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The W - Current Events & Politics - Dean shows them retirees who's boss
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PalpatineW
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Since: 2.1.02
From: Getting Rowdy

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#1 Posted on | Instant Rating: 9.00
http://www.boston.com/ news/politics/president/ articles/2004/01/12/dean_rebukes_a_gop_questioner/

Also, note the headline: Dean rebukes a GOP questioner. The man in question was a Republican, yes; but he said very little in favor of the Republicans. More notably, he was 66 years old, retired, and polite. Reportedly, the crowd ate this up. I derive some small amount of disgust from the thought of an angry Dean crowd cheering as Howie verbally berates an old man.



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eviljonhunt81
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Since: 6.1.02
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#2 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.25
    Originally posted by the article
    When Ungerer tried to interrupt . . .

I think that's the most telling part. I read this same story on some other news site, and it sounded like the guy went on for a few mniutes, and wouldn't let Dean respond, and then tried to cut Dean off when he was responding. So, yeah, I would tell him to sit downa nd be quiet too. Nobody came to the event to hear some guy ramble on about what he sees wrong with Dean' campaign, they came to hear Dean. Could he have been nicer about it? Perhaps, but from the other article I got the impression that this guy wouldn't stop talking until Dean told him to shut up.



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#3 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.65
    Originally posted by eviljonhunt81
      Originally posted by the article
      When Ungerer tried to interrupt . . .

    I think that's the most telling part. I read this same story on some other news site, and it sounded like the guy went on for a few mniutes, and wouldn't let Dean respond, and then tried to cut Dean off when he was responding. So, yeah, I would tell him to sit downa nd be quiet too. Nobody came to the event to hear some guy ramble on about what he sees wrong with Dean' campaign, they came to hear Dean. Could he have been nicer about it? Perhaps, but from the other article I got the impression that this guy wouldn't stop talking until Dean told him to shut up.
What if you read it this way, as reported by the New York Times (nytimes.com)?

Later, Dr. Dean flashed his much-talked-about temper at a town-hall-style forum here in a sharp exchange with a 67-year-old retiree, Dale Ungerer. Mr. Ungerer, who said he was a registered Republican but had sometimes voted for Democrats, challenged Dr. Dean to "please tone down the garbage, the mean-mouthing of tearing down your neighbor and being so pompous," questioning why the candidate spent so much time bashing President Bush.

Dr. Dean declared, "George Bush is not my neighbor." As Mr. Ungerer, stood up, Dr. Dean said, "You sit down. You've had your say, and now I'm going to have my say."

"I love my neighbor, but I want that neighbor back in Crawford, Tex., where he belongs," Dr. Dean said. "The president is always my president but the president is not my neighbor if he takes 500,000 kids off their health care benefits."


Hopefully there's some video, and we'll get to see it to judge for ourselves.



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eviljonhunt81
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Since: 6.1.02
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#4 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.25
    Originally posted by NYT
    Dr. Dean declared, "George Bush is not my neighbor." As Mr. Ungerer, stood up, Dr. Dean said, "You sit down. You've had your say, and now I'm going to have my say."


This is the important part of the exchange, and it's reported a little bit different in each article. I agree that it is hard to tell without video what exactly happened. I'd say the guy probably was being somewhat rude, Dean had enough, and responded in an equally rude (or ruder) fashion.

Still don't really see what the big deal about it all is, though. Dean's yet to punch anybody or anything, and seemed to keep his cool during the debate when being grilled by Sharpton (something which would probably be hard for anyone to do), so I don't really know why such a big deal is made out of his temper.



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Since: 1.8.02
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#5 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.24
The thing is, The guy did have a point.

The most frustrating thing about many of the Democratic canditates is that they DON'T have plans, 99% of what they have to say amounts to "Bush is evil." They are campaigning against the man, not the man's ideas.

They guy asked a legitimate question, and Dean's response was the exact opposite of what the guy wanted.

How is Dean going to beat Bush, when open-minded conservatives (the ones that have not ALREADY decided to vote Bush) can't get a decent reason why they should cross that line? There is no one else out there saying "I think I can do a better job than Bush - Here's how." I for one am sick of hearing "Bush is a liar, a villian, a Nazi, worse than Hitler, vote for me!!!" I am far from the type of person that votes Rep only, yet there is no one out there giving me any good reasons to vote another party.

I like a lot of what Bush has done- yes. But there are other things I don't like so much. Where are the people out there with "better"ideas? Even if that person loses, the idea is on the table, and talking about it might make some change in the way things are done. Bush bashing accomplishes nothing at all.



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Since: 7.2.02
From: Huntington, NY

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#6 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.12
    Originally posted by PalpatineW
    Reportedly, the crowd ate this up. I derive some small amount of disgust from the thought of an angry Dean crowd cheering as Howie verbally berates an old man.


I'll check with my parents, who are about that age, but I don't think 66 qualifies one as being "old". Actually, this sounds something like my father does on a regular basis - mostly to waiters and waitresses. But who really cares if Dean yelled at him or not...

    Originally posted by Pool-Boy

    The most frustrating thing about many of the Democratic canditates is that they DON'T have plans, 99% of what they have to say amounts to "Bush is evil." They are campaigning against the man, not the man's ideas.



This is true - and if detailing budget changes won elections, they'd be doing it. But as usual, criticizing the incumbent is pretty much the way to go.

See also Schwarzenegger, Arnold...
eviljonhunt81
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Since: 6.1.02
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#7 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.26
    Originally posted by Pool-Boy
    The most frustrating thing about many of the Democratic canditates is that they DON'T have plans, 99% of what they have to say amounts to "Bush is evil." They are campaigning against the man, not the man's ideas.

I just looked at the websites for Gephardt, Lieberman, Kucinich, Dean and Clark and was able to find their stances and proposals for many different issues quite easily. Just because the soundbites are about Bush doesn't mean they don't have any plans.



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Since: 11.7.02
From: MD

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#8 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.29
I will say this. That for most of the Democrats, their plans are beyond "Bush is bad".

For most of them the message is "Bush is bad and Dean is nuts."

Of course if this exchange is true, then he probably is. Not usually a good idea to piss off the voting age group most likely to show up at the polls.



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No money in it, but sometimes you do things despite there not being any money in it. Besides, how often do you get a chance to help like this? It's pretty cool (if you ignore that it's only possible because a man's life is in danger).
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