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The W - Current Events & Politics - Keyes and Dershowitz making sense!
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DMC
Liverwurst








Since: 8.1.02
From: Modesto, CA

Since last post: 3418 days
Last activity: 3412 days
#1 Posted on
Did anyone catch Alan Keyes show last night? They had a great discussion on the Middle East situation, and for the first time in my life I found myself agreeing with almost everything Alan Dershowitz said! I just thought it was a very interesting mixture to see a conservative black guy and a liberal Jewish guy both agreeing with eachother 100% on a pro-Israeli, anti-terrorism stance. They were both making a lot of sense as far as I could tell, while Michael Lerner acted like a retarted clown and the other guest made only a few good points. Did anyone else catch this last night?

DMC



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MoeGates
Andouille








Since: 6.1.02
From: Brooklyn, NY

Since last post: 7 days
Last activity: 7 days
#2 Posted on
Alan Deshowitz is pretty far from being a liberal. Although I have to agree with you about Michael Lerner being a retarted clown (although I'd imagine for different reasons).

Moe



Expressing myself EVERY day!
HBK 2002
Linguica








Since: 17.2.02

Since last post: 4271 days
Last activity: 4265 days
#3 Posted on
I try to stay out of political talk, but Alan Dershowitz is most assuredly a liberal. Here is a link to a news article that quotes Dershowitz:

http://www.sptimes.com/News/100301/State/Secretary_of_State_Ha.shtml

Also, here is an article by UCLA Law Professor Eugene Volokh. Volokh mentions that liberal speakers, like Dershowitz, have addressed the Federalist Society.

http://www.law.ucla.edu/faculty/volokh/fedsoc.htm

Just a few random articles from a Google search of the term "Liberal Alan Dershowitz."

Now, I will once again refrain from political talk.
BDC
Chourico








Since: 26.1.02
From: Falls Church, VA

Since last post: 4408 days
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#4 Posted on

    Originally posted by MoeGates
    Alan Deshowitz is pretty far from being a liberal. Although I have to agree with you about Michael Lerner being a retarted clown (although I'd imagine for different reasons).

    Moe



How liberal do you have to be to consider Dershowitz to not be one? Holy smokes!

BDC



"Hitler had pieces of flair that he made the Jews wear."
PalpatineW
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Getting Rowdy

Since last post: 2773 days
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#5 Posted on
You wanna talk insane...

Anyone see the episode of "Making Sense" that dealt with the post 9/11 cartoon about Terror Widows, and suggested that they're exploiting the tragedy? A worthy opinion, in my eyes, but Keyes went full-on Baptist revival on the guy and threw all reason out the window. Making sense he was not.



It's time to party/let's party/party with yourself and have a crazy party

The Immortal Andrew WK, Poet and Philosopher
Zeruel
Thirty Millionth Hit
Moderator








Since: 2.1.02
From: The Silver Spring in the Land of Mary.

Since last post: 17 hours
Last activity: 14 hours
#6 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.05
i don't know about you all, but i'm starting to see why they are sending sucide bomers to save their country...just just want to live alone with our isrealy [sp?] occupation.

some see the military actions taken by isreal a nessary act, some see it as an act of terror...

i can see both sides of the fence...one man's terror is another man's cry for freedom

DISCLAIMER: I DO NOT CONDONE THE ACTS OF 9/11; BIN LADEN MUST PAY!!!



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Jaguar
Knackwurst








Since: 23.1.02
From: Phoenix, AZ

Since last post: 141 days
Last activity: 141 days
#7 Posted on
Cash or Credit?



"You gotta hate somebody before this is over. Them, me, it doesn't matter."

"Hate, who do I hate? You tell me."

"Who do you love?"

-Wintermute to Case in William Gibson's Neuromancer
DMC
Liverwurst








Since: 8.1.02
From: Modesto, CA

Since last post: 3418 days
Last activity: 3412 days
#8 Posted on
"i can see both sides of the fence...one man's terror is another man's cry for freedom

DISCLAIMER: I DO NOT CONDONE THE ACTS OF 9/11; BIN LADEN MUST PAY!!!"

Am I the only one having trouble reconciling those two sentences?

DMC



"Blinded by her sight, it's the darkness in her eyes that so enslaves me. But if my love is blind, then I don't want to see, she's a mystery to me." -Roy Orbison, Mystery Girl, written by Bono and The Edge
PalpatineW
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Getting Rowdy

Since last post: 2773 days
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#9 Posted on

    Originally posted by DMC
    "i can see both sides of the fence...one man's terror is another man's cry for freedom

    DISCLAIMER: I DO NOT CONDONE THE ACTS OF 9/11; BIN LADEN MUST PAY!!!"

    Am I the only one having trouble reconciling those two sentences?

    DMC



Well, yeah. I'm sure the British saw Sam Adams and the sons of liberty as terrorists, and today history regards their acts as a cry for freedom. John Brown was a terrorist, more or less, but I think he was attempting to do a good thing (raid federal munitions dump, free slaves). Condoning violent resistance to violent oppression doesn't necessarily entail condoning attacks on civilians.



It's time to party/let's party/party with yourself and have a crazy party

The Immortal Andrew WK, Poet and Philosopher
DMC
Liverwurst








Since: 8.1.02
From: Modesto, CA

Since last post: 3418 days
Last activity: 3412 days
#10 Posted on
"Well, yeah. I'm sure the British saw Sam Adams and the sons of liberty as terrorists, and today history regards their acts as a cry for freedom. John Brown was a terrorist, more or less, but I think he was attempting to do a good thing (raid federal munitions dump, free slaves). Condoning violent resistance to violent oppression doesn't necessarily entail condoning attacks on civilians."

Well then that's a very important distinction. It may be ok to raise up arms in a revolution, but not to slaughter innocent people simply because you don't like them, or for any other reason for that matter. I think the latter more clearly falls into a definition of "terrorism." The only question I have is whether or not Bin Ladin's actions can in ANY way, and at ANY time be called a legitimate "cry for freedom" as the other post seemed to suggest. In his case there is no room whatsoever to "see the other side of the fence." What he did was EVIL, close the book, have a cookie, go to your room. End of discussion.

DMC



"Blinded by her sight, it's the darkness in her eyes that so enslaves me. But if my love is blind, then I don't want to see, she's a mystery to me." -Roy Orbison, Mystery Girl, written by Bono and The Edge
Travis
Boerewors








Since: 7.3.02
From: Baltimore, MD

Since last post: 4481 days
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#11 Posted on

    Originally posted by DMC
    "Well, yeah. I'm sure the British saw Sam Adams and the sons of liberty as terrorists, and today history regards their acts as a cry for freedom. John Brown was a terrorist, more or less, but I think he was attempting to do a good thing (raid federal munitions dump, free slaves). Condoning violent resistance to violent oppression doesn't necessarily entail condoning attacks on civilians."

    Well then that's a very important distinction. It may be ok to raise up arms in a revolution, but not to slaughter innocent people simply because you don't like them, or for any other reason for that matter. I think the latter more clearly falls into a definition of "terrorism." The only question I have is whether or not Bin Ladin's actions can in ANY way, and at ANY time be called a legitimate "cry for freedom" as the other post seemed to suggest. In his case there is no room whatsoever to "see the other side of the fence." What he did was EVIL, close the book, have a cookie, go to your room. End of discussion.

    DMC


Define for me "evil", please.



Fueled by Guinness, powered by YOUR LOVE.
Cheers, byatch!
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DMC
Liverwurst








Since: 8.1.02
From: Modesto, CA

Since last post: 3418 days
Last activity: 3412 days
#12 Posted on
"Define for me "evil", please."

The lack of good. But I suppose I may not be able to help you with this if you do not accept as self-evident that there are such things as objectively good and evil actions.

DMC



"Blinded by her sight, it's the darkness in her eyes that so enslaves me. But if my love is blind, then I don't want to see, she's a mystery to me." -Roy Orbison, Mystery Girl, written by Bono and The Edge
Jaguar
Knackwurst








Since: 23.1.02
From: Phoenix, AZ

Since last post: 141 days
Last activity: 141 days
#13 Posted on
Well, Osama sends his followers to kill Americans and that's evil.

Bush sends his Army to kill Afghani's and that's.... what?

Justice?

-Jaguar



"You gotta hate somebody before this is over. Them, me, it doesn't matter."

"Hate, who do I hate? You tell me."

"Who do you love?"

-Wintermute to Case in William Gibson's Neuromancer
ges7184
Lap cheong








Since: 7.1.02
From: Birmingham, AL

Since last post: 114 days
Last activity: 37 days
#14 Posted on
Self-defense.
Travis
Boerewors








Since: 7.3.02
From: Baltimore, MD

Since last post: 4481 days
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#15 Posted on

    Originally posted by DMC
    "Define for me "evil", please."

    The lack of good. But I suppose I may not be able to help you with this if you do not accept as self-evident that there are such things as objectively good and evil actions.

    DMC



How are the concepts of good and evil "self evident"? You're using Bible logic. (ie: none)



Fueled by Guinness, powered by YOUR LOVE.
Cheers, byatch!
RandomWrestling:why be obsequious when you can be HONEST?
DMC
Liverwurst








Since: 8.1.02
From: Modesto, CA

Since last post: 3418 days
Last activity: 3412 days
#16 Posted on
"How are the concepts of good and evil "self evident"? You're using Bible logic. (ie: none)"

No, it's called Jeffersonian/Enlightenment logic. Read the Declaration of Independence.

DMC




"Blinded by her sight, it's the darkness in her eyes that so enslaves me. But if my love is blind, then I don't want to see, she's a mystery to me." -Roy Orbison, Mystery Girl, written by Bono and The Edge
PalpatineW
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Getting Rowdy

Since last post: 2773 days
Last activity: 2615 days
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#17 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.44
Everyone's missing the point. Riki was talking about the Palestinian situation, not the 9/11 attacks.



It's time to party/let's party/party with yourself and have a crazy party

The Immortal Andrew WK, Poet and Philosopher
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