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The W - Baseball - Come argue about how overrated Derek Jeter is!
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StaggerLee
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Since: 3.10.02
From: Right side of the tracks

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#1 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.07
He wins a Gold Glove. So does Texiera.
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=4642325
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Psycho Penguin
Liverwurst








Since: 24.6.07
From: Greenacres FL

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#2 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.14
Sportscenter at 6 PM led off with "Derek Jeter wins a Gold Glove. So do a bunch of other people, that story later on."



http://www.gamefaqs.com/features/recognition/9471.html

IT'S TRUE! IT'S DAMN TRUE!

Mr. Boffo
Scrapple








Since: 24.3.02
From: Oshkosh, WI

Since last post: 361 days
Last activity: 321 days
#3 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.38
KenTremendous has already done so on twitter.

    Originally posted by KenTremendous
    Congrats to Gold Glove Award Winner Derek Jeter! And to the voters for correctly determining that when it comes to shortstops, 4th = best!
    http://bit.ly/oo1Yb

The bit.ly link goes to fangraphs.com's defensive ratings, showing that Jeter ranks 4th among qualified AL shortstops in Ultimate Zone Rating Per 150 Games (UZR/150), behind Cesar Izturis (Baltimore), Adam Everett (Detroit), and Elvis Andrus (Texas).
Now cue the "UZR is a made-up statistic" people.
It's False
Scrapple








Since: 20.6.02
From: I am the Tag Team Champions!

Since last post: 3 days
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#4 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.32
This thread title reminds me of that old SNL Weekend Update segment that had Derek Jeter debating Seth Meyers on why he does/doesn't suck.

I don't have a problem with Jeter being a Gold Glove winner. Now if Jeter were to bring home MVP, THEN there'd be a problem.

(edited by It's False on 11.11.09 0122)



All hail the Hypno-Toad
JayJayDean
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02
From: Seattle, WA

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#5 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.30
Franklin Gutierrez did NOT win a Gold Glove. That's all you need to know about how well-thought out these awards are.

FWIW, the Fielding Bible awards, which cover both leagues and are presumably voted on by folks who understand defensive value, went to these guys...

1B - Albert Pujols, STL
2B - Aaron Hill, TOR
3B - Ryan Zimmerman, WAS
SS - Jack Wilson, PIT/SEA
LF - Carl Crawford, TB
CF - Franklin Gutierrez, SEA
RF - Ichiro!, SEA
P - Mark Buerhle, CHI (AL)
C - Yadier Molina, STL



Holy fuck shit motherfucker shit. Read comics. Fuck shit shit fuck shit I sold out when I did my job. Fuck fuck fuck shit fuck. Sorry had to do it....

*snip*

Revenge of the Sith = one thumb up from me. Fuck shit. I want to tittie fuck your ass.
-- The Guinness. to Cerebus
Eddie Famous
Andouille








Since: 11.12.01
From: Catlin IL

Since last post: 243 days
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#6 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.59

    Originally posted by Mr. Boffo
    KenTremendous has already done so on twitter.

      Originally posted by KenTremendous
      Congrats to Gold Glove Award Winner Derek Jeter! And to the voters for correctly determining that when it comes to shortstops, 4th = best!
      http://bit.ly/​oo1Yb

    The bit.ly link goes to fangraphs.com's defensive ratings, showing that Jeter ranks 4th among qualified AL shortstops in Ultimate Zone Rating Per 150 Games (UZR/150), behind Cesar Izturis (Baltimore), Adam Everett (Detroit), and Elvis Andrus (Texas).
    Now cue the "UZR is a made-up statistic" people.


Nah, you just have to point out how two of those people, Izturis and Everett are basically worthless, and Andrus has a chance to be pretty good though his minor league numbers suggest a high-K low-production player.

And Jack Wilson is a quality waste of a major league roster spot.



As of 2/28/05: 101 pounds since December 7, 2004
OFFICIAL THREE-MONTH COUNT: 112 pounds on March 9, 2005
OFFICIAL SIX-MONTH COUNT: 142 pounds on June 8, 2005
OFFICIAL ONE YEAR COUNT: 187 pounds on December 7, 2005
As of 2/27/06: 202 pounds "I've lost a heavyweight"
As of 7/31/06: 224 pounds
As of 12/7/08 (four years out): Still 210 pounds down!
Now announcing for NBWA Championship Wrestling!
*2008 NBWA Personality of the Year*
DrDirt
Banger








Since: 8.10.03
From: flyover country

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#7 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.48
As an Indians fan for over 40 years, I hate all things Yankee. But Jeter is a class act on and off the field. He just knows how to win and has proven it forever. No sane, unbiased person would deny his ability.



Perception is reality
hansen9j
Andouille








Since: 7.11.02
From: Riderville, SK

Since last post: 8 days
Last activity: 4 hours
#8 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.48
    Originally posted by DrDirt
    No sane, unbiased person would deny his ability.


We can doubt specific aspects of it. For example, his complete lack of range (despite winning the Gold Glove). Or the fact that he was tied for 5th best OPS on his own team AND he was in the same league as Joe Mauer, who beat him in EVERY STAT except runs and hits, in 25 fewer games (despite Jeter winning the Hank Aaron Award for best hitter in the league).



It is the policy of the documentary crew to remain true observers and not interfere with its subjects.

Let's Go Riders! (10-7-1, 1st West Division, tiebreaker to Riders, first division title since 1976!!)

Go Pack Go! (4-4, T-2nd NFC North)
jam1975
Loukanika








Since: 8.10.03

Since last post: 704 days
Last activity: 704 days
#9 Posted on
    Originally posted by Eddie Famous
      Originally posted by Mr. Boffo
      KenTremendous has already done so on twitter.

        Originally posted by KenTremendous
        Congrats to Gold Glove Award Winner Derek Jeter! And to the voters for correctly determining that when it comes to shortstops, 4th = best!
        http://bit.ly/​​oo1Yb

      The bit.ly link goes to fangraphs.com's defensive ratings, showing that Jeter ranks 4th among qualified AL shortstops in Ultimate Zone Rating Per 150 Games (UZR/150), behind Cesar Izturis (Baltimore), Adam Everett (Detroit), and Elvis Andrus (Texas).
      Now cue the "UZR is a made-up statistic" people.


    Nah, you just have to point out how two of those people, Izturis and Everett are basically worthless, and Andrus has a chance to be pretty good though his minor league numbers suggest a high-K low-production player.

    And Jack Wilson is a quality waste of a major league roster spot.


Except the award is for defensive prowess, offensive stats should not factor in at all. That's what the Silver Slugger is for.
Joseph Ryder
Head cheese








Since: 19.3.02
From: Seattle, WA

Since last post: 1108 days
Last activity: 641 days
#10 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.97
    Originally posted by Eddie Famous
      Originally posted by Mr. Boffo
      KenTremendous has already done so on twitter.

        Originally posted by KenTremendous
        Congrats to Gold Glove Award Winner Derek Jeter! And to the voters for correctly determining that when it comes to shortstops, 4th = best!
        http://bit.ly/​​oo1Yb

      The bit.ly link goes to fangraphs.com's defensive ratings, showing that Jeter ranks 4th among qualified AL shortstops in Ultimate Zone Rating Per 150 Games (UZR/150), behind Cesar Izturis (Baltimore), Adam Everett (Detroit), and Elvis Andrus (Texas).
      Now cue the "UZR is a made-up statistic" people.


    Nah, you just have to point out how two of those people, Izturis and Everett are basically worthless, and Andrus has a chance to be pretty good though his minor league numbers suggest a high-K low-production player.

    And Jack Wilson is a quality waste of a major league roster spot.

You realize we're talking about defense and defense only right?



I run
Eddie Famous
Andouille








Since: 11.12.01
From: Catlin IL

Since last post: 243 days
Last activity: 237 days
#11 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.59

    Originally posted by Joseph Ryder

    You realize we're talking about defense and defense only right?


Of course.

*I* was talking about overall best shortstop. If people want to use the GG award as a chance to try to make Jeter out to be less of a player than he is, then they're ridiculous. Any less range Jeter has in the field is more than made up for in his production, obviously.

Any stat that values a player like Adam Everett over Derek Jeter is questionable in value itself.



As of 2/28/05: 101 pounds since December 7, 2004
OFFICIAL THREE-MONTH COUNT: 112 pounds on March 9, 2005
OFFICIAL SIX-MONTH COUNT: 142 pounds on June 8, 2005
OFFICIAL ONE YEAR COUNT: 187 pounds on December 7, 2005
As of 2/27/06: 202 pounds "I've lost a heavyweight"
As of 7/31/06: 224 pounds
As of 12/7/08 (four years out): Still 210 pounds down!
Now announcing for NBWA Championship Wrestling!
*2008 NBWA Personality of the Year*
lotjx
Scrapple








Since: 5.9.08

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 20 min.
#12 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.13
He is the Captain. The Golden Glove is pretty much meaningless anyway other then to give the media control of something they shouldn't have control over in baseball coughhalloffamecough. Jeter's defense is vastly improved over last year, I will say that. I agree with Eddie famous about any stat putting shorstop in the AL over Jeter is worthless.
hansen9j
Andouille








Since: 7.11.02
From: Riderville, SK

Since last post: 8 days
Last activity: 4 hours
#13 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.53
Thread title: "Come Argue How Overrated Derek Jeter Is"

Evidence A: Derek Jeter wins a Gold Glove he doesn't deserve.

Evidence B: Derek Jeter wins a Hank Aaron award he doesn't deserve.

Non-existent Argument: Jack Wilson, Cesar Izturis , Adam Everett, and Elvis Andrus are better overall baseball players than Derek Jeter.

Existent Argument: Jack Wilson, Cesar Izturis , Adam Everett, and Elvis Andrus are better at defense than Derek Jeter.



It is the policy of the documentary crew to remain true observers and not interfere with its subjects.

Let's Go Riders! (10-7-1, 1st West Division, tiebreaker to Riders, first division title since 1976!!)

Go Pack Go! (4-4, T-2nd NFC North)
thecubsfan
Scrapple
Moderator








Since: 10.12.01
From: Aurora, IL

Since last post: 22 hours
Last activity: 7 sec.
#14 Posted on | Instant Rating: 10.00
    Originally posted by lotjx
    . The Golden Glove is pretty much meaningless anyway other then to give the media control of something they shouldn't have control over in baseball coughhalloffamecough.


    Originally posted by wikipedia
    The Rawlings Gold Glove Award, usually referred to as the Gold Glove, is the award given annually to the Major League Baseball players judged to have exhibited superior individual fielding performances at each fielding position in both the National League (NL) and the American League (AL), as voted by the managers and coaches in each league


(So, who do you want voting on the HOF?)



thecubsfan.com - luchablog
Big Bad
Scrapple








Since: 4.1.02
From: Dorchester, Ontario

Since last post: 4 days
Last activity: 11 hours
#15 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.61
Nobody is arguing that Izturis and company are better overall players than Jeter. We are arguing, however, that they're better overall with the glove than Jeter is. That said, this was probably the best defensive year of Jeter's life, so I'm not too broken up about him winning a Gold Glove. Hey, he finally deserved out out of his four! Congrats, Captain!

I agree with JayJayDean that Gutierrez not winning a GG is the bigger crime here. Gutierrez's UZR was 29.1 last season, whereas Adam Jones was -4.7. That's right, negative.



Kirk, crackers are a family food. Happy families. Maybe single people eat crackers, we don't know. Frankly, we don't want to know. It's a market we can do without.
Eddie Famous
Andouille








Since: 11.12.01
From: Catlin IL

Since last post: 243 days
Last activity: 237 days
#16 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.59

    Originally posted by thecubsfan

    (So, who do you want voting on the HOF?)


Me.

You can have half a vote too, Cubs.



As of 2/28/05: 101 pounds since December 7, 2004
OFFICIAL THREE-MONTH COUNT: 112 pounds on March 9, 2005
OFFICIAL SIX-MONTH COUNT: 142 pounds on June 8, 2005
OFFICIAL ONE YEAR COUNT: 187 pounds on December 7, 2005
As of 2/27/06: 202 pounds "I've lost a heavyweight"
As of 7/31/06: 224 pounds
As of 12/7/08 (four years out): Still 210 pounds down!
Now announcing for NBWA Championship Wrestling!
*2008 NBWA Personality of the Year*
supersalvadoran
Landjager








Since: 10.1.08
From: westbury, new york

Since last post: 10 days
Last activity: 12 hours
#17 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.91
All I know is that the GG award ceased to become relevant in the 90's when stiffs like McGwire won for no good reason. Wake me up when they announce the MVP/ Cy Young winners.






i before e
Chorizo








Since: 17.10.03

Since last post: 1310 days
Last activity: 70 days
#18 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.62
Lets see... Arod steroid scandal,Passing Lou Gherig on the all time Yankees hit list, World Series title, Gold Glove, Silver Slugger Award, Hank Aaron Award, Filming a movie in the off season, probably slept with a small army of the hottest chicks on the planet, and I'm probably leaving some stuff out, and there's probably more to come. Oh, and dont forget about the millions of dollars. If you could be any person in history for any one year of their life, Derek Jeter - 2009 has to be on the short list. What a year!
The Game
Boudin rouge








Since: 5.5.09

Since last post: 290 days
Last activity: 290 days
#19 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.59
    Originally posted by DrDirt
    As an Indians fan for over 40 years, I hate all things Yankee. But Jeter is a class act on and off the field. He just knows how to win and has proven it forever. No sane, unbiased person would deny his ability.


I will agree with that; I am Braves fan myself and do not like the Yankees. However in an age of sports figures who have no class act and the topic of steroids over-populating the media, Jeter still remains off from both of these unfortunate topics. He is a class act and is honestly the epitome of an all-around player who consistently hits, is arguably the best clutch hitter still, and has the Gold Glove caliber talent (not too much of that any more). Overrated? No. Over-publicized? Perhaps.
hansen9j
Andouille








Since: 7.11.02
From: Riderville, SK

Since last post: 8 days
Last activity: 4 hours
#20 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.53
Mauer (mlb.mlb.com) wins easily, getting 27 out of 28 first place votes. Jeter got third behind Teixeira. Miguel Cabrera got the other first place vote, though, from Keizo Konishi of Kyodo News, based in Seattle.



It is the policy of the documentary crew to remain true observers and not interfere with its subjects.

Let's Go Riders! (10-7-1, 1st West Division, going to the Grey Cup!)
Go Pack Go! (6-4, 2nd NFC North)
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Well, it's kind of tough to keep a soul patch when one has no soul. Sorry, I just wanted to get in cheap Yankee heat.
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