I've been thinking about this for a while, and the non-turn of Kane spurred me to actually start a thread about it: The WWE seems to think for some reason that as many big names as possible should be faces.
Think about it: right now, what heels could realistically challenge for (or defend) either version of the world title on a PPV? I count all of four: HHH and Jericho on Raw, and Big Show and Cena on Smackdown. That's basically it.
Now take a look at how many faces fit that description. Let's see...Kane, RVD, Booker, Taker, Lesnar, Benoit, Scott Steiner, Shawn Michaels, Nash, Angle, Goldberg. And they also had Hogan/Mr. America, although that appears to be out the window. So even without him,. that's 11 compared to 5. Yow! Especially on the Raw side, that's very lopsided--and Smackdown does have some guys who are not too far off that mark (Rikishi, Eddy, Rhyno). (I'm also not counting Austin or Foley, who are certainly faces and are certainly over enough to main event, but who at least at present aren't actively wrestling, although this may change wrt Foley.) So with all of that, why NOT pull the trigger on a heel turn out of the RVD/Kane split? It makes no sense to me.
The result of all this? Well, I must make the obligatory mention that it results in lots of screen time for HHH. It also means lots of attention for heel authority figures (Vince and Eric) and some rather one-sided feuds and matches--look at the two six man tags on SD last week, as Undertaker had the APA with him against the FBI, although he hardly seemed to need them after winning matches against FBI members with the others interfering, and Team NotAngle got into the main event with Big Show against Lesnar, Angle and Hogan. Again the word "lopsided" comes to mind.
This should be a golden opportunity to get some new main event heels over, but it hasn't happened, except for Cena. Most of the heel action seems to come in the tag ranks. They've done a very good job getting Hass and Benjamin over as a major tag team, but not as singles stars (not that they'd be the ideal candidates at the moment). The FBI certainly isn't turning anyone into a singles star. Rodney Mack isn't getting anywhere. And so on.
The guys I'd really like to see given that kind of push aren't even in the running. Sean O'Haire was put into the Piper lackey role and is now adrift. Kanyon, who had some momentum from his role in the invasion, isn't even on the main show. Will being called "boring" by Steve Austin make it happen for Lance Storm? I'd like to see it, but I have my doubts. Test has probably been given the best chance of anyone to break through to the top, but it hasn't happened.
This might not be a problem with heel champions to chase, but in my view their best options are keeping Lesnar as SD champ and building Goldberg up for a run with the Raw belt. But they need credible opponents, and not just two of them.
So I'd prescribe a couple of heel turns, starting with either Benoit or Rhyno who are well into building to a split, but not ending there. (As discussed on another thread, though, Goldberg should stay face for the forseeable future. Fans have been waiting for his big face return to the top ever since Hall tasered him; it's past time.) And also some serious pushes for midcard heels--but of course I'd like that to mean O'Haire, Kanyon, Storm and maybe Nowinski or Orton--no A-Train or Rosey pushes, please!
Have I missed anyone important? Does anyone see other good ways to handle the situation?
On the RAW side, until Trip drops the belt its not worth turning anyone heel, because they will just be dropped down to the mid card and away from championship status. On the SD side, I still hold out hope that the Angle face turn is just an excuse to help Brock along on the road of taking Sting's 'Dumbest Man In Wrestling' title when Angle turns on him and takes his championship. As for Benoit/Rhyno, its probably inside of a month before they have Rhyno turn.
Where have you gone Gene Rayburn, a nation turns it lonely eyes to you.
Originally posted by redsoxnationOn the RAW side, until Trip drops the belt its not worth turning anyone heel, because they will just be dropped down to the mid card and away from championship status. On the SD side, I still hold out hope that the Angle face turn is just an excuse to help Brock along on the road of taking Sting's 'Dumbest Man In Wrestling' title when Angle turns on him and takes his championship. As for Benoit/Rhyno, its probably inside of a month before they have Rhyno turn.
Well, even if Rhyno turns, who's to say he'll be any better off for it? WWE has a bad habit of wasting people's momentum (RVD's debut, Jericho's phantom title win, Austin's post-injury return) and I'm worried for both Rhyno and Kane. On the RAW side, I'm not so worried about lack of heels as much as I'm worried about lack of faces. Last night's show proved that RVD, Booker T, and Kane are not strong enough to carry a show themselves. They're just experimenting with Goldberg and not taking him seriously as top guy right now. So, who is left to feud with Hunter? Nobody. RAW needs Benoit or Angle to switch over to them and fast. Triple H and Evolution squashing a bunch of JTTS is not the way to go. WWE needs big time faces outside of Brock and Kurt. With good faces, heels will come.
On RAW, they seem to be counting on Randy Orton to be a big-time heel but as redsoxnation said, there can only be one strong heel on RAW. Oh and according to JR, Test is a Main Eventer now. :b They could turn Van Dam but at his cockiest in ECW, it just made him more of a face kinda like The Rock.
On Smackdown, they really need some new challengers from Brock. May as well turn Benoit because they blew capitalizing on the Royal Rumble momenteum. I still like the idea of Heyman returning to throw challenger after challenger at Brock. He got the Big Show over as a heel. He can do the same for Benoit and/or Rhyno.
And don't forget about Matt Hardy. He could be a good mid level heel if they got behind him strong.
Originally posted by fuelinjectedOn RAW, they seem to be counting on Randy Orton to be a big-time heel but as redsoxnation said, there can only be one strong heel on RAW.
The only problem is Randy Orton doesn't seem to be involved in a feud. All he does is make the save for HHH. Get him into a good feud with someone, but not with Tommy Dreamer or Spike Dudley (i mean come on, in WWE, there not going to move anywhere), like RVD or Booker.
(edited by XPacArmy on 1.7.03 1622) On this day, June 24, I would like to wish my other sister Happy Birthday!!
The only problem in this is that HHH, Christian and La Resistance are all Honky Tonk heels who ALWAYS seems to be holding onto the belt despite whatever the faces can muster. Despite the greater number of faces, they're all devalued because they're presented as never being able to win the big one. Smackdown is just the opposite, with all faces holding the belts (and it's gotten to the point now where fans know that Big Show won't ever beat Brock for the belt again).
Over 1550 posts and still never a Wiener of the Day!
Oliva: You are the weakest link! Goodbye!
Stewie: Ahahaha. Oh God, that's funny. That's really funny. You write your own material? Do you? Because that is so fresh. 'You are the weakest link. Goodbye!' You know I've never heard anyone make that joke before. You're the first. I've never heard anyone reference that outside program before. Because that's what she says on the show, right? Hmmm? 'You are the weakest link. Goodbye!' And ye...ye..yet you've taken it and....and used it out of context to insult me in this everyday situation. What a clever, smart girl you must be. To come up with a joke like that all by yourself. Mmmmm...that's so fresh too. Any Titanic jokes you want to throw at me as long as we're hitting these phenomena at the height of their popularity. Mmmm? Cuz i'm here God you're so funny!
It's funny, I was thinking last night while watching the show that Orton should be going after IC Champ Booker T. Or Booker should be going after IC Champ Randy Orton. Or something with Orton and Booker.
I still love Christian, but the HTM revival isn't getting it done and it's pissing the live audiences off no end. Things are different now from when HTM was running amok, and the live fans f'ing hate DQ's and Bischoff-induced "draws". I notice that the count-out finish has been completely dropped off the radar. Why not the Dusty finish, too? Ah well, I'm cranky today.
Simple way to make me happy: 2003 World Series Champions, Your Boston Red Sox
Originally posted by redsoxnationOn the RAW side, until Trip drops the belt its not worth turning anyone heel, because they will just be dropped down to the mid card and away from championship status. On the SD side, I still hold out hope that the Angle face turn is just an excuse to help Brock along on the road of taking Sting's 'Dumbest Man In Wrestling' title when Angle turns on him and takes his championship.
I think that even turning Angle heel last year was too much. The character dynamic for the Angle-Brock storyline heading into WrestleMania was incredibly weak and Brock's face character has not shown itself to be well-performed nor exciting in any way. Brock's the one who should turn. Again.
Just like Rikishi has been rubbing his ass in guys' faces for the last three years, Angle has been perpetually placed in the heel role, and dozens of midcarders have remained dozens of midcarders. The short-sighted writing in WWE doesn't give anybody the opportunity to develop or go anywhere.
Although, yes, as far as RAW goes, there's really no room for another heel at the top of RAW while HHH is holding the belt. Although, I have my doubts that even after he drops the belt, we'll see another heel rise up.
(edited by SKLOKAZOID on 1.7.03 1530) "If you're asking if I would ever date a wrestler, certainly I would. However it wouldn't be good business for me to get romantically involved with anyone in any aspect of our business." -Stephanie McMahon (Off the Record, June 3rd, 1999)
If I booked RAW and Smackdownwith the given talent on each roster, respectively:
Top Raw heels-
1) Chris Jericho- The man always gets a reaction. He is good enough of a character and wrestler to help carry the WWE into prosperity yet again.
2) Triple H- Triple H is not that bad. Good in fact. But his stranglehold on the Raw booking and the overall WWE booking is killing business and fan support for the product. I'd give him the IC title though.
3) Lance Storm- I would have gone with Randy Orton as being the 3rd top heel on Raw, but I still think he's green. Give the ball to Lance and let him run with it. It's not like things could get any worse.
Top Smackdown Heels-
1) Kurt Angle- The MVP of the WWE, in my opinion. I can't picture this man as a long-term face. He is best as heel.
2) Eddy Guerrero- Eddy is best as 'tweener but I'll put him on this list regardless. I'd like to see Eddy heel again. His character is established well enough for the WWE audience to accept him as a top character.
3) Tie---Matt Hardy/Paul Wight- My only beef with Matt Hardy is that he wrestles in pajama pants. Paul Wight is good in his feud with Lesnar, but I wouldn't count on him for any long-term plans.
I'd mention John Cena but I can't take his character seriously. But he certainly has the talent to take him to full-time main-event status.
(edited by IfYouWill on 2.7.03 0045) "I am a real American, Fight for the rights of every man, I am a real American, fight for what's right, fight for your life!"
I think this year is going to be the exception in terms of the "upper-midcarder gets a winter first-time Title run" rule. The upper card is just too glutted. Austin, Rock, HHH, Jericho, Taker, Hogan, Angle. That's (arguably)