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The W - Current Events & Politics - FOX NEWS CHANNEL RULES! (Page 2)
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Leroy
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Since: 7.2.02

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#21 Posted on

    Originally posted by PalpatineW
    Truly; this is a free market. If people wanted to hear liberal ideas, Donahue would still have a job. After 9/11, people are feeling less and less guilt about being affluent, or free, or white, or American, or just plain better. We're rediscovering pride. And proud people don't tend toward liberalism.


Or it could be that people are watching more right-wing programming and responding to it because there are no other alternatives.

Liberals tend to be less exciting than your Bill O'Reillys because you cannot sum up problems in nifty little sound bites. People who are on the left side of the politcal tend to want content over presentations - and will even criticize liberal comentators who use Limbaugh like techniques.



"It's hard to be a prophet and still make a profit."
- Da Bush Babees
Eddie Famous
Andouille








Since: 11.12.01
From: Catlin IL

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#22 Posted on


    Originally posted by Leroy
    Or it could be that people are watching more right-wing programming and responding to it because there are no other alternatives.

    Liberals tend to be less exciting than your Bill O'Reillys because you cannot sum up problems in nifty little sound bites. People who are on the left side of the politcal tend to want content over presentations - and will even criticize liberal comentators who use Limbaugh like techniques.



If that is true, why didn't they watch Donahue?



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PalpatineW
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Since: 2.1.02
From: Getting Rowdy

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#23 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.44

    Originally posted by Leroy

      Originally posted by PalpatineW
      Truly; this is a free market. If people wanted to hear liberal ideas, Donahue would still have a job. After 9/11, people are feeling less and less guilt about being affluent, or free, or white, or American, or just plain better. We're rediscovering pride. And proud people don't tend toward liberalism.


    Or it could be that people are watching more right-wing programming and responding to it because there are no other alternatives.

    Liberals tend to be less exciting than your Bill O'Reillys because you cannot sum up problems in nifty little sound bites. People who are on the left side of the politcal tend to want content over presentations - and will even criticize liberal comentators who use Limbaugh like techniques.



I can't decide if this is laughable or offensive.

To your first point, there is liberal programming, or was. What was Donahue? Why did he fail? By your logic, viewers hungry for a liberal view point in this conservative-dominated media should have flocked to Donahue. After all, who else can provide them with the left-leaning content they so desire? (Other than Dan Rather Peter Jennings Aaron Brown Connie Chung Walter Cronkite Andy Rooney and everyone not on Fox).

And your second point is just ridiculous. We've got a guy on the talk radio up here in Boston, a man so left-wing the Boston freaking Globe called him "left of Lenin," Jim Braude on 96.9 FM, and he's not bad. I find his views repugnant, but I think he's a good host and he gets his Marxism across well. Alan Colmes easily holds his own against Hannity, whom I find to be overblown, to O'Reilly proportions at times.

And you assertion that "left side of the politcal [spectrum] tend to want content over presentations" is, really, quite silly. There are simplistic kooks on the left and the right, and plenty of very simplistic anti-semitic arguments to satsify them all. Is Cynthia McKinney complicated? Does Al Sharpton have a tough time condensing his views to (highly entertaining and sometimes murder inciting) soundbites? Is the concept of a "vast right-wing conspiracy" too hard for people to understand? Have you ever watched Crossfire? Do you notice that Carville and Begala (the Left) are consummate showman, whereas Bob Novak is in his 70s and comatose? And Tucker Carlson is a well-mannered, bowtied geek?



"May God bless our country and all who defend her."

George W. Bush, 3/19/03
spf
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Since: 2.1.02
From: The Las Vegas of Canada

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#24 Posted on
Well, for those looking for a different, oftentimes slanted the opposite way of US media, perspective on things, Al Jazeera has launched its English language site at http://english.aljazeera.net (english.aljazeera.net)



"It is well that war is so terrible, lest we grow too fond of it." - Robert E. Lee
Jakegnosis
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Since: 26.7.02
From: Maine

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#25 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.91
Donahue is hardly a liberal. That people consider him one is indicative of how conservative TV news is. The best (and possibly only) liberal news show on TV is NOW with Bill Moyers, which is intellectual, in-depth and, subsequently, on public television in the dead of night.



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Since: 11.7.02
From: MD

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#26 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.29

    Originally posted by Leroy

    People who are on the left side of the politcal tend to want content over presentations




    Originally posted by Jakegnosis
    Donahue is hardly a liberal. That people consider him one is indicative of how conservative TV news is. The best (and possibly only) liberal news show on TV is NOW with Bill Moyers, which is intellectual, in-depth and, subsequently, on public television in the dead of night.


I'd like to thank both of you guys for the huge belly laughs I got today from reading these outstanding comedy presentations...



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Sultan_of_Submission
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Since: 12.3.03
From: Ft. Meade, MD

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#27 Posted on
I hate Bill O'Rilley.....





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calvinh0560
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Since: 3.1.02
From: People's Republic of Massachusetts

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#28 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.00

    Originally posted by Sultan_of_Submission
    I hate Bill O'Rilley.....


I like O'Reilly. While he is overbearing most of the time he does ask tough questions and for the most part is a good interviewer. Plus I love is little war against Rev. Jackson.
asteroidboy
Andouille








Since: 22.1.02
From: Texas

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#29 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.95

    Originally posted by PalpatineW
    Truly; this is a free market. If people wanted to hear liberal ideas, Donahue would still have a job. After 9/11, people are feeling less and less guilt about being affluent, or free, or white, or American, or just plain better. We're rediscovering pride. And proud people don't tend toward liberalism.


Exactly. We can get back to hating poor brown-skinned Communists. Damn, I feel better already!




-- Asteroid Boy


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MoeGates
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Since: 6.1.02
From: Brooklyn, NY

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#30 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.28
I like O'Reilly. While he is overbearing most of the time he does ask tough questions and for the most part is a good interviewer. Plus I love is little war against Rev. Jackson.

Every time I start to think maybe O'Reilly is worth watching, he'll do something completely ridiculous. First he yelled at the guy who had his dad die in on 9-11 and was pro-peace about how his dad would be ashamed of him and what not. Then a couple days ago he did this really weird thing with the guy from Fairness and Accuracy in the Media, where he asked him a complete non-sequiter question, and when the guy hesitated answering because he couldn't figure out what the hell O'Reilly was talking about, Bill smugly accused him of hating America. It made even less sence than it sounds like here.

I still can't figure out how they manage to pass him off during Prime-Time on a "news" channel. He'd be great opposite Oprah at 4:00.

Exactly. We can get back to hating poor brown-skinned Communists. Damn, I feel better already!

I remember hating not-too-poor white Communists when I was a kid.

Quite frankly they still bug the hell out me, except now it's because of all the broken vodka bottles on my block, not because they want to nuke me.


(edited by MoeGates on 27.3.03 1355)


It seems that I am - in no particular order - Zack Morris, John Adams, a Siren, Janeane Garofalo, Cheer Bear, Aphrodite, a Chihuahua, Data, Cletus the Slack Jawed Yokel, Amy-Wynn Pastor, Hydrogen, Bjork, Spider-Man, Boston, and a Chaotic Good Elvin Bard-Mage.
Pool-Boy
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Since: 1.8.02
From: Huntington Beach, CA

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#31 Posted on

    Originally posted by asteroidboy

      Originally posted by PalpatineW
      Truly; this is a free market. If people wanted to hear liberal ideas, Donahue would still have a job. After 9/11, people are feeling less and less guilt about being affluent, or free, or white, or American, or just plain better. We're rediscovering pride. And proud people don't tend toward liberalism.


    Exactly. We can get back to hating poor brown-skinned Communists. Damn, I feel better already!



How does Pride equate to racism?

Oh yeah, I forgot, according to the laws of P.C., if you are white, and proud of your heritage, you are racist...

Damn, so if I say "Scottish Pride!" I will likely be flamed, huh?





Still on the Shelf #1
godking
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Since: 20.10.02
From: Toronto

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#32 Posted on

    We're rediscovering pride. And proud people don't tend toward liberalism.


That's because Pride is, in case you forgot, one of the seven deadly sins.



The Rock thinks you should fire him.
dMr
Andouille








Since: 2.11.02
From: Edinburgh, Scotland

Since last post: 15 days
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#33 Posted on
    Originally posted by Pool-Boy

      Originally posted by asteroidboy

        Originally posted by PalpatineW
        Truly; this is a free market. If people wanted to hear liberal ideas, Donahue would still have a job. After 9/11, people are feeling less and less guilt about being affluent, or free, or white, or American, or just plain better. We're rediscovering pride. And proud people don't tend toward liberalism.


      Exactly. We can get back to hating poor brown-skinned Communists. Damn, I feel better already!



    How does Pride equate to racism?

    Oh yeah, I forgot, according to the laws of P.C., if you are white, and proud of your heritage, you are racist...

    Damn, so if I say "Scottish Pride!" I will likely be flamed, huh?



Dang I'm 100% unadulterated Scottish and I dont get that reference.

I think the racism element is two-fold.

1. In PalpatineW's original post he referred to not simply being proud of being rich and white, but 'plain better' than others. The idea that someone is better based on affluence or race is, well, prejudiced.

2. The traditional 'white and proud' movement often (though not always) go way beyond pride in their own culture to showing complete disrespect for other cultures and races.

Bottom line is while nobody should be ashamed of their background or social standing, if they believe that this somehow makes them ipso facto superior to others then that crosses into the realms of racism.

Edit: hit submit before I meant to.

(edited by dMr on 27.3.03 1910)


"People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which they avoid."
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Leroy
Boudin blanc








Since: 7.2.02

Since last post: 8 days
Last activity: 5 days
#34 Posted on
    Originally posted by PalpatineW
    I can't decide if this is laughable or offensive.

Well, actually, its neither...


    To your first point, there is liberal programming, or was. What was Donahue? Why did he fail? By your logic, viewers hungry for a liberal view point in this conservative-dominated media should have flocked to Donahue. After all, who else can provide them with the left-leaning content they so desire? (Other than Dan Rather Peter Jennings Aaron Brown Connie Chung Walter Cronkite Andy Rooney and everyone not on Fox). And your second point is just ridiculous. We've got a guy on the talk radio up here in Boston, a man so left-wing the Boston freaking Globe called him "left of Lenin," Jim Braude on 96.9 FM, and he's not bad. I find his views repugnant, but I think he's a good host and he gets his Marxism across well. Alan Colmes easily holds his own against Hannity, whom I find to be overblown, to O'Reilly proportions at times. And you assertion that "left side of the politcal [spectrum] tend to want content over presentations" is, really, quite silly. There are simplistic kooks on the left and the right, and plenty of very simplistic anti-semitic arguments to satsify them all. Is Cynthia McKinney complicated? Does Al Sharpton have a tough time condensing his views to (highly entertaining and sometimes murder inciting) soundbites? Is the concept of a "vast right-wing conspiracy" too hard for people to understand? Have you ever watched Crossfire? Do you notice that Carville and Begala (the Left) are consummate showman, whereas Bob Novak is in his 70s and comatose? And Tucker Carlson is a well-mannered, bowtied geek?

Donahue failed be cause he was poorly advertised on a network that no one watches. And his show was not all that good. I only caught it once or twice, and I was very dissappointed - and I am big fan.

Every example of a "liberal" commentator you mention is more moderate than left-wing. Al Sharpton does not host his own talk show on a major network, and gets far less TV time than a Bill O'Reilly. And sure you can find counter-examples in local markets, but nationally the programming is by far right-wing dominated.

But this quote is the one that got me...


    After all, who else can provide them with the left-leaning content they so desire? (Other than Dan Rather Peter Jennings Aaron Brown Connie Chung Walter Cronkite Andy Rooney and everyone not on Fox).

Dan Rather is not a liberal. Connie Chung is not a liberal. Carville and Begala are not "the Left". Not even close. Andy Rooney, Peter Jennings and Walter Cronkite might be a little to the left of where you stand, but they are NOT, by any remote stretch of the imagination, liberals. It would be pushing it to even call them moderates. And because a George Will or a Tucker Carlson can more eloquently phrase a sentance than a Rush Limbaugh, doesn't mean that they are saying anything different.

(edited by Leroy on 27.3.03 1154)


"It's hard to be a prophet and still make a profit." - Da Bush Babees
redsoxnation
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Since: 24.7.02

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#35 Posted on
To be fair, perhaps we shouldn't classify Rather as a liberal. I think he falls under the classification of senile.
As for Donahue not being heavily promoted, MSNBC did a promotional blitz for the 2 months prior to his shows debut. The only problem is they forgot most people got sick of him whining by the late 80's, which is why his daytime show has been off the air for over a decade.



If it wasn't for war, you wouldn't know what peace was.
Cerebus
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Since: 17.11.02

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#36 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.74
Ok, I'm not sure who the anchor was, but yesterday on CNN, they were supposed to cut over to something live with some marine I think, and they cut over and we got LIVE footage of a guy taking a leak on a jeep. YES, we even saw the penis which was really funny.

The other one, I think this was on FOX news, A reporter says to an enlistedmen how the Iraqis have been surrendering and then after we take them in and feed them, they open fire on our men. The poor gut gets this freaked out look like he's about to start crying or shoot someone. THAT was freaky as shit.



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PalpatineW
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Since: 2.1.02
From: Getting Rowdy

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#37 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.44
    Originally posted by asteroidboy

      Originally posted by PalpatineW
      Truly; this is a free market. If people wanted to hear liberal ideas, Donahue would still have a job. After 9/11, people are feeling less and less guilt about being affluent, or free, or white, or American, or just plain better. We're rediscovering pride. And proud people don't tend toward liberalism.


    Exactly. We can get back to hating poor brown-skinned Communists. Damn, I feel better already!



That was pathetic. Do us all a favor and try not to lower the conversation in this forum to a level resembling grade-school recess.


    Originally Posted by Leroy
    Every example of a "liberal" commentator you mention is more moderate than left-wing. Al Sharpton does not host his own talk show on a major network, and gets far less TV time than a Bill O'Reilly. And sure you can find counter-examples in local markets, but nationally the programming is by far right-wing dominated.


Your assertion was that right-wing pundits find it easier to be bombastic, due to their simplistic views. I refuted your argument, I believe successfully, by presenting a host of simplistic liberals. Your defense is that none of these people are liberal. Is anyone to the right of Paul Wellstone liberal, in your eyes?


    Originally Posted by Leroy
    And because a George Will or a Tucker Carlson can more eloquently phrase a sentance than a Rush Limbaugh, doesn't mean that they are saying anything different.


But that isn't the point. Your point was that right-wingers succeed because of their bombast. I've offered you right-wingers who are not at all bombastic. You apparently have no explanation for their success. Is your problem with the style of right-wing pundits, or the fact that they hold right-wing beliefs?

Edit: And while I'm at it, do you even listen to Limbaugh? I don't tune in often, maybe an hour or two a week, but the man is not the drooling idiot everyone likes to make him out to be.

(edited by PalpatineW on 27.3.03 1805)


"May God bless our country and all who defend her."

George W. Bush, 3/19/03
Pool-Boy
Lap cheong








Since: 1.8.02
From: Huntington Beach, CA

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#38 Posted on
I find that most people who HATE HATE HATE Rush Limbaugh have never once in their life listened to the guy... and they won't listen to him EVER because they HATE HATE HATE him...

Where that hate comes from, I will never know... One thing is for certain though, the guy is pretty damned well spoken, and is by no stretch of the imagination stupid...


(edited by Pool-Boy on 27.3.03 1514)




Still on the Shelf #1
Leroy
Boudin blanc








Since: 7.2.02

Since last post: 8 days
Last activity: 5 days
#39 Posted on

    Originally posted by PalpatineW
      Originally posted by asteroidboy

        Originally posted by PalpatineW
        Truly; this is a free market. If people wanted to hear liberal ideas, Donahue would still have a job. After 9/11, people are feeling less and less guilt about being affluent, or free, or white, or American, or just plain better. We're rediscovering pride. And proud people don't tend toward liberalism.


      Exactly. We can get back to hating poor brown-skinned Communists. Damn, I feel better already!



    That was pathetic. Do us all a favor and try not to lower the conversation in this forum to a level resembling grade-school recess.


      Originally Posted by Leroy
      Every example of a "liberal" commentator you mention is more moderate than left-wing. Al Sharpton does not host his own talk show on a major network, and gets far less TV time than a Bill O'Reilly. And sure you can find counter-examples in local markets, but nationally the programming is by far right-wing dominated.


    Your assertion was that right-wing pundits find it easier to be bombastic, due to their simplistic views. I refuted your argument, I believe successfully, by presenting a host of simplistic liberals. Your defense is that none of these people are liberal. Is anyone to the right of Paul Wellstone liberal, in your eyes?


      Originally Posted by Leroy
      And because a George Will or a Tucker Carlson can more eloquently phrase a sentance than a Rush Limbaugh, doesn't mean that they are saying anything different.


    But that isn't the point. Your point was that right-wingers succeed because of their bombast. I've offered you right-wingers who are not at all bombastic. You apparently have no explanation for their success. Is your problem with the style of right-wing pundits, or the fact that they hold right-wing beliefs?

    Edit: And while I'm at it, do you even listen to Limbaugh? I don't tune in often, maybe an hour or two a week, but the man is not the drooling idiot everyone likes to make him out to be.

    (edited by PalpatineW on 27.3.03 1805)



I never said bombastic - I said content over presentation. In other words, reducing issues so that they can be discussed in relatively simplistic terms rather than the complicated issues that the are... generally speaking. And those simplistic terms tend to lend themselves to right-wing politics.

CNN's first priority is to make money (via ratings thus advertising). So the want their news to be as entertaining as possible... a Crossfire-esque show does little or nothing to really explore issues because its primary focus is to use current events to sell advertising time. To get into real explanations require time.

To use Eric Alterman's example - someone on the right MIGHT say people are poor because because they are lazy. And if you frame the conversation within a "poor = lazy" perspective, you aren't even allowed room to delve into social and economic reasons, (such as, how mobility between economic levels is extremely difficult, etc). And you won't have a real liberal or leftist debating the issues, you'll have a moderate like Carville or Colmes, who know how to make an argument entertaining....

It's all about how the conversation is framed -its more entertaining to argue about "poor = lazy" than it is to discuss economic theory, even though the latter is more of a reality.

That's why a real academic conservative, like William F. Buckley, has never been on Fox or MSNBC. Here's a guy who is obviously intellegent, but does not work in the 30 second sound bite format. It takes time to argue with him because he knows his stuff and can make some pretty strong arguments.... and that's not entertaining enough for commercial television.

And yes, I have listened to Limbaugh extensively, and his intelligence is evident in his use of radio and his in use of rhetoric, not in his ability to dissect political issues.



"It's hard to be a prophet and still make a profit."
- Da Bush Babees
asteroidboy
Andouille








Since: 22.1.02
From: Texas

Since last post: 1400 days
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#40 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.95

    Originally posted by PalpatineW
      Originally posted by asteroidboy

        Originally posted by PalpatineW
        Truly; this is a free market. If people wanted to hear liberal ideas, Donahue would still have a job. After 9/11, people are feeling less and less guilt about being affluent, or free, or white, or American, or just plain better. We're rediscovering pride. And proud people don't tend toward liberalism.


      Exactly. We can get back to hating poor brown-skinned Communists. Damn, I feel better already!



    That was pathetic. Do us all a favor and try not to lower the conversation in this forum to a level resembling grade-school recess.



What's pathetic is your bullshit "angry white male" posturing. Yes, white men have really had no chance of advancement in this country. Thankfully we realize that now.

What's pathetic is you attributing emotions to a particular political party and your obnoxious nationalism. Sleep in flag sheets, stick a sticker in the back of your car, staple flags to the inside of your eyelids, but leave us the hell alone.



-- Asteroid Boy


Wiener of the day: 23.7.02

"My brother saw the Undertaker walking through an airport." - Rex
"Was he no-selling?" - Me
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