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The W - Current Events & Politics - Michael Moore (Page 2)
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OlFuzzyBastard
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Since: 28.4.02
From: Pittsburgh, PA

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#21 Posted on
Well, when polls don't go your way, you guys are always the first to say that they don't mean anything, and I still think one in four is a pretty large percentage of the population anyway.



CxMorgado
Boudin rouge








Since: 21.1.02
From: Boston MA is the rippen'ist town...

Since last post: 220 days
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#22 Posted on

    Originally posted by Michrome
    For 30 seconds, hollywood showed a little class and booed his ass out of the building. What a disgrace he is.


You know as far as the booing goes, I couldn't help but notice that every celebrity shown during his speech was sitting in silence (i.e. Scorcese giving Moore a standing ovation when he won and then squirmimng uncomfortably when he started ranting.), which leads me to believe that the booing wasn't exactly coming from the Hollywood elite... all the celebs were probably thinking of what it would do to their image if they were caught applauding Moore's rantings.

He should have stuck with bringing the other nominees up with him as a show of solidarity; that would have been simple and classy.




Can't hear your voice
Back in the crowd
Move up front
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TAKE A STAND!
vsp
Andouille








Since: 3.1.02
From: Philly

Since last post: 2950 days
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#23 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.00
All I'll say about Michael Moore's speech is that my wallet's getting emptier and emptier these days. I had Dixie Chicks CDs on my shopping list; now, I'll be filling in the gaps in my Moore collection as well. (I'm about halfway there; "The Big One" and season two of "The Awful Truth" are probably next.)




"To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public."
-- Theodore Roosevelt
Freeway
Scrapple








Since: 3.1.02
From: Calgary

Since last post: 221 days
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#24 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.96
Oscars And Anti-War Views: A Retrospective

Ever since Vanessa Redgrave took a stand against the Palestinians...and Richard Gere wanted to "free Tibet", celebrities have always been blowhard assholes at the Oscars...

THIS YEAR:
-Lots of peace signs and specific mentions of the word "Peace", including Adrien Brody's AWESOME shushing of the band when they tried to play him off the stage, followed by an excellent pro-peace speech.
-Michael Moore's embarrassing rant, the EXACT same speech I saw earlier in the day on the re-run of the Spirit Awards.
-Steve Martin's classy anti-Moore joke immediately following Moore's speech...and then his classy end comment, dedicating the show to the boys (and girls) overseas.

We're for peace...we're not against the war. We just want it to be over as soon as possible, right?



Whoo!!
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Since: 17.3.02
From: Queidersbach

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#25 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.00

    Originally posted by Grimis
    -George W. Bush had sufficient votes to win the electoral college. What's so fictitious about that.
    - Orange alerts? He has a problem with preparation?
    The fact that the picked a tactless moment(after it had been revealed that US troops were being executed by Iraqis) shows that he has no common sense and, as kazhayashi mentioned, is just a fat, bitter, tactless man who deserves pity.


The electoral college is a fictitious and archaic system. It's a projection of votes, not an actual tally of them that is used in the interest of getting the results quicker. I agree with Moore when he says that time should not be a concern. They just need to get it right in order to avoid the stupidity that happened in 2000. His presidency is fictitious because he did not win the majority of the actual votes. Combine that with the fact that the state that caused the dispute is governed by his brother. I know I know, you're gonna say that I'm just like every other liberal conspiracy theorist, but sometimes, the "cooincidences" are just too cooincidental. I don't think that Moore has a problem with preparation, rather he has a problem with the ridiculousness of the whole system. One man based on intelligence gets to call out a color every morning and Americans are supposed to "prepare" accordingly. It's complete horseshit. I disagree with your calling him tactless for making his diatribe when it had been recently discovered that US troops were being executed by Iraqis. I think the timing was perfect. Sure, some might think it is tactless, but it really brings the issue of how inane this "war" really is. I think that was his point. When it all boils down, you cannot blame the liberals for the loss of lives. You cannot blame the conservatives either. The finger gets pointed at the geriatric Bush administration. 3 out of 4 people (according to the USA today poll) are for the "war", so I guess that means that they are in agreeance with King George II. But I have to wonder whether those who died in Iraq would have died had we not decided to make an imperialistic military movement? We will never know for sure, and it seems that Curious George is able to sleep at night with those deaths on his conscious so I guess that this "war" really is worth it.



Be peaceful, be courteous, obey the law, respect everyone; but if someone puts his hand on you, send him to the cemetery.
-Malcom X
Pool-Boy
Lap cheong








Since: 1.8.02
From: Huntington Beach, CA

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#26 Posted on
Huh???
Kid- do you ever READ? It is pretty clear that you have no idea how the electoral college works, what it was intended for, and even how the electoral process works in general. Read up and come back... maybe we can have an intelligent debate that way. If you want to OPPOSE the use of the electoral college that is one thing. At least do so from a relatively informed stance.. Predicting votes... sheesh...

Moore is an ass- you can oppose the war, you can oppose Bush, without resorting to a completely offensive and irrational rant. The only reason he chose that moment to spew his rant was because it was the largest stage he had ever been on, and will likely ever be on again.

I honestly feel that Moore is a classic example of "white guilt." First look at his racist commetns from before, coupled with this- he is living fat and happy and feels guilty about it. Only he is too selfish to do anything real or substantial about it- he instead chooses to bitch.




The Vile1
Lap cheong








Since: 4.9.02
From: California

Since last post: 1929 days
Last activity: 1661 days
#27 Posted on
In hindsight, did anyone really expect Moore to do or say anything else? From what I understand he gave the same speech at the indy spirit award to cheers so I'm really not suprised. I'm not justifying or defending Moore's words but this IS Michael moore, and as soon as he got an academy award nomination people should've seen this coming a mile away. Some people say it was ballsy and gutsy for moore to do what he did. I say no, I say it would've been ballsy if Moore just took his award said thank you and then go and eat some Plucker's. or maybe he felt bad that his crappy film got the oscar so he had to say something to make himself more controversial. :)



"I am many things Kal-El, but here I am god."
-Darkseid
Grimis
Scrapple








Since: 11.7.02
From: MD

Since last post: 1186 days
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#28 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.29

    Originally posted by Kidbrooklyn
    electoral college is a fictitious and archaic system.

Ifi t's fictitious, why is it mentioned in Article II, Section 1 of the Constitution?


    Originally posted by Kidbrooklyn
    It's a projection of votes, not an actual tally of them that is used in the interest of getting the results quicker.

Because real-time reporting was important in 1788...


    Originally posted by Kidbrooklyn
    His presidency is fictitious because he did not win the majority of the actual votes.

So fucking what? It doesn't matter. The only votes that matter are the Electoral College votes. This happened in 1824 and 1876. Are JQ Adams and Rutherford Hayes illegitmate and "fictitous" too?


    Originally posted by Kidbrooklyn
    Combine that with the fact that the state that caused the dispute is governed by his brother.

(sigh)


    Originally posted by Kidbrooklyn
    I know I know, you're gonna say that I'm just like every other liberal conspiracy theorist, but sometimes, the "cooincidences" are just too cooincidental.

Or I think one should make sure that his brain is loaded before shooting his mouth off.


    Originally posted by Kidbrooklyn
    I disagree with your calling him tactless for making his diatribe when it had been recently discovered that US troops were being executed by Iraqis. I think the timing was perfect. Sure, some might think it is tactless, but it really brings the issue of how inane this "war" really is. I think that was his point.

How?


    Originally posted by Kidbrooklyn
    3 out of 4 people (according to the USA today poll) are for the "war", so I guess that means that they are in agreeance with King George II.

Uh....George II died in 1760.


    Originally posted by Kidbrooklyn
    But I have to wonder whether those who died in Iraq would have died had we not decided to make an imperialistic military movement? We will never know for sure, and it seems that Curious George is able to sleep at night with those deaths on his conscious so I guess that this "war" really is worth it.

Whoo-boy...



There is no room in this country for hyphenated Americanism.
- Theodore Roosevelt, Ocotber 12, 1915
RYDER FAKIN
Six Degrees of Me








Since: 21.2.02
From: ORLANDO

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#29 Posted on
OFB:

It should also be noted that he recieved a standing ovation, which underscores just how divided the country really is.

That was from Hollywood. And therein lies the reason the unwashed masses were not allowed to be part of the ceremony this year (wink wink)

And, yeah, he was a little heavy-handed, but he is Michael Moore. What do you expect when you give Michael Moore a live mic and international television time?

Exactly what he did. I was not shocked in the least.

And while even I'm tired of discussing the 2000 election results, the facts remain the same. Not only did Gore recieve the clear majority of the popular vote, even the most conservative sources agree that Gore got more votes in Florida. He wouldn't have gotten them using the recounting standards he wanted, but that doesn't change the fact that more people in the state of Florida cast their vote for Al Gore than George W. Bush in 2000. And I personally will get over it in 2004, even if Dubya gets "re"elected, unless the same thing happens again

No, he didn’t. The issue was that supposedly more people may have “meant” to vote for AG, which is how the whole “controversy” started. Too many Buchanan votes for democratic South Florida set off the red flags. That still doesn’t change the fact that he LOST his home state and LOST Clinton’s state (both of which should have been a gimmie)…elections were just as close in four (Illinois and Oregon jump to mind?) other states, but he only wanted FLORIDA recounted. Best odds of getting “elected” (conspiracies), but that’s a topic for another time. Bush’s cabinet (Rumsfeld, Rice, Powell) is what is making him look good at the moment…I never had faith in Gore, period, much less for him to install a cabinet that would make up for his very obvious shortcomings.

I do agree with you on the "polls"...they only work in favor of those who are looking for the answer they want

FLEA



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SKLOKAZOID
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Since: 20.3.02
From: California

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#30 Posted on

    Originally posted by kazhayashi81
    What I found truly funny is they discovered the chemical weapons factory shortly before his speech.

    "fictious reasons" my ass.

    I just got the entire situation that he was a fat, bitter, tactless man who deserves pity.

    And he also cemented whether or not I'll ever go see Bowling for Columbine.



NEW YORK (Dow Jones)--U.S. officials said Monday that no chemical weapons were found at a suspected site at Najaf in central Iraq, U.S. television networks reported.

NBC News reported from the Pentagon that no chemicals at all were found at the site. CNN, also reporting from the Pentagon, said officials now believe the plant there was abandoned long ago by the Iraqis.


http://www.datekdj.newsalert.com/bin/djstory?StoryId=CpN6q0aebqLqWmduWmJu
MoeGates
Andouille








Since: 6.1.02
From: Brooklyn, NY

Since last post: 7 days
Last activity: 1 day
#31 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.28
I love how the crowd boos Michael Moore, and then gives a standing ovation (and the damn BEST DIRECTOR AWARD) to child rapist Roman Polanski. Classy move.

I couldn't believe that either. Made me want to throw up. I don't care if the guy made the best film since CItizen Kane, you simply don't applaud a guy that drugged and sodomized a 13-year old girl. One of life's pretty simple rules. And yet one more reason to hate France.

I was pissed Eminem wasn't there. I would have paid money to see him get up on stage and make a speech right there in front of Barbra Steisand.






It seems that I am - in no particular order - Zack Morris, John Adams, a Siren, Janeane Garofalo, Cheer Bear, Aphrodite, a Chihuahua, Data, Cletus the Slack Jawed Yokel, Amy-Wynn Pastor, Hydrogen, Bjork, Spider-Man, Boston, and a Chaotic Good Elvin Bard-Mage.
DMC
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Since: 8.1.02
From: Modesto, CA

Since last post: 3392 days
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#32 Posted on
Oh my you've got to love this country...what a hearty debate!

On the Polanski thing, that is pretty sick. That and giving Moore a standing ovation is just the nail in the coffin for the idea that Hollywood is anything but flamingly liberal and lacking in any sense of morality.

DMC



"I'm on this Zoloft thing, right? But I'm on that to keep me from killin' ya'll!" -Mike Tyson
IsaacYankem
Polska kielbasa








Since: 4.3.03
From: Cybertron

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#33 Posted on
Well, why not? Admiral Poindexter is a criminal too, and look at the high gov't office he occupies..
spf
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02
From: The Las Vegas of Canada

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#34 Posted on
Just to correct one small error by Flea: "elections were just as close in four (Illinois and Oregon jump to mind?"

Illinois was actually a blowaway for Gore, as he won 54-42, which is why I felt okay voting for Nader. If I lived in FL, I would have never voted for him, but I knew here in IL that Bush stood no chance.



"It is well that war is so terrible, lest we grow too fond of it." - Robert E. Lee
Enojado Viento
Potato korv








Since: 12.3.02
From: Your Grocer's Freezer, NC

Since last post: 638 days
Last activity: 55 days
#35 Posted on

    Originally posted by IsaacYankem
    Well, why not? Admiral Poindexter is a criminal too, and look at the high gov't office he occupies..


Yeah, in charge of recording every e-mail, phone call and credit report in America. You know, despite this being about security, having a convicted felon run a department with the Orwellian name Total Information Awareness makes me feel less safe by the second.

On the topic tho, I didn't give a shit about Moore's speech. Hell Vanessa Redgrave stood up for the Palestinians and Richard Gere wouldn't shut up about Tibet, so I almost really expect that.

The Polanski thing tho . . .that made my fucking blood boil. Not just that he got the Oscar, but that made it into a joke. I'm sure the girl he raped found it real funny.

Fuck the gold statue, get that man some irons and drag him to the nearest maximum security penitentiary and show him that while the Hollywood gliteratti may love him, even the worst of us hate child abusers.

Sorry--needed to vent.




-LS

"I don't know if we can beat these bastards." "Maybe not, but we don't have to JOIN them."
cactuspete
Blutwurst








Since: 22.9.02
From: Parts Unknown

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#36 Posted on

    Originally posted by MoeGates
    I love how the crowd boos Michael Moore, and then gives a standing ovation (and the damn BEST DIRECTOR AWARD) to child rapist Roman Polanski. Classy move.

    I couldn't believe that either. Made me want to throw up. I don't care if the guy made the best film since CItizen Kane, you simply don't applaud a guy that drugged and sodomized a 13-year old girl. One of life's pretty simple rules. And yet one more reason to hate France.

    I was pissed Eminem wasn't there. I would have paid money to see him get up on stage and make a speech right there in front of Barbra Steisand.





When a crowd gives a child-rapist a warmer reception than you, your time is up! Shame on you, Mr. Moore! Shame on you!

He actually used the same speech the day before during the Independence Spirit Awards (a Sundance clone hosted by John Waters). It went over well with that crowd, which is even more liberal than Hollywood.

And regarding the war and the 2000 election, the vast majority of the partisan rhetoric and protests (including on these boards) is complete utter bullshit. If this was pushed by Democratic Administration, it would be treated as a "humanitarian mission" (i.e. Somalia). The libs would be for it; the conservatives would be against it. If Gore got the electoral college but Bush got the actual majority, the sheep would jump across to the other side of the fence.



"What do you mean 'Parts Unknown'? Are you telling me he doesn't have a social security number so we can track him down? How does he get a paycheck?" - G. Monsoon


Eddie Famous
Andouille








Since: 11.12.01
From: Catlin IL

Since last post: 250 days
Last activity: 244 days
#37 Posted on


    Originally posted by cactuspete
    And regarding the war and the 2000 election, the vast majority of the partisan rhetoric and protests (including on these boards) is complete utter bullshit. If this was pushed by Democratic Administration, it would be treated as a "humanitarian mission" (i.e. Somalia). The libs would be for it; the conservatives would be against it. If Gore got the electoral college but Bush got the actual majority, the sheep would jump across to the other side of the fence.


Foul! Use of common sense! 15 yards!

What are you, some kind of disgruntled realist?





George Washington gave his signature
The Government gave its hand
They said for now and ever more that this was Indian Land

"As long as the moon shall rise"
"As long as the rivers flow"
"As long as the sun will shine"
"As long as the grass shall grow"


Stefonics
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Since: 17.3.02
From: Queidersbach

Since last post: 9 days
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#38 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.00

    Originally posted by Grimis
    So fucking what? It doesn't matter. The only votes that matter are the Electoral College votes. This happened in 1824 and 1876. Are JQ Adams and Rutherford Hayes illegitmate and "fictitous" too?

No. They are very real men, and I was wrong to imply that they were in fact fake. George W. Bush is also a very real person and his presidency is painfully real. I threw around the term "fictitious" very loosely, and it was not meant to be interpreted literally as you have done. For that I apologize.

    Originally posted by Grimis
    (sigh)

Yes, sigh at my jumping on the conspiracy bandwagon. Please sigh at how George W Bush won the presidency. Maybe you're a liberal at heart because that's what we all seemed to do when we found out that we had been cheated out of who we voted for. Please don't even offer to come up with an argument disputing my claim of foul concerning Jeb giving his brother the presidency. Just sigh.

    Originally posted by Grimis
    Or I think one should make sure that his brain is loaded before shooting his mouth off.

Always the way of the conservative to use analogies involving firearms. Charlton Heston would be proud. But on a seriuos note, I apologize for my gross oversight of what the electoral college actually does. I am now aware of the purpose they serve, and I still disagree with it.

    Originally posted by Grimis
    How?

How is it tactless to call out the president who is spearheading this campaign against a clearly inferior country? It is the indirect fault of George W Bush that these men had to die. They might have been willing to do so in order to fight for what they have been brainwasshed to believe, but that was their decision and not mine considering that I never enlisted. I'm sure that President Bush knows best concerning military action, so these losses were not for nothing. They furthered the crusade against EVIL in the world. These men were heroes. I am certain that George W Bush will look proudly upon the memory of these men, as they were his brothers in arms.



Be peaceful, be courteous, obey the law, respect everyone; but if someone puts his hand on you, send him to the cemetery.
-Malcom X
kazhayashi81
Potato korv








Since: 17.6.02
From: Buenos Aires, Argentina

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#39 Posted on
UNITED WE STAND


    Originally posted by spf2119
    Just to correct one small error by Flea: "elections were just as close in four (Illinois and Oregon jump to mind?"

    Illinois was actually a blowaway for Gore, as he won 54-42, which is why I felt okay voting for Nader. If I lived in FL, I would have never voted for him, but I knew here in IL that Bush stood no chance.



And that's the problem with just saying "Gore won the popular vote". People with actual civics knowledge and an understanding of the way government works.. many of them wouldn't have voted the way they did if those were the rules. I voted for Harry Browne, as I lived in Texas at the time, which Gore had NO SHOT IN HELL OF WINNING, but if it would've been popular vote total, I'd have voted for Bush. There's no guarantee what the results would've been if the vote had just been popular takes all.





"The time for debate is really beforehand. Obviously history will speak on whether this was the right thing or the wrong thing, but right now (the soldiers) are out there. Support 'em. There's plenty of time for commentary later."
-David Robinson
PalpatineW
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Since: 2.1.02
From: Getting Rowdy

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#40 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.44
A.) Who cares that Iraq is an inferior country? Terrorists are inferior people. Heck, common criminals, rapists and murderes are inferior people. We still fight them.

B.) You use the word "EVIL" in what seems to be a mocking way. Do you not believe in evil? Do you think that when we condemn Saddam's regime, it's really just a difference of opinion?



"May God bless our country and all who defend her."

George W. Bush, 3/19/03
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I am so freaking steamed about this I can barely see straight. First of all, NCLB is a HORRIBLE idea.
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