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The W - Pro Wrestling - Chris Benoit passes away (Page 27)
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JustinShapiro
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Since: 12.12.01
From: Pittsburgh, PA

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#521 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.62
    Originally posted by BDL
    how the hell was he passing any kind of test?



    Dr. Phil Astin prescribed Chris Benoit
cranlsn
Liverwurst








Since: 18.3.02
From: Sussex, WI

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#522 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.87

    Originally posted by JustinShapiro
      Originally posted by BDL
      how the hell was he passing any kind of test?



      Dr. Phil Astin prescribed Chris Benoit



Yeah, I get that, but I thought the prescription excuse only covered the presence of steroids up to their existing "baseline". If so, how high was the baseline to cover that kind of usage?

As far as demeanor...perhaps that's where some of the other more "recreational" pharmaceuticals came in?
ges7184
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Since: 7.1.02
From: Birmingham, AL

Since last post: 43 days
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#523 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.43
    Originally posted by BigDaddyLoco
    This is on the Observer site, ESPN has something similar on it's as well ...

      Originally posted by The Observer
      A Fox News Channel report said that records obtained by investigators show that between May 2006 and May 2007, Dr. Phil Astin prescribed Chris Benoit "a ten month supply of steroids" every three to four weeks. The report stated that every three to four weeks, Benoit would get a new ten-month supply.



    If true this is just insane. How was he able to keep the cool, calm demeener everyone talked about and how the hell was he passing any kind of test?

    This is one of the things Vince had to fear the most. Maybe these amounts are more common among this sort of crowd than I think. I sure wouldn't want to be this doctor.





    (edited by BigDaddyLoco on 2.7.07 1727)


Dr. Astin has been charged with improperly dispensing drugs to patients.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2007-07-02-wrestler-dead_N.htm?csp=34

Given what he apparently did for Benoit, I imagine this was a pretty easy call to make for the DA. Well that, and the fact that he had written prescriptions for "about 1 million doses of controlled substances over the past two years." Yikes!



The Bored are already here. Idle hands are the devil's workshop. And no... we won't kill dolphins. But koalas are fair game.
JayJayDean
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Since: 2.1.02
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#524 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.40
    Originally posted by cranlsn
    Yeah, I get that, but I thought the prescription excuse only covered the presence of steroids up to their existing "baseline". If so, how high was the baseline to cover that kind of usage?


I am under the impression that it was 10-to-1 without a prescription, but if you HAD a prescription you could be a a billion-to-1 and still be OK, by the letter of the law.



Holy fuck shit motherfucker shit. Read comics. Fuck shit shit fuck shit I sold out when I did my job. Fuck fuck fuck shit fuck. Sorry had to do it....

*snip*

Revenge of the Sith = one thumb up from me. Fuck shit. I want to tittie fuck your ass.
-- The Guinness. to Cerebus
Jim Smith
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Since: 17.10.04
From: Bloomington, IL

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#525 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.53
    Originally posted by JustinShapiro
    Believe it or not, the crossface story actually is in the Observer. Well, sort of. It says he police's belief is that Daniel was killed with "something approximating the crippler crossface," because they were perplexed by the bruising on Daniel since it wasn't consistent with choking someone with your hands, whereas the bruising on Daniel was on his arm and face. Then someone saw footage of Benoit doing the crossface and realized the bruising patterns matched the application of the hold.


Here's what I don't get. Last week I actually considered that Benoit might have used his finisher, but decided that he must not have because the police were calling it a "choke hold". The crossface--even the modified version theorized by the police--pulls the head back by applying pressure to the, well, face. Now, I have no doubt that a grown man could kill a child with the hold, but wouldn't it have broken Daniel's neck before it asphyxiated him?
Tribal Prophet
Andouille








Since: 9.1.02
From: Winnipeg, MB, Canada

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#526 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.38
Guys, something "approximating" the crossface could also be a sleeper hold, or any variation of a sleeper/chokehold with his knee on Daniel's arms to keep him from moving.

I don't want to get into too many more visualizations to be honest, but remember that the people investigating the murders aren't wrestling fans. They could see a northern-lights suplex and confuse it with a piledriver (I know I know, blasphemous to us).

The truth is, any well-trained wrestler probably knows dozens of different variations of headlocks that could kill someone. Telling them all apart isn't something anyone other than wrestling fans is going to care about though.


Tribal Prophet
Cheesehead
Mettwurst








Since: 24.10.03
From: WI, now in the land of the Vikings...*shudder*

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#527 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.18
    Originally posted by Freeway
    More questions arise:
    -Does the "liquification" of Benoit's body hinder the progress of toxicology reports?


Though it probably wouldn't hinder the progress of the tox report in the sense of how long it will take (a crimelog backlog will be more of a factor in that), it could effect the results. Though not a tox expert (i worked as a forensic scientist, but i analyzed the actual drugs themselves), a lot of drugs can be very sensitive to conditions (heat, possibly bacteria, etc) and could breakdown, thus changing the level of drugs detected.

They would also have to do a specific test for GHB because (at least in our system) it is not usually done as part of a routine tox screen. GHB is a different kind of beast to analyze--not impossible, just different.



Profile for Giraffa
ges7184
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Since: 7.1.02
From: Birmingham, AL

Since last post: 43 days
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#528 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.43
The DA is now questioning whether Daniel had Fragile X. He said they can't find anything in the medical records they have reviewed so far. Also, WWE is beginning to distance themselves from the statement made by their attorney (Jerry McDevitt) about Daniel having Fragile X.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070703/ap_on_re_us/wrestler_dead_20

If it turns out that Daniel did not have Fragile X, it will be interesting to find out if Daniel had anything wrong with him at all, or if he was perfectly healthy.



The Bored are already here. Idle hands are the devil's workshop. And no... we won't kill dolphins. But koalas are fair game.
BigDaddyLoco
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Since: 2.1.02

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#529 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.47
The whole Fragile X thing is really strange to me. Someone has to know something about this kid don't they?

Also this is a little unnerving for the neighbor now ...

    Originally posted by Observer
    The Boston Herald at thetrack.bostonherald.com/... has a story about Holly McFague, Benoit's next door neighbor who actually was the one who found the bodies, hiding out in Boston while the media from around the world is staking out her home. Officers were at first afraid to go to the house because of Benoit's attack dogs, and since she knew the dogs, she actually went in first. She also said she talked to Benoit on Saturday, while his was likely between murders, and he told her in great detail about Nancy and Daniel having food poisoning. McFague actually was surprised at the detail he went into about their illness. She said she liked Nancy but didn't particularly like Chris.


... so he was just kicking around the yard and still able to keep his cool enough to at least not alarm her that anything was wrong.



(edited by CRZ on 4.7.07 0145)


Cerebus
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Since: 17.11.02

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#530 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.48
Believe me, I hate posting in here, but has anyone got a link to Warriors interview?

I kinda want to see that.

-----

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ch6dDLVAJvo&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fnodq%2Ecom%2Ffeatures%2F185514566%2Eshtml

Oh yeah, this is a video of Mark Furman (uhh?) spreading doubt that Benoit actually did the murders... Well, he'd certainly be an expert if the crime scene had been staged or if evidence had been planted, that's for sure.
CajunMan
Boudin blanc
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Since: 2.1.02
From: Give me a Title shot!

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#531 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.01
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,287361,00.html

Warrior was also on H/C tonight too.


(edited by CajunMan on 4.7.07 0000)

I'm CajunMan and I approve this message.
CxMorgado
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Since: 21.1.02
From: Boston MA is the rippen'ist town...

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#532 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.29
I actually think Warrior managed to not come off as a complete whack job insano for once (tho I may just think that because I happen to agree with him on the difference between steroid use and abuse), but he def had his volume set on shout for the whole thing and didn't want to cooperate at all.

Hogan saying Nancy worshipped Satan was weirder than anything Warrior said, quite frankly...

http://www.nationalledger.com/artman/publish/article_272614513.shtml

(edited by CxMorgado on 4.7.07 0134)


Biddip-bo!
CajunMan
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Since: 2.1.02
From: Give me a Title shot!

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#533 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.01
http://usmagazine.com/hulk_hogan_talks_to_i_us_i_about_the_killer_wrestler


finally hogan talks



I'm CajunMan and I approve this message.
Jackson
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Since: 4.1.02

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#534 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.85


“She was into devil-worship stuff. It was part of her [wrestling] character, but [she was] somebody who gets so close to their character, someone who gets into their character too much. Sometimes these people believe their own publicity.”

WOW. Talk about your pot-kettle.



The Genius
Loukanika








Since: 10.12.01
From: New York

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#535 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.80
Justin he's calling you a NETCOP




The "" Genius
Quezzy
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Since: 6.1.02
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#536 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.56
    Originally posted by cranlsn
      Originally posted by JustinShapiro
        Originally posted by BDL
        how the hell was he passing any kind of test?



        Dr. Phil Astin prescribed Chris Benoit



    Yeah, I get that, but I thought the prescription excuse only covered the presence of steroids up to their existing "baseline". If so, how high was the baseline to cover that kind of usage?


Last night on Between The Ropes there was an interview with Brian Alvarez of F4WOnline. They talked to him for about an hour on all the topics relating to the Chris Benoit death. He confirmed that if you have a prescription your levels can be absolutely anything and you'll be excused. Of course he also pointed out this makes no sense because if somebody needs to be prescribed steroids for a lack of testosterone then the drugs should only take their levels back to the regular 1 to 1, not make it go over like 6 to 1 or 10 to 1 or whatever.

I don't have any idea if he or his site is a good one, I don't keep track of those things but he sounded like he knew what he was talking about.



Lance's Response:

THAT IS AWESOME!
Mr. Boffo
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Since: 24.3.02
From: Oshkosh, WI

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#537 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.12
    Originally posted by Quezzy
    I don't have any idea if he or his site is a good one, I don't keep track of those things but he sounded like he knew what he was talking about.

I've heard Bryan Alvarez talk on Joe Versus The World, a wrestling podcast (available at joeversustheworld.com or thecubsfan.com). He seems very knowledgeable (all the guests on there do, frankly).
KJames199
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Since: 10.12.01
From: #yqr

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#538 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.54
    Originally posted by Quezzy
    I don't have any idea if he or his site is a good one, I don't keep track of those things but he sounded like he knew what he was talking about.
I'm a subscriber. I generally like his audio shows, even if he's technologically retarded and can't handle the daunting challenge of Winamp. The TV show recaps with his friends are fun (MORE BRENT) and the frequent interviews with Dave Meltzer and Lance Storm are always good.

There's a free Raw recap audio show posted every Tuesday morning (here's this week's) if you feel like checking it out.



JK
Alessandro
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Worcester MA

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#539 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.04
(deleted by Alessandro on 5.7.07 1813)
emma
Cherries > Peaches








Since: 1.8.02
From: Phoenix-ish

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#540 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.10
    Originally posted by Quezzy
    Last night on Between The Ropes there was an interview with Brian Alvarez of F4WOnline. They talked to him for about an hour on all the topics relating to the Chris Benoit death. He confirmed that if you have a prescription your levels can be absolutely anything and you'll be excused. Of course he also pointed out this makes no sense because if somebody needs to be prescribed steroids for a lack of testosterone then the drugs should only take their levels back to the regular 1 to 1, not make it go over like 6 to 1 or 10 to 1 or whatever.
Standard "no expert" disclaimers here, but I don't think that objection is valid.

My understanding: The numbers are the ratio of testosterone to epitestosterone. Click Here (ncbi.nlm.nih.gov) Your body makes both of those more or less in parallel. If you have an actual "Low Testosterone" condition, you'll most likely have low values of both numbers, but likely still about in a generally 1:1 ratio. The testosterone supplements prescribed for low testosterone conditions are testosterone only -- they don't supplement the epitestosterone at all. So, yeah, if you start with an actual low testosterone condition, you'll have low values for both numbvers. Supplementing the testosterone so that the value is normal, the epitestosterone will still be low, causing the ratio to show testosterone supplementation.

So, that ratio is a screening device, but what actual values are appropriate for an individual patient is a whole lot more complex -- hence requiring doctor's evaluation.
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