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The W - Current Events & Politics - Everyone's calling for Don Imus' head on a platter (Page 3)
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dwaters
Lap cheong








Since: 16.10.02
From: Connecticut

Since last post: 7 days
Last activity: 4 hours
#41 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.66
    Originally posted by It's False
      Originally posted by skorpio17
      He didn't say anything worse than 100 rappers and a dozen comics. Watch an episode of the Chappelle show, Family Guy, the Office, HBO, MTV, BET, and you'll hear worse than nappy headed ho.


    And according to Media Matters, you can hear worse from OTHER radio talk show hosts.

    In comparison to some of these guys, the Imus comments seem pretty tame. Why Imus was singled out for this incident, I'm not sure. I think this is a bad situation that got blown way out of proportion.

    EDIT: While most of the comments in that link are awful...for some reason, I couldn't help but laugh at Glenn Beck's comments towards Rosie O'Donnell.

    (edited by It's False on 12.4.07 2325)


Thanks for posting that link.
It's pretty shocking to hear what these guys get away with.
The Imus comment was NOTHING compared to some of the hate speech listed there.





Michael: I am a victim of a hate crime! I think Stanley knows what Im talking about

Stanley: Thats not what a hate crime is

Michael: Well I hated it! A lot!
Leroy
Boudin blanc








Since: 7.2.02

Since last post: 5 days
Last activity: 4 days
#42 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.68
    Originally posted by AWArulz
    Dammit! This is cutting into my Anna Nicole Smith's Daughter DNA testing stories!


Spoiler for AWArulz:

Spoiler Below: Highlight text to read

The father is Larry Birkhead. HE TOLD YOU SO!!!


    Originally posted by Eddie Famous

    Hm. I hear talk radio heads, now in fear of being held accountable for what they say, saying that Imus' firing is an "attack on all talk radio".


Is that such a bad thing? Seriously, Imus aside... is there any "real" value these programs bring?

It seems to me that talk shows serve two purposes: to preach to their proverbial choir, and/or to be so outrageous as to "entertain" more than provide substantive discourse.

Personally, I think Hannity and the lot are feigning outrage over Imus' firing just as much as Sharpton and Jackson were feigning outrage over Imus' comments. If, in the end, there's less stupidity on the radio, then I'm all for this incident being the catalyst...

(edited by Leroy on 13.4.07 1523)


"Oh my God! They have a shit-load of Cockapoo stuff!"
-Jennifer's greatest quote... ever.
Eddie Famous
Andouille








Since: 11.12.01
From: Catlin IL

Since last post: 332 days
Last activity: 326 days
#43 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.57

    Originally posted by Captaincuba
    I'll try to explain one last time.

    Radio's "rules" are monitored by the FCC. Imus broke no FCC regulations. CBS had allowed and profited from this behavior for the last 20 years


I'll try to explain this as well, as 23 years in the business just MIGHT give me some experience to write about.

FCC rules don't have one thing to do with why Don Imus was fired. Bad publicity from saying something stupid plus bad ratings = getting fired.

That's how performance businesses work.




As of 2/28/05: 101 pounds since December 7, 2004
OFFICIAL THREE-MONTH COUNT: 112 pounds on March 9, 2005
OFFICIAL SIX-MONTH COUNT: 142 pounds on June 8, 2005
OFFICIAL ONE YEAR COUNT: 187 pounds on December 7, 2005
As of 2/27/06: 202 pounds "I've lost a heavyweight"
As of 7/31/06: 224 pounds
ges7184
Lap cheong








Since: 7.1.02
From: Birmingham, AL

Since last post: 42 days
Last activity: 2 hours
#44 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.43
Columnist Jason Whitlock has an interesting take of this situation:

http://www.kansascity.com/182/story/66339.html

Granted, the fact that Whitlock is black makes it even more interesting. Here's a partial quote:


    From the article
    Thank you, Don Imus. You extended Black History Month to April, and we can once again wallow in victimhood, protest like its 1965 and delude ourselves into believing that fixing your hatred is more necessary than eradicating our self-hatred.

    The bigots win again.

    While were fixated on a bad joke cracked by an irrelevant, bad shock jock, Im sure at least one of the marvelous young women on the Rutgers basketball team is somewhere snapping her fingers to the beat of 50 Cents or Snoop Doggs or Young Jeezys latest ode glorifying nappy-headed pimps and hos.

    I aint saying Jesse, Al and Vivian are gold-diggas, but they dont have the heart to mount a legitimate campaign against the real black-folk killas.


He also offered the first reasonable explanation for why Rutgers handled this the way they did, for the chance to recruit on national TV. I find it hard to disagree with much of what Whitlock had to say here.




The Bored are already here. Idle hands are the devil's workshop. And no... we won't kill dolphins. But koalas are fair game.
AWArulz
Knackwurst








Since: 28.1.02
From: Louisville, KY

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Y!:
#45 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.45
    Originally posted by Eddie Famous
    FCC rules don't have one thing to do with why Don Imus was fired. Bad publicity from saying something stupid plus bad ratings = getting fired.

    That's how performance businesses work.



PLEASE read this again, CC. This is why Imus was fired. Cause an employer can fire you for poor performance, including being stupid.

    Originally posted by Leroy

    Spoiler for AWArulz:


Who knew? I enjoyed him getting high fives from people at the press conference announcing this "Yes, High Five! It is CONFIRMED I did it with Anna Nicole! High Five!"

Quite an interesting country we live in.



http://myspace.com/awarulz
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skorpio17
Morcilla








Since: 11.7.02
From: New Jersey

Since last post: 2407 days
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#46 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.35
    Originally posted by Eddie Famous
      Originally posted by Captaincuba
      I'll try to explain one last time.

      Radio's "rules" are monitored by the FCC. Imus broke no FCC regulations. CBS had allowed and profited from this behavior for the last 20 years


    I'll try to explain this as well, as 23 years in the business just MIGHT give me some experience to write about.

    FCC rules don't have one thing to do with why Don Imus was fired. Bad publicity from saying something stupid plus bad ratings = getting fired.

    That's how performance businesses work.



I'd like to know what makes you think Imus had bad ratings. Last I heard he was a great lead-in and owned the coveted rich NYC Limosine Liberal demographic. It was the advertisers dropping after feeling pressure that got him sacked.

Employers can fire you for any reason (as long as not racist-discriminatory) or no-reason as long as you work in an "at will" state.

And where does freedom of speech not apply. So now my employer can fire me for saying something offensive at work? at lunch? after work? at home? on a message board? Is it ok to fire me for something I post on my blog?

So now the only people who are have freedom of speech are the unemployed?
Eddie Famous
Andouille








Since: 11.12.01
From: Catlin IL

Since last post: 332 days
Last activity: 326 days
#47 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.57

    Originally posted by skorpio17
    I'd like to know what makes you think Imus had bad ratings. Last I heard he was a great lead-in and owned the coveted rich NYC Limosine Liberal demographic. It was the advertisers dropping after feeling pressure that got him sacked


From Westwood One:
"IMUS IN THE MORNING was carried on 61 stations across the U.S. and distributed over the WESTWOOD ONE RADIO NETWORK."

There is more to the US than New York. He was 25th in Washington DC, for example. His TV simulcast was estimated at less than 300,000 viewers, miniscule.

    Originally posted by skorpio17
    And where does freedom of speech not apply. So now my employer can fire me for saying something offensive at work? at lunch? after work? at home? on a message board? Is it ok to fire me for something I post on my blog? So now the only people who are have freedom of speech are the unemployed


I promised CRZ I would stop repeating myself.



As of 2/28/05: 101 pounds since December 7, 2004
OFFICIAL THREE-MONTH COUNT: 112 pounds on March 9, 2005
OFFICIAL SIX-MONTH COUNT: 142 pounds on June 8, 2005
OFFICIAL ONE YEAR COUNT: 187 pounds on December 7, 2005
As of 2/27/06: 202 pounds "I've lost a heavyweight"
As of 7/31/06: 224 pounds
wolvesslasher
Cotto








Since: 20.4.04
From: SAINT JOHN,NB,CANADA

Since last post: 2747 days
Last activity: 2524 days
#48 Posted on | Instant Rating: 0.04
    Originally posted by RYDER FAKIN
    The circle of stupidity continues. Whats really the shame here is the Rutgers team has been played as pawns in a game no one wins. Their response should have been Imus who? Who cares what he says?.

    You are only a victim if you let yourself be. Or let yourself be played as one, which is what Rev. Al and Jesse have made a career out of doing to people who dont know any better. Now, instead of being the Champion Rutgers Girls Basketball team, they are the black girls who were demeaned and destroyed by the ramblings of an old coot, but have managed to become strong black women, overcoming adversity and discrimination

    Now they can go on Oprah and STRONG AND PROUD BLACK WOMEN (tm CRZ), in lieu of being booked as champions. Regardless of Color.

    FLEA


What about the white girls on the basketball team? Imus didn't say he was specifically talking about the black girls when he mentioned "nappy headed hoes". He could of been saying that about the white girls or the entire team. What's so racist about his comment anyway? He didn't mention skin color or that all black girls are "nappy headed hoes".(If,in fact, he was only talking about the black girls on the team.)
Mr. Boffo
Scrapple








Since: 24.3.02
From: Oshkosh, WI

Since last post: 449 days
Last activity: 410 days
#49 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.12
    Originally posted by wolvesslasher
    What about the white girls on the basketball team? Imus didn't say he was specifically talking about the black girls when he mentioned "nappy headed hoes". He could of been saying that about the white girls or the entire team. What's so racist about his comment anyway? He didn't mention skin color or that all black girls are "nappy headed hoes".(If,in fact, he was only talking about the black girls on the team.)

Yes, it is theoretically possible that he could have been saying that about the two white girls on the team, and not the 8 black girls on the team. However, nappy signifies curly hair, and both the white girls have straight hair.
http://www.scarletknights.com/basketball-women/roster/roster-alph.asp

Nappy-haired is nearly always used as a derogatory comment for black people, especially the darkest-skinned blacks. It's a "code word", if you will. If you Imus using that phrase for a predominantly black team isn't racial, then you may be interested in an e-mail I received from a gentlemen who needs your help getting millions of dollars out of Nigeria.

As a bonus, guess the white girls: Katie, Matee, Essence, Dee Dee, Rashidat, Myia, Epiphanny, Judith Brittany, Kia, and Heather.




Zeruel
Thirty Millionth Hit
Moderator








Since: 2.1.02
From: The Silver Spring in the Land of Mary.

Since last post: 3 days
Last activity: 7 hours
#50 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.05
    Originally posted by skorpio17
    I'd like to know what makes you think Imus had bad ratings.


Guess you missed my post, #15 in this thread: http://the-w.com/post.php/id=359706


    And where does freedom of speech not apply.


You, and a few others in this thread, REALLY need to re-read the first amendment.
    Originally posted by The First Amendment
    Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.


Read that bold part. To answer your question, Freedom of Speech does not apply when the government is not involved.


    So now my employer can fire me for saying something offensive at work?


Yes.


    at lunch?


Yes. Remember Jimmy "The Greek" Snyder? Back in 1988 he said "During the slave period, the slave owner would breed his big black with his big woman so that he would have a big black kidthat's where it all started."

Guess what CBS did to him?


    after work?


Yes.


    at home?


Why not?


    on a message board?


If they can prove it is you that said it.


    Is it ok to fire me for something I post on my blog?


Oh gods yes. In fact, last year my local Fox station ran a series of reports urging recent college grads and first time job seekers to remove all their myspace pages and the like. I remember a HR person commenting that if they see their applicant drinking or making obscene comments/gestures in/on any website they can find the applicant on, they will not employ them.



-- 2006 Time magazine Person of the Year --

Leroy
Boudin blanc








Since: 7.2.02

Since last post: 5 days
Last activity: 4 days
#51 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.68
    Originally posted by skorpio17
    Is it ok to fire me for something I post on my blog?


Actually, yes it is.

Fired For Blogging (CBS Online, 7 March 2005)


    Annalee Newitz, a policy analyst at the civil liberties group Electronic Frontier Foundation, said employees often "don't realize the First Amendment doesn't protect their job."

    The First Amendment only restricts government control of speech. So private employers are free to fire at will in most states, as long as it's not discriminatory or in retaliation for whistle-blowing or union organizing, labor experts say.






"Oh my God! They have a shit-load of Cockapoo stuff!"
-Jennifer's greatest quote... ever.
EddieBurkett
Boudin blanc








Since: 3.1.02
From: GA in person, NJ in heart

Since last post: 3 days
Last activity: 1 hour
#52 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.76
    Originally posted by Mr. Boffo
    Nappy-haired is nearly always used as a derogatory comment for black people


So when do Sharpton and Jackson go after Shawn Fanning?



You believe me, don't you?
Please believe what I just said...
Captaincuba
Italian








Since: 25.10.05

Since last post: 231 days
Last activity: 105 days
#53 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.55
They did not fire him for what he said.

For over the last 20 years he has said FAR WORSE and CBS never blinked an eye.

Why? Because he was bringing in the money. Even last year, he brought CBS over 15 Million dollars in advertising profit.

They fired him due to the pressure brought down upon him by these so called African American "leaders".

It's a joke.

Jackson called NYC "Hymie Town"
Jackson was quoted as saying "I'm tired of hearing about the Holocaust"
Sharpton was the catalyst in both the Tawana Brawley and Duke Lacrosse incidents?

Where is their accountability?
When is their livelihood going to be taken away?

I'm not arguing that his statement (in today's hyper-sensitive, regulated, post Janet-Jackson media world) was stupid.

I'm arguing that they can't have it both ways. If Imus can't say it, neither can Dave Chappelle or Timbaland.

Once Freedom of Speech is based on one's race, is it really free speech for all?

If you can't see the double standard, I really don't know what to tell you.

CC

StingArmy
Andouille








Since: 3.5.03
From: Georgia bred, you can tell by my Hawk jersey

Since last post: 16 days
Last activity: 16 days
#54 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.83
    Originally posted by Captaincuba
    Where is their accountability?
    When is their livelihood going to be taken away?

You want somebody to fire Al Sharpton? Fire him from WHAT?

    I'm not arguing that his statement (in today's hyper-sensitive, regulated, post Janet-Jackson media world) was stupid.

    I'm arguing that they can't have it both ways. If Imus can't say it, neither can Dave Chappelle or Timbaland.


The difference between Imus and Chappelle and other entertainers is that 1) the entertainers don't attack helpless, innocent victims; and 2) the entertainers aren't being offensive just for the sake of being offensive.

Imus' comments were not funny. They were awkward and just plain wrong. And you know what? That may be solely due to the fact that he was attacking a SPECIFIC group of college women who had done nothing to deserve his attacks. There have been PLENTY of white entertainers that have used sex and race to entertain. Some have said things arguably "worse" than what Imus said. However, it's all about the context. So quit trying to act like all minorities can do whatever they want with impunity while all whites aren't allowed to say anything.

    Once Freedom of Speech is based on one's race, is it really free speech for all?

    If you can't see the double standard, I really don't know what to tell you.

For the love of God, PLEASE stop talking about freedom of speech. Find a new soapbox to stand on. As any number of people - in this thread alone! - can tell you, freedom of speech has ABSOLUTELY NO APPLICATION WHATSOEVER in a private employment context. Until Imus gets arrested for what he said, nobody can say anything about his right to free speech being abridged.

- StingArmy
Hogan's My Dad
Andouille








Since: 8.6.02
From: Canada

Since last post: 3 days
Last activity: 55 min.
#55 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.26
The arguments for his firing being "bullshit" are pretty weak.

"He's said worse." Ooh, good point. So if someone makes stupid and insensitive comments on a regular basis, they should never have to answer for it? I've been informed that he's been saying "Towelhead" for years, but is it any black person's fault that Muslims/Arabic people are the new "niggers", about whom almost anything can be said by almost anyone with no reprecussions? Well, sucks to be them, but it's their turn.

"Freedom of speech." Yes, but not freedom of speech while in performance of your job. He said something stupid on the job. You don't have the right to be employed no matter fucking what. No one is saying he shouldn't be allowed to run around burning crosses and watching Roots for comedic value if he wants to confine this behaviour to his own home. But when you represent a major corporation they have the right to fire you when you bring a shitstorm of bad publicity on them.

"Rappers/comedians say worse." Yes, this is from the racism ended the day slavery did camp. No matter how badly you want to be able to say nigger, you can't. Accept that. You're white; you can't say it. There's a historical context that makes that word absolutely unacceptable coming out of your mouth. I know Italians who call themselves Wops; I'm not Italian so I don't say it. I know Chinese people who call themselves Chinks: I'm not Chinese so I don't say it. I know South Asians who call themselves Pakis; I don't say it. So even if it mattered that other people have said worse, and it doesn't, because that's like not arresting someone for theft because others have murdered, the point is that other people say things that are accepted in their communities. You don't hear a lot of rappers using any of the terms I just listed, or for that matter Kike or any other hideous epithet you can imagine because they don't belong to those communities. They use it about their own people in a context that historical white racism is solely responsible for. And now, after four hundred years of telling us what God to believe in, where to live, and what to do, you want to tell us what we're allowed to say to our own people in order to diffuse the hatred that was inflicted upon us. All of these communities are using these words to make them hurt less, to make them impotent and powerless, and this process is reversed when white people whine that they should be able to say it too.

And this is coming from someone who, rest assured, wants nothing to do with Jesse Jackson or Al Sharpton.



Was It Something I Said?
Leroy
Boudin blanc








Since: 7.2.02

Since last post: 5 days
Last activity: 4 days
#56 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.68
The difference is context. Imus may have meant to call the team "nappy headed hos" as a term of affection, but everyone else took it as a derogatory term. Why he thought he could get away with it is beyond me - and that move (rightfully) cost him dearly.

    Originally posted by Captaincuba

    I'm arguing that they can't have it both ways. If Imus can't say it, neither can Dave Chappelle or Timbaland.


Chappelle was poking fun at racism. He was not throwing those terms around for the sake of it, nor was he using those words in a derogatory manner. In fact, interviews I've read with Chappelle suggest that he quit The Chappelle Show when he realized he was the only one who was getting the joke.

It's not even in the same ballpark as what Imus did - not even remotely.

(edited by Leroy on 14.4.07 1042)


"Oh my God! They have a shit-load of Cockapoo stuff!"
-Jennifer's greatest quote... ever.
wmatistic
Andouille








Since: 2.2.04
From: Austin, TX

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#57 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.08
I'm just not buying the "it's ok for blacks to say these terms" argument. If it's to take away the power of these words, it's obviously not working anyway. And I seriously doubt if you ask a black rapper why he uses them he will tell you it's to help "diffuse the hatred". I don't see blacks flying the battle flag of the confederacy in an attempt to make it "powerless". The whole concept seems absurd to me. Did blacks really sit around and say, "you know let's start calling each other the N word, that way it will lose some of it's power over us?" Really?

And no I'm not saying this because I want to use them, but rather because it's idiotic for anyone to claim their use is justified regardless of color. A bad word is a bad word. It's like telling your kids they should never use cuss words and then using them liberally yourself.

That being said, this whole thing has been blown so out of proportion it's a joke to me now. Imus said something stupid, which he's done plenty of times before. This should not have been the lead story over the Duke guys, and it's a damn shame we've wasted all this time with it.
Zeruel
Thirty Millionth Hit
Moderator








Since: 2.1.02
From: The Silver Spring in the Land of Mary.

Since last post: 3 days
Last activity: 7 hours
#58 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.05
    Originally posted by StingArmy
    So quit trying to act like all minorities can do whatever they want with impunity while all whites aren't allowed to say anything.


You do have to concede that if Robin Williams, Jim Carrey, or Jerry Seinfeld (or any white person) says the things that come out of Carlos Mencia's mouth around the racial group the joke is targeting, they will get into some trouble.

Hell, that's the main theme of his stand-up I saw in November. "You whites can't say what I'm saying and I can. Even though this is DC, the "Chocolate City," I can say 'nigger, nigger, nigger' because they know I hang with blacks and I can talk like they talk and they feel me."

I'm paraphrasing, but that was the gist of his speech upon opening his part of the show. All throughout the show he kept defending why he can use racist jokes/speech) basically because he's not white.

(edited by Zeruel on 14.4.07 1602)


-- 2006 Time magazine Person of the Year --

CRZ
Big Brother
Administrator








Since: 9.12.01
From: ミネアポリス

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#59 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.00
    Originally posted by Hogan's My Dad
    No matter how badly you want to be able to say nigger, you can't. Accept that. You're white; you can't say it.
It's funny. Nobody used (said) "nigger" in this thread until post #55. Or "wop," or "chink," or "kike," or...what was the other one? "Paki," I never even heard of that one.

So... bravo, Hogan's My Dad - YOU HAVE THE MOST SHOCKING POST IN THE THREAD.

Now please don't do it ever again.




I AM CRZ
Hogan's My Dad
Andouille








Since: 8.6.02
From: Canada

Since last post: 3 days
Last activity: 55 min.
#60 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.26
The point was not to be shocking. I brought up that word, and similar slurs, because of the Imus apologists (not necessarily of this board) insisting that "rappers say worse". That has to mean the "N word" because he said ho, unless people are saying common profanities are worse than what Imus said.

If you really thought I said/wrote it just to be shocking, you would have deleted it, so I must have made some good points.



Was It Something I Said?
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You don't have to apologize to the rest of the world. You do, however, have to apologize to Barbra Streisand.
- The Goon, Thanks for speaking for us! (2004)
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