I wasn't sure if this should go in Baseball, Politics, or Movies/TV for the sheer entertainment value - but I figured I'd dump it here.
Well, our trip to congress certainly was long, and accomplished nothing. The congresspeople asking the duo questions ranged from "Star-Struck Hero Worship" to "Venomous Rage". Some highlights:
- A story is recalled via Mike Stanton, about Clemens walking around the clubhouse with blood seeping through his shorts. The pair discuss HGH use, and Clemens immediately starts carrying around bandaids to mask the wound. If Schilling's sock is HOF worthy, surely there's something to be done with the Rocket's underoos?
- Clemens' lawyers continually attempt to interject their two cents, and are smacked down by Waxman over and over. I think if he could have walloped them with his gavel, he would have.
- Speaking of Waxman vs. Roger, he clearly didn't believe a word he had to say from the start, and basically told him in the final few minutes to shut the fuck up. Watching Clemens shrink was priceless.
- Speaking of people slinking away, McNamee being compared to a petty drug dealer sure took the charge out of his case today. Waxman made sure to apologize later.
- Clemens is asked about Pettitte's testimony repeatedly, but Roger's saying even though Pettitte's as honest a man you'll ever find, THIS time he is certainly wrong.
- NANNYGATE! Apparently Roger's Nanny can confirm that he was at a party with Canseco. Roger says no. It's found that Clemens talked to her before the investigators got to her. He's given the finger of shame for potentially tampering with witnesses. Rocket raises his voice for even questioning his integrity.
- B-12 is pink, Winstrol is white, and HGH is clear. Just so we're all on the same page.
- Lacy Clay begins fellating Roger, LIVE on CNN! After praising him for all his work with the kids, his career, his Cy Youngs, and his impressive beer gut, that's followed up by asking what uniform he's going to wear to the Hall Of Fame. I am NOT making this up.
- So seriously, what's up with McNamee sitting on evidence for years? Is this standard? McNamee says Roger was untrustworthy, and he did the same to Knoblauch - whose needles have been handed over to authorities. Well, at least he's consistent. Not looking good, Rahj.
- Roger's wife takes it up the ass, and not Clemens himself. That's where Pettitte got the idea that Clemens is taking. They discussed this in 2000 you see, 3 years before she actually took HGH. But what good is a timeline anyway?
So we're no further ahead than we were yesterday, and while Roger is certainly not guilty just yet, it's really starting to look like he's got some fessin' up to do. McNamee, while shaken, especially when confronted by his history of lying, seems to be the more credible witness. Or rather, McNamee backed by PETTITTE.
Ultimately, the syringes are the smoking gun. If they're inconclusive, Roger's off the hook - but his reputation is shot forever. If they prove HGH, he's going to jail for lying to the feds.
Hardly the last chapter, but definitely a fun way to kill half a day.
Clemens is uber-screwed and he has best friend Andy Pettitte to thank for it. The funny thing is, I keep hearing that Pettitte has no motivation to lie. Considering that Spring Training starts in a matter of days, I think Pettitte's motivation to lie would be that he wants these Congressional people off his back before he drags all this unnecessary publicity to Yankees training camp. I still can't help but think Clemens might be telling the truth. Especially since Jose Canseco, who's made a name out of throwing people under the steroids bus, denies that Clemens was on anything.
You know what I DO know, however? Congress is full of idiots. Isn't there a war going on? Isn't the housing market on the verge of collapse? Isn't the economy so bad that the dollar's value around the world is sinking rapidly? And yet they still want to waste their time with Clemens and McNamee bickering back and forth like a real-life episode of the People's Court. If it was up to me, I wouldn't vote for ANY of these clowns when re-election time comes around. As it is, though, the only one I can actually take my vote away from is Henry Waxman, who happens to be one of the ringleaders of this circus. I'm sure a lot of people feel the same way, especially after realizing that THIS is where our tax dollars are going!
(edited by It's False on 13.2.08 1418)
Don't mess with Superman Prime or he'll kill you to death!
I can respect a guy like Pettitte, because at least he owned up and told what he did. Took some responsibility. Roger's an idiot and a jerk. Today made it perfectly clear he's also a liar.
While a couple of the members did try their best to pay Roger back for those signed baseballs, the rest did their job and it was obvious that Roger's stories don't add up.
And where are the people who said the whole steroids thing was a witchhunt to get Bonds, in part because he was black? Roger's getting the same treatment, rightfully so.
I didn't want Congress to get into this again, but at the same time it appears that's what it takes for us to get to the truth. I'm tired of steroids but even more tired of players thinking they can lie and act insulted when they get caught. Hopefully he'll pay a hefty price for this matter, as it would send a HUGE message to other players. Be honest, because even those you consider your best friends might turn on you if you're not.
- Clemens had the better body language, but he has been a public figure forever so you can't grade McNamee to harshly on that I suppose.
- Lacy Clay, what a waste of time that guy was. How many autographed balls and pictures did that doofus get? Save the fandom for another time buddy.
- So Pettitte is a great friend a stand up guy ... but an idiot according to Clemens. He confused Roger saying he used HGH with Roger talking about tv?
- The MRI on Clemens was an interesting piece of information.
- The Nanny thing looked really shady. The Roger Clemens camp was really brazen on this one. This was probably the most shocking part of the five hours.
- Seeing Clemens get cocky and then smacked back down at the end was, I guess, as good an ending as we were going to get.
- Overall, this was a huge waste of time and money. Clemens barely answered any questions straight on and McNamee was what I thought he'd be. I guess they could try waterboarding next if they really wanted answers.
I'd say neither Clemens nor McNamee gained or lost any ground today and Congress ended up looking like the fools when it was all said and done.
EDIT: I also wanted to add that it's a shame that the other big story in Washington today was the Spygate saga.
Considering the nitwits that compose the vast majority of the House of Representatives, it is far better for them to waste time on this type of topic than screw up the country even more. I'd write up Canseco's support of Clemens to Clemens agreeing to the type of deal that Canseco allegedly offered Ordonez: Give me money, and I won't say you used the juice. They had Clemens under oath and they didn't ask him if he pulled himself from Game 6 in '86? They asked everything else that wasn't relevant, that at least has been debated for 2 decades. Did Roger really think Andy Pettite, who used to sell Mormon Bibles on TV, was going to commit perjury for him? Since Pettite admitted in his deposition to using substances in '04, doesn't that mean a suspension for the Yankees #2 starter? With the Boston Herald running the 'World According to Roger' series in the 90's, he really should have taken the Sammy Sosa defense and claimed not to know the English language.
Originally posted by wmatisticAnd where are the people who said the whole steroids thing was a witchhunt to get Bonds, in part because he was black? Roger's getting the same treatment, rightfully so.
Clemens hasn't gone through a fraction of what Bonds went through - deserved or not. Granted, it is still early for Clemens in all of this, and it's starting to look more and more like he's hiding something, but I think it's way too early to make these kinds of comparisons.
Here's the thing we did get out of yesterday...I think anyone who watched that can agree that there is sufficient reason for the justice department to look into perjery by both these men. Correct? (btw, this says nothing as to what a waste of time this all is, but if they broke the law it should be looked into)
Now, they have these needles and other things with Roger's blood on them, supposedly. But unless he's under investigation for something, they can't just take his DNA sample to match up. So they investigate him for perjury, are able to forcefully get the sample and all of a sudden it doesn't matter if we think McNamee is a liar or not. We've got physical evidence along with Pettitte's testimony and Roger goes down.
So unless McNamee faked that evidence, Roger's done.
Roger Clemens' appearance before Congress not only may have failed to clear his name, it might also have led to more trouble.
The New York Times reported on Monday that the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform has drafted a letter recommending that the Justice Department launch a criminal investigation into whether Clemens committed perjury during his testimony on Feb. 13.
Citing three lawyers familiar with the matter, the newspaper said that Clemens' accuser, Brian McNamee, was not included in the letter, prompting speculation that the committee has concluded that the trainer's testimony was truthful.
But the best part of this story?
The Feb. 13 hearing was split along partisan lines, with Republicans blasting McNamee and Democrats questioning the veracity of Clemens. The tenor of the event led many to believe that the committee would recommend an investigation into both Clemens and McNamee. Although McNamee could be included in a final recommendation from the committee, the draft letter suggests the group's thinking at this time.
If there's anything dumber than continuing to waste valuable tax dollars on this issue, it's that Congress has somehow found a way to turn this into a PARTISAN issue!
If you're keeping score at home, if you're a Democrat you believe McNamee and if you're a Republican you support Clemens.
I'm we would normally be fixated on the Yankees putting up a choke job on the level of last year's Red Sox team right about now, but...the Orioles! The ORIOLES! Holy crap, the Orioles! Grimis would be proud if he was still alive. [/Simmons]