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The W - Pro Wrestling - HUH? (Tough Enough 2) (Page 2)
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drjayphd
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Since: 22.4.02
From: Long Island

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#21 Posted on
Speaking of which, you think they realized they have the greatest heel in TE history now with Nappy Chris? And who the hell was that sitting next to Jake with the semi-Hogan beard?

Either way, I think they actually made the best short-term choice. They could (if they haven't already) just as easily sign Jake y Kenny.
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Since: 30.8.02
From: New York, NY

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#22 Posted on
you mean Kenny didn't have that intangible like Heyman talked about Jake Roberts in Beyond the Mat?

Kenny was Denzel's FRIEND... but he wasn't Denzel



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Since: 7.2.02

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#23 Posted on
I think you are all making too big a deal out of all of this.

Personally, I thought Kenny was the only guy who had any real potential. Jake has a "look", but Kenny had some skill and charisma, and was basically clay that could have been molded into anything. Ivory seemed to imply when she was interviewing him that he was not entirely out of the picture yet... even though the "contest" was over.

Does it really matters who they pick? Unless they develop into somthing watchable, they are all pretty green when they win this contest.



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Since: 23.3.02
From: Bay Area

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#24 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.00
OK, I think I've said this over two million times, but here goes again:

WOMEN'S WRESTLING SUCKS. PERIOD.

Go watch freeking GLOW or whatever the hell it's called if you wanna watch women wrestle.

I def think that NWA will sign Jake if the WWE doesn't pick him up...I could see the signing happening by tomorrow.



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Since: 14.5.02
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#25 Posted on
PANDAS ARE PEOPLE TOO!!!!

Women's wrestling sucks huh? Have you only seen the United States version??? Is THAT what you're basing this decision off of? And while you're at it, tell that to Ayako Hamada or Megume Kudo. Kudo, inventor of the Kudo Driver, AKA the Vertabreaker. Half of the insane cruiser moves/ insane ECW maneuvers came from Japanese WOMEN'S wrestling. So just keep that in mind. Sorry to go Puro on you, but you gotta respect.

(edited by PandaMask on 30.5.02 2358)




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Since: 12.1.02
From: Indianapolis, IN; now residing in Suffolk, VA

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#26 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.52

I hate (very very very very much) to agree with PandaMask, but I have to agree with him here.

The WWF's version of women's wrestling sucks. The women's matches I saw at the local indy show ruled all. So I can just imagine how well-done the Japanese matches are.

Not that I'd ever want to wrestle in Japan... I'd probably end up getting sliced in half after being powerbombed through a barbed-wire flaming table rigged to explode...



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Since: 6.1.02
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#27 Posted on

    Originally posted by Stephanie
    And, even if the two TE2 winners add some talent to the Women's Division, the Women's Division will still be treated like a bastard stepchild. And - unless the match is a "strip-em" match or a Spanking Match - the majority of the crowd will still use the women's match as an opportunity to hit the restroom or buy a beer. Only a few of us watch the women's matches to see actual wrestling (myself included) - and the WWE always finds a way to disappoint on that front.

    Steph



I actually think legit women feuds Trish v. Jazz/now Molly, They have the same or more reaction then the other mid-card stuff. Trish/Jazz feud got more "ohhs and ahhs" and reaction to pins then most tag title matches, Euro and cruisers title bouts (even though I'm a fan of the cruisers) and other mid-card bouts. Good example that on Raw the Trish/spike v. Regal/Molly the fans wanted and got into when the gals were in there... If there's 6 or 7 storylines on Raw brand I think the women stuff is right in the middle in general fan interest.

As for the direction of the women, SPF is so right, The direction of Raw and Smackdown is night and day. Raw's women (Trish/Molly/Jazz) have storylines that involve each other, interesting characters and personality. While SD women are just kinda there, and the talented one is MIA. Heck even when Trish goes from show to show is like she's takes up 2 different characters... Even When Raw does show skin there's some sort of payoff, ie bikini/paddle on the pole had a cool visual of zombie Molly coming in and nailing Trish's skull with a wooden paddle or even the swimsuit contest when Molly did a "comedy" spot with her 1940s swimwear.. On SD we have Torrie Wilson showing her freedom by stripping her Kamona?, and Trish coming out to show her underwear just to show up Stacy, for no preticular reason?

Another thing I noticed is that the WWE has like one real women storyline per time, I mean you have I think a real talent like Ivory on SD and you don't use her? (while other TE trainers Snow, Holly and Chavo all had mini-feuds), you could have her come out after Trish destroyed Stacy as McMahon throwing a wrestler now at Trish for what she did to Stacy, but Trish is going straight to a Molly feud.

With so many women talked about coming in, Dawn Marie, Tough Enough Jackie, Linda, Nidia, injured Sharmell, Victoria rumors. I could see them cutting a lot of the current women like Jaqualine( same fate as one-name Tori after Torrie Wilson came in) Terri(harcore title = goodbye gift?. Plus she took TV time away from Lilian doing backstage interviews on heat, errrr), Torrie Wilson (on looks alone she is right up there, but she's got zero charisma.. ahh who i'm i kiddin she's stayin), Ivory (oh do I dig Ivory so much, I hope she sticks and a great "sport-entertainer" but her not getting any TV time while other TE trainers do worry me), Linda McMahon (just seeing if you are reading tell the end)



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Since: 11.12.01
From: Catlin IL

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#28 Posted on
Perhaps Tough Enough just should've been a one-shot deal, instead of what will become more and more of a fully scripted series.



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Since: 2.1.02
From: Madison, WI

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#29 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.22
You know - the more I think about it, the more I believe that the TE2 Finals were worked - not by the participants, but by WWE itself. I have this feeling that both women got contracts tonight so that they could bask in the glow of the lights for the live MTV cameras...and then use that exposure to foster name recognition for themselves once they do surface in WWE. Also, I believe that WWE is counting on the controversy this move has generated - word-of-mouth, bulletin boards, petition drives - to put TE2, TE3, and WWE at large in the public eye (using the "no such thing as bad PR" reasoning).

It would not shock me to learn that Jake and Kenny have already been offered developmental contracts. As I mentioned in an earlier post, I could see it explained as Flair hiring them both on behalf of WWE RAW to counter the injustice of Vince hiring both women for his own nefarious desires.

Do I think that this is a dangerous method for drawing attention to your company? Definitely. Look at the "casual fan" riot BigSammyE described - some of them will not understand the Machiavellian manipulations and will never watch TE3 based on the TE2 results. Some of them may not even pay attention to WWE any longer. Those in power at WWE likely think that the long-term positives will outweigh the short-term negatives. For their own sakes, they had better be right.

Steph



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billnopus
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Since: 3.1.02
From: From the Dark Side

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#30 Posted on
Actually, this isn't *all* bad.

Because they now had 2 same-sex winners, in TE3, the
contestants will know that they are competing against
*everyone* -- not just their gender.

It also gives the WWE a little more flexibility, in case they have a situation like TE1, when they got down to two
females real quick.

Like others, I also think you'll see a few more from this group get signed to deals over the summer. Maven' injury could slow down his feud with the TE2 rep, but his most natural feud is with Chris Harvard.




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evilwaldo
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Since: 7.2.02
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#31 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.00
I think Al and Jake were very pissed off and Jake made it known on camera. It was obvious that no one knew ahead of time that they would be picking 2 women. The second pick of Linda is a bit of a waste because of her knee problems. She already has a torn ACL and really should have surgery. The WWF could have picked one of the guys and agreed to pay for Linda's surgery and rehab in return for signing her to a developmental deal.

If I were the NWA I would be on the phone talking to Jake and Kenny about signing a contract.



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Since: 4.1.02
From: The Hague, Netherlands (Europe)

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#32 Posted on
Wouldn't the NWA(-TNA) be better off with real wrestlers so they can deliver on their promise of 4 ppv-quality shows a month?

I have never seen TE2 as they don't air it here but are they really any 'good' in the ring?

The choice for the 2 women is obvious.
They are trying to get more women in the women's division who live up to the WWE standard (2 moves and stand around in lingerie) while they have plenty off jobbers right now so they don't need two green rookies.

And as has been pointed out, they might get developmental contracts which is probably better than ending up in your one match and never be seen or heard again (hi..bye Nidia)

Al pissed? Again I haven't seen the show or the format but wouldn't he know who would win? Who picked the winners if the coaches didn't?



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Since: 2.1.02
From: Blacksburg VA

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#33 Posted on
Here's a thought that may run shivers down your spine. In the recent Road Rules-Real World Challenge -- also on MTV, remember -- one of the guys had a "character" called The Mizz, a professional wrestler. His side won, getting him about $20-30K after sharing it with people ... and on the "reunion" show he said he spent his money on going to wrestling school. If MTV does get more proactive in TE ... anyone else think they might press for a spot for this guy on TE3? It actually might be an interesting cross-promotion, but I dunno.
CRZ
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Since: 9.12.01
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#34 Posted on
Wow, you guys must think NWA TNA's really gonna last a lot longer than I think it's gonna last.



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BigSammyE
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Since: 30.5.02

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#35 Posted on
Yeah, I feel like I have to re-emphasize my point that Women's Wrestling is as dead as dead could be. Face it: if it's not some sort of specialty women's match that goes under 2 minutes, people just don't care. And besides that, the thing with Women's wrestling is that it's a dead end venture. Look at it like this:

If TE2 had Jake and Kenny win, then they could've moved them in all sorts of directions. Jake could've spent some time in the Hardcore Division, which requires a lot less finess (or however that word is spelled), while Kenny could get some matches in as a bump machine where a big guy just tossed him around for a bit while he made the moves look a whole lot more impressive. Then you could throw him into a wide variety of angles and make him a contender for a European Title.

But then you have two women, Jackie and Linda (one of whom may not even be able to perform, who knows). You send them to Lousiville or Cincinatti, then bring them back. The what do you do with them? Neither would be credible in Hardcore or any other men's wrestling titles. So you put them in matches against Trish for the women's title. They win and lose the title. Then what do you do with them? You throw them into the specialty matches that last under 2 minutes. Why? Cause fans don't want to watch women wrestling longer than that unless there's a chance for brief nudity or a thong shot. And besides that, at this time, there's only really a few women that the WWF can give the title to, regardless of work rate and what not, just because they're remotely over: Trish, Stacey, Torrie, and maybe Molly.

Remember what happened with Jazz? Half the time, the crowd was dead silent, unless she ruined one of those Wet T-Shirt Contests or something of that nature. Then she'd get booed just because the people wanted her to go away. Now she's injured. How many casual fans do you know that actually care? Sorry to say it, but people really didn't care, and the Women's division just went on.

I have to agree that one of these girls will end up as Vince's little plaything by the end of the year.

And to add one last thing, even if the fans did care about Women's wrestling, I'm sure that the WWF wouldn't know how to get it right.
TinMan
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Since: 11.1.02
From: TX

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#36 Posted on
Well my predictions were wrong but I do think that Jake is already under some sort of developmental deal. I said in another post that 411 had it in their news that Jake had quit his fireman's job and was training full time. Kenny wasn't mentioned but all of the trainers looked pretty impressed with his match against Chavo. I even think that what's his name that supposedly slept with Jackie may even get a contract. Quite a big deal was made about his sleeping with Jackie so that is a ready made cross gender feud. I think that even a stable would work consisting of Jake, Kenny, and Chris Harvard against Al Snow and Maven when he returns. A "so you didn't think we were good enough" type of thing.



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Since: 7.2.02
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#37 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.00

    Originally posted by TinMan
    A "so you didn't think we were good enough" type of thing.


That is how you bring them into the NWA. They may not be ready to be prime-time players but they do have name and face recognition. The 13-25 age group wants to see young, recognizable faces not over the hill wrestlers. Note how the RAW ratings dropped after Hogan won the belt.



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TinMan
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Since: 11.1.02
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#38 Posted on

    Originally posted by evilwaldo

      Originally posted by TinMan
      A "so you didn't think we were good enough" type of thing.


    That is how you bring them into the NWA. They may not be ready to be prime-time players but they do have name and face recognition. The 13-25 age group wants to see young, recognizable faces not over the hill wrestlers. Note how the RAW ratings dropped after Hogan won the belt.



I gotta agree with CRZ though, I really don't see NWA:TNA lasting very long doing the PPV route. They need a weekly show, even a syndicated deal, to get casual fans interested beyond a month or so. I consider myself a casual fan that enjoys reading the rants and raves online. I actually find them funny b\c I don't take it as seriously. My point being, as a casual fan, I am not going to get the NWA ppv's so I don't see why any other casual fan would beyond satisfying their initial curiosity.



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Since: 22.1.02
From: Texas

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#39 Posted on

    Originally posted by T.R.
    you mean Kenny didn't have that intangible like Heyman talked about Jake Roberts in Beyond the Mat?

    Kenny was Denzel's FRIEND... but he wasn't Denzel



I just don't think Kenny or Jake had tremendous aptitudes for the performance side of our business. But that's just me.
Parts Unknown
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Since: 2.1.02
From: Darkenwood

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#40 Posted on
Some thoughts:

I think the Women's Division kicks ass, and yes, I think the fans care. When Trish beat Jazz a few weeks back for the title, the place ERUPTED because the WWE has really done a lot to put her over. I wanted more women for the division. I got 'em. I'm very happy.

I thought Linda's promo and Jackie's promo rocked. Their matches were good, too.

Jake will end up on the roster. Just wait and see - he'll do a run-in on Maven when he gets back.

Kenny is boring as hell. I'm so glad he didn't win.

When Kenny said the contest wasn't based on athleticism, did you think he was implying Jackie or Linda or both had sex with Al or McMahon or someone? You gotta wonder.

Stacy Keibler is a dumbass. First, she says Pete and Jackie had sex, making everyone in the place uncomfortable. Then she asks if the winner is correct. I think she was trying to be her usual heelish secretary character when she asked, but I don't think the audience (me included) caught it immediately. I think she was trying to say, "Ugh...these chicks are gonna give me competition!" in character but it came off like "Are you sure? McMahon wants both of them and not Jake or Kenny?" She's an idiot.



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