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The W - Pro Wrestling - Hennig Tribute (Page 2)
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Wolfram J. Paulovich
Frankfurter








Since: 11.11.02
From: Fat City, Baby

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#21 Posted on

    Originally posted by Parts Unknown
    My favorite little segment, weirdly enough, was the one where he was sitting at the announce table. He turned the camera, cracked a huge grin, flipped his pencil into the air in a very elaborate way and caught it flawlessly. The look on his face...one of pure joy and happiness...just broke my heart.


That bit made me so sad. The unabashed glee on his face.... Anyone else would have rehearsed that or insisted on its taping. For Hennig, it was just a thing. And he looked so happy, joyful, just giddy. It was as if Mr Perfect was being all the things we wanted to be, as kids; and he was the biggest kid of all. He was in on a joke that only we got. Sure, Vince had him wrestling and doing something — but the real fun, that fun belonged to us and him.

That smile, that joy.... I can't ever forget that. And I want to smile with him, but I can't. I feel as if I have to smile for him now. That grin, that little pencil flip.



To get to The Obtuse Angle Archive, Click Here

Burns: Smither's this beer isn't working! I don't feel any younger, or funkier....
Smithers: I'll switch to the tablespoon, sir.
Parts Unknown
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Darkenwood

Since last post: 82 days
Last activity: 2 days
#22 Posted on

    Originally posted by Jeb Tennyson Lund

      Originally posted by Parts Unknown
      My favorite little segment, weirdly enough, was the one where he was sitting at the announce table. He turned the camera, cracked a huge grin, flipped his pencil into the air in a very elaborate way and caught it flawlessly. The look on his face...one of pure joy and happiness...just broke my heart.


    That bit made me so sad. The unabashed glee on his face.... Anyone else would have rehearsed that or insisted on its taping. For Hennig, it was just a thing. And he looked so happy, joyful, just giddy. It was as if Mr Perfect was being all the things we wanted to be, as kids; and he was the biggest kid of all. He was in on a joke that only we got. Sure, Vince had him wrestling and doing something — but the real fun, that fun belonged to us and him.

    That smile, that joy.... I can't ever forget that. And I want to smile with him, but I can't. I feel as if I have to smile for him now. That grin, that little pencil flip.



Very well spoken, Jeb. I'm going to tape Confidential this weekend just to have that moment captured.



"Also, don't incur the wrath of P.U. It can only lead to trouble." - Torchslasher
Boston Idol
Blutwurst








Since: 17.2.03
From: San Jose, CA

Since last post: 2900 days
Last activity: 2693 days
#23 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.54
Let's start by clearing up a few smaller points.

Was Curt Hennig a talented worker? Sure, but so was
Adrian Adonis and he didn't change the business.

Was Curt Hennig the heir apparent to Ric Flair? Seems
kinda laughable with Ted DiBiase, who was larger and
more talented and more significant in the company
already there, but let's ignore Ted and say Curt was the
heir apparent anyway. So was Barru Windham in the
late eighties. Did Barry change the business or have
any lasting impact beyond matches that you and I love
but that few fans have actually seen?

And sure, if Curt hadn't gotten hurt he might well have
been pushed like Bret Hart and Shawn Michaels, but
he did get hurt while they got pushed. Adonis might
have had more impact if he hadn't chubbed out and
Windham certainly would have had more impact if he
had taken better care of himself, but what is the point
of counting those missed opportunities?

During Curt's actual WWF career he had "IC champ"
and second tier guy written all over him. His "pursuit"
of Hogan was no different than more than a dozen
guys who came in, got pushed up to a match with
Hogan, then got dropped to some lower level. Well,
actually it was a little different, Hennig never got to
challenge Hogan for the title on SNME. Poffo did.

This brings me to a particular section of Hogan's My
Dad's post which called for more thought and research.

"Before Bret Hart had his first singles push Hennig
was an occasional headliner against Hogan and
the matches were well-received. Hennig was a
non-bodybuilder and while certainly well-built,
you can't say he was in the mould of most of
Hogan's heel foils from 1984-1990."
- HMD

And what was the "mould" of most of Hogan's
heel foils from 1984-1990?

"Even mid-sized men Hogan faced during that period,
most notably Savage and Orndorff, were jacked to the
maximum of any point in their careers during their
programs with Hulk. And Perfect, in his prime, looked
quite small compared with those guys during their
Hogan runs."
- HMD

Interesting, so Hogan's typical opponent was gassed
out of his mind on steroids?

How many Hogan opponents did you go through
when developing that thesis?

I decided to do some research into Hogan's "typical"
opponent by looking at SNME results.

I'll try to group them into simple classes:

Really fat guys
Really tall guys
Chunky guys
Muscular guys
Average build

Let's go...

1 - Bob Orton - average build
2 - Nikolai Volkoff - chunky guy
3 - tag against King Kong Bundy - really fat guy - and John Studd - really tall guy
4 - Terry Funk - average build
5 - Don Muraco - chunky guy (muscular if you must, but he was blimping out here)
6 - tag against Terry Funk and Dory Funk - two average builds
7- Paul Orndorff - muscular guy
8 - Hercules - muscular guy
9 - Orndorff - muscular guy
10 - battle royal
11 - did not appear
12 - Sika - chunky guy
13 - King Kong Bundy - really fat guy
14 - King Kong Bundy - really fat guy
15 - Harley Race - chunky guy
16 - did not appear (Savage vs OMG)
17 - Haku - chunky guy (Savage vs
18 - did not appear (Savage vs Andre)
19 - Akeem - really fat guy
20 - Bad News Brown - chunky guy
21 - Big Boss Man - really fat guy
22 - Honkytonk Man - average build
23 - Ted DiBiase - average build to chunky
24 - Lanny Poffo - average build
25 - tag against Perfect and Poffo - two average builds
(Note: In the midst of Hennig's "pursuit", Hogan loses to Warrior at WM)
26 - Mr. Perfect - average build (non-title, non-pursuit)

Looking at that list, "muscular" doesn't jump out at me.
Sure, Savage was muscular and he didn't happen to
face Hogan on SNME, but neither did Piper (average
build) or Kamala (really fat guy) or Adonis (chunky).

Hogan took on all shapes and sizes and he took on
smaller wrestlers early and often from Roddy Piper,
Bob Orton, and Terry Funk to Lanny Poffo.

Hennig's "pursuit" of Hogan, touted as proof that a
smaller man could chase the champ was merely
filler until the Hogan vs Warrior main event at
Wrestlemania. Yeah, Warrior was muscular and
maybe that's why he won, but then doesn't that
prove that Curt's filler program didn't change
anything?

As for Hennig pioneering the "cool heel" role, a
quick review of Starrcade 87 will reveal that heel
challenger Flair was getting cheered heavily
against babyface champ Garvin. Heels like Piper
had large fanbases as well. In fact, people who
complain about Backlund point to Jimmy Snuka
being seen as a cool heel way back in 1982.

You liked Hennig. That's great. It doesn't mean
he had much impact on the business. Had he not
gotten hurt he might have had impact, he was a
very good worker, but he did get hurt and others
like Hart and Michaels did have that impact.

Curt's vaunted "pursuit" of Hogan was a mirage,
a fond fanboy remembrance of the way things
should have been, not the way they were. Curt
was never seen as being on par with Ric Flair,
or even Ted DiBiase for that matter. He was a
great worker tabbed for an IC level push, much
like one of my favorites, Don Muraco. Curt got
pushed into a program with Hogan, but it was
as filler until Hogan could face the Warrior.

Frank

==========

Bigger names than Curt Hennig
(unordered, but numbered to make it easy to count) :

1. Hogan
2. Piper
3. Flair
4. Savage
5. DiBiase
6. Dusty
7. Andre
8. Warrior
9. Hart
10. Michaels
11. Sting
12. Luger
13. Hall
14. Nash
15. Steamboat
16. Terry Funk
17. Sid
18. Rick Rude
19. Jake Roberts
20. Undertaker
21. Davey Boy
22. Vader
23. Road Warriors
24. Steiner Brothers

I have no doubt Curt could have been a bigger name
than many on this list if he hadn't gotten hurt and if
he hadn't milked the insurance settlement, but he did,
so he isn't even in the top two dozen from any ten year
stretch one cares to select.
fuelinjected
Banger








Since: 12.10.02
From: Canada

Since last post: 3293 days
Last activity: 3293 days
#24 Posted on
Is it necessary to go on such a tirade to dispute a recently deceased man's impact on wrestling?

Hennig was a talented performer who left his mark on the wrestling industry. He had the utmost respect from his peers and it would have been nice to see where how far he would have gone when Vince made the transition to smaller guys due to the steroid scandal.

Very few people changed the wrestling business, Curt wasn't one of them but he was very good at what he did.
Boston Idol
Blutwurst








Since: 17.2.03
From: San Jose, CA

Since last post: 2900 days
Last activity: 2693 days
#25 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.54
Originally posted by fuelinjected:

: Is it necessary to go on such a tirade to dispute a
: recently deceased man's impact on wrestling?

I believe it was the Mad Hungarian who posted:

:: ...we should all stop and reflect on how important
:: he was to the business.

So that's what I'm doing, reflecting on the facts of
Curt's career rather than inventing fictions about
his supposed "pursuit" of Hulk Hogan where he
apparently pursued Hogan into the waiting arms
of the Ullltimate Warrior.

: Hennig was a talented performer

Agreed.

: who left his mark on the wrestling industry.

Not really.

: He had the utmost respect from his peers

As a performer, yes, but as a person they hated him.
Check out Bradshaw's backhanded "rememberance"
of Curt on the WWE website. Curt had a reputation
for being a total asshole and shitting, literally taking
a crap, on other wrestlers clothes in the locker room.

: and it would have been nice to see where how far
: he would have gone when Vince made the transition
: to smaller guys due to the steroid scandal.

Agreed, and we can certainly discuss that, but we
shouldn't claim that it actually happened. For a
variety of reasons including a real injury and also
including faking injury to defraud an insurance
company, Hennig never lived up to his promise.
It happens to lots of guys, but it's an insult to those
who were influential to overrated Hennig's influence.

I know it's nice to say nice things about dead people,
but how is making stuff up a sign of genuine respect?

: Very few people changed the wrestling business,
: Curt wasn't one of them but he was very good at
: what he did.

That's a perfectly fair and accurate statement.

Frank

==========

Curt Hennig from the eighties to the early nineties







Nate The Snake
Liverwurst








Since: 9.1.02
From: Wichita, Ks

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#26 Posted on
Boston, your "top 25" list doesn't hold much water without any sort of... you know... facts to back this up. What're you basing this list on, aside from personal preference?

I mean, Rick Rude? Sid? Jake Roberts?

These guys were all big names, but none of them were any bigger than Hennig was. Rick Rude was out for extended periods exactly the same way Perfect was, and the only time he was ever higher on the card than IC level was in WCW with their bogus "International" title. If Hennig had been in WCW at the time? He'd have been in the exact same spot, for the exact same reason.

Sid was pushed time and again because bookers are marks for big people, and his consistent lack of drawing power or any major crowd reaction to him at any point is a testament to just exactly how out-of-place on your list he is. And hell, if you're going to dq Hennig for being gone with a LEGIT injury, why is Softball Sid even on the list at all?

And hell, I'm a huge Jake mark and there's no WAY you can sit there and tell me with a straight face that he was ever higher up on the food chain than Mr. Perfect. He wasn't ever really a serious contender to any belt.

Curt Hennig, Mr. Perfect, was important to this business because he was good at what he did. He left a mark because he had a memorable character, who did things no one else did. You can look at a lot of the arrogant heel characters today and see some of Mr. Perfect in them. If that's not leaving a mark by your standards, well, I'd say that's your problem.



Kansas-born and deeply ashamed
The last living La Parka Marka: HE raised the briefcase!
Excalibur05
Knackwurst








Since: 19.1.02
From: Minnesota

Since last post: 1 day
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#27 Posted on
And of course, ranking Rick Steiner above Hennig is simply insulting. Not even Scott. Oh, yeah I know, they were a great team with some great matches, but certainly not at Hennig's level, especially late into their careers (while Hennig was still wrestling decent matches and Rick and Scott went to hell).

Of course any such list is completely subjective, and your list is no less correct or incorrect than any other person's. The fact that so many of his fans have showed up on message boards like this one and the fact that the WWE is going out of their way to honor him, however proves that at the very least that he had a big impact on both the business and its fans.



RAW Satire 2/17
Buffy 7.15 gets a 8 The Kennedy tweener turn happened out of nowhere, but whatever. Mostly good stuff though.
The Masked Hungarian
Pickled pork








Since: 23.1.02
From: Staten Island NY USA

Since last post: 3421 days
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#28 Posted on
Couple things for Boston Idol

1) I agree that lists are very subjective....but you're going to argue that the British Bulldog had a greater impact? Not Dynamite Kid....but Davey Boy Smith??

2)"As a performer, yes, but as a person they hated him."

So you've interviewed how many wrestlers to come up with that conclusion?

3) MASKED Hungarian...not Mad - its the little things
Boston Idol
Blutwurst








Since: 17.2.03
From: San Jose, CA

Since last post: 2900 days
Last activity: 2693 days
#29 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.54
Nate the Snake posted:

: Boston, your "top 25" list doesn't hold much water
: without any sort of... you know... facts to back
: this up. What're you basing this list on, aside
: from personal preference?

Rick Rude main evented for the WWF world title
against the Ultimate Warrior at SummerSlam 90.

I'll let you bring the facts for Hennig.

: Sid was pushed time and again because bookers are
: marks for big people

Agreed, Sid was a choad, but he was as you say
"pushed time and again" higher and harder than
Curt Hennig.

: And hell, I'm a huge Jake mark and there's no
: WAY you can sit there and tell me with a
: straight face that he was ever higher up on
: the food chain than Mr. Perfect. He wasn't
: ever really a serious contender to any belt.

His gimmick was better known, in part because of
longevity, and I note than he also main evented
for WCW against Sting at Halloween Havoc.

Speaking of Havoc, there is Rude again, 3rd from
the top one year, in the semi-main the next.

Again, I'll let you bring the _facts_ for Hennig.

: Curt Hennig, Mr. Perfect, was important to this
: business because he was good at what he did.

So was Paul Orndorff. Wait, Orndorff drew more
than 60,000 opposite Hogan for the WWF title.

Hennig drew _____ opposite Hogan for the title?

Should I add Paul Orndorff to the list, too?

: You can look at a lot of the arrogant heel
: characters today and see some of Mr. Perfect
: in them.

"Ric Flair: The Arrogance of Greatness"
- PWI in the mid-eighties

Arrogant heels may have been new to you when
Curt came along. Some of us are a bit older.

====================

The MASKED Hungarian posted:

: 1) I agree that lists are very subjective....

Nah, that's a red herring for people who don't
want to face facts in this case. We're not
debating who was a better worker, I wouldn't
be listing Dusty Rhodes and Andre the Giant
if that were the case.

Who had more impact on the business? It's easy
to go back and look at where people were slotted
by their promotions. Curt was mainly slotted by
the WWF at the IC level, with the exception of
the Hennig/Poffo time filler with Hogan prior
to Hogan vs Warrior, the important rivalry.

: but you're going to argue that the British
: Bulldog had a greater impact? Not Dynamite
: Kid....but Davey Boy Smith??

Impact at the gate and in terms of fame goes
to the man who fought for World titles in two
real promotions. I'm not talking here about
"influence" as in inspiring copycats, simply
impact during a career. But, if you want to
argue that Dynamite also had more impact than
Hennig, be my guest. I'm comfortable that
Davey Boy Smith had more impact than Hennig.
Of course Davey had more time to have impact.

:: 2)"As a performer, yes, but as a person they
:: hated him."

: So you've interviewed how many wrestlers to
: come up with that conclusion?

Point me to anyone in this thread who has
interviewed a wrestler, yourself included.

Why is it that gushing never requires research?

: 3) MASKED Hungarian...not Mad - its the
: little things

Little things like Rude getting pushed at the
World Title level while Hennig was scratching
around with the IC title?

Curt was a better worker than most of the guys
on my list, but he wasn't a star in both the
US and Japan like the Steiners, he didn't get
pushed as hard as Sid... in both promotions,
and he didn't have nearly the longevity or
name recognition of Jake "The Snake" Roberts.

I jumped into this thread to refute the notion
that Curt was a major figure in the business,
he simply wasn't. He probably meant less to
his promotions than Arn Anderson, though Arn
didn't get pushed as high as Hennig.

Frank

(Editing to replace "long" with "known".
I'd also like to apologize to the MASKED
Hungarian for getting his name wrong.)

(edited by Boston Idol on 20.2.03 2356)
spf
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02
From: The Las Vegas of Canada

Since last post: 21 days
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#30 Posted on
I'm guessing you are not the guy anyone in your family turns to for the delivery of eulogies or Best Man toasts are you? Buzzkiller ;)



The Most Bitter Place On The Net.

The current artist tickling my fancy: Brenda Weiler


Immortality
AWArulz
Knackwurst








Since: 28.1.02
From: Louisville, KY

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 2 min.
AIM:  
Y!:
#31 Posted on

    Originally posted by Hogan's My Dad

    I think actually, Hennig's influence on the business is a lot larger than you think.



And I'll give you the number 1 reason. Number 1. The piece of vide we say dominating the tribute the other night. With Curt making half-court baskets and so on, were, to my knowledge, the 1st long-term, pre-entry, get the product over viginettes I ever remember seeing. They GOT Curt over even though he was coming from the AWA, which, to be frank, wasn't much by that time.

And the WWF later used the same concept with other players coming in:Flair, for one had this, as did others. And it's common today (Nathan Jones is a current example)





We'll be back as soon as order is restored.....
krakken2000
Kishke








Since: 31.10.02
From: seattle

Since last post: 2032 days
Last activity: 1759 days
#32 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.36
"I'll let you bring the facts for Hennig."

Hennig did hold the AWA title, while it didn't mean much by 1987 the fact that he was a world champion should not be dismissed. As a fan in the 80's being AWA world champ meant as much to me as being NWA or WWF champion.

-also-
Hennig fought for the WCW title against Goldberg on ppv at Bash at The Beach 1998.
He was in (and a pivotal part of) the Fall Brawl 98 main event.
Hart vs. Hennig at Summerslam 91 is second to the top as the sub main event.
I also remember much of the (non Luger/Yokozuna) hype for Summerslam 93 being about Hennig vs. Micheals.
Hennig seconded the world champion in the co-main event at WM8.
Hennig played a major role in the suspense and eventual outcome of Summerslam 92.
Hennig fought in the main event of Survivor Series 92.
Hennig was present in the co-main event at WM10.
Hennig was a legit challenger to Hogan's title in '90 (I have never forgotten the image of Hennig smashing Hogan's world title)
He nearly won the royal rumble in 90, being the last man eliminated and again TWELVE years later in 2002 making the final four.


Title's Hennig has held: AWA tag team, AWA world, WWF IC, WCW US, WCW tag team

I'm not saying Hennig was the greatest, but his career was an impressive one that should not be so easily rejected. Obviously the outpouring of grief and kind words by his fans, friends and family prove that the man was important to the wrestling industry.

My question for you is why are you so eager to dismiss the career of Hennig?

Do you enjoy being so insensitive? Dude; let the body cool first....


(edited by krakken2000 on 21.2.03 1132)


Flaming Box of Stuff, blah, blah, blah...
The Masked Hungarian
Pickled pork








Since: 23.1.02
From: Staten Island NY USA

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#33 Posted on
Boston Idol says:

1) Point me to anyone in this thread who has
interviewed a wrestler, yourself included.

Why is it that gushing never requires research?


There is a huge difference between MY opinion of how impactful Henning's career was and YOU stating the opinion of wrestlers you've never talked to about the man. If you said YOU hated him that's fine...because it's YOUR opinion...but you're throwing a blanket statement about men you've never met hating a guy.

If Curt Henning did NOT have a deep impact on this business then McMahon wouldn't be devoting the time he is to his career. I'm trying to remember the last time someone received the still screen treatment then a video package and finally a Confidential piece. Vince McMahon has never been accused of being a humanitarian so for him to do this something must be special.

(edited by The Masked Hungarian on 21.2.03 1418)
jdw
Loukanika








Since: 21.2.03
From: SoCal

Since last post: 3841 days
Last activity: 3841 days
#34 Posted on
AWArulz wrote:
: And I'll give you the number 1 reason. Number 1.
: The piece of vide we say dominating the tribute
: the other night. With Curt making half-court
: baskets and so on, were, to my knowledge, the
: 1st long-term, pre-entry, get the product over
: viginettes I ever remember seeing.

Outback Jack had them earlier. As did others DiBiase's Million Dollar Man gimick. Heck, the Fab Ones had them in Memphis long before that.


: And the WWF later used the same concept with
: other players coming in:Flair, for one had
: this, as did others.

Actually, Flair didn't. Hennan showed his belt at SummerSlam. Hennan talked about him on the shows a bit. Then Ric showed up on Primetime and one of the Syndicated shows. Hogan also did an interview acknowleding Flair.

There were no viginettes for Flair coming in.


John
Parts Unknown
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Darkenwood

Since last post: 82 days
Last activity: 2 days
#35 Posted on
I rarely open fire on anyone here on the board, but Boston Idol, you are a moron.

Just because Sid and Rick Rude were pushed harder than Hennig means he made less of a contribution to the business? Since when does McMahon's "big man push of the month" constitute a contribution to the business?

I guess Ludvig Borga made more contributions than Hennig, huh? How about Giant Gonzalez?

Most of us (the IWC) will always think of Hennig when we remember that special era of the WWF when we were children and when we were marks. Screw Lex Luger, screw Hall and Nash, and screw 90 percent of the other guys on your list: Hennig is etched in my memory for his skill, his personna and his charisma. He epitomizes the joy I used to feel as a kid when I turned on Prime Time Wrestling...and that's more than enough of a "contribution" for me to honor Hennig.



"Also, don't incur the wrath of P.U. It can only lead to trouble." - Torchslasher
jdw
Loukanika








Since: 21.2.03
From: SoCal

Since last post: 3841 days
Last activity: 3841 days
#36 Posted on
Masked Hungarian wrote:
: If Curt Henning did NOT have a deep impact
: on this business then McMahon wouldn't be
: devoting the time he is to his career. I'm
: trying to remember the last time someone
: received the still screen treatment then
: a video package and finally a Confidential
: piece.

Confidential hasn't been around long, so it's moot when comparing with prior wrestlers who dropped dead. But Rood and Davey Boy and plenty of others got pieces. Owen got a whole show, and Pillman had a show built largely around him (teasing towards that horrid interview Vince did with his wife).

Perhaps a better question is which WWf guys from that era *haven't* gotten pieces? I mean, obviously guys like Louie didn't. Some of these guys died before the "Kinder Gentler Vince" era, such as JYD and Studd. Does anyone remember what they did for JYD?


: Vince McMahon has never been accused
: of being a humanitarian so for him to
: do this something must be special.

Nah, Vince has been accused of trying to get himself over. Using death to get over is a common thing, especially in the wrestling business. From Fritz to RYDER to Vince to Meltzer to Lano.


John
Nate The Snake
Liverwurst








Since: 9.1.02
From: Wichita, Ks

Since last post: 3780 days
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AIM:  
#37 Posted on
Well, damn, I go to bring the facts and someone else already did. At least facts don't weigh as much as, say, pianos. My knees are already bad enough...

And, since I'm psychic, I'll get this out of the way right off the bat. One of the (many, thank you krakken for the faster-than-myself work) facts krakken brought up was his world title match against Goldberg. "Well," I can hear you huffing, "He was just being fed to the Goldberg machine. He had no real chance, and everyone knew it."

And Rick Rude had a chance against the Ultimate Warrior in the first big match after he won the title. Both matches had the same purpose: to get the champs over as dominant. Thus, they are, at best, equal in determining any sort of status for the participants.

-Agreed, Sid was a choad, but he was as you say
-"pushed time and again" higher and harder than
-Curt Hennig.

Yes. And each time, that push bombed. Sid's impact on this business so far has essentially been as a champ who can't draw and doesn't excite the crowd. I'd say that's a negative impact, wouldn't you? If you're not taking positive vs. negative into account and only looking at the size of the splash you should've had Ole Anderson and the mythical, diabolical IWC version of HHH on your list waaaaay high up there.

And again, the fact that Sid cared so little about the biz that he bailed to play softball counts for a lot against him.

-His gimmick was better known, in part because of
-longevity, and I note than he also main evented
-for WCW against Sting at Halloween Havoc.

Well, whether Jake "The Snake" is a more well-known gimmick than Mr. Perfect is highly debatable. (And, ultimately, subjective.) And as far as his one-shot against Sting... where did that go again? Ohhh yeah. Nowhere.

-So was Paul Orndorff. Wait, Orndorff drew more
-than 60,000 opposite Hogan for the WWF title.

Okay, now you're grasping at straws. The Orndorff-Hogan feud was a completely different beast. It took place much earlier in Hogan's career, before he'd started to become stale, and had a hell of a lot more behind it than Hennig's run at Hogan, which was basically just a placeholder until his loss to the UW. (Note that I have never implied otherwise.)

-Arrogant heels may have been new to you when
-Curt came along. Some of us are a bit older.

Yes, and age automatically gives you a great deal of authority... if you're talking about where to cash your Social Security check. Don't be an asshole.

The Flair-style heel and the Perfect-style heel may be similar, but they're pretty easy to distinguish if you, you know... pay attention. Flair played the playboy, high-flyin', I'm-the-champ-and-you're-not type of character. Never claimed to be the best, per se, just that he would beat you, by hook or by crook. Perfect was the best. He was lost in his own ego, to a far, far greater extent than Flair. Jericho combines the two of them, as does HHH and Kurt Angle. Hell, there's a fair amount of Hennig's ego in Chris Benoit's heel character, too.

And if you're going to say that Arn Anderson wasn't a major figure in the WCW... well, you're just deluding yourself, but that's a whole other thread. And is also fairly obvious.



Kansas-born and deeply ashamed
The last living La Parka Marka: HE raised the briefcase!
Boston Idol
Blutwurst








Since: 17.2.03
From: San Jose, CA

Since last post: 2900 days
Last activity: 2693 days
#38 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.54
Nate the Snake posted:

:: Arrogant heels may have been new to you when
:: Curt came along. Some of us are a bit older.

: Yes, and age automatically gives you a great
: deal of authority...

No, I was just trying to provide an excuse for
some of the comments made on Hennig's behalf in
this thread which seem rooted in the belief that
pro wrestling began around 1990.

Curt wasn't the first character to be introduced
by a series of vignettes, he wasn't the first
cool, arrogant heel, etc. Anyone who started
watching wrestling prior to 1990 would know that.
The Outback Jack promos were legendary.

: Flair played the playboy, high-flyin', I'm-the
: -champ-and-you're-not type of character. Never
: claimed to be the best...

"To be the best, you've got to beat the best,
and I'm the best thing going today. Whooo!"
- Ric Flair, ad nauseum

Like I say, a lot of these attempts to make Curt
the "first" at something seem poorly informed.

Frank

(Still laughing over the attempt to build Hennig
up by counting his appearance as a valet as if he
was part of the main event. If that counts, I do
believe Elizabeth also had more impact than Curt.)

Nate The Snake
Liverwurst








Since: 9.1.02
From: Wichita, Ks

Since last post: 3780 days
Last activity: 3249 days
AIM:  
#39 Posted on
Nowhere did I claim that Mr. Perfect was the first arrogant heel, or any of the other things you mentioned. I said he was damn good at what he did, good enough to be remembered by the fans and imitated/admired by his peers, and that some of your choices of people who had a greater impact in the business than he did were highly debatable.

If you're going to get snarky about something you read, get snarky with the person who said it. All you're going to accomplish by pulling that on me is make yourself look like a prick, and this is far too interesting a subject to just walk away from because of the asshole factor.



Kansas-born and deeply ashamed
The last living La Parka Marka: HE raised the briefcase!
CRZ
Big Brother
Administrator








Since: 9.12.01
From: ミネケポăƒȘă‚č

Since last post: 22 min.
Last activity: 20 min.
AIM:  
ICQ:  
Y!:
#40 Posted on
Nate, Parts Unknown - let's try to back off the namecalling, please. I'm pretty sure both of you are perfectly able to attack Frank's position without having to resort to attacking Frank.


    Originally posted by jdw
    Does anyone remember what they did for JYD?


Hey, I do!

Jim Ross: "Last Tuesday, Sylvester Ritter, better known as the Junkyard Dog, was tragically killed in an automobile accident. The Dog's big heart and undeniable charisma made him one of the most beloved WWF superstars of his era. JYD will always hold a special place in our hearts, and our thoughts, and our prayers go out to his family."
"JYD" Sylvester Ritter 1952-1998

RAW 98.6.8



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