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18.12.14 1943
The W - Pro Wrestling - HHH and the chase
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JWstorm
Kolbasz








Since: 23.10.02
From: Tarheel State

Since last post: 3108 days
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#1 Posted on
We all remember HHH's long reign at the top from 2000. The difference between that and today is the fact that then there was a true chase. At least one that the fans cared about. There was reason to keep the belt on HHH. They were trying to put him over as the super heel as Foley and the part i found most interesting the Rock chased after him and the title. I remember this particularly because my first time gettin back into wrestling since 1997 was the night HHH beat Big Show for the title. With this in mind i wonder how they can justify having the title on HHH, as he has already been established and is gaining or losing no heat from a title that was not earned.
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fuelinjected
Banger








Since: 12.10.02
From: Canada

Since last post: 3318 days
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#2 Posted on
He's bonking the bosses daughter, that's how they justify it.
FurryHippie
Frankfurter








Since: 29.10.02
From: New York

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#3 Posted on
I know you guys can't be different fans from the days when we all clamored for a long title reign. Now you got one, but because it's Triple H, it sucks? Sure, it's not helping his character at all, and everybody hates him for it, but look at the Brock/Undertaker situation. Everybody wanted Taker's head after Unforgiven, but the wait made HIAC even better at No Mercy. Would you be happier if HHH dropped the title at No Mercy last month, or if he loses cleanly in the Elimination Chamber or at a bigger PPV? Think about it. The long wait could make the HHH demolition even better....isn't that what we wanted back in the days of frequent title switches??
The Amazing Salami
Sujuk








Since: 23.5.02
From: Oklahoma

Since last post: 3844 days
Last activity: 3843 days
#4 Posted on

    Originally posted by FurryHippie
    I know you guys can't be different fans from the days when we all clamored for a long title reign. Now you got one, but because it's Triple H, it sucks? Sure, it's not helping his character at all, and everybody hates him for it, but look at the Brock/Undertaker situation. Everybody wanted Taker's head after Unforgiven, but the wait made HIAC even better at No Mercy. Would you be happier if HHH dropped the title at No Mercy last month, or if he loses cleanly in the Elimination Chamber or at a bigger PPV? Think about it. The long wait could make the HHH demolition even better....isn't that what we wanted back in the days of frequent title switches??


I'm with FurryHippe (great name by the way). The HHH hating is getting tiresome. Some of it used to sound logical. Now, we are getting really creative with our conspiracy theories. Or we just wear out the "he's bonking the boss's daughter" line.



"You're always 17 in your hometown." - Cross Canadian Ragweed
humanmeal
Mettwurst








Since: 17.3.02
From: East Bay Area, California

Since last post: 4202 days
Last activity: 3479 days
#5 Posted on
Boinking the boss' daughter isn't worn out; it's renewed as a fact each and every time Steph and H do it. To ignore it when she's running half the show would be foolish indeed.

The REST of the HHHating, based largely on what someone thought he heard someone else say about a conversation with HHH, HAS gotten (somewhat) tiresome. But not so much that someone who relies on it for an argument doesn't have a good one by me.

The long 'title' reign in on a wrong guy, and I'll tell you why. It definitley has some of the positives FH id'd, no question, but there's a difference between the old chases and this one: The announcers, the bookers, the other wrestlers, etc., all sent signal after signal that the champ was undeserving and rooted WITH the fans for the belt to move but - OH!-- things just didn't work out, over and over again, creating that atmosphere you praise.

Today, HHH is seldom placed in a context where he's portrayed as a cancer on WWE's title(s), regardless of how extreme his behavior. "He's The GAME, JR!" says the King for the umpteenth time each night.

Also, once the long-reigning champ was established, it was the CHALLENGER who got promos and mike time during the chase. Champs were seldom seen, let alone pushed in our faces doing essentially the same, video-assisted promo three weeks running-- at the start of a show, no less.

Also, how can he get his comeuppance? He's already no sold death, kidnapping, and injury to his dog... .
No, things are quite different and not quite as good in this 'title chase.'

(edited by humanmeal on 29.10.02 0751)


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The Amazing Salami
Sujuk








Since: 23.5.02
From: Oklahoma

Since last post: 3844 days
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#6 Posted on
HHH is the biggest star left on the roster (that isn't too old to be a full time guy like Flair or HBK). Austin is gone. The Rock is gone. HHH is the only "household name" left. I think it's the smart thing to do to keep the strap on him as long as he's a heel. If he's a face, have him chase strap and hold it only briefly when he has it (which is pretty much what they did during his post-injury face run).

Obviously his heel routine has done its work on us (the IWC). I remember right before he came back from his injury, we all couldn't wait. We heralded him as the savior and his comeback was the most important event in years.

Now that he's a heel and he's playing that "I'm above everything and everyone" card, we all hate him. Maybe we make up different reasons - politics, backstage bullshit - but it all comes down to the same things. HHH beat our guy (be it Jericho, Booker, whatever) and we don't like it.



"You're always 17 in your hometown." - Cross Canadian Ragweed
redsoxnation
Scrapple








Since: 24.7.02

Since last post: 535 days
Last activity: 535 days
#7 Posted on

    Originally posted by The Amazing Salami
    HHH is the biggest star left on the roster (that isn't too old to be a full time guy like Flair or HBK). Austin is gone. The Rock is gone. HHH is the only "household name" left. I think it's the smart thing to do to keep the strap on him as long as he's a heel. If he's a face, have him chase strap and hold it only briefly when he has it (which is pretty much what they did during his post-injury face run).

    Obviously his heel routine has done its work on us (the IWC). I remember right before he came back from his injury, we all couldn't wait. We heralded him as the savior and his comeback was the most important event in years.

    Now that he's a heel and he's playing that "I'm above everything and everyone" card, we all hate him. Maybe we make up different reasons - politics, backstage bullshit - but it all comes down to the same things. HHH beat our guy (be it Jericho, Booker, whatever) and we don't like it.





The biggest problem with Trip isn't that he's banging Steph, because sleeping with the booker for a title is not new in wrestling (Hi Tommy Rich). The problem is, he isn't what he was in the ring 2-3 years ago. If he was putting on quality matches, who the hell cares. But if he is going to put on shitty matches, and be involved in moronic angles, he's an open target.



I want you to know, I agree with everything I've just said.
Santa Sangre
Bockwurst








Since: 21.6.02
From: Germany

Since last post: 527 days
Last activity: 415 days
#8 Posted on

    Originally posted by JWstorm
    We all remember HHH's long reign at the top from 2000. The difference between that and today is the fact that then there was a true chase. At least one that the fans cared about. There was reason to keep the belt on HHH. They were trying to put him over as the super heel as Foley and the part i found most interesting the Rock chased after him and the title.


I agree with this part 100%

Kane said it his self last night, "It's not about the title". That is exactly what's wrong with this show. Raw isn't about anyone gunning for HHH's title. It's about stupid skits about assholes and necrophillia. If they could get someone in the chase for the big belt, the show would be much more interesting.



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Chipolata








Since: 8.1.02
From: Farmingdale, NY

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#9 Posted on
I really have no problem with HHH holding the strap right now. Right this moment, he's looked at by the common fan like a top star, heat or no heat. I don't think much of him at the moment since he really has only had a bare minimum of good matches since he's returned (which is really thanks more to Jericho, Shawn Michaels and a select few others). Despite that, with him continuing to hold the title, it is building it up as worthwhile. It wouldn't have meant anything if Van Dam won it at Unforgiven, and does anyone really want Kane as champ?

I'm thinking that he and Booker get into it during this "Elimination Chamber" match, building to a one-on-one match at Armageddon (or whatever the december PPV is now). Book takes the title there, possibly loses it to Steiner at Rumble and wins it back at Mania. HHH won't have to be involved in the title scene, in theory at least, since he should have the final blow off match with Shawn at Mania. Or who knows, Maybe HHH will wind up holding it until Mania. I'm sure everyone will REALLY be screaming for his head by that point.



They gotta bring these back!!!:
"talk to the hand because the man don't understand." - "The Crippler" Chris Benoit
"...and that is the LAST WORD." - "The Big Nasty" Paul Wight
and of course: "Don't hate the playa...HATE THE GAME~!" - WCW World Champion Booker T
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Bratwurst








Since: 20.3.02
From: California

Since last post: 7 hours
Last activity: 2 hours
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#10 Posted on

    Originally posted by FurryHippie
    I know you guys can't be different fans from the days when we all clamored for a long title reign. Now you got one, but because it's Triple H, it sucks?


Well, yeah. I don't think anyone's really complaining about having long title reigns, but rather the complete lack of substance that goes along with the current HHH reign. After a turbulent summer, things have settled and they decided to split the title up so that HHH could have a long reign while Brock had his. However, they're going to have some real problems in establishing the worth of HHH's belt.

A lot of people in this thread have referenced the traditional "excitement of the chase" in regards to HHH's title reign in 2000, but neglect to mention that said "chase" had no payoff. The payoff/blowoff is the most instrumental part in regards to the actual excitement of the chase. If there's no ending, what's the fun of a chase that goes nowhere?

HHH never effectively lost to The Rock to end his 2000 reign, Vince McMahon took the blow. Due to the fact that he never really gave the fans an ending to his 2000 reign, I don't anticipate him following through at all on this one. If he doesn't actually lose and let someone else run with the belt, this "chase" isn't going to result in worthwhile television.

HHH is the #1 star on RAW, but that's because it's how WWE wants it right now. They CAN use HHH as a vehicle to elevate someone else, but so far, he hasn't done any of that, for good reasons since he needs to build heat. However, there will be a day when it will get to the point where someone will need to feed off of HHH's heat, and that will be the day when we find out if this "chase" is worth the trouble. Given HHH's past, it won't be.

Taking a look at Survivor Series' match, HHH is bascially in the ring with four of his most hated rivals, and young upstart Booker T. It's going to take five guys to beat HHH in a match that he can look good in losing. That's not a payoff. That won't build a star. That's crap.

WWE needs to take a risk and have a face destroy HHH for that belt. Someone needs to have HHH's number in order for this to work, but will WWE let it happen?
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