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The W - Current Events & Politics - Interesting quote...
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OlFuzzyBastard
Knackwurst








Since: 28.4.02
From: Pittsburgh, PA

Since last post: 3 days
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#1 Posted on
This comes from Milton Mayor's book "They Thought They Were Free", detailing private German citizens during the Third Reich and how they could possibly have allowed it to happen.


"What happened here was the gradual habituation of the people, little by little, to being governed by surprise; to receiving decisions deliberated in secret; to believing that the situation was so complicated that the government had to act on information which the people could not understand, or so dangerous that, even if he people could understand it, it could not be released because of national security. . . .Each step was so small, so inconsequential, so well explained or, on occasion, "regretted," that, unless one were detached from the whole process from the beginning, unless one understood what the whole thing was in principle, what all these "little measures" that no "patriotic German" could resent must some day lead to, one no more saw it developing from day to day than a farmer in his field sees the corn growing. One day it is over his head."






"The only difference between lilies and turds are those humankind have agreed upon, and I don't always agree."
---George Carlin

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---Anon.
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DMC
Liverwurst








Since: 8.1.02
From: Modesto, CA

Since last post: 3384 days
Last activity: 3378 days
#2 Posted on
I think many Germans probably did regret some of the internal moves the Nazi party made in asserting their power, but it is actually a debate within German history whether or not they regretted the moves against the Jews, both within and outside of Germany. Someone like Daniel Goldhagen would say that the country had become rabidly anti-semetic (even before the Nazis came to power) that the Holocaust was just a natural outgrowth of their hatred of Jews.

DMC



"Do you not think there are things in this universe which you do not understand and yet which are true?" -Abraham VanHelsing
WyldeWolf1
Boerewors








Since: 20.6.02
From: Florida

Since last post: 4340 days
Last activity: 4340 days
#3 Posted on
You also have to remember the kind of shape Germany was in following World War I. The economy was in shambles and stayed there due to war reparations and the general damage to their infrastructure. Their money was used as children's building blocks, unemployment was sky-high, etc. They were vilified by the world for a war that they didn't start (World War I was due to the mess of alliances woven by men like Bismarck and a stupid assassin in Yugoslavia).

So life is sucking for a German citizen. This this guy comes along and says, "The war wasn't our fault. Germany is great. The other countries are ruining us." He says some other things about Jews, but you take it in stride. Then the Nazis start building, restore the military, etc. It may not be a sound democracy, but now you have a job, money that has value, and a restored pride in your nation.

In other words, Germany was ripe for the picking for a maniac like Hitler.

I have a problem with the comparisons of current American policy and USSR/Nazi Germany, mainly because we have a precedent in this country for taking such action in a time of war. Look it up...go as far as the Civil War to find war-time limitations of freedom that are restored at its resolution. I think it would hit home if the war was being fought on American soil, or everyone knew someone overseas (as in WWII).



"My doctor says my nose would stop bleeding if I'd just keep my darn finger out of there!"
"Me fail English? That's un-possible!"
--Ralph Wiggums
eviljonhunt81
Pepperoni








Since: 6.1.02
From: not Japan

Since last post: 2896 days
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#4 Posted on
"the Civil War to find war-time limitations of freedom that are restored at its resolution"

I just wanna say that the federal government has expanded from the Civil War on. While I agree with the majority of your post, the government is very resistant to giving up power that it usurps "in times of crisis."



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WyldeWolf1
Boerewors








Since: 20.6.02
From: Florida

Since last post: 4340 days
Last activity: 4340 days
#5 Posted on
Government expansion since the Civil War is not due to things like Lincoln's suspension of habeas corpus. It is due to the fact that the power of individual states as defined by the Constitution ended at that time. In theory, the states entered into an agreement to form the federal government. Therefore, the states are the ones with the power to dissolve it. However, the victory of the federal government over the seceding states meant that it could expand its power over areas relegated to the state governments in the Constitution. It does this today primarily by controlling the purse...almost all federal money has strings attached.



"My doctor says my nose would stop bleeding if I'd just keep my darn finger out of there!"
"Me fail English? That's un-possible!"
--Ralph Wiggums
MoeGates
Andouille








Since: 6.1.02
From: Brooklyn, NY

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 1 day
#6 Posted on
Mostly it's the Constitutionally mandated Federal responsibility of "Regulating Interstate Commerce" that is the root of a great deal of the Feds power, as virtually everything can in someway or another (especially in this day and age) affect interstate commerce in some way.



Expressing myself EVERY day - but especially on July 22, 2002!
Zeruel
Thirty Millionth Hit
Moderator








Since: 2.1.02
From: The Silver Spring in the Land of Mary.

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 1 hour
#7 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.05

    Originally posted by WyldeWolf1
    You also have to remember the kind of shape Germany was in following World War I. The economy was in shambles and stayed there due to war reparations and the general damage to their infrastructure. Their money was used as children's building blocks, unemployment was sky-high, etc. They were vilified by the world for a war that they didn't start (World War I was due to the mess of alliances woven by men like Bismarck and a stupid assassin in Yugoslavia).

    So life is sucking for a German citizen. This this guy comes along and says, "The war wasn't our fault. Germany is great. The other countries are ruining us." He says some other things about Jews, but you take it in stride. Then the Nazis start building, restore the military, etc. It may not be a sound democracy, but now you have a job, money that has value, and a restored pride in your nation.

    In other words, Germany was ripe for the picking for a maniac like Hitler.

    I have a problem with the comparisons of current American policy and USSR/Nazi Germany, mainly because we have a precedent in this country for taking such action in a time of war. Look it up...go as far as the Civil War to find war-time limitations of freedom that are restored at its resolution. I think it would hit home if the war was being fought on American soil, or everyone knew someone overseas (as in WWII).



wow, i never looked at it that way...hmmmm...i'll have to ask my dad what he thought of WWII [he just got into the war at the end of the asian side and has a medal for being part of the occupational forces in japan]



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