomb", an inward backward flip off the top rope is called a "Shooting Star Press", and an outward backward flip off the top rope is a "Moonsault", what would an outward forward flip off the top rope be called? And has anybody ever done that move before?
I think the move you're basically describing is a Vader bomb from the top rope except the guy (obviously not Vader) does a 450 before landing on the opponent. It could, conceivably, be physically done, though I've never seen it.
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I think that's just known as the 450 or Phoenix Splash. Juventud Guerrera used to do it once in a while. I think Blitzkrieg even threw a corkscrew in there somewhere. At the very least, it's usually one of my turnbuckle specials for No Mercy and Smackdown!.
Originally posted by TheCowI remember Juventud using that move a few years back, too.
Senor seems to have pulled the same names out for it that I remember: the 450 and the Phoenix Splash. They look really impressive when done right, too.
(Although it took me a few minutes to visualize what you were asking about.)
I think Big Bad was more onto what joepet was asking about. The 450/Phoenix Splash is done facing inward. joepet was asking if there was a move done in the same motion as an SSP, just facing out (towards the crowd) like a moonsault when you start. Sounds sick if done properly. Though I can't recall anyone ever doing it.
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I was under the impression that he meant just one flip, not the full 450 degrees like the 450. Basically like a Swanton Bomb but starting off in the moonsault position and doing the flip while moving backwards to land on your back. I might just be visualizing it wrong though.
If we're talking about 450/Phoenix/Firebird Splashes, then nobody does a more beautiful one than Ai Fujita of ARSION fame.
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I'm not sure that what's essentially a shooting star press into the ring while facing the crowd is physically possible. If it ever is done, well, name it after the guy who managed it! :-)
Now, I seem to remember seeing Scorpio do something like a corkscrew moonsault (not the Tumbleweed, which if I remember correctly is the same as Booker's Houston Hangover) while facing away from the ring in a WCW Saturday night match. Of course, I could be wrong...
Swanton Bomb: Facing the ring, forward somersault, land on back on opponent (about 270 or so degrees of rotation).
450/Phoenix Splash: Facing the ring, forward somersault, land on front on opponent (450 degrees of rotation).
Shooting Star Press: Facing the ring, backward somersault, land on front on opponent (about 270 degrees of rotation).
Moonsault: Facing crowd, backward somersault, land on fron on opponent.
The move I think joepet was trying to get at would be:
Facing crowd, FORWARD somersault, land on front on opponent. It would be a 450-degree motion like the Phoenix Splash.
The easiest way to explain is using diving terms (see this link) A Swanton or a Phoenix Splash is a "forward dive." A Moonsault is a "backward dive." A Shooting Star Press is a "reverse dive." What joepet would like to see is an "inward dive."
As much as it would seem an SSP is more dangerous (because you're rotating away from where you're looking), I think you'd have to be totally fucking crazy to try the "inward dive," as it'd be a full 450 degrees, it'd be hard to get any real distance across the ring, and there's three ways to lose it: bashing your head on the turnbuckle at the beginning, hitting the turnbuckle with your feet halfway through, or bashing your head on the turnbuckle towards the end.
I think it's safe to say you'll never see this one.
....tarnish is definately right. I still wasn't visualizing it right. You wouldn't have to go the entire way with it, though. Maybe you could call it a 90-degree flop... but even that way, it'd be dangerous (and not a flip), because you could still play Head meets Turnbuckle.
In theory, I think that it COULD be done, but it would require a lot of work with someone who's fully aware of what their body is doing at all times. All the same, I'd cringe if I ever saw it.
Thanks all for your comments! Yes, I was thinking more of a 270 inward flip, with the guy back first on the opponent like the Swanton, with the guy doing it having his feet langing very close to the corner he jumped out of. I can't imagine anybody but an Olympic diver doing an inward 450 facing outwards off the top rope...