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The W - Pro Wrestling - Impact 9-04-08
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Quezzy
Knackwurst








Since: 6.1.02
From: Pittsburgh, PA

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 5 hours
#1 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.50
No Karlos this week so I'll start the Impact thread. No recap though so if anybody wants to do that then go for it.

-After this week's Impact I got the feeling that it wasn't so much about new guys vs. old guys as much as guys that built TNA vs. guys that came along for the ride. But it's still confusing as who is heel and face. Christian is acting like a face and AJ is acting like a face with him. But then Sting is acting like a face, which makes AJ a heel. Sting is on Kurt and Booker's side but Kurt and Booker are still acting like heels. It's too bad the sides are so confusing because AJ gave the best (serious) promo of his life and I'm not even sure if it was a heel promo or face promo.

-This was a pretty good show other than the Curry Man/Sharkboy/Eric Young stuff.

-It's too bad that Christian/AJ had a run-in because other than that it was the best 15 minute match I've seen this year. Lots of blocks and counters as they played up the fact that both wrestlers know each other so well. Hopefully the run-in by Frank Trigg at least leads to Trigg wrestling since AJ is now available for the PPV.

-I kind of liked Homicide's eye patch. I wouldn't mess with a latino pirate.

-Probably the most interesting development of the night was ODB going after Saed's mask. Anytime a wrestler goes after another wrestler's mask it's eventually going to come off so I'm pretty sure we're going to see Saed unmasked soon. Maybe we can even get a hair vs. mask match out of it at Bound for Glory since I'm not sure what title match they could put on at BfG after the Angelina/Wilde match this month.

-We got about 421 promos about the TNA Impact game. I'll probably rent it to see how the story mode is and see how the Ultimate X match is. Anybody else going to pick it up?



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CruelAngel777
Landjager








Since: 7.4.02

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 15 hours
#2 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.60
After looking at trailers several times (not just tonight, though it was quite much) I get a scary feeling the thing plays like reversal city. Like Dead or Alive 1 type easy reversal gameplay. Like worst then the reversal system in Backyard Wrestling 1 (somebody but me must of played it). Yet I bet there's no reversal to finishers.


I only caught half the show. It was extremely dull, and yes I can't tell who's the Heels and who's the Faces right now either. Oh yeah....


One-Eyed Homocide! Sounds like a special drink.

(edited by CruelAngel777 on 4.9.08 2107)
sentonBOMB
Frankfurter








Since: 25.11.02
From: Jersey

Since last post: 2029 days
Last activity: 730 days
#3 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.56
I've never been more pissed off at Impact Zone fans than I was tonight. Sting's promo was CLEARLY a heel promo, meant to have them booing... and they cheered. He mentioned Samoa Joe and AJ... silence. I honestly don't believe that TNA has just done a bad job of building up faces; this was, to me, clearly an example of fans thinking they are smarter than they are, and that they need to give respect to the older wrestlers. As Quezzy said, AJ gave the best serious face promo of his life, taking a page out of the Samoa Joe intensity book, but for what? I was jumping off my couch cheering, and there were no cheers from the live fans? I even thought I heard some "AJ Sucks" chants that were semi-edited out in post-production.

Maybe I'm wrong, maybe Sting's promo was really that ambiguous. I just think it was another example of TNA fans being too clever for their own good.

Aside from that, it was a solid show. 3D vs. Morgan/Abyss is shaping up nicely; the title match seems like it at least has good workers in it; if Kip James is going to be on my TV then at least it's just as a valet to women; and finally Beer Money vs. LAX is still one of my top 3 feuds in wrestling right now.
dMp
Banger








Since: 4.1.02
From: The Hague, Netherlands (Europe)

Since last post: 9 days
Last activity: 16 hours
#4 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.77
    Originally posted by sentonBOMB
    I've never been more pissed off at Impact Zone fans than I was tonight. Sting's promo was CLEARLY a heel promo, meant to have them booing... and they cheered.


Perhaps it's more a case where the bookers/writers can't make it clear who is supposed to be cheered/booed.

Despite everyone's efforts over the past ten years to create "shades of grey" it has never really worked out imo.

The heel needs to be a rotten person and act as such (see Chris Jericho atm. We might love him for the way he does it, but we all know he is really a jerk in his actions and words)

WWE seems to be able to pull off face vs face feuds right now (the Batista vs Punk and Batista vs Cena matches come to mind) because they have establishes all of these characters as strong faces (no matter what you -think- of Cena, he acts as a good guy) but that took time establishing.

As soon as things become muddy the crowd isn't sure how to respond (like when Edge turned crazy on fellow-hell Vickie G, and now the Sting stuff)



Avatar Mud
hansen9j
Andouille








Since: 7.11.02
From: Riderville, SK

Since last post: 7 days
Last activity: 8 hours
#5 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.36
Samoa Joe brings batons into fights with unarmed men (and gets outsmarted). He cries. Often. And Sting was right, he went too far in the first Booker match, and was given ample warning to not try and kill him, and he continued.

What has Joe done in the last 3 months that was like a face, besides not literally turning heel?

    Originally posted by dMp
    The heel needs to be a rotten person and act as such (see Chris Jericho atm. We might love him for the way he does it, but we all know he is really a jerk in his actions and words)


That's nice, but not always necessary. But you have to at least make the face not be a douchebag.



It is the policy of the documentary crew to remain true observers and not interfere with its subjects.

kentish
Andouille








Since: 19.8.05
From: My Old Kentucky Home

Since last post: 26 days
Last activity: 10 days
#6 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.76
Perhaps they want things to be ambiguous right now, and dare I say, let the fan dictate who becomes the faces and heels in this story. Maybe we will learn more in the coming weeks, or when Foley enters the fray (and you know he will)? The fans, like us, have a right to react any way they want. It's not that different than the old ECW fans, they booed and cheered who they wanted, not always who the company told them to.

Who knew AJ had it in him?




"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ."

-- Mahatma Gandhi
Oliver
Scrapple








Since: 20.6.02
From: Kolob

Since last post: 7 days
Last activity: 2 days
#7 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.42
ODB eats beans, and busts into the mens room to relieve herself! That probably looked funnier on paper than how it played out.

I half expect a lot of complaints concerning Raisha Saied's "unmasking" as it were. Of course, it'll be ignored that the woman underneath isn't actually Muslim, but who knows?

AJ was ON FIRE last night. Incredible match, incredible promo...but I'm still confused on Sting. Just turn him heel already. Could TNA do it?

I miss Jeff Jarrett.

ABYSS RETURNS!!! It was interesting to see how he struggled with using weapons...this is one storyline I'm really liking.

(edited by Oliver on 5.9.08 1146)



You wouldn't like Ozu Makito when he's mad!
thecubsfan
Scrapple
Moderator








Since: 10.12.01
From: Aurora, IL

Since last post: 1 hour
Last activity: 1 hour
#8 Posted on | Instant Rating: 10.00
If TNA was so interested in letting it's fans dictate the direction they take, you'd figure they would've fired Russo at least a dozen chants ago. I'm not saying you're wrong, but you have to realize you're being very generous to assume TNA is doing (and is even capable of) some sort of post-modern story telling instead of the Occam's Razor explanation of "they're bad at this."

In isolation, this is hard to believe, but intermixed with segments of people playing off the rack very defined heels and faces (Sonjay Dutt just needs a mustache to twirl and perhaps some train tracks to tie Val on after she rejects him again), it's hard to believe they'd want something completely different for the main events. You experiment with what people might like or not like in the matches that aren't supposed to draw, and you ought to know what people want to pay to see when you're building up to something (or a lot of months of somethings) that you want them to pay to see.

If I'm all wrong, and they're truly leaving it up to the people to pick their heroes, it's kinda even worse on the writers. If they're so out of touch with the audience that they need to run segments just to fish for reactions on what they're interested in, then perhaps it's time for TNA to switch to people who are in better tune. (I'm not interested in the position, thanks.) If you're a con man who doesn't know how people are going to react after every move you take, you're not going to be lasting long.

On the other hand, I envy your optimism and positive outlook on life.

White people can't be Muslim? (alternate: north Africans (?) can't adopt white children?)



thecubsfan.com - luchablog
Matt Tracker
Scrapple








Since: 8.5.03
From: North Carolina

Since last post: 9 hours
Last activity: 2 hours
#9 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.40
    Originally posted by thecubsfan
    (Sonjay Dutt just needs a mustache to twirl and perhaps some train tracks to tie Val on after she rejects him again) ... White people can't be Muslim? (alternate: north Africans (?) can't adopt white children?)


Speaking of which, have they tried to put Dutt with Saied yet? Seems like a natural pairing for two heels, three if you count Kong.

Also, how long have Beer Money been Beer Money Inc?



"To be the man, you gotta beat demands." -- The Lovely Mrs. Tracker
Quezzy
Knackwurst








Since: 6.1.02
From: Pittsburgh, PA

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 5 hours
#10 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.50
    Originally posted by Matt Tracker
      Originally posted by thecubsfan
      (Sonjay Dutt just needs a mustache to twirl and perhaps some train tracks to tie Val on after she rejects him again) ... White people can't be Muslim? (alternate: north Africans (?) can't adopt white children?)


    Speaking of which, have they tried to put Dutt with Saied yet? Seems like a natural pairing for two heels, three if you count Kong.



That's a great idea. I like the idea of Sonjay winning the X Division title and then constantly hiding behind his new friend Kong because of his association with Saied.

As for the main story purposely being ambigious so the fans can choose, I don't believe that is what they are doing. If it is I don't think it's going to work. You can't really trust the fans in the Impact zone to make decisions for you. On one side you got Sting, who is always going to be cheered, and Angle, who is always going to be booed. On the other side you have AJ, who I believe would be cheered against anybody other than Sting, and Jarrett, who might get a big pop at first but will eventually be booed. I don't believe for a second that the TNA fans will ever completely choose one side or the other as long as the sides remain how they are.

What TNA should've done is made a face team of wrestlers they know the TNA fans will cheer and make a heel team of wrestlers they know TNA fans will boo. If they absolutely have to do the young vs. old angle then it should be:
Heels - Angle, Booker, Christian, Nash, Jarrett, Team 3D
Faces - Joe, Styles, Daniels (he's actually older than Christian but he's kind of perceived as a "young" guy), Abyss?, Kaz? MCMG? LAX? with Sting siding with them instead of the old guys
Really these teams seem so obvious that it's mind boggling that TNA is doing it differently.



Lance's Response:

THAT IS AWESOME!
kentish
Andouille








Since: 19.8.05
From: My Old Kentucky Home

Since last post: 26 days
Last activity: 10 days
#11 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.76
    Originally posted by thecubsfan
    If TNA was so interested in letting it's fans dictate the direction they take, you'd figure they would've fired Russo at least a dozen chants ago. I'm not saying you're wrong, but you have to realize you're being very generous to assume TNA is doing (and is even capable of) some sort of post-modern story telling instead of the Occam's Razor explanation of "they're bad at this."

    In isolation, this is hard to believe, but intermixed with segments of people playing off the rack very defined heels and faces (Sonjay Dutt just needs a mustache to twirl and perhaps some train tracks to tie Val on after she rejects him again), it's hard to believe they'd want something completely different for the main events. You experiment with what people might like or not like in the matches that aren't supposed to draw, and you ought to know what people want to pay to see when you're building up to something (or a lot of months of somethings) that you want them to pay to see.

    If I'm all wrong, and they're truly leaving it up to the people to pick their heroes, it's kinda even worse on the writers. If they're so out of touch with the audience that they need to run segments just to fish for reactions on what they're interested in, then perhaps it's time for TNA to switch to people who are in better tune. (I'm not interested in the position, thanks.) If you're a con man who doesn't know how people are going to react after every move you take, you're not going to be lasting long.

    On the other hand, I envy your optimism and positive outlook on life.

    White people can't be Muslim? (alternate: north Africans (?) can't adopt white children?)


Good points, but I did say "perhaps". While I do doubt they are really letting the audience decide, I was really trying to make the point that we should not judge the angle too quickly, not that I had it all figured out. I will give them the benefit of the doubt, though. IMO, bashing TNA, as well as Russo, is the "cool" thing to do on the net, but the show is not bad, and hasn't been for months. It's also not great, and has asinine moments for sure (ODB last night), but they are no better or worse than Raw or SD! right now.

It is a difficult angle to pull off, because many of the key players are on opposite sides of the fence, but to do an old vs new story, they somehow have to align with people they normally would not.




"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ."

-- Mahatma Gandhi
Kei Posiskunk
Kolbasz








Since: 7.1.02
From: Central PA, USA

Since last post: 198 days
Last activity: 148 days
#12 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.00
One thing to keep in mind, is that Sting was supposed to cut a promo that made him more clearly defined as a heel, but supposedly he overturned that, and went off-script because he felt that cutting a full-on "heel" promo (Brother Ray style) was totally against what the Sting character would do.






Creeping you out since 2004
Oliver
Scrapple








Since: 20.6.02
From: Kolob

Since last post: 7 days
Last activity: 2 days
#13 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.42
    Originally posted by Kei Posiskunk
    One thing to keep in mind, is that Sting was supposed to cut a promo that made him more clearly defined as a heel, but supposedly he overturned that, and went off-script because he felt that cutting a full-on "heel" promo (Brother Ray style) was totally against what the Sting character would do.
I'm a little confused; just what kind of character is Sting?

I would love to see Sting as a full on heel. Outside of his promos, he bores me.




You wouldn't like Ozu Makito when he's mad!
GodEatGod
Boudin rouge








Since: 28.2.02

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 23 hours
#14 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.00
Sting definitely seems to be the sticky wicket in the whole thing. If not for Sting, it seems like the sides would be pretty clearly defined and everything would probably be perfectly smooth. But whether it's because the fans refuse to boo him or because Sting's a crappy heel, either way, his presence in the angle is totally throwing off the dynamics. Which is sad, because I think it's an interesting angle that hasn't yet been done very well in wrestling, and they've got the roster to do it very well if it works. But if they're utterly bound and determined for Sting to be a heel in this, then he needs to get on board and act like a heel. I have no particular problem with shades of grey. I actually think TNA did that very well earlier this year with the Angle/Christian feud, particularly all the stuff revolving around A.J. and Tomko. Of course, it all fell apart in the end, but it was quite good for a while, at least. I'm still definitely very interested in the angle, but, if things continue as they are, I may have to just find some way to tune the fans in the Impact Zone out.



"Never piss off a hawk with a blowgun" - Conan O'Brien
Karlos the Jackal
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: The City of Subdued Excitement

Since last post: 7 days
Last activity: 17 hours
#15 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.00
I am back from San Francisco! Alcatraz and the Musee Mecanique and Teatro ZinZanni are all pretty awesome. (Alcatraz was a little surreal because I kinda knew my way around from playing Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 4 -- turns out it's pretty accurate.)

Not much to add here except that I read on another board that, according to Meltzer's newsletter (so, second-hand -- can anyone confirm?), Kei is right -- supposedly Sting was supposed to be cutting more heely promos, but he vetoed everything he thought was too heely. Now, is the blame Sting's, for being inflexible, or the bookers, for trying to shoehorn Sting into a role that he probably told them in advance he wasn't comfortable doing, and has the power to say "no" to?

Also, I'm aware that ref Shane Sewell, who pulled off his shirt and attacked Abdul Bashir on the show, used to wrestle in Puerto Rico under the name Glamour Boy Shane -- anyone here seen anything by him? Is he any good? It looks like be might go back to being an active wrestler, huh?

Nice to see everyone here again!

--K



Last 5 movies seen: Baby Mama *** - The Dark Knight **** - The Mole People *** - Monster on the Campus **1/2 - Redbelt ***
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RVD should go heel, and face Undertaker after No Mercy. Hmm...
- FleaDude, What about RVD?! (2004)
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